Fred -
I was just wondering what your numbers were like when you were first able to dunk, i.e. height, weight, vertical, some of your lifts that translate to jumping, etc.
Also, nice video, keep making 'em.
[quote]MikeSh wrote:
Hey Fred, I like your split alot and I was wondering if you had any advice on the split I will be using for the next 6 weeks.
Day1 - Olympic Lifting + Chins-
Day 2 - Rest
Day 3 - Olympic Lifting -
Day 4 - Plyos + Shoulder prehab
Day 5 - Rest
Day 6 - Olympic Lifting + Presses-
Day 7 - Rest[/quote]
I think it all depends on the intensity of your plyos. But if it’s high like depth jumps, I would try to include it in one of the olympic lifting session. You could also have a 2 day rest at the end of the week, which is very appreciable after you’ve worn out your nervous system with plyos and explosive lifts. Just my opinion.
[quote]mikren wrote:
Fred -
I was just wondering what your numbers were like when you were first able to dunk, i.e. height, weight, vertical, some of your lifts that translate to jumping, etc.
Also, nice video, keep making 'em.[/quote]
Thanks man.
Well it was in 89 so I was like 13 years old. However I was almost my current height already, probably 5’10-11. (I’m 6ft even now) It wasn’t anything special, one-legged. I had seen a friend touch the rim so I figured I would try dunking with a volley ball, and it felt easy so I moved on to a regular ball. My vert was probably low cause I could only jump off one leg.
I don’t think you could single out one or another lift that translates into vertical jump. It’s a combination of things. Strength work, speed/reactivity, and power. So in my book, I would go for Deadlift/box squat (although I’ve just started box squatting, still a rookie at it), Sprint/Depth jumps, Power snatch or clean from block or hang/Jump squats/Bands box squat.
Great thread. I really wish I had access to bumper plates so I could also do olympic lifting and related movements like powercleans, etc…
Ah well, I’ll have to just get big and strong using the more standard methods.
Fred, any advice on good books or websites to learn plyometric exercises? I’d really like to increase my agility in a general sense.
[quote]huey.ot wrote:
Great thread. I really wish I had access to bumper plates so I could also do olympic lifting and related movements like powercleans, etc…
Ah well, I’ll have to just get big and strong using the more standard methods.
Fred, any advice on good books or websites to learn plyometric exercises? I’d really like to increase my agility in a general sense.[/quote]
http://www.jumpforsts.com I like their video for plyometrics (science of jumping) it really shows the correct way to do the depth jumps. But you don’t really need any books or vid. The important point to remember are to perform the exercise on soft surfaces like grass or a wrestling mat. ABSORB the shock with the muscle, don’t drop like a ton of bricks, picture a cat, make as little noise as possible on landings. And obviously, explode up as fast and high as you possibly can on each and every rep. Each rep must be a record best. Other variables like the use of arms and the height of the box must also be taken in consideration.
What I like to do with regular depth jumps is to have a target for height. I used a basketball rim today and try to get higher and higher on each and every rep.
Here is my workout of the day.
Long jumps ? court length 3x
Depth jumps 4x 6(about 30in)
Depth long jumps one-legged 2x 6 ea leg
Zigzag depth jumps 2x each direction Shake & bake 8-10x(relaxed/sprint)Agility run/ sprint/jump 5-6x(half court, sprint left, sprint right,sprint and jump to rim)
[quote]FredB4 wrote:
TheBodyGuard wrote:
A typical example of the talent level and system is Joe Bryant (Kobe’s dad) was still competing professionally in Italy at the age of 41 - this was WELL beyond when he had any NBA career. He mentioned Sedale Threate who washed out over here in the NBA. I’m sure he went to Europe and played. And I’m sure he was the star of his team - if he wasn’t, they wouldn’t waste the one to two roster spots on an American that wasn’t their star player.
You’re so living in the 80’s… Wake up. There are so many non-american players in the NBA and the US haven’t won any international comp since Sydney 2000… If it wasn’t about talent also, they would have figured it out by now.
And no Sedale didn’t play here, he was like 40+!!! As I mentioned I just played with him for fun. Can’t you read or is your overweight lazy ass lacking comprehension skills???
I’ve also played against steve kerr, david wesley, and thabo sefalosha to name a few… Man, you’re so fucking stupid. Now go back kiss kobe dad’s ass and leave that thread alone until you post your sorry FOOTAGE of your sorry second argentinian division games.[/quote]
You are an idiot for sure. And no, you can’t dance lmfao. The fact that there “are many non americans playing in the NBA” doesn’t change my comments (they are still the minority), factual comments, about the talent level of the professional teams in Europe, top to bottom. Our has beens and never beens still commute overseas every damn year, take the highest paid salary from your club teams and are the stars of your club teams. For someone that proclaims to be a player, you sure are the dumb one b/c you don’t seem to understand the difference between the pro club teams and the NATIONAL teams you keep referring to. Americans DON’T play on your NATIONAL TEAMS dimwit. If someone other than a bunch of folks that can’t jump and are impressed with your jumping were here, you’d get roasted. You’re plain stupid, and wrong. If anyone is lacking comprehension skills, it is you. Club team, National team. Rinse and repeat dancing trick shot boy. On the other hand, American teams don’t get European rejects…it is the other way around. That you can make that comment about the relative talent levels exposes you for the clown that you are.
Second division? Oh, you DO KNOW something right? LOL. Maybe that is why we never got a straight specific answer to the question about what TEAM you played on. Other than your masturbation video in the park - WHAT TEAM DID YOU PLAY FOR and what were your stats. C division maybe? And the bench. Like I said, you couldn’t play D2 here. You’d be a D3 novelty and a sometime amusement man in the lay up line dunking - its all you got.
And if you think that talent wise, that Europeans stack up against Americans, you got your dancing bobblehead up your arse. I don’t think you’ll find any intelligent agreement anywhere for that stupid statement - except maybe from a C Division 2nd string European point guard who got to play once with Steve Kerr lolol.
And finally, you must LOVE the internet like you said before. The internet allows a clown like you to talk ISH without getting your jaw re-wired. The internet even has a place for someone like you to put up a masturbation video of you dunking…let’s see, ALONE and in a HIGH SCHOOL game against Europeans LOLOLOLOL. The lifting was impressive, but you aint exactly an Olympic level lifter. So I ask, what is it you actually have done or accomplished that would compel you to put a vid on youtube you boob??? LOL. Guys that can dunk are a dime a dozen. You act as if you can touch the top of the backboard - now that might be worthy of putting on the internet. But at the end of the day, you’re really not that dumb, and that is why I bother you so much - at the end of the day, you’re just another guy that can dunk…not very remarkable at all - and you know it, save for all your false bravado, chest thumping and puffing.
Just remember, you’re a nobody and you’re just mad b/c someone actually game along, saw that weak game (felix Unger had a similar “jump shot” lolololol), saw that you had the audacity to mention “pro” like it means something over here in the US, and called you on it. I did try to be gentle with you…but it seems you like it rough. LOL, just like my girl.
BodyGuard - You showed up on this thread calling out his basketball skills when he never even posted the video in the first place. Bottom line is, you both never made it to the NBA and it seems hes the only one who has put it behind him. You are just dragging him in to a flame war. He’s on this site to better his physical performance, not his jumper which is why everyone is complementing him on how he trains. Stop being immature and drop it. You are acting like an 8 year old by trying to argue in English about an irrelevant topic with someone from a different country.
Fred just ignore him. Keep up the good work. Post a video when you hit the 40" mark at 220lbs.
I don’t think so. I tried to end it a couple of times and each time he acted a fool. I’m not quite done with him yet. You can always switch to another thread if you don’t like it or just keep criticizing me…the latter really doesn’t bother me.
and who are you to critisize him?
What are you credentials “Mr. Somebody”???
If you dont like his vid, fine, no need to type a essay about it.
holy shit you dunked at age 13??
dayumn
[quote]FredB4 wrote:
mikren wrote:
Fred -
I was just wondering what your numbers were like when you were first able to dunk, i.e. height, weight, vertical, some of your lifts that translate to jumping, etc.
Also, nice video, keep making 'em.
Thanks man.
Well it was in 89 so I was like 13 years old. However I was almost my current height already, probably 5’10-11. (I’m 6ft even now) It wasn’t anything special, one-legged. I had seen a friend touch the rim so I figured I would try dunking with a volley ball, and it felt easy so I moved on to a regular ball. My vert was probably low cause I could only jump off one leg.
I don’t think you could single out one or another lift that translates into vertical jump. It’s a combination of things. Strength work, speed/reactivity, and power. So in my book, I would go for Deadlift/box squat (although I’ve just started box squatting, still a rookie at it), Sprint/Depth jumps, Power snatch or clean from block or hang/Jump squats/Bands box squat.[/quote]
[quote]Mikeee wrote:
holy shit you dunked at age 13??
dayumn
[/quote]
Yes I might find some footage too… lol But like I said, nothing impressive at all as I was already my current height almost. At the time I thought I would grow to like 6’5-6’6… But no!!! LOL
Hi guys,
my first post on this forum because I have strong feelings about this subject. I even joined this forum for vertical jumps and especially this topic which I read.
I play basketball in Holland on a very average level. Which means I get to play against guys who got skills but are not good enough for the real work. So people who retired from pro ball in Holland or were found too short or something, they end up in my competition.
I recognize good ballers, like BodyGuard does, because I played them each week for the last 13 years now. I play against people nowadays far less athletic, fast, etc. as I am but still they punish me. Their shot, there basketball intelligence etc. is far superior than anything my team has to offer. We’re a bunch of 20/21 year olds still learning the tricks, maybe even still developing our shots and we play against veterans who got skills you can’t teach or learn. It’s all natural and comes with experience on a high level.
These dudes in their thirties or forties got a release on their shots that’s pure beauty. They haven’t lost anything of their former touch. You can’t forget how to shoot so Fred, I can see your shot is plain but-ugly and my guess is it’s always been that way.
So you, thinking your the man on the court, I’m sorry but this video did not impress me a bit. I won’t rate you because of the video on a day in the park, but I can see your shot, your slow handles etc. and it just doesn’t do it for me.
On a more positive note:
Your training is the shit, your dunks are cool.
I also train to be able to dunk. I’m 6" and touching the rim. I added 15 centimeters of vert and 10 kg’s of bodyweight over the last months and I feel good about it.
Basketball, for me, is fun. I won’t be pro, nor do I want to. I want to dunk because it looks cool and I bet it feels even better to do it. I care about winning, don’t get me wrong, but I want to be able to dunk in practise, on a street court and maybe even in a game. And why? Because it looks cool and is a big part of what makes basketball a nice game to watch.
In games, I throw a lot of weird no look passes or daring behind the backs. I make sure they’ll work, it doesn’t make my game bad. These are the plays people talk about after a game. Not a 12 foot jumpshot anyone can make.
So I believe basketball should be fun and good to watch. Dunking is a BIG part of that and I can totally see why one should bust his ass in a gym to jump higher. In fact, I’m gonna do it myself right now. Squatting, nice and deep, imagining myself floating through air, dunking a ball.
Bye now!
ps. have you guys thought about the fact that his training will not only make him jump higher but also move faster? Sprinting and jumping are very related. So the argument that dunking is not a part of the basketballgame does not count: being able to run fast and jump high DOES (rebounds, anyone?) and dunking comes with the package.
Nice training, nice dunks, bad dancing.
As to the basketball, he isn’t the greatest but who really cares? He is a million times better than I ever was although my jumpshot is prettier (but might not go in as often)!
[quote]FredB4 wrote:
digitalairair wrote:
the thread should be titled “STRONG people CAN jump”
Hey Fred,
nice numbers and vid, they are impressive!
There was a clip of a much smaller man dunking during a bball game jumping off of 1 leg. Was that you too? Its interesting because where you stand on the static-spring scale might have changed as you get older/turned to strength training.
What was your vert when you started?
and how much did you improve from the age 25- 30?
thanks for sharing,
and keep up the good work.
Thank you!
Yes it was me at about 19-20 years old. - YouTube
Actually my progression is probably unorthodox. When I was in the US, I used isokinetic machines (fast twitch training center) and my vert went up like crazy, +8 inches in just 4 months, up to 35in. Then it went down as my playing season were pretty long, so I studied and researched a lot myself for the appropriate training. I’ve even learned the o’lifts myself at first. And eventually, eventhough I got bigger and heavier I could manage to increase my jumping ability. Especially my standing vert. I don’t jump off one foot any more. I’m just too heavy.[/quote]
The Leaper??
I train for looks & my two sports, tennis & bball. Been playing bball my whole life, right out of the crib, actually, in the crib. LOL. Anyone in South Fl. give me a yell if you want someone to train with or play ball.
I’m also a big fan of the SuperCat vertical jump machine, which I own. Recently getting over a back injury & starting up my vert training once again. Here’s what I’ll be using in my home gym.
Super Cat, anyone seen video of Gary Fuller??
Box squats
SLDL
GHGR
Lunges & its many cousins
Front squats
Hex bar DL
Back exts.
And of course upper body exercises, weighted dips, chins, pull-ups, rows, db bench, towel bench, close grip bench, incline db bench etc.
So if you want some comp. $20 bucks to play me in horse or 1 on 1 - pro rules, no make it take it. If you win ( Hahhaha, yah right! ) you get $50 right back in your hand. Yes, I’m damn good.
Anyone, I need some comp. and making $$ is always fun too! 
Or if you want a kick ass workout partner, give me a yell.
Cool thread!
Yo Fred,
I just realized what a huge difference a wider grip makes when doing push presses! I had WAY too close of a grip before, I did it wider, about the width that you grab it (a strength coach I know and have access to, he’s mad experienced, certified and everything informed me that bigger guys like me need a wider grip when doing push presses and other related movements).
Anyways 225 is a joke for push presses for me now… I did 10 singles today and it was a breeze, I’ll be doing 245 next week and I guarantee I’ll push press 275 inside of 6 months.
Watching your video really helped me! I was grabbing the bar WAY too close, before.
Peace.
Fred, ignore the haters, great job, its cool to see somebody training with a combination of powerlifting,olympic,bodybuilding, and plyos. I might even steal that training schedule you put up earlier for my summer workouts.
–WS4
Way to go!!
well I think you should pick the grip where you’re the strongest. A powerful leg drive and you’ll be able to do 300 in no time.
[quote]huey.ot wrote:
Yo Fred,
I just realized what a huge difference a wider grip makes when doing push presses! I had WAY too close of a grip before, I did it wider, about the width that you grab it (a strength coach I know and have access to, he’s mad experienced, certified and everything informed me that bigger guys like me need a wider grip when doing push presses and other related movements).
Anyways 225 is a joke for push presses for me now… I did 10 singles today and it was a breeze, I’ll be doing 245 next week and I guarantee I’ll push press 275 inside of 6 months.
Watching your video really helped me! I was grabbing the bar WAY too close, before.
Peace.[/quote]
Thanks man,
I do ignore it from now on but I can’t believe that bodyguard dude thinks we’re dumb enough not to know he’s Tielie as well… lol He must have a lot of free time on his hands.
Anyways, yes feel free to try it and let me know how that split treats you. I adjusted it a little over a 14 days period now to give it just a little more rest. I want to look forward to the next work-out session, that’s always a good sign you’re on the right track.
[quote]WS4JB wrote:
Fred, ignore the haters, great job, its cool to see somebody training with a combination of powerlifting,olympic,bodybuilding, and plyos. I might even steal that training schedule you put up earlier for my summer workouts.
–WS4[/quote]
Fred,
I train similar to you (deadlifts, sprints, plyos) and have similar goals (max speed and improving vertical). I just wanted to say that I really like your approach to training and that you’re an inspiration. Keep up the good work and don’t worry about the haters.
-EIC