potf X… plz show me a study that proves that excess protein intake (past 0.8g/lbl) results in better gains in str and size… cuz i have yet to find one.
[/quote]
Studies? ? ? ? ? Who needs studies when you have results right in front of you - your results - the only results that matter. (or should I say lack of results).
What you are doing is not working.
DO SOMETHING DIFFERENT.
A good place to start is following the lead of others who have achieved what you want.
They say eat more, especially protein.
Show me the studies where people have eaten hardly anything like you, and become really strong.
It can happen, my examples are people who did hard labour for a long time on minimal diet / starving who didn’t build much size but built a bit of strength. But it takes years. They don’t get enormously strong (on a crap diet). And they are still probably eating more than you. And then they don’t go for a run / play soccer when they finish on the farm.
IronHead don’t take everyone bagging you out the wrong way, I am sure everyone thinks it is good that you want to look after your health, it is just that you have picked up a lot of nonsense ideas about diet. Throw those ideas out the window, for a few months at least, and see if eating more - more than you EVER have - works. IF not, then go back to what you are doing now and accept you won’t get stronger.
You are not gaining strength because you are a fucking panzy. Even when i wasn’t eating enough calories to put on size i could still make some strength gains, although the strength gains came alot easier when i upped my calories. Your not gaining strength because you dont want to gain strength, you dont know how to push yourself. Don’t ask us for advice when you dont take it and you tell us how much you know about how to set up a proper program, when you only squat 180 and bench 160. And oh yeah the biggest and strongest guys in the world only eat 0.8 grams of protein per pound of body weight because some pencil neck scientist said so, give me a break. Get in the gym, lift some fucking heavy weights, eat alot of food, and you will get stronger, that simple.
[quote]binford wrote:
You are not gaining strength because you are a fucking panzy. Even when i wasn’t eating enough calories to put on size i could still make some strength gains, although the strength gains came alot easier when i upped my calories. Your not gaining strength because you dont want to gain strength, you dont know how to push yourself. Don’t ask us for advice when you dont take it and you tell us how much you know about how to set up a proper program, when you only squat 180 and bench 160. And oh yeah the biggest and strongest guys in the world only eat 0.8 grams of protein per pound of body weight because some pencil neck scientist said so, give me a break. Get in the gym, lift some fucking heavy weights, eat alot of food, and you will get stronger, that simple. [/quote]
Dude the problem is not my training… i lift heavy and hard and i’m following a very renowned rotuine to a tee.
Your probably right the problem is not your training program, the problem is you. If you have only gained 10 lbs in a year on your squat and you squat is 180 and haven’t gained any on your bench and your bench is 160, the problem is YOU, not your training program. Why do you even go to the gym and waste your time, put some more weight on the bar you panzy.
Push yourself a little bit, damn. Anyone can get stronger on any program if you push yourself, which you are obviously not doing.
[quote]binford wrote:
Your probably right the problem is not your training program, the problem is you. If you have only gained 10 lbs in a year on your squat and you squat is 180 and haven’t gained any on your bench and your bench is 160, the problem is YOU, not your training program. Why do you even go to the gym and waste your time, put some more weight on the bar you panzy.
Push yourself a little bit, damn. Anyone can get stronger on any program if you push yourself, which you are obviously not doing. [/quote]
But…but there are studies that show that antioxidents are formed if he eats food, therefore, if he can just avoid eating, he can live forever!
[quote]IRoNStaLLion wrote:
binford wrote:
You are not gaining strength because you are a fucking panzy. Even when i wasn’t eating enough calories to put on size i could still make some strength gains, although the strength gains came alot easier when i upped my calories. Your not gaining strength because you dont want to gain strength, you dont know how to push yourself. Don’t ask us for advice when you dont take it and you tell us how much you know about how to set up a proper program, when you only squat 180 and bench 160. And oh yeah the biggest and strongest guys in the world only eat 0.8 grams of protein per pound of body weight because some pencil neck scientist said so, give me a break. Get in the gym, lift some fucking heavy weights, eat alot of food, and you will get stronger, that simple.
Dude the problem is not my training… i lift heavy and hard and i’m following a very renowned rotuine to a tee.
[/quote]
You are right, your problem seems to be an inability to realize you are the problem.
Someday you will be old enough to realize you don’t know everything anymore.
[quote]IRoNStaLLion wrote:
again i don’t care if i gain mass along with strength (as long as i don’t put on huge amounts since i play soccer and run)
In regards to the protein thing i’ve done lots of research on boards and journals and i have yet to find one study that claims that eleveated (more than 0.8g/lbl) protein supports better performance in anyway… i’m also concerned about the long term effects of high protein diets since there have been o studies done on that.[/quote]
You need to listen to these guys. I play soccer as well. For years I had almost no gains, and just figured I wasn’t wired for strength. This past winter I doubled my protein intake to 160g/day. My squat and dead went up ~80lbs in 3 months, respectively. In only gained 2lbs of muscle (and I tried to gain more:) Now this isn’t just from eating, as I changed from doing a WSFSB workout to doing a ME day and DE day. On my ME day I have a 3 week cycle.
Week 1: down week, new exercise at 85-90% of previous max, singles only (not all that taxing, but gets me used to the exercise).
Week 2: 3 rep max
Week 3: 1 rep max
I’m still hitting PRs every cycle on both 3 and 1 RM, even though I’m doing a lot more running than I was Dec-Feb.
The results have really surprised me. However, I know that eating more was the key, as I would never have been able to recover from the extra workouts without more food. Don’t forget, I didn’t gain any real mass, and I tried - just did too much running playing indoor soccer.
I seriously dont think he’ll get thru the plateau even if he ate more…
In any other case for sure more food=bigger muscles=more strength
but with his lifts 180/165 and not being able to make any decent gains in past year…must not be pushing very hard.
even with those calories SHOULD be able to make some gains on the bench i’d think… even if its just doing nothing but pushups!!!
Thats a pretty good 3 week cycle, i like the down week in there. I probably need to start doing that as i get pretty beat up doing all max effort all the time. How many singles do you do at 90%?
[quote]gkearnan wrote:
IRoNStaLLion wrote:
again i don’t care if i gain mass along with strength (as long as i don’t put on huge amounts since i play soccer and run)
In regards to the protein thing i’ve done lots of research on boards and journals and i have yet to find one study that claims that eleveated (more than 0.8g/lbl) protein supports better performance in anyway… i’m also concerned about the long term effects of high protein diets since there have been o studies done on that.
You need to listen to these guys. I play soccer as well. For years I had almost no gains, and just figured I wasn’t wired for strength. This past winter I doubled my protein intake to 160g/day. My squat and dead went up ~80lbs in 3 months, respectively. In only gained 2lbs of muscle (and I tried to gain more:) Now this isn’t just from eating, as I changed from doing a WSFSB workout to doing a ME day and DE day. On my ME day I have a 3 week cycle.
Week 1: down week, new exercise at 85-90% of previous max, singles only (not all that taxing, but gets me used to the exercise).
Week 2: 3 rep max
Week 3: 1 rep max
I’m still hitting PRs every cycle on both 3 and 1 RM, even though I’m doing a lot more running than I was Dec-Feb.
The results have really surprised me. However, I know that eating more was the key, as I would never have been able to recover from the extra workouts without more food. Don’t forget, I didn’t gain any real mass, and I tried - just did too much running playing indoor soccer.[/quote]
My bro is 145lbs eats 5000 cals a day and is barely gaining. Hope that helps.
You need to try and listen to some of the folks on here. You seem to think you know what to do, you’re still a kid. If someone who IS BIG tells you to eat more, try it.
[quote]IRoNStaLLion wrote:
but 2500 cals for a 145 lbl is alot isnt’ it??
I mean sure i ate like 3500 cals/day it might be easier to gain str but… i should still be gaining on 2500 shouldn’t I??
Also one of the reasons why i’m reluctant to take in so many cals is becasue its known that caloric restriction can potenialy decrease the risk of disease, agiging, and increase life expectancy due to lower prodduction of ROS’s[/quote]
[quote]IRoNStaLLion wrote:
nopal_juventus wrote:
Why do you want to gain strength? Do you want to be a better soccer player, or are you just interested in gaining maximal strength.
both… my goal to increase str is also so i can become faster and more explosive.
[/quote]
Okay IRoNStaLLion, you’re just not getting it, are you? I’m a 100M sprinter who is on pace to run a 10.5 this year and I currently weigh between 200-205. In order to get strong, to get fast, you need to eat and gain muscle.
In the last year I’ve put on more than thirty pounds and I’m stronger and faster than ever. So, my advice to you is eat like a MFer (3500-4500 calories a day) and get plenty of protein (200+ grams). You’ll get heavier, but you’ll also get stronger and faster. Trust me.
And if you’re worrying about not being able to run, trust me, gaining weight does not hurt.
As far as training, just bang out 5-6 sets of 3 on squats or deadlifts once a week with some heavy posterior chain accessory lifts and some split squats. With your running, this should be enough training to get you strong without overtraining.
Anyway, just listen to people with experience sometimes, and not just your little “studies”. Sometimes experience beats out a degree.
I mean sure i ate like 3500 cals/day it might be easier to gain str but… i should still be gaining on 2500 shouldn’t I??
[/quote]
Should be? Obviously not. If it’s not working now, it won’t magically start soon.
I played soccer in high school, was about 5’8" and 145. And I ate everything I could get my hands on. I believed a large, supreme pizza was the single serving size. I didn’t gain weight until I stopped running so much.
If you love soccer, great! Don’t stop running, but you’re going to have to increase your calories drastically to get any changes in your body.
I am a teenager that once stagnated in progress myself. Know what the problem was? I didn’t bring any attitude with me when I trained and read all this scientific jargon on the strength-speed continuum and trained according to it thinking I would get hugely fast and explosive. To give you an idea I was deadlifting about 185 x 6 and struggling to overhead pressing 90ish lbs for reps. Then I realized the most important thing in lifting was growin some balls and fucking tearing heavy weights off the floor and off the rack and less than a year later I deadlift about 300 x 3 and overhead press 135 for 3 x 5. Nothing to write home about but better than most people my age.
I used to be caught with all this relaitve strength shit as well. I’m a wrestler and would always be paranoid about what weight class I would make next year and bitch about if what I ate would make me fat or not. Guess what? After I stopped bitching about eating and ate to gain muscle instead of preventing fat gain my relative strength went up. Now I eat 3,000 calories a day and am training on a Westside template improving on my ME exercises basically every week. I’m also about 40 lbs heavier than when I was deadlifting 185 x 6. Not impressive but a big improvement.
Get a training partner who’s crazy and makes you do (what you think to be) way to much, and holds you to the same work out for 3-4 months.
It’s true that you need to put on some weight at your height, but you need to push harder – with a 5x5 squatting workout you should probably feel like you’re about to die… after each set. Then sit down for 5 minutes and do it again. Beginners and even fairly experienced lifted make considerable gains on terrible programs because they bust their asses.
Do westside for skinny bastards or 5x5 or whatever for 4 months, eat an extra 1000 calories a day, and pretend that you’ve never even heard of overtraining and you’ll make some great gains.
i guess i could eat more and see what happens… but still my gains were low even for someone only eating 2500 cals/day…
Sure eating more might make it easier to gain str, but my gains over the past year should have still been better given the fact that i was following decent training protocols… I worried that my lack of STR could be due to something else, and by eating a shitload and gaining weight, my strenth would still go up in pitiful amounts… thus iwould decrease in relative strength
please don’t assume that i don’t push my self… each week i try to set a 5rm PR on squats/bench/dead and i push that last rep out.
about protein intake… i would love to take in 1.5-2g/lbl… heck i love chicken!! But aren’t any of you at least a little concerned as to what the long term effects would be of such high protein intake?? as i said there have been no studies done on that…
[quote]RJ24 wrote:
IRoNStaLLion wrote:
nopal_juventus wrote:
Why do you want to gain strength? Do you want to be a better soccer player, or are you just interested in gaining maximal strength.
both… my goal to increase str is also so i can become faster and more explosive.
Okay IRoNStaLLion, you’re just not getting it, are you? I’m a 100M sprinter who is on pace to run a 10.5 this year and I currently weigh between 200-205. In order to get strong, to get fast, you need to eat and gain muscle.
In the last year I’ve put on more than thirty pounds and I’m stronger and faster than ever. So, my advice to you is eat like a MFer (3500-4500 calories a day) and get plenty of protein (200+ grams). You’ll get heavier, but you’ll also get stronger and faster. Trust me.
And if you’re worrying about not being able to run, trust me, gaining weight does not hurt.
As far as training, just bang out 5-6 sets of 3 on squats or deadlifts once a week with some heavy posterior chain accessory lifts and some split squats. With your running, this should be enough training to get you strong without overtraining.
Anyway, just listen to people with experience sometimes, and not just your little “studies”. Sometimes experience beats out a degree.
RJ
[/quote]
RJ, since you’re a sprinter/lifter, do you think i could do WS4SB on a three day cycle (ME upper, ME lower, RE full body) with my sprints and running without overtraining?