How'd They Do It Before Supps?

Training Bodybuilding
121

[quote]dankid wrote:
GetSwole wrote:
Dankid, before you talk about his ‘lack of big lifts’ realize he has videos of himself at 17 years old squatting 700 and benches in the mid 400s I believe.

I take back part of my statement. I didn’t even check his profile, the name threw me off. Props to you newb, thats freaking crazy, you a beast.

Still though, look at dave tate. He actually started eating less calories, but ate clean, and only lost like a pound of muscle.

If you really are using fast food to bulk, your wasting the gift that you have. With proper nutrition, and proper supplementation, along with good training, you have what it takes to achieve so much. As far as supplements, you are probably one of the few people that really can benefit a lot from supplements. But the average gym goer on here is not you.

Grats on the lifts, hope you keep progressing.[/quote]

This is getting stupid. I have eaten fast food before and did not die. Newb has even stated that he is not relying on “fast food” (which in itself is way too general a term) alone as his source of all calories yet some of you still act like he is about to die.

It’s irritating to watch people who can only think in extremes.

122

[quote]dankid wrote:
Still though, look at dave tate. He actually started eating less calories, but ate clean, and only lost like a pound of muscle.
[/quote]

Maintaining or regaining weight is a lot easier than building it in the first place.

[quote]
If you really are using fast food to bulk, your wasting the gift that you have. With proper nutrition, and proper supplementation, along with good training, you have what it takes to achieve so much. As far as supplements, you are probably one of the few people that really can benefit a lot from supplements. But the average gym goer on here is not you.[/quote]

How often do you see people who obsess over always eating clean reach the upper echelons of size and strength? More often, I notice those who’re willing to do whatever it takes to get there reach it. Not saying everyone has to take the same road, but at any rate I don’t see were the idea of the excess approach limiting gains comes from.

Just to reiterate yet again, as seems to be a must in every thread like this one, this isn’t about subsisting on fast food. Just the idea that it might benefit some people in some amounts.

123

[quote]Mega Newb wrote:
jstreet0204 wrote:
Mega Newb wrote:
Short Hoss wrote:
You can’t beat a Triple Whopper when it comes to needing calories and protein.

Your gonna die when your 30!

Besides, who eats food to put on muscle anymore? Its all about the whey.

Are you fucking serious! Go back and read a little, nobody said it was all about whey. You can eat whole foods and get the calories and protein and much more nutrients without that bad effects of fast food.

I’d say at 320 lbs and 17 years old, unless you post up some pics of yourself looking like Ronnie coleman, I’d say you at least 100lbs overweight. That’s not bulking that’s lack of discipline. You are at a prime age to make your best gains. Your test levels over the next few years are going to be the highest they will ever be.

You could scratch your nuts with a dumbell and make gains at your age. There is no need to fill your body with junk to do it. You only get one chance at being that young don’t waste it.

first off I have read more about lifting etc than I care to admit. So dont tell me to read more, because you have no idea about what I have and haven’t read.

Secondly, who the fuck benches mid to high 400’s deadlifts mid 700’s and squats 700 and is 220lbs at 6"2??? And why the fuck would you assume I should be this person?

No really, you want to say Im 100lbs over weight, so find me someone who does those lifts at 6"2 who is 220. I cant wait to see that guy.

Lack of dicipline? Its much easier to diet and look good while your a teenager than it is to be fat as hell just to be strong. I didnt always weigh 320 you know, I decided what I wanted to do, found the best course of action to get there.

And gaining excess weight was part of it. Thats the strongest fucking dicipline, doing something you dont want to do to get results that you do want. Whats your idea of doing something you dont want to do in lifting? training legs? Dont talk to me about discipline.

By the way, eating fast food isnt wasting my young life, its not doing shit to me. Other than making it easier to do what I gotta do to reach my goals. Im not drinking drain o here, are you insane? Its some ground beef with white bread and american cheese, GOD IM GONNA DIE BY 30!

Since you questioned my dicipline and said unless I showed you a picture that looked like ronnie coleman I must be 100lbs over weight. The picture is of me at 200 and a 350 deadlift a little over 2 years ago.

and the video is of me at 320 about 4 weeks ago.

Care to put your own personal progress, pictures, and video’s out there? I looked through your pictures, you arent huge by any means, and your not lean by any means. And you did this over many many years of lifting while eating clean and taking supplements. Where as I made my progress on devil fast food.

I think Il stick with the fast food and die at 30, like the hundreds of thousands of the other people who grew up on white bread, american cheese, and beef and are still alive.

[/quote]

Great post, great lifts.

124

I don’t know why this thread has only focused on nutritional supplements. I consider good peri-workout nutrition with a Surge-like substance hugely beneficial and and a casein protein before bed very helpful.

Otherwise, I’d go with whole food at all other times if not for the convenience issues. But, in my opinion, it’s other supplements such as nutritent repartioning agents, and supps that aid neural recovery and work capacity that make the biggest difference for today’s natural trainees compated to those of 70 years ago. Endogenous T-boosters for those who need them too.

125

[quote]jstreet0204 wrote:
Mega Newb wrote:
Blah blah blah…

Secondly, who the fuck benches mid to high 400’s deadlifts mid 700’s and squats 700 and is 220lbs at 6"2??? And why the fuck would you assume I should be this person?

I benched 485 weighing in at 228 so don’t try to tell me you need an extra 100lbs of body fat to be that strong. But the last time I checked this was the bodybuilding forum, not the strongman forum so advocating cheeseburgers as a basis to put on muscle is just stupid. I was just trying to help you out, but you got all figured out, so good luck with that.
[/quote]

your 2" shorter than me, so that would put you at about 245 if you were my height, that is 25lbs heavier heavier than you said I should be. Tell me, did you squat 700 and deadlift 700 for reps at the time? Because if you did that would also have you weighing significantly more.

I didnt say I needed a extra 100lbs on 220 to do those lifts, I just said that Im not 100lbs over weight and logically proved it. And then you made a post about your 485 bench that helped me prove it.

I didnt tell anyone to use cheese burgers as a basis to put on muscle, I said its what worked for me. I said everything I said either being a fact, or my own personal experience or opinion. You guys however, keep saying shit that you cant back up.

126

[quote]GetSwole wrote:
What is a nutrition application?[/quote]

I’m a programmer. One of my current projects is developing basically a diet log application based off the published USDA nutritional database.

127

Some of the supplements that are touted to people dont work. However i would like to point out that the supplements fed to the cattle that you eat, and the chicken that lay your eggs. Do indeed work, and is one of the primary reasons why the “clean” food you eat is indeed so affordable.

There is a ton of research into what makes cows grow bigger and faster then usual. Aswell as highly processed foods that cows would never really get to eat. As for chicken, they often live of of pellets. Perfectly created, and constantly refined formula’s to make them fatter. Faster.

Supplementation works. Its just that humans are stupid enough to misapply the information and get carried away with fantasy and denial.

So in conclusion. Your opinion is wrong. You are a idiot.

128

[quote]dankid wrote:
Mega Newb wrote:

I think Il stick with the fast food and die at 30, like the hundreds of thousands of the other people who grew up on white bread, american cheese, and beef and are still alive.

Are you freaking serious. Have you never heard of obesity? Or have you seen “super-size me”?

If it was all about calories, and not nutrients, then people would easily achieve success on the mcdonalds diet. I think you need to look more into Dave Tate, and what he’s been through. Your going down his path, except the only difference is you wont have the big lifts to compensate for your big belly.

Currently, im eating less fast food, and all together less junk food, and focusing on clean eating, and im getting my best results ever. Sure I lost a little weight when I did this, but it was just water that went with my carbs, and im actually stronger then I ever was, when I was on “the bulk”.

You can keep lying to yourself though. But you aren’t going to convince anyone, that you took the road less traveled by NOT eating healthy, and instead you had to force yourself to eat junk. C’mon who you trying to kid.[quote]

I definitely took the route less traveled, but saying that alone doesn’t mean much at all. Not many people will do what I did, or if they do it would take them much longer because they wouldnt want to gain as much fat as I did. Thats fine. Im not gonna hate on anyone for their goals, their goal may be to look good where as mine was to get as big and strong as I could as fast as possible. I dont think anyones gonna disagree with this. Like I have said 10 times now, being fat isnt fun, Im not fat out of lazyness Im fat because I have ate to much on purpose for a long time to reach the goals that I set. Shit, the hardest part of dieting for me is just accepting the fact that I wont be getting stronger while I lose weight, or I will actually lose strength.

You got the wrong idea when you said (your not gonna convince anyone that you took the road less traveled) What I meant is that its physically and mentally easier for me and the huge majority of people to just be lean and look good and not have allot of muscle. But blah blah blah like I said before I wanted to be bigger and stronger etc. If fast food helps me get in the calories when I need them, Im gonna eat fast food. Not because its hard core, but because its easy. I never try ed to say I was hardcore because I eat unhealthy food sometimes. ITS JUST EASIER TO EAT FAST FOOD SOMETIMES, just like its easier to get some of your protein from shakes, the only difference is I dont eat fast food the majority of days. I said before I use fast food as a supplement, and gave the reasons why.

And if everything goes as planned this year all my raw lifts will be over dave tates best raw lifts. But he will still have me beat in equipped lifting if thats what you meant by big lifts.

Hope this clears up the imaginary argument people are having with me.

129

[quote]cyph31 wrote:
derek wrote:
cyph31 wrote:

120 grams of insulin-spiking refined carbs, that will sure do wonders for your body composition

And always worrying about what a certain meal will do to your body composition will keep you forever small and weak.

it isn’t difficult for me to get 1000 calories in a meal from clean sources without a lot of preparation or cost so i think i’ll take that option instead of feeling like my blood flow is clogging everytime i bite that hamburger[/quote]

I hear ya. I was just pointing out that no one needs to be so anal about avoiding some fast food once in a while. Of course I advocate healthy food over fast food but I also don’t over-react by getting the feeling like like my arteries are clogging if I eat a freaking cheeseburger. I mean, give me a break about THAT one.

130

Newb, don’t even try to justify your actions with these people. They will never have the size/strength you have/will have.

Jealousy, I suppose.

131

[quote]Short Hoss wrote:
Newb, don’t even try to justify your actions with these people. They will never have the size/strength you have/will have.

Jealousy, I suppose.[/quote]

I doubt its jelousy, eating clean and gaining allot of weight is allot harder than eating unclean and gaining allot of weight. I could see why people who gianed their weight by eating clean would have allot of reasons why eating unclean is really bad for you. Other wise the wouldnt be eating the way they are.

And when you get into a argument about something like this of course everyone is gonna go to the extreme to prove their point.

Anyway, this whole thing was a bit of a misunderstanding I think.

132

[quote]Mega Newb wrote:

Anyway, this whole thing was a bit of a misunderstanding I think.
[/quote]

Ya gotta admit, the “kid” has a great attitude and demeanor.

Keep it going, brother!

133

[quote]Mega Newb wrote:
Short Hoss wrote:
Newb, don’t even try to justify your actions with these people. They will never have the size/strength you have/will have.

Jealousy, I suppose.

I doubt its jelousy, eating clean and gaining allot of weight is allot harder than eating unclean and gaining allot of weight. I could see why people who gianed their weight by eating clean would have allot of reasons why eating unclean is really bad for you. Other wise the wouldnt be eating the way they are.

And when you get into a argument about something like this of course everyone is gonna go to the extreme to prove their point.

Anyway, this whole thing was a bit of a misunderstanding I think.
[/quote]

I agree that we may have both mis read what the other was saying and I appretiate that you are being a little less of a smart-ass about it today than last night. You seem much more level headed than I gave you credit for. My argument was not driven by jealousy nor was it meant to be critical. As I stated my best bench is probably on par with yours, so it shouldn’t matter. I can not compare deadlift or squat since I have a back and knee injury from the army that limits how hard I can push those two. But it is irrelevant because my goals and accomplishments are mine. I don’t base them off of anyone elses.

You are however wrong, about my reason being based on making all my gains eating clean. If you look at what I wrote closer in this thread and the pics in my profile, you’ll see that I was at one time about 100lbs overweight. So my point of view is from someone that has been there and just trying save you from the health issues I had to deal with. I still live with that fact that the damage I’ve done to my arteries from years of being overweight and eating poorly, may cause me to have a heart attack at an early age like several friends I know.

You don’t think about these things when your 17, but you think about them when you are older and have kids. My honest intent was to help, so if I came down a little too hard I apologize. I wish you the best of luck with your goals, but I hope that you’ll take your long term health into consideration. I won’t preach to you anymore.

134

[quote]derek wrote:
Mega Newb wrote:

Anyway, this whole thing was a bit of a misunderstanding I think.

Ya gotta admit, the “kid” has a great attitude and demeanor.

Keep it going, brother!

[/quote]

I agree.

135

I think the op is atleast part right. Too many trainees (mostly beginners)think there is a magic potion or shortcut. Alot of these ads are deceptive from the start. I’ve been lifting for years and have made steady gains along the way with vitamin c and a multi vit. I think most newbies should crank out the weights for a bit before looking for a supplement.

136

[quote]derek wrote:
cyph31 wrote:
derek wrote:
cyph31 wrote:

120 grams of insulin-spiking refined carbs, that will sure do wonders for your body composition

And always worrying about what a certain meal will do to your body composition will keep you forever small and weak.

it isn’t difficult for me to get 1000 calories in a meal from clean sources without a lot of preparation or cost so i think i’ll take that option instead of feeling like my blood flow is clogging everytime i bite that hamburger

I hear ya. I was just pointing out that no one needs to be so anal about avoiding some fast food once in a while. Of course I advocate healthy food over fast food but I also don’t over-react by getting the feeling like like my arteries are clogging if I eat a freaking cheeseburger. I mean, give me a break about THAT one.
[/quote]

Good point. Rocky’s trainer Mickey ate bacon and eggs daily his whole life and lived to be like 90 something.

137

You people are all idiots. Everyone knows you need injectable creatine and NO-XPLODE to get a halfway decent physique. And to look REALLY good, you have to use steroids.

Hard work and a good diet won’t do a thing for you.

Am I being sarcastic? You be the judge.

138

Look how small and weak this douchebag is. If he’d gone hard on the steroid use, then he’d be hyoooge. This guy need NO-XPLODE ASAP, and has to start cycling creatine too. Regular testosterone injections wouldn’t be a bad thing either.

Once again, there is that distinct possibility that I could be playing the sarcasm card. And, once again, I shall let you decide whether or not I am.

139

[quote]drip wrote:
derek wrote:
cyph31 wrote:
derek wrote:
cyph31 wrote:

120 grams of insulin-spiking refined carbs, that will sure do wonders for your body composition

And always worrying about what a certain meal will do to your body composition will keep you forever small and weak.

it isn’t difficult for me to get 1000 calories in a meal from clean sources without a lot of preparation or cost so i think i’ll take that option instead of feeling like my blood flow is clogging everytime i bite that hamburger

I hear ya. I was just pointing out that no one needs to be so anal about avoiding some fast food once in a while. Of course I advocate healthy food over fast food but I also don’t over-react by getting the feeling like like my arteries are clogging if I eat a freaking cheeseburger. I mean, give me a break about THAT one.

Good point. Rocky’s trainer Mickey ate bacon and eggs daily his whole life and lived to be like 90 something.
[/quote]

Oh great so if it works for a fictional character in a film then it must be OK, I wonder what superman eats?

This thread has gone on for a long time without anyone mentioning genetics.

The BB that is shown in the first picture was genetically pre disposed to be big and stung, and he has worked hard in the gym and ate well to achieve his physique.

I know guys that look similar to that yet they do not use any supplements and they do not bust heir balls down the gym, some people are just lucky bastards and have large muscular physiques without much effort.

140

[quote]Makavali wrote:
Look how small and weak this douchebag is. If he’d gone hard on the steroid use, then he’d be hyoooge. This guy need NO-XPLODE ASAP, and has to start cycling creatine too. Regular testosterone injections wouldn’t be a bad thing either.

Once again, there is that distinct possibility that I could be playing the sarcasm card. And, once again, I shall let you decide whether or not I am.[/quote]

MAk you sarcastic? Na it can’t be :slight_smile: