Diet Questions

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:

  1. Go up in steps of 50g per day. So bump carbs intake to 125g on cardio days and 150g on weight days. Next week, bump it up by another 50 if you have not yet added fat.

  2. I don’t like to uniformly jack up protein. Yes, at first, this will give you some gains. But in the moderate term it will simply get your body used to that amount and anabolism will go down. What I’d do is increase protein intake by 100g for the week but instead of adding 15g or so per day, keep 6 days the same at 195g and have one very high protein day at 300g.

Heck it would be even better to LOWER protein intake on one day to 100g and have 400g the next day.

Something like:

Monday: 195g
Tuesday: 195g
Wednesday: 100g
Thursday: 400g
Friday: 195g
Saturday: 195g
Sunday: 195g

Your most important workout would be place on Wednesday as the contrast between super low and super high protein intake will create an anabolic surge.

  1. First don’t take carbs post-workout (read my para-workout threads)… put all 65g BEFORE the workout. Since you are adding 50g of carbs on your workout days, have them pre-workout too. 50g of LOW GLYCEMIC carbs 60 minutes before and 65g of HIGH GLYCEMIC carbs plus protein 10-15 minutes prior to the workout.

On the other days add the 50g of carbs at breakfast.[/quote]

CT,
Curious why Wednesday, the low protein day (100g), is the anabolic day? Would have guessed Thrus or Friday to be…

Thanks

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
ddelmast wrote:
CT-

Since I weigh around 170lbs, according to your guidelines you’ve provided for mass gain I would need roughly:

215g carbs
215g protein
80-90g of fat

If I eat 5 meals per day outside of the Para-workout nutrition, how would you break up the nutrient composition of each meal? Should I just divide the above numbers by 5 and eat that much at each meal or should break it down a different way?

Thanks,
Darian

You could do that… or ingest the carbs in the first two meals of the day and the fat in the other 2. And if you want to be really anal about it ingest one third of the carbs at breakfast, one third in the meal 90 minutes after your workout, and spread the rest throughout the remaining 3 meals.[/quote]

CT-

Thanks for your response, how would this plan look if I wanted to incorporate pulsing into my eating plan?

Here are my nutrient consumption goals per day:

215g carbs
215g Protein
80g fat

Pulse- 12g CH
Breakfast- ~70g carbs 31g Protein 16g fat

Pulse- 12g CH
Lunch- ~24g carbs 31g Protein 16g fat

Pulse- 12g CH
Snack- ~24g carbs 31g Protein 16g fat

Para-Workout nutrition

Pulse- 12g CH
Dinner- ~94g carbs 31g protein 16g fat

Pre bed snack- 43g Protein 16g fat

[quote]mass production wrote:
Christian Thibaudeau wrote:

  1. Go up in steps of 50g per day. So bump carbs intake to 125g on cardio days and 150g on weight days. Next week, bump it up by another 50 if you have not yet added fat.

  2. I don’t like to uniformly jack up protein. Yes, at first, this will give you some gains. But in the moderate term it will simply get your body used to that amount and anabolism will go down. What I’d do is increase protein intake by 100g for the week but instead of adding 15g or so per day, keep 6 days the same at 195g and have one very high protein day at 300g.

Heck it would be even better to LOWER protein intake on one day to 100g and have 400g the next day.

Something like:

Monday: 195g
Tuesday: 195g
Wednesday: 100g
Thursday: 400g
Friday: 195g
Saturday: 195g
Sunday: 195g

Your most important workout would be place on Wednesday as the contrast between super low and super high protein intake will create an anabolic surge.

  1. First don’t take carbs post-workout (read my para-workout threads)… put all 65g BEFORE the workout. Since you are adding 50g of carbs on your workout days, have them pre-workout too. 50g of LOW GLYCEMIC carbs 60 minutes before and 65g of HIGH GLYCEMIC carbs plus protein 10-15 minutes prior to the workout.

On the other days add the 50g of carbs at breakfast.

CT,
Curious why Wednesday, the low protein day (100g), is the anabolic day? Would have guessed Thrus or Friday to be…

Thanks[/quote]

It’s a typo, I meant thursday

Coach when having a low protein day in a muscle gaining phase do we keep carbs and fat the same as on other days or do we increase them to make up for the total nutrient loss or can we just keep them the same and just use it as one of our control days. thanks

[quote]kg wrote:
Coach when having a low protein day in a muscle gaining phase do we keep carbs and fat the same as on other days or do we increase them to make up for the total nutrient loss or can we just keep them the same and just use it as one of our control days. thanks[/quote]

I’d increase carbs. So it would also serve the purpose of glycogen loading. Plus, carbs are protein sparing

thanks as always

Is around 30g of dextrose taken only preworkout enough to knock one out of ketosis, even if that’s the only time of day you really consume carbs?

[quote]Patrickahn wrote:
Is around 30g of dextrose taken only preworkout enough to knock one out of ketosis, even if that’s the only time of day you really consume carbs?[/quote]

It will, but by the time you’re done with the workout you’ll be right back in again. I’ve tried even twice that amount before a workout while in ketosis and was right back in it after working out.

Hi CT,

I was reading this article Strength Training, Bodybuilding & Online Supplement Store - T NATION and wondering if I should use this with your bodybuilding program from your body transformationbook Jekyll & Hyde? Or should I stick with the carb cycling?

CT, is there any significant downside to not doing anything after eating? After I finish a meal I always feel like I should be going to exercise and if I just sit down or lie down and do nothing then more of it is going to go towards fat. Is that just unnecessary or would it really be better to be walking around after each meal?

Thanks

If most of the population does not work well on carbs and most people do not mobilize fat well, what can we eat? I don’t ask it sarcastically. To understand the premise of my question: It’s like if one starts to learn every little thing about science, you realize you can’t do anything without causing damage.

[quote]Loui.s wrote:
If most of the population does not work well on carbs and most people do not mobilize fat well, what can we eat? I don’t ask it sarcastically. To understand the premise of my question: It’s like if one starts to learn every little thing about science, you realize you can’t do anything without causing damage.[/quote]

The more I work with various people the more I realize that it’s not so much that people don’t tolerate carbs well, but rather that people tend to eat the wrong carbs, at the wrong time, and in the wrong amount!

I’m not saying that everybody can lose fat on a high carbs diet, but rather that carbs are not as evil as many coaches (including myself a few months back) tend to amply.

The key is not to go overboard, to eat the right carbs (no processed carbs, only a small amount of starch, if at all) and at the right time (mostly peri-workout and in the morning).

I see no reason to go above 90g of fat per day… 70-80g is better in most cases. Protein should be set at 1 to 1.25g per pound (NOT counting peri-workout protein intake) and carb intake is set depending on how the body is reacting.

CT my man, when carb cycling what do you think is more effective for dieting? (Of course keeping and even possibly gaining muscle while losing as much fat as possible)… A once a week HIGH carb up like 2-3 g per lb. of BW. or a every 4-5 day carb up using a moderate carb up say 1.25-1.5 g per lb. of BW.?

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:

I see no reason to go above 90g of fat per day… 70-80g is better in most cases. Protein should be set at 1 to 1.25g per pound (NOT counting peri-workout protein intake) and carb intake is set depending on how the body is reacting.[/quote]

What do you add then if they’re not gaining weight? Say someone is 180lb., that would give them at most 1700 calories + whatever they get from carbs which probably wouldn’t be higher than 300g or so, so thats 2900 calories which really isn’t all that high. So what do you add if they stop gaining weight?

And in your opinion what is wrong with a higher fat intake? It seems many, even Poliquin, still advise lower carbs and thus higher fats to make up the difference.

CT,

I have a few questions about my diet, but first let me tell you how I got here. I am 179 cm tall and until about a 1 1/2 year I used to weight around 90 kg (I think I almost reached 100 kg at my worst). I did not exercise and ate a lot of junk food.

Early in 2008 (circa feb/march) I slowly started changing my diet and loosing weight. By sept/oct my weight dropped to about 75 kg, I think. Things were working nicely, no added sugars, eating small portions more frequently, more whole foods etc.

Since I still had quite a bit of fat left, I tried to stick to the diet. But things started to go wrong – I guess I kept eating less and less without realizing. A couple months later I was under 70 kg without loosing much fat.

So there I was, from morbidly obese to skinny fat. I decided it was time to take things more seriously and hit the gym. I had tried doing some cardio and weight lifting before, but I had no motivation and gave up quickly. This time it would be different. By november I joined the gym and did an evaluation test. The result was a bit shocking, but it was interesting to compare it to my previous attempt at working out.

(2006 - 2008)
Weight … 88,50 - 65,60 kg
Height … 178,50 - 179,50 cm
BF … 27,38 - 13,23 %

At the time I thought my weight was close to 70 kg, so I was a bit surprised.
For the first month or so I did weights 3 times a week, then 5 days a week.
Right now I’m doing a 3 day split (3 sets, 10 reps). I don’t do cardio, except for a quick warm up sometimes. I just can’t stand the treadmill. Recently I tried to run outdoor, and it’s much better, although it’s hard to find time to do it.

After joining the gym I also started to eat more, but tried to keep it clean. I added some carbs (basically brown rice and whole bread) and tried to eat more protein. Gained some weight, and went up to about 72 kg.

A few weeks ago I hurt my shoulder and had to go easy on the training. Since my eating was getting a bit sloppy, I decided it was time to cut a bit and try to loose some fat.

Yesterday I came across the Nutrition for Newbies articles and decided to take the advice and start a food log at FitDay. It’s something I’ve tried briefly before, but didn’t go far.
My calorie intake ended up being way lower than I expected, and I’m not sure it’s correct. I used the “custom food” feature for most of it, adding the information from the label.

This is basically what I’ve been eating for the past few weeks, except I usually don’t drink milk the meals are spread more evenly throughout the day. Occasionally I’ll have a cheat meal or a few beers.
Last time I checked, I was down to 67,6 kg (from 71-72 kg). I certainly did loose some fat and didn’t notice any loss in lean mass.

FOOD LOG

12:00
Cooked brown rice (about 3-4 tablespoons, I guessed 80 grams)
88 cal, 0.7g fat, 18.2g carb, 2g prot
Boiled Broccoli (300 g)
69 cal, 0g fat , 7.2g carb, 8g prot
Turkey Breast (2 pieces / 200 g)
200 cal, 2.2g fat, 2.6g carb, 42g prot

15:30 Post Workout
Wheat/oat bran cereal (3/4 cup, 40 g)
91 cal, 1.7g fat, 13g carb, 6.1g prot
Yogurt fat-free (185 g)
79 cal, 0.6g fat, 11g carb, 7.7g prot
Egg Albumin Powder (2 tbsp, 30 g)
111 cal, 2g fat, 0g carb, 24g prot

18:00
Salad (totals 150g, a mix of lettuce, watercress, radish and carrot), 5 Egg Whites (boiled) and Extra Virgin Olive Oil (1 tbsp)
145 cal, 12.5g fat, 9g carb, 19g prot (the salad is a bit of a guess, though)

19:30
7 Grains Sugarfree Sliced Bread (50g)
112 cal, 1.5g fat, 14g carb, 10.4g prot
Frescal 0% Fat (130g)
99 cal, 0g fat, 5.5g carb, 19.5g prot
Smoked Turkey Breast (45g)
40 cal, 0.6g fat, 0g carb, 8.2g prot
Skim Milk (200 ml) and chocolate (1 tbsp)
109 cal, 1g fat, 16.8g carb, 6.4g prot

20:00
Wheat/oat bran cereal (3/4 cup, 40 g)
91 cal, 1.7g fat, 13g carb, 6.1g prot
Yogurt fat-free (185 g)
79 cal, 0.6g fat, 11g carb, 7.7g prot

01:15
Skim Milk (400 ml)
154 cal, 2g fat, 20g carb, 11.6g prot
Egg Albumin Powder (2 tbsp, 30 g)
111 cal, 2g fat, 0g carb, 24g prot

Total
1,664 Calories
29.3g Fat (16%)
141.6 Carbs (34%)
203.2 Protein (50%)

I just need some feedback, because the sum seens too low for me. For example, the nutrition facts on the broccoli package say 69 calories, but according to FitDay the same serving of cooked broccoli has 162 calories. I’m confused, which one is right? I buy the broccoli froozen and just boil it, perhaps FitDay assumes it’s cooked some other way? What about the brown rice, am I guessing too little for 3 tbsp?

And most important, should I stick to this diet? My goal is to loose fat, I’d like to get my abs showing and loose a bit of fat I still carry on my chest. I just can’t afford to loose any muscle.
My BMR alone is ~1700 calories. Based on today’s food log, it don’t think I’m eating more than 1500-1600.
Other than spending 1 hour at the gym, I don’t do much exercise. Yeah, I walk around a bit but nothing really physically demanding. So I’ll consider my “activity” factor 1,4. That gets me to 2380 calories. For fat loss, my calorie intake should be up to 20% under my DEE, which is ~1900. Am I risking too much? Should I add a few calories?

I’m sure a lot of people think I should be bulking, but my short-term goal is to get my BF% down so I can be confortable with my body.
I plan to keep eating clean and lifting for the rest of my life, so I’ll have plenty of time to slowly add muscle.

Thanks!

[quote]Needmassquick wrote:
Christian Thibaudeau wrote:

I see no reason to go above 90g of fat per day… 70-80g is better in most cases. Protein should be set at 1 to 1.25g per pound (NOT counting peri-workout protein intake) and carb intake is set depending on how the body is reacting.

What do you add then if they’re not gaining weight? Say someone is 180lb., that would give them at most 1700 calories + whatever they get from carbs which probably wouldn’t be higher than 300g or so, so thats 2900 calories which really isn’t all that high. So what do you add if they stop gaining weight?

And in your opinion what is wrong with a higher fat intake? It seems many, even Poliquin, still advise lower carbs and thus higher fats to make up the difference. [/quote]

You might have missed the part where I say that this excludes the peri-workout protocol.

The peri-workout protocol alone has around 1200 calories, so I really doubt that you’ll only get 1700 calories per day!!!

With 80g of fat (720 calories), 250 of protein would be 1000 calories. I also recommend a starting point of around 100-150g of carbs outside of the peri-workout period when trying to gain size, so that’s another 400-600 calories.

720+1000+500+1200 = 3400 calories as a starting point. But more importantly 1200 of those nutrients are timed to maximize growth. It’s not just how much nutrients that is important, but also the type and the timing.

But if someone is not gaining from that he should gradually increase carbs intake.

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
You might have missed the part where I say that this excludes the peri-workout protocol.

The peri-workout protocol alone has around 1200 calories, so I really doubt that you’ll only get 1700 calories per day!!!

With 80g of fat (720 calories), 250 of protein would be 1000 calories. I also recommend a starting point of around 100-150g of carbs outside of the peri-workout period when trying to gain size, so that’s another 400-600 calories.

720+1000+500+1200 = 3400 calories as a starting point. But more importantly 1200 of those nutrients are timed to maximize growth. It’s not just how much nutrients that is important, but also the type and the timing.

But if someone is not gaining from that he should gradually increase carbs intake.
[/quote]

Actually I did see that part about the peri-workout nutrition, I just considered that the “300g of carbs” I listed, I Guess it’s significantly higher than that (and I counted protein as 225). Thanks for the answer.

This is what I’m talking about. Let’s say, I have here 1/2 cup of brown rice, 300 grams of broccoli and 200 grams of turkey breast. Just 376 calories… this can’t be right?

I take around 50 grams of simple carbs 15 minutes before training. In the morning I take around 150 grams of berries and 1 orange 1 hour post training.

My rate of fat loss is slow, but my strength is increasing enormously even doing HIIT 4 a week (get jacked is amazing)

If I’m feel a bit flat, even with the cheat meal of sunday. Can I increase the carbs before the workout 25 grams more without be worry about fat lose?

If I separate HIIT from the workout, Can I intake some carbs after?

I’m astonished how my bodyweight no varies even decresing protein a bit, I’m on 6th week. My bodyfat improve slowly, so I’m putting mass, but I don’t know why following all your plan I can’t drops bodyfat like another porces I did.

But the most important thing I’m learniing is that I’m be able to handle month to month my work capacity and low reps. I’ve crashed all my marks! and I’m putting mass without burn my adrenal system. Months ago that was a dream for me.

I would like to finish the get jacked program with a good bodyfat percentage to begin I, bodybuilder with all the stuff. I’m very excited.

Thanks

I ordered some PS, and when i looked at it online it said it contianed 500mg of PS. However when I received it actually containes 150 mg of PS and 50 mg of soybean extract. Should I keep it, or get some more without the soybean extract? Thanks for any reply.