You may be overloading your shoulders with all of that extra work you are doing for shoulder rehab. I like the motivation and extra work you are putting in, but more isn’t always better. Sometimes you just need to let the area settle down. Personally, I would recommend replacing benching for push ups in your program for a little bit to help improve some scapular health.
[quote]LevelHeaded wrote:
You may be overloading your shoulders with all of that extra work you are doing for shoulder rehab. I like the motivation and extra work you are putting in, but more isn’t always better. Sometimes you just need to let the area settle down. Personally, I would recommend replacing benching for push ups in your program for a little bit to help improve some scapular health.[/quote]
Sweet. I checked out the Diesel Crew, and the Dave Tate’s cure for bench. Kinda funny/sad that Ive been benching wrong for 2 years now…
As for the chest, I’m going to stay away from the Bench/DB Presses for a week to get this scapular deal down. I’ll resume with the correct technique after.
couple more questions:
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If I can’t do pull ups and chin ups, what other good power exercises can I do for the back, besides barbell/db rows?
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and during my time with shoulder rehab, should I be doing normal shoulder exercises like standing military presses, seated arnold presses?
Thanks guys, you just opened the world of correct form to me…
As long as you aren’t getting any pain with the military presses, etc., go for it. In terms of back exercises, try subbing some lat pulldowns if the pull ups/chin ups are causing problems. Really focus on setting the scapula (retraction and depression) with each rep. Also, you have standing cable single arm rows, face pulls, scarecrows, “fat boy”/horizontal pull ups, single arm pull down variations, tons of different back exercises to choose from. Ultimately, a few weeks off of pull ups/chin ups isn’t going to effect your progress and will help allow the injury to heal.
Since my shoulder surgery low cable rows, face pulls, and t-bar rows have become my best friends. I started all with low weight, and the best form possible to feel the muscles working that needed to. Ever back exercise squeeze shoulders back and down. My back was my worst, but is now my best bodypart. Prone shrugs are also better than standing imo.
Lay off any exercise that is bothering, and try to find a variation that does not. It’s OK to use machines too if they take some of the pressure off. Plus, we have only said to do exercises thus far, but DO NOT forget to stretch the chest, pec minor, and lats, Lightly at first, because if you’re still tender they may not feel that great. Remember that rehabing an injury like this is a balancing act between strengthening the weak under active muscles and stretching the stronger overactive ones.
RC = rotator cuff
[quote]casrol28 wrote:
Sweet. I checked out the Diesel Crew, and the Dave Tate’s cure for bench. Kinda funny/sad that Ive been benching wrong for 2 years now…
[/quote]
Well be careful there. Dave teachers PL benching, moving the most weight. Thats different than pec building for BB purposes. In PL benching is all about triceps, front delts and lats, pecs are surely a secondary feature especially for a shirted lifter. If you wanted to build pecs [you probably would not choose Barbell Bench Press] you would execute form differenly
[quote]saps wrote:
[quote]casrol28 wrote:
Sweet. I checked out the Diesel Crew, and the Dave Tate’s cure for bench. Kinda funny/sad that Ive been benching wrong for 2 years now…
[/quote]
Well be careful there. Dave teachers PL benching, moving the most weight. Thats different than pec building for BB purposes. In PL benching is all about triceps, front delts and lats, pecs are surely a secondary feature especially for a shirted lifter. If you wanted to build pecs [you probably would not choose Barbell Bench Press] you would execute form differenly[/quote]
How is the form going to be then for just body building? Do the same principles of keeping the back/scapula muscles tight?
Also, I read somewhere that you should keep the scapula tight for Barbell/DB rows? And I assume the same goes for Dumbbell Chest Press?
[quote]saps wrote:
[quote]casrol28 wrote:
Sweet. I checked out the Diesel Crew, and the Dave Tate’s cure for bench. Kinda funny/sad that Ive been benching wrong for 2 years now…
[/quote]
Well be careful there. Dave teachers PL benching, moving the most weight. Thats different than pec building for BB purposes. In PL benching is all about triceps, front delts and lats, pecs are surely a secondary feature especially for a shirted lifter. If you wanted to build pecs [you probably would not choose Barbell Bench Press] you would execute form differenly[/quote]
And to just clarify, tightening the scapula is basically like imagining holding a pencil in between your shoulder blades, am I correct?
I don’t think saps point was necessarily different form, but more that for aesthetic purposes, the bench press is not the best option for pec hypertrophy.
No it is different form as well. To build pecs you want/need maximal range of motion in the shoulder joint. The elbow out to the side technique places more emphasis on pecs as would bench press to the neck/collarbone. For PL these are all leverage disadvantages and thus would never be used to move big weight. Even a raw bencher is going to bring the bar lower than the BB pec builder would.
For a BB the advantage of the scapula back is it increases the potential stretch and ROM of the pecs.
And yes just squeeze them together if this pencil thing is a mental queue for you great
[quote]LevelHeaded wrote:
I don’t think saps point was necessarily different form, but more that for aesthetic purposes, the bench press is not the best option for pec hypertrophy.[/quote]
Ok. What do you think are the best options then for pec hyper trophy. For now, all Im doing is Bench, DB Flat Press, DB Incline Press, and occasional chest dips.
saps already clarified he meant the flared elbow technique. That technique does place more stress on the pec muscle fibers, but also places a lot more stress on the shoulders. So with your current shoulder issues, I’d recommend staying away from the flared elbow technique.
[quote]saps wrote:
No it is different form as well. To build pecs you want/need maximal range of motion in the shoulder joint. The elbow out to the side technique places more emphasis on pecs as would bench press to the neck/collarbone. For PL these are all leverage disadvantages and thus would never be used to move big weight. Even a raw bencher is going to bring the bar lower than the BB pec builder would.
For a BB the advantage of the scapula back is it increases the potential stretch and ROM of the pecs.
And yes just squeeze them together if this pencil thing is a mental queue for you great[/quote]
What do you think about this video: Bench Press proper form and techniques - YouTube
This was the first result when i typed in bench press form in youtube. These people say that tucking the elbows in actually recruit more of the chest muscles…
I think don’t bench with flared elbows until your shoulder issues are resolved.
Keeping your scapula area tight is all about retraction (squeezing a pencil between the shoulder blades) and depression (pull your shoulder blades down like you’re trying to get them in your back pockets)
[quote]casrol28 wrote:
[quote]LevelHeaded wrote:
I don’t think saps point was necessarily different form, but more that for aesthetic purposes, the bench press is not the best option for pec hypertrophy.[/quote]
Ok. What do you think are the best options then for pec hyper trophy. For now, all Im doing is Bench, DB Flat Press, DB Incline Press, and occasional chest dips.[/quote]
If you want long term pec hypertrophy I’d focus for the short term on shoulder recovery. You are very early in a potential lifting career. Yeah the best thing for pecs will involve dumbbells at some point and will need full ROM lifts. The other part of the equation is also heavy weight. You are in position to do neither if your shoulder is compromised. So simply put take a step back and get the shoulder issue fixed/addressed and that way you can take two steps forward
[quote]ucallthatbass wrote:
I think don’t bench with flared elbows until your shoulder issues are resolved.
Keeping your scapula area tight is all about retraction (squeezing a pencil between the shoulder blades) and depression (pull your shoulder blades down like you’re trying to get them in your back pockets)[/quote]
can you guys give me some pointers on my form. I’ve been trying to switch over to the tighter back/elbows tucked in method. Not that used to it, but hopefully I’ve almost got it. Let me know how it looks.
[quote]ucallthatbass wrote:
I think don’t bench with flared elbows until your shoulder issues are resolved.
Keeping your scapula area tight is all about retraction (squeezing a pencil between the shoulder blades) and depression (pull your shoulder blades down like you’re trying to get them in your back pockets)[/quote]
I’ve been trying to switch over to the tighter back/elbows tucked in method. Not that used to it, but hopefully I’ve almost got it. Let me know how it looks.
1st, what happened to resting the area or getting some soft tissue work done on it.
2nd, from that jerky camera work your grip appears to be really wide, maybe too wide for your frame
3rd, on some reps you hit what appears to be well below you chest and end up with the bar over your eyes, which way way to much north south movement
Heres a side view. Yeah, Ive been taking it easy, only did a couple warm up sets to check out the form. That was the other thing I was wondering–if I was lowering the bar too low on the chest in terms of like way below my nipple line…
Looks fine to me but then again Im more incline towards PL and moving bigger weights. If it were me I’d be pressing more straight up and down than you are with less drift back over the face.
Seriously, if you really have a legit tweak, rest it and get it fixed by someone who specializes in soft tissue work. You’re not going to shrink and lose all your strength if you dont bench at all for the next 2 weeks
alright, thanks everyone for the help, i appreciate it. good luck with your guyses training.