What are people’s favourite/recommended boxing books for learning?
The more I box the more I realise I have to learn.
Man, I have like 1 million and 1 questions about footwork, head movement etc. Always looking to learn and I love reading online so figured books could be golden for info
[quote]CarltonJ wrote:
What are people’s favourite/recommended boxing books for learning?
The more I box the more I realise I have to learn.
Man, I have like 1 million and 1 questions about footwork, head movement etc. Always looking to learn and I love reading online so figured books could be golden for info[/quote]
Any questions you have; ask. Through questions we all learn.
[quote]donnydarkoirl wrote:
[quote]CarltonJ wrote:
What are people’s favourite/recommended boxing books for learning?
The more I box the more I realise I have to learn.
Man, I have like 1 million and 1 questions about footwork, head movement etc. Always looking to learn and I love reading online so figured books could be golden for info[/quote]
Any questions you have; ask. Through questions we all learn.
[/quote]
Awesome, sure.
I know thereâ??s a lot of knowledge here, and I always appreciate the input. Just wary I maybe have too many questions ha.
But ye, here goes.
Gloves
For a 168lbs fighter, should I be using 10oz gloves for pad and bag work? I feel I?ve exhausted using 14-16oz at this stage (my speed is good, technique needs refining), and I see a lot of professionals using what appear to be very small (10oz) and limiting 16oz to sparring.
Reactions
Do you guys do any reaction timing training? If so, id love to hear what drills. On the one hand, I think reactions are kind of like power. In that your born with it and/or you can develop this skill most when young. Just my opinion. With that said, I understand fast reactions are a huge advantage and therefore very willing to work at it.
One thing I?ve heard quite a few fighters who stepped in the ring with Mayweather say is, whilst hes got fast hands, his footwork and reactions are out of this world. Recent case in point, anyone seen that clip where he has hands down by his side, slips 3 berto jabs and then lands a left hook?!
Footwork Question
Currently I do 3 x 3 minute shadowboxing-esq rounds (twice per week) dedicated solely to footwork. I focus on 2 movements:
Pivoting (left and right)
The ?L? step (moving back with the lead foot, followed by moving right with the rear foot).
Wondered if there are any other ?moves? to practice.
Head movement
Without a doubt my worst attribute. I?m so lazy with it on the heavy bag and in shadow boxing when I practice, some of my moves just seem to lack purpose.
I combine it with blocking and do 3 x 3 minute shadowboxing rounds once per week. Any drills or tips people particularly like are very welcome.
[quote]CarltonJ wrote:
Gloves
For a 168lbs fighter, should I be using 10oz gloves for pad and bag work? I feel I?ve exhausted using 14-16oz at this stage (my speed is good, technique needs refining), and I see a lot of professionals using what appear to be very small (10oz) and limiting 16oz to sparring.
[/quote]
Padwork is for refining technique.
As such you should use as close to a competition glove as you can.
Even slight differences in weight will cause you to throw in a different motor pattern, so when refining technique, use as close to competition as possible (10oz.)
The bag should be similar. The only difference is with the bag we are unloading on a static target. This can take wear on your hands/joints etc. real quick. I use 10oz and double wrap for bag sessions, but theres nothing wrong with a 12 or 14oz glove here.
[quote]CarltonJ wrote:
Reactions
Do you guys do any reaction timing training? If so, id love to hear what drills. On the one hand, I think reactions are kind of like power. In that your born with it and/or you can develop this skill most when young. Just my opinion. With that said, I understand fast reactions are a huge advantage and therefore very willing to work at it.
[/quote]
In 2013 I was part of a study in the university of Limerick measuring reaction times.
In the study I performed ok. A “good” rating.
I know of young boxers who received “excellent” reviews. But when we get to the boxing gym, I was out performing them.
In our sport, reactions are vital. Even more vital is the knowledge of what reaction to use for each stimulus.
So, while I understand what you’re getting at, my take is; dont over complicate; spend your time mastering techniques and principals and once you have grasped the movements, try adding speed.
[quote]CarltonJ wrote:
One thing I?ve heard quite a few fighters who stepped in the ring with Mayweather say is, whilst hes got fast hands, his footwork and reactions are out of this world. Recent case in point, anyone seen that clip where he has hands down by his side, slips 3 berto jabs and then lands a left hook?!
[/quote]
This is related to the above.
Knowledge on when and how to react can make a spontaneous or poorly contemplated attack look novice like.
Additionally; timing beats speed.
They called Archie Moore “the Mongoose,” famed for catching even his most snake-fast opponents; despite the fact that he wasn’t an athletic freak of nature.
Timing beats speed; knowing what tool to implement and when makes that lethal.
[quote]CarltonJ wrote:
Footwork Question
Currently I do 3 x 3 minute shadowboxing-esq rounds (twice per week) dedicated solely to footwork. I focus on 2 movements:
Pivoting (left and right)
The ?L? step (moving back with the lead foot, followed by moving right with the rear foot).
Wondered if there are any other ?moves? to practice.
[/quote]
When we were amateurs they used to tell us the first form of defence was our guard.
Complete manure.
Your feet are your first form of defence. If you can move and evade an opponents attack’s there is no need for a guard!
So footwork is your most basal defence.
Then I employ what I refer to as “footwork defenses.”
These include;
The Step away
Sidestepping
Pivotting
Pull Counters
and more variations
[quote]CarltonJ wrote:
Head movement
Without a doubt my worst attribute. I?m so lazy with it on the heavy bag and in shadow boxing when I practice, some of my moves just seem to lack purpose.
I combine it with blocking and do 3 x 3 minute shadowboxing rounds once per week. Any drills or tips people particularly like are very welcome.
[/quote]
Its difficult to focus on head movement when you’re working out on the bag.
My girlfriend is national ladies champion. On the offense she is world class; but she struggles to integrate head movement to her game.
Padwork is one method of improving head movement.
Using a countering system, you can set up nice drills there.
Outside of that, I think shadowboxing in the mirror is really helpful.
In some other thread I outlined how I rehearse myy head movement;
I outlined it bettter back then, but essentially his is how it goes;
Stimulus > Defence > reaction
So I visualise an attack coming at me; I rrespond with a defence; and I counter his aggression
Opponents Jab > Outside Slip (R) > Straight, LH, Straight
I will then drill that repeatedly in the mirror so that my defense is quick and smooth and my counter is explosive and accurate.
Awesome stuff Donny, a real insight and a great deal of wisdom.
[quote]LondonBoxer123 wrote:
Awesome stuff Donny, a real insight and a great deal of wisdom. [/quote]
We recite the same textbook mate
Ask and thou shall receive.
yea, agreed, awesome post. really appreciate the time taken.
[quote]CarltonJ wrote:
Footwork Question
Currently I do 3 x 3 minute shadowboxing-esq rounds (twice per week) dedicated solely to footwork. I focus on 2 movements:
Pivoting (left and right)
The ?L? step (moving back with the lead foot, followed by moving right with the rear foot).
Wondered if there are any other ?moves? to practice.
[/quote]
When we were amateurs they used to tell us the first form of defence was our guard.
Complete manure.
Your feet are your first form of defence. If you can move and evade an opponents attack’s there is no need for a guard!
So footwork is your most basal defence.
Then I employ what I refer to as “footwork defenses.”
These include;
The Step away
Sidestepping
Pivotting
Pull Counters
and more variations
funnily enough, andy lees trainer, adam booth, actually tweeted something to this affect recently. I cant recall which professional fight was on tv, but he said “keeping hands up does NOT mean u have an effective defence, to criticise low hands shows ignorance 2 the greatest of defensive fighters”
I favourited the tweet, it was the first time I had an eye opening to the importance of movement. I use to think I need to put my gloves up, how else can I stop getting hit.
I aren’t very proficient at this whole quoting thing…
I respect Adam Booth. I think he is more intelligent than he is given credit for.
[quote]LondonBoxer123 wrote:
Awesome stuff Donny, a real insight and a great deal of wisdom. [/quote]
X2 on this ^^^^^^^^^^^^, one of the best I have ever read on boxing. Thank you, I learned a lot and appreciate you taking the time to share.
Guys, don’t thank me for talking about boxing.
I’m just grateful that I found something I love and I grateful for the forum here where I can share my views and learn so mu h from all of you.
What are peoples thoughts on the rear hand right hook (left for a southpaw)?
Ive read some articles discrediting it and saying it isnt trained, but i seem to see quite a few fighters using it. For one when they are getting round a fighters guard (the punches kovalev throws at the end when he stops pascal come to mind - ill post the video below).
Im curious about how the rear hand is used. I only throw straights and the uppercut normally. I tried throwing that looping, overhand right maidana throws and it felt so awkward. BUT, on oone (and only one lol) occasion in sparring recently, at close range, i managed to use it after a jab to the body and it worked really really well - i caught the guy flush right on the mouth area.
34:45 onwards is to when im referring (there also a beautiful left hook mixed in there that pascal never recovers from).
Nice one Carlton, now youve opened a can of worms
(1.0) THE REAR HAND ATTACK
(1.1) Hierarchy of Boxing Attacks
A boxer is said to have twelve basic offensive tools;
1 The Jab
2 The Straight
3 The Left Hook
4 The Right Uppercut
5 The Left Uppercut
6 The Right Hook
Each of these punches can be thrown to the head and body. (6 x 2 = 12 punches.)
I have applied a numeral representation for each punch. The numbers not only represent the importance of each punch in my opinion, but also then frequency of use.
No. 6 as you can see is the Right Hook. The least used. The least useful punch(?)
It is the least used because of complications I will touch on below.
But with twelve basic tools at our disposal, a coach would be negligent not to teach it.
(1.2) THE DIFFICULTY IN LANDING RIGHT HOOKS
Landing a right hook can be difficult and extremely dangerous because of two separate issues.
(1.2.1) Physical Complications
Firstly, the rear hand, shoulder and hip are the farthest from the opponent. In order to land this punch we have to establish range, with a foundation quite close to the opponent.
Our boxing stance projects our front foot, hip and shoulder forward, a defensive barrier in front of your centre line; with the right foot, hip and shoulder taking up the rear; the engine responsible for generating forward momentum.
As such, the boxer must be very close to land a true Rear Hook and there is always the danger of squaring up and being tagged yourself.
(Please bear with my mechanics;)
In order to attack with a rear hook; the rear foot, Hip and shoulder must be sufficiently close to pivot on the rear foot, rotate the rear hip internally, rotate the rear shoulder internally
and direct the force with a shortened rear lever onto the side of the opponents temple or jaw.
(1.2.2) IGNORANCE
As a pale, impolite Irishman, I am a product of one of the best amateur boxing systems in the world. I have trained all over our country and I have also had the good fortune to train and compete extensively abroad. I can only recall two occasions where a coach sought to educate me on the rear hand, (for me the right.)
Previously, I outlined the twelve basic punches. These are the essentials that a boxer must learn. However, the range of strikes available is not restricted to this list. There are modified punches, there are hybrid punches, there are punches with different angles, weighting and paces; all for different purposes.
Nowhere is this more apparent than in the case of the right hand.
Throw the right hook is an instruction commonly called from ringside. It is easier to see openings from the ring apron and this can be quite a good instruction.
IF the boxer has been schooled correctly on his right hands.
Because in reality, the right hand is the most bastardised punch in boxing.
Consider this; for the head alone the rear hand can be used to throw; The Straight. The Cross. The Overhand. The Hook or The Swing.
Referring to these referred to as simply right hands is evidence to the gradual dilution of our sport. A lazy generic term cannot do justice to the intricacies of the sport or the craftsmanship of its masters.
(1.3) REAR HAND PUNCHING
(1.3.1) Straight
The straight is the principal rear hand punch. Having already secured the opponent in range, momentum is generated from the rear foot. A 90 degree pivot and slight dip of the hips will send weight violently forward. The right arm is extended, rotating so that when the arm reaches full extension, the fist will simultaneously rotate with the palm facing the floor and the knuckles facing the ceiling. The rear shoulder is retracted to add velocity and your rear shoulder will travel to the fore, The front foot acts as a brake mechanism, so that the weight travelling forward will not allow the boxer to stumble forward or over reach. The rear arm travels straight. It does not cross the centreline of the body. Standing straight if you raise the arm, this will show you its trajectory. Any further extension is a result of the rotation of the hips and shoulder; propelling the punch toward the opponent
(1.3.2) Cross
The Cross is a punch from the rear hand which is allowed to cross the centre line. In my experience this punch is most useful in aggressive situations when pursuing the opponent. The range is closer than that of the straight and when thrown less rotation of the hips is utilised. If the straight sees the rear shoulder travel 180 degrees, the cross sees the shoulder travel only 90 degrees. This punch has the benefit of bringing the rear shoulder across the chin, for a nice physical barrier against an opponents left hook.
(1.3.3) Overhand
The rear overhand is commonly confused with the hook. An aggressive attack this punch looks to land over the high lead glove of opponent. With the same pivot mechanics as the above, the overhand sees the boxer form a 45 degree bend at the elbow. This means the punch will not travel straight and instead arc outside and over the opponents lead glove. The overhand will have a crashing effect travelling downward on the opponent and will often be used to try and crack a tight guard. The punch lands with the palm downwards and in experience, this is a good injury preventative as the muscles of the forearm are not under tension, allowing the blow to land solidly without damage to the boxers wrists.
(1.3.4) Hook
The hook is the phantom punch of boxing. Everyone has claimed to see it, but Im not sure how many people have actually seen this punch. To throw a rear hook, the distance must be closed and the opponent in fixed range. Weight may be transferred back to the rear hip, loading for the punch.
The lead foot may be adjusted to allow space for a lot of power to transfer forward. The rear foot, hip and shoulder pivots forward violently and the punch is directed with the elbow bent as range requires. The fist lands with a hammer grip; the palm facing the boxer and knuckle facing the opponent. It is easy to get weighed down in detail, but inside or outside this punch must be thrown quickly. I will try to link an example.
www.wevideo.com/view/488800619
(1.3.5) The Swing
The Swing is the most natural attack.
Similarly to the hook the swing has a lateral trajectory and may be targeted to travel over the shoulder on route to the chin.
The name betrays a less calculated attack; but this sweeping punch can be a great finisher as evidenced by Kovalev.
Another quality post. If im understanding you correctly youre saying the punch I reference by kovalev is more of a right hand variation, than an actual hook. which I can def see why if so.
[quote]CarltonJ wrote:
Another quality post. If im understanding you correctly youre saying the punch I reference by kovalev is more of a right hand variation, than an actual hook. which I can def see why if so. [/quote]
I’d loosely call that a hook, sure.
He was targettting his area and decided to go bout it laterally. Seemed to close the gap with his lead arm and let loose when he got his range.
Pascal covered up, so he let rip with a series of hard, hard blows.
General boxing question; how good do people think roy jones jr was?
I’ve heard both hes a top 5 goat, or that he didnt fight some of the top names in 90s.
for instance, I believe max Kellerman rates him top 5 and has mentioned him alongside sugar ray Leonard. Then I hear others say something contrary.
I don’t know much about 90s boxing, nor too many of his opponents. From what I know, I guess maybe he wasn’t the same time as eubank, benn or some of the other super middleweights? Eubank in particular who I believe had his best years very early 90s.
So yea, be interested to see how highly people rate him? He certainly seemed to be lightning fast, and I know we went from 160-heavyweight.