Christian - Changing Technique

Bigger Stronger Leaner Powerlifting & Strength Sports
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Christian,

I posted awhile back about the bulgarian technique and my coach and I fooled around with lifting like Gardev vs. Vanev and we found out Gardev’s technique suits me the best. I have only been lifting for about 8 months so I can still change my technique because my motor patterns are still pliable to a degree. So how would I go about reteaching myself this technique for example how many sets and reps and how many times a week should I spend on it and how many times should I spend on certain segments and how should I progress with weights while reteaching myself. I am asking you this because my coach is leaving for the summer and I am pretty much on my own. Also do you have any info on how the Bulgarians started their beginner lifters in their program because I know they just didnt throw them in the max out 6 times a week program, any info would be much appreciated. Thank you for your time.

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This gives me the perfect opportunity to tell this story. I guess it was just last year. Seems like it was longer ago than that. I was in the gym & had just finished doing some C&J’s and was about to do some supplemental jerk work since it’s my weakest lift. While I was setting up the power rack for some overhead supports some people walk in and start talking to the gym owner. I here “Bulgarian…bla bla bla…gymnast…gold medalist…train…” So I’m thinking that some Bulgarian Gymnast needs a place to train…NO!!! Freaking Galabin Boevski (Yeah Olympic gold medalist, world champion, world record holder) is visiting the States and is staying with Olympic Gymnast Gold Medalist Jordan Kushtov(who owns a training facility here in OKC for gymnasts). Anyways He was here for 2 months and I got to train with him. He even helped me quite a bit, but until the last week I thought the only English that he knew was “No, No good.” Let see very day I train with Chad Vaughn (multi time US Champ an 2004 Olympian), Loreen Miller (3x US Champ & World Games Silver medalist), Jodi Wilhite (Currently ranked 4th in women’s overall). So I’ve trained with some super strong fools but Galabin was insane. He weighed like 155lbs at the time & i never in two months saw him front squat less than 440lb for a triple & he front squated 6 DAYS A WEEK, and we’re not talking 1 set, no 4-6 sets every day. I got tons of stories about the dude. Maybe sometime I’ll share some of them Maybe even share what he told us about trainging. Really good info (Westside immediately came to mind…hint hint), but for now I’m out of time.

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What a breath of fresh air! I have been looking at that ridiculous go heavy board for a couple of days and getting a bit down with all the bs about how europeans are cheaters, its all drugs, US lifters are pure as the virgin snow, etc., etc. Those chumps take this shit way to friggin seriuosly. I am always eager to hear training philosophies of our European counterparts, please post some more or even PM me if you wouldn’t mind.

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I would love to hear some stories!!!

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Ok, let me first say that I don’t have a computer of my own so these posts might be only once a week. I’ll start off with by giving you his workout actually he made it sound like almost all the Bulgarian lifters did it this way. By the way, alot of this info isn’t new. It is in fact stuff we have heard before, but have be told by most of our American coaches that it was BS or that it only works for people on the juice. I can tell you the when you figure out you body’s tollerance for this program (wich will much much higher than yout think.)it will work excellent for nearly anyone. As with any program it works even better when you juice. Here it goes:

You know how I Westside they have ME and speed days? Well, Bulgaian apperently does basically the same thing. Galabin worked out 6 day a week on this program while he was here. Alternating between the two. Here’s the program, not the basic program mind you, THE program (at least as far as he was concerned):

Speed day (first workout after a day off):
Front Squat
Power Snatch
Power Clean & Power Jerk

ME day:
Front Squat
Snatch
C&J

Mind blowingly simple, huh??

A few things real quick and I’ve got to go.

Remember I said that he FS 200Kg (440lb) every day for triples for 4-6 sets? Well, those were light for him. He actually it looked the same as when he warmed up with the bar. His best is like 250kg (550lb). So here’s what he said: On you speed days you’re going to sqaut lighter but not less that 80%. He also said it doesn’t matter if you FS or BS he just preferred the FS.

Also you are going add 2.5kg (5.5lb) to your snatch, C&J and your Power variations every week, unless you were missing the weights from the week before, in which case you would repeat the previous weeks weights. And very important, every third week is a down week in wich intensity is dropped. But your weight never go under 80% on your heavy days on this week. Your light day’s are under 80% though.

Well that’s it for now. You guys have fun discussing. Next week I’ll talk about how all of us modified this routine in an attempt to make it better & if our attempts succeeded. I’ll also go into his technique a bit. It’s very wierd, but again he says all the good lifters do it this way & you know what I checked some videos in slow motion & he was right even dimas. It is just very very slight in some lifters (but it’s there)& sometime hard to notice even if you’re looking for it. The only two top lifters that I have found to be the exception are Kahki and Gardev. I’ll admit I was reluctant to change. In fact i didn’t change for about two months after he left, but I’ll let you know it can make a big difference. Ohh you want to know so bad don’t you and you want to know now. I’ll give you a hint…the triple extension, take it a throw it right out the window.

You guys can shoot me a PM. And if any of you know my Coach Steve Miller, don’t let him know that I’m telling this stuff.

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Add me to the list of those who want to hear more, give us some details. I heard a little about his training when he was in Michigan, but very few details.

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If you read the Weightlifting Encyclopedia by Arthur Dreschler it goes into more detail about the overall training. They usually train about an hour on and an hour off from nine in the morning till night. The workouts are split so they might go to max squat in the morning. Then powersnatch and clean. Then max in the snatch and clean and jerk. Then do higher rep pulls and presses and max in the front squat. Usually the volume and intenstity is based on what they did the last day. If a guy matched close to his best the next day the workload would still be high. And vice versa.

Keep in mind that these guys have about 10 years experience. They start heavy conditioning around 8 or 10 and don’t even get to compete untill they are 14. So that could be six years of preperation before they start competing. They also have the attitude that you become world champion or you die trying. And in fact they have had guys that have dropped dead from heavey drug use and exhaustion. I guese if you want to be champ you have to train like one.

If you are uncoached the best thing you can do is tape your workouts and make sure you are staying over the bar and finishing the pull especially if your using that bulgarian tech.

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I’m dyin’ to hear this now!! TELL ME!!

(hehe)

Seriously though, I’ve been trying to get better at my olympic lifts for competition, and hearing this and anything that will help me is awesome.

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Man am I pumped up to here what your gonna tell us next. Couple of quick questions if this technique your describing is better than why does your coach steven miller support the Gardev technique (flatfooted pulling), also did Boveski say if the Bulgarians maxed out every day or is that just a myth to fool the masses. Please share all your information.

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Good stuff, I look forward to more!!!

Thanks a ton for posting this info!!!

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Most interseting think I have seen here in a long time.

Rob

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I agree knobbers (hi, btw) this is some good shit! In my Ironmind video of the Bulgarians, I thought Boevski’s technique looked a little weird, it doesn’t seem he gets a good pwok off his hips during his transition, it seems more fluid. Is this what you were saying about “throw the triple extension out the window” Olympiclifter?

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I am going to make an educated guess here. I’ve talked with the current Mexican WL coach who is from Bulgaria and was taught by Abadjiev himself. From what I understand it sounds like the Bulgars are trained to more or less just use the torso as a lever to speedily hoist the bar as opposed to actually pulling the bar with a shrug/hip ext. via classic Russian tech. My understanding is there is no real shrug as all the back muscles are contracted right off the floor, the focus is on speed, speed, and more speed. This is probably the main reason the Bulgars are famous for never doing pulls, they wouldn’t benefit their lifting style. Anyway, this is just a slightly educated guess, and am eagerly awaiting more of the story as everyone else is.

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About a year ago Bud Charniga explained to me why full extension is not optimal. You can read it in his article at the following link:

http://www.dynamic-eleiko.com/
sportivny/library/farticles011.html

Essential Components of Weightlifting Technique - part 2

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hey galvatron, I’ve been using the rusian technique all the while (is that where we go into a full triple extension?) wow do the bulgarians just do like a really fast deadlift?

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I hope I’m not coming off as someone who trying to be a know it all here. I’m just trying to share the wealth and start some good conversation and maybe an argument or two.

I’m going to address some replies that have been posted

Firesnatch:
Steve (my coach) and Artie are friends. In fact Artie is one of the few friends steve has in the sport. They e-mail each other frequently and when Boevski was here, that talked several times a week. As I understand it Artie was kinda taken back by some of the things Boevski said and did.
First off, Boevski did say that there are lifters who train multiple times a day, but he said it’s a “good way to get hurt.” His words not mine. Second, the thing about the pulls and presses, according to Boevski isn’t true, not for the Bulgarian team at least. They have basically 6 lifts to choose from BS, FS, Snatch, C&J, Power Snath and Power C&J. In fact I never saw him do any of the lifts from blocks or the hang. They were all done from the floor. Third, the intensities are all very high. In fact they aren’t suppose to go below 80% during one of the heavy weeks. If I snatch 100kg & c&j 140kg on tue, then according to boevski, I need to go for the same weights on my other heavy days. If you were on a six day training cycle like him that would mean lifting the same weights on thur and sat. And if you suceeded and this was you’re first heavy week in a cycle, the you would try to move up 2.5kg in both lifts. If you did not suceed then you would attempt them again in the second week.

Job85:
Did you know that Boevski and Gardev roomed together for 4 years at one of the training facilities. That doesn’t have anything to do with anything, I just thought it was interesting when he told us that.
Well I assume that you are referring to the videos that steve helped develop? Well, steve and a fellow at my gym (an engineer) went thru tons of lifting videos looking for the ideas on what the perfect technique should look like. Well the engineer determined that, as far as the physics are concerned, with Gardev’s flat footed technique more force could be generated. What he didn’t account for is that there is more to OL than just Force. Like not letting the bar slow down as it passes the knees. After experimenting with Boevski’s techique we learned that what were taught was wrong may in fact actually be right. Steve still does teach the Gardev method to his beginners & then has the switch techniques. It’s actually a very easy switch to make.

Galvatron:
Good info. Alot of stuff that Boevski taught us had to do with keeping the shoulder blades together and the chest out right off of the floor…even when we did our squats.

Rick Jakubowski:
No one said that the full extension was out the window, just the triple extension. I hope my next post will clarify.

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I see it this way. The biggest lifts ever for the clean&jerk are roughly Taranenko with 266 and 265.5, and Pisarenko with 265, then Chemerkin at 262.5, all of whom were Soviet trained. The Bulgars have produced Yanni Marchokov (Jaber for Qatar) whose best is still 255, but has cleaned 263, and for this argument we’ll include Rezzazadeh whose trained by Bulgar methods and is credited with 263. I am a fan of Krastev who claims a gym best of 265. It may be a case of half-dozen of one and six of the other, but it seems to me (and my Georgian friend too who witnessed Chemerkin C&J 270 in training one time) that the Russain program has produced more all-out stronger athletes than the Bulgar system. I know Bulgaria is a much smaller country, but they haven’t had more than a small handful of effective supers nonetheless. Of the twelve or so men who have lifted 260 or more, I think Rezzazadeh is the only non-Russain trained lifter to do so in a competition. This is a very narrow way to look at it, but the C&J is the king of lifts, and the Russain system seems to produce bigger lifts more often, and their lifters careers also seem to last a little longer. If I had a Bulgar coach to work with me full-time, I would most definately use their program, but from my experience the classic Russian program is more forgiving and fun and just as effective. I am still looking forward to hearing Boevski’s approach to technique though.

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Same here I want to hear more about Boveski’s technique. I think I have an idea of part of it like lifting the heals of the ground during the scoop phase and I saw this is dimas slightly but you were right about really having to look at it. Another question I have is Gardev’s technique still equally effective compared to Boveski’s or is Boveski’s alot better, because when I see Chad Vaughn he pulls alot like Gardev and Chad’s a heck of a lifter. So if possible explain step by step Boveski’s technique and how we could all start applying it. Thanks

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I’m not going to sit here and say anything bad about the ressian method. I think that you are right. The Russian method is more fun and interesting. In fact I think it is more flexible. I recently quit my gym because i wanted to do more training in the fundamental strength exercises like pulls and squats and such. I needed more or training to just get stronger. My coach never put me throught the conditioning that Firesnatch was talking about. I think that is a strong point of the russian system. I you need pulls then you have room to do pulls even if that means cutting back on the volume of snatches or c&j’s that you do. So I’m going to go join a commercial type gym tomorrow. I’m going to still to my power snatches and power c&j and I’m going to be able to throw snatch drops and other OL variations (which I think help my lifting alot). I’m also going to be doing lots of squats and DL’s. I’m even going to do dips and some arm work (something that I haven’t done in the last 4 years.) And in 4 years or so when I get out of college I’ll probably go back and give pure OL a try again. Hopefully by then I’ll be able to full squat 500 600 dare I dream of even 700.

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We need to have T-mag start a seperate forum for Olympic lifters. Not just in strength sports becuase most of it seems to be more toward powerlifters posting there, no offense to powerlifters. I just think it would be helpful for the olympic lifters to share their ideas on training, technique, etc… Especially since goheavy the main olympic forum on the net just gets flooded with posts about the insane steroid use of non american lifters and that is why we can’t win world championships…it just gets tiring of seeing that when I really want to see are posts about how to get better at weightlifting.