What the fuck is an empty calorie?
[quote]Short Hoss wrote:
What the fuck is an empty calorie?[/quote]
Exactly my point! A quarter pounder’s got Vitamin A, C, Iron, Calcium and fiber!
That’s freakin’ health food!
[quote]jsbrook wrote:
Supps are not essential at all. But guess what: the elite bodybuilders of the 40s look like today’s average, reasonably dedicated gym rat. Wonder why?[/quote]
He speaks truth. New training methods, nutritional knowledge, and supplements are the difference. When I see soccer games of the 70’s and 80’s, I’m almost appalled by how these teams play. The modern game is so much faster because of new training methods, nutrition, etc…just like BBing.
[quote]derek wrote:
jstreet0204 wrote:
derek wrote:
cyph31 wrote:
120 grams of insulin-spiking refined carbs, that will sure do wonders for your body composition
And always worrying about what a certain meal will do to your body composition will keep you forever small and weak.
Actually KNOWING what every meal will do to your body composition will make you big and strong, since you aren’t wasting years guessing and throwing empty calories down your throat.
Only a dumbass would train his ass off for years and not know what always eating loads of empty calories can do to your body.
But one, who said we’re only throwing empty calories down our throats for years on end? Not me.
And two, how do you come to the conclusion that a cheeseburger, a fish sandwhich and a shake with 2 scoops of protein equates to empty calories?
Maybe if you were talking stuffing a bunch of Twinkies down your throat but we weren’t.
[/quote]
I was more pointing out that your logic is flawed, but you honestly don’t think there are a bunch of empty calories in that? 77 grams of sugar?
Not to mention the 2041 mg of sodium, 163 mg of cholesterol. I’m in the process of writing a nutrition application so I have easy access to all this.
There are cheap means of eating real food without all the bad stuff. I buy 5 dozen eggs for about $7. At sams I can get chicken breast for $1.99 a pound. Oatmeal is cheap, brown rice is cheap. 5 pounds of frozen brocolli is ony about $5.
[quote]SteelyD wrote:
For those of you arguing against supplements, especially protein of all things-- how can you justify using a computer to communicate?
Shouldn’t you be hand delivering your messages? You know, like they did in the old days.[/quote]
Not sure how this was missed, but in terms of the OP’s original argument, and the overall tone of the thread, this is the one of the better posts I caught in the entire 5 pages.
[quote]derek wrote:
Short Hoss wrote:
What the fuck is an empty calorie?
Exactly my point! A quarter pounder’s got Vitamin A, C, Iron, Calcium and fiber!
That’s freakin’ health food! [/quote]
Ok, you are joking right?
[quote]jstreet0204 wrote:
derek wrote:
Short Hoss wrote:
What the fuck is an empty calorie?
Exactly my point! A quarter pounder’s got Vitamin A, C, Iron, Calcium and fiber!
That’s freakin’ health food!
Ok, you are joking right?
[/quote]
Of course I was joking!
But what I do really mean to get across is this;
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I do NOT eat that more than once or MAYBE twice per month, sometimes several months without it at all.
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That if I DO eat that occasional meal, I won’t get fat from it, I wont die from it and my long-term health is not in danger from it. Sure, if it made up more of my diet, yeah, I may be in for some trouble. But the fact is that I take my multi, my fiber, my omerga 3 caps, eat tons of fruit and vegetables and a flock of chicken every week.
There is a major dfifference in long-term health prospects when you compare chronic vs. acute ingestion of those types of foods. No one here, at least not me, is suggesting you live on the stuff. I’m just saying that being anal about it is not nescesary at all.
[quote]derek wrote:
jstreet0204 wrote:
derek wrote:
Short Hoss wrote:
What the fuck is an empty calorie?
Exactly my point! A quarter pounder’s got Vitamin A, C, Iron, Calcium and fiber!
That’s freakin’ health food!
Ok, you are joking right?
Of course I was joking!
But what I do really mean to get across is this;
-
I do NOT eat that more than once or MAYBE twice per month, sometimes several months without it at all.
-
That if I DO eat that occasional meal, I won’t get fat from it, I wont die from it and my long-term health is not in danger from it. Sure, if it made up more of my diet, yeah, I may be in for some trouble. But the fact is that I take my multi, my fiber, my omerga 3 caps, eat tons of fruit and vegetables and a flock of chicken every week.
There is a major dfifference in long-term health prospects when you compare chronic vs. acute ingestion of those types of foods. No one here, at least not me, is suggesting you live on the stuff. I’m just saying that being anal about it is not nescesary at all.[/quote]
I completely agree with that. Everything in moderation. I just got the impression that some of these guys think they can use fast food as a foundation for their nutrition. I love a damn baconator, but I’m not gonna eat more than once a month or so, and I’m sure not gonna try to justify to make gains in the gym.
Yeah, and being 37 for me it’s even more important than the younger guys.
But you know young guys, they often have this immortal view of the world.
Just remember the guy from Super-Size Me!
I’m 38 and at one time got to about 100lbs overweight. I lost it several years ago, so I’ve been where some of these guys are heading, just trying to save them some wasted time.
[quote]jstreet0204 wrote:
Mega Newb wrote:
Short Hoss wrote:
You can’t beat a Triple Whopper when it comes to needing calories and protein.
Your gonna die when your 30!
Besides, who eats food to put on muscle anymore? Its all about the whey.
Are you fucking serious! Go back and read a little, nobody said it was all about whey. You can eat whole foods and get the calories and protein and much more nutrients without that bad effects of fast food.
I’d say at 320 lbs and 17 years old, unless you post up some pics of yourself looking like Ronnie coleman, I’d say you at least 100lbs overweight. That’s not bulking that’s lack of discipline. You are at a prime age to make your best gains. Your test levels over the next few years are going to be the highest they will ever be.
You could scratch your nuts with a dumbell and make gains at your age. There is no need to fill your body with junk to do it. You only get one chance at being that young don’t waste it. [/quote]
first off I have read more about lifting etc than I care to admit. So dont tell me to read more, because you have no idea about what I have and haven’t read.
Secondly, who the fuck benches mid to high 400’s deadlifts mid 700’s and squats 700 and is 220lbs at 6"2??? And why the fuck would you assume I should be this person?
No really, you want to say Im 100lbs over weight, so find me someone who does those lifts at 6"2 who is 220. I cant wait to see that guy.
Lack of dicipline? Its much easier to diet and look good while your a teenager than it is to be fat as hell just to be strong. I didnt always weigh 320 you know, I decided what I wanted to do, found the best course of action to get there.
And gaining excess weight was part of it. Thats the strongest fucking dicipline, doing something you dont want to do to get results that you do want. Whats your idea of doing something you dont want to do in lifting? training legs? Dont talk to me about discipline.
By the way, eating fast food isnt wasting my young life, its not doing shit to me. Other than making it easier to do what I gotta do to reach my goals. Im not drinking drain o here, are you insane? Its some ground beef with white bread and american cheese, GOD IM GONNA DIE BY 30!
Since you questioned my dicipline and said unless I showed you a picture that looked like ronnie coleman I must be 100lbs over weight. The picture is of me at 200 and a 350 deadlift a little over 2 years ago.
and the video is of me at 320 about 4 weeks ago.
Care to put your own personal progress, pictures, and video’s out there? I looked through your pictures, you arent huge by any means, and your not lean by any means. And you did this over many many years of lifting while eating clean and taking supplements. Where as I made my progress on devil fast food.
I think Il stick with the fast food and die at 30, like the hundreds of thousands of the other people who grew up on white bread, american cheese, and beef and are still alive.
[quote]Mega Newb wrote:
Now, please quit crying about how Il have a heart attack when Im 30. It makes you look like your insecure about your progress in the gym. We all know that you would be a IFBB pro bodybuilder if you ate mcdonalds and took steroids to, but you want to live to be past 30 years old. Calm it down tough guy.
[/quote]
I don’t care IF you have an heart attack… You wish to continue on your fast food love affaire and fantasize that It will have no ill effect on your long term well being, hey eat it up. However don’t tell any one that that is a valid or even superior way to gain strength and size…
As for my own progress I have never failed to meet my goals in the gym, but hey If it makes you feel better about my opinion then ok Dr. Phil…
Calm down? You don’t warrant even a blip in my blood pressure…
[quote]Mega Newb wrote:
Blah blah blah…
Secondly, who the fuck benches mid to high 400’s deadlifts mid 700’s and squats 700 and is 220lbs at 6"2??? And why the fuck would you assume I should be this person?
[/quote]
I benched 485 weighing in at 228 so don’t try to tell me you need an extra 100lbs of body fat to be that strong. But the last time I checked this was the bodybuilding forum, not the strongman forum so advocating cheeseburgers as a basis to put on muscle is just stupid. I was just trying to help you out, but you got all figured out, so good luck with that.
This whole thing is weird… cuz I am not anti-food
I for one eat mostly non sup food and take great pains to eat 4 meals with 3 snacks daily… Pain in the ass due to the fact I work out in the field mostly and it’s hot as blazes so caring your food around is rather gay but… there you go…
Prof X said it best that sups are a modern convenience…
Very helpful… Yes.
superior to whole food… No.
Necessary… that’s the debate…
Necessary to what ends? Only the trainer could say… Limited time? Limited budget? Specific goals…
I for one would rather have protein powder with my eggs in the morning than get the same amount of protein from eggs alone…
(my personal example)
As for the deceptive adds for sups… Well snake oil sales men have and will always be around… Best defence is an informed buyer armed with good resources for research.
What is a nutrition application?
[quote]Mega Newb wrote:
I think Il stick with the fast food and die at 30, like the hundreds of thousands of the other people who grew up on white bread, american cheese, and beef and are still alive.
[/quote]
Are you freaking serious. Have you never heard of obesity? Or have you seen “super-size me”?
If it was all about calories, and not nutrients, then people would easily achieve success on the mcdonalds diet. I think you need to look more into Dave Tate, and what he’s been through. Your going down his path, except the only difference is you wont have the big lifts to compensate for your big belly.
Currently, im eating less fast food, and all together less junk food, and focusing on clean eating, and im getting my best results ever. Sure I lost a little weight when I did this, but it was just water that went with my carbs, and im actually stronger then I ever was, when I was on “the bulk”.
You can keep lying to yourself though. But you aren’t going to convince anyone, that you took the road less traveled by NOT eating healthy, and instead you had to force yourself to eat junk. C’mon who you trying to kid.
I dont know how this thread got turned into fast food is better than supplements, but here’s my opinion on the importance of food, and supplements in achieving general performance, body composition, and health goals.
In order from greatest to least important:
1.) Lean protein sources:
Grass fed beef, fish, poultry, nuts, etc. This is the area thats holding me back the most, but im working on increasing it, and I know my results will follow.
2.) Green leafy veggies, including broccoli, etc:
They dont supply a lot of calories or energy, but when you start eating a ton of spinach and other veggies, you just plain feel better, and can train harder, and recover better.
3.) Fruits and all other veggies:
Same as #2
4.) All other carb sources, including sugar:
They all have their purpose, you just gotta focus on when you eat them, and it depends on your goals.
5.) Supplements:
Im hesitant to group all supplements into one category, because there is some junk out there that has no evidence backing it up, but we can group them all together. Again they all have their purpose, and some are a waste for some people while others may find them beneficial.
6.) Junk food:
This would be the least important, as it for the most part IS EMPTY CALORIES. But if done strategically these meals could possibly be beneficial. I cant really think of a way they are beneficial, because the macronutrient combination is just perfect for fat gain. So maybe if your BF is dangerously low, Junk food would be better than supplements or eating clean.
I dont care if you disagree with me on all of this, but for those of you that want to achieve the best results, in the fastest time, with the least amount of money spent, the above list is a good way to go. I follow the above list, and DO take supplements and DO have junk food once in a while, but I follow the list in order. Stuff like protein powder and fish oil I take, because its so cheap, and convenient.
I would like to see a study done though in which people ate a diet completely defficient in nutrients, but supplemented everything. Im talking living off white rice, bread and water, and taking all kinds of supplements from fish oil, to fiber, to multi vitamins, EVERYTHING. If they do a study like this that shows no long term problems, performance increases, Body comp improvement, and all achieved faster than eating clean, then I’ll recant everything I have currently said.
Good luck with that one.
[quote]derek wrote:
cyph31 wrote:
120 grams of insulin-spiking refined carbs, that will sure do wonders for your body composition
And always worrying about what a certain meal will do to your body composition will keep you forever small and weak.[/quote]
it isn’t difficult for me to get 1000 calories in a meal from clean sources without a lot of preparation or cost so i think i’ll take that option instead of feeling like my blood flow is clogging everytime i bite that hamburger
Dankid, before you talk about his ‘lack of big lifts’ realize he has videos of himself at 17 years old squatting 700 and benches in the mid 400s I believe.
^
where are the fat sources ?
[quote]GetSwole wrote:
Dankid, before you talk about his ‘lack of big lifts’ realize he has videos of himself at 17 years old squatting 700 and benches in the mid 400s I believe.[/quote]
I take back part of my statement. I didn’t even check his profile, the name threw me off. Props to you newb, thats freaking crazy, you a beast.
Still though, look at dave tate. He actually started eating less calories, but ate clean, and only lost like a pound of muscle.
If you really are using fast food to bulk, your wasting the gift that you have. With proper nutrition, and proper supplementation, along with good training, you have what it takes to achieve so much. As far as supplements, you are probably one of the few people that really can benefit a lot from supplements. But the average gym goer on here is not you.
Grats on the lifts, hope you keep progressing.