I pretty much do the same thing as STB.
Use a little less than a teaspoon normally and during a meet cycle bump it up to a little more. I don’t take it year round, either.
I think what he is getting at is your body uses more the harder it’s driven so why not take it in a way that accomodates that.
FWIW, I do think it helps my work capacity when I am on it.
[quote]farmerson12 wrote:
[quote]BigSkwatta wrote:
STB
Why would you cycle creatine?
I just take 3-5 grams on normal days, 6-8 grams on days I don’t have red meat. [/quote]
I am nowhere near the level STB is at and probably never will be but in all honesty, I seriously doubt it matters. For every study done on a type of diet, supplement, or how to take that supplement, there is another study contraindicating it. The only people I believe should worry about this is the elite. Again, Im not saying cycling is wrong but I wouldnt worry about it too much. [/quote]
I would agree with this statement on about 99% of the supplements out there but, creatine is different. There are very very few studies, if any because I have not found any, that contradict the effects of creatine. There are very few supplements that actually cause a positive training effect in your body and have been shown to do so in research. Beta-alanine, HMB, ZMA, and leucine are some other good ones that actually work.
To answer the original question, I cycle creatine to be sure my levels are topped off at all times during training. During highly intense cycles, more anaerobic metabolism is done so more creatine is needed. I have never had any clinical tests done or anything to make sure I am doing it correctly but usually the only reason I ever feel like shit during training is because I am not eating enough of something. So, if I dont feel like shit, I know everything is ok.
Sorry to bring this thread back from the dead…but I have a question regarding creatine and weight gain. I have a meet on August 11th, and right now I fluctuate right around 181 lbs., give or take a few pounds on any given day. I’m looking to start taking creatine, but am a bit cautious this close to a meet due to potential weight gain. I’ve read that it’s not uncommon to gain anywhere from 6 to 10 lbs. in the first week to 10 days of starting a “loading phase.”
For those of you that have taken or currently take creatine, what sort of weight gain did you experience in the first 2 weeks or so?
You won’t have much of a creatine saturation after two weeks, especially if you’re not oversaturating in the first couple weeks. A regular dose (10mg) every day will saturate in about 3-4 weeks, so I wouldn’t expect much, if any, weight gain/water retention until then.
Necro creatine thread…
I agree though; it will be AT LEAST 2 weeks before you notice that much from it. Also, I wouldn’t even bother loading. Just take a teaspoon of it everyday and you’ll load up your muscles just fine.
Creatine has also been shown to block the muscle limiting effects of Myostatin. Keifer goes into great detail the effectiveness of Creatine in his carb back loading book.
[quote]StormTheBeach wrote:
There is some terrible information on here. Pretty much everyone should be taking creatine. Not just lifters but everyone on Earth.
Yes, you should cycle creatine.
It does not give you energy or stamina and taking it to get an “edge” in a single work out is fucking retarded.
You can’t feel it working.
Creatine is a product of ATP-PCR energy metabolism. You use this energy system when you do extremely intense work. Creatine can do 2 things once it has been seperated from its phosphate:
With those in mind, all that matters is taking enough to keep your levels topped off. You should take more during a cycle where your workouts are more intense and when relative training volumes are highest. You should take less, because you don’t need it as much, earlier in your training plan… if you even have. A rule I follow:
Recovering from a meet: Basically no extra creatine other than whatever is in the meat I eat
Initial training cycles: 3-5g a day
Closer to a meet (final 3-4 weeks): 6-8g a day
Start over.
Its another tool in the tool box. If your diet sucks, none of this matters. If your training sucks, none of this matters. Just like every other training variable, its a part of a whole.[/quote]
STB, thanks for the explanation of the way you cycle creatine. I’ve essentially just done 5-6g a day for as long as I can remember, with the goal of just making sure I get enough. Not particularly worried about having too much.
I’ve always felt the same way about the benefits of creatine to just about everyone. Pretty hard to convince people this is true though. The fact that people on sites like this have trepidation about even using it in the first place shows how much the media has skewed public perspective. My dad thinks creatine is a steroid, and he’s got a Physics PHD (in other words, not an idiot). If TNation members think creatine is dangerous, imagine what the general population thinks. I’ve had people warn me that ‘that stuff will kill you’.
[quote]flipcollar wrote:
STB, thanks for the explanation of the way you cycle creatine. I’ve essentially just done 5-6g a day for as long as I can remember, with the goal of just making sure I get enough. Not particularly worried about having too much.
[/quote]
I didn’t say anything about the cycling discussion since it was so old. For all I know STB has totally changed his philosophy on cycling creatine. No one can dispute the amount of strength he has developed. Scientifically though, there is no reason to ever cycle creatine.
[quote]csulli wrote:
[quote]flipcollar wrote:
STB, thanks for the explanation of the way you cycle creatine. I’ve essentially just done 5-6g a day for as long as I can remember, with the goal of just making sure I get enough. Not particularly worried about having too much.
[/quote]
I didn’t say anything about the cycling discussion since it was so old. For all I know STB has totally changed his philosophy on cycling creatine. No one can dispute the amount of strength he has developed. Scientifically though, there is no reason to ever cycle creatine.[/quote]
You know that? Or are you just saying you haven’t seen anything to indicate anything higher than 5g a day is ever beneficial? He didn’t say he cycles off of it at anytime, he just says he ups his dosage based on his training. I would absolutely agree that there is no proof that cycling completely off of creatine is ever beneficial. That’s also not what STB is saying, and I’ve never seen any study that has examined creatine dosages for powerlifters in the weeks before a PL meet. Saying that there is no scientific reason for what STB was talking about is a pretty strong statement.
[quote]flipcollar wrote:
[quote]csulli wrote:
[quote]flipcollar wrote:
STB, thanks for the explanation of the way you cycle creatine. I’ve essentially just done 5-6g a day for as long as I can remember, with the goal of just making sure I get enough. Not particularly worried about having too much.
[/quote]
I didn’t say anything about the cycling discussion since it was so old. For all I know STB has totally changed his philosophy on cycling creatine. No one can dispute the amount of strength he has developed. Scientifically though, there is no reason to ever cycle creatine.[/quote]
You know that? Or are you just saying you haven’t seen anything to indicate anything higher than 5g a day is ever beneficial? He didn’t say he cycles off of it at anytime, he just says he ups his dosage based on his training. I would absolutely agree that there is no proof that cycling completely off of creatine is ever beneficial. That’s also not what STB is saying, and I’ve never seen any study that has examined creatine dosages for powerlifters in the weeks before a PL meet. Saying that there is no scientific reason for what STB was talking about is a pretty strong statement.[/quote]
When I say “cycle” creatine I mean cycle completely off of it. I’ve only ever heard the words “cycle” and “creatine” applied in that manner. I actually didn’t realize that he was talking about cycling up to a higher dose and then back down to a “regular” dose; I thought he was cycling completely off of it for some length of time. Like I said, haven’t heard of someone doing that before, but it sounds pretty logical, especially for guys bigger than us, like STB and other 270 plus or 300 pound plus guys.
[quote]flipcollar wrote:
STB, thanks for the explanation of the way you cycle creatine. I’ve essentially just done 5-6g a day for as long as I can remember, with the goal of just making sure I get enough. Not particularly worried about having too much.
I’ve always felt the same way about the benefits of creatine to just about everyone. Pretty hard to convince people this is true though. The fact that people on sites like this have trepidation about even using it in the first place shows how much the media has skewed public perspective. My dad thinks creatine is a steroid, and he’s got a Physics PHD (in other words, not an idiot). If TNation members think creatine is dangerous, imagine what the general population thinks. I’ve had people warn me that ‘that stuff will kill you’. [/quote]
That’s why “average joes” are just that…“average”. I do find it amazing that those kind of people will not listen to sound advice from people who have their shit together but will believe nearly everything they see on a fucking infomercial. ( I have friends & relatives like this) o well I say, more Creatine and awesomeness for me.
[quote]StrengthDawg wrote:
[quote]flipcollar wrote:
STB, thanks for the explanation of the way you cycle creatine. I’ve essentially just done 5-6g a day for as long as I can remember, with the goal of just making sure I get enough. Not particularly worried about having too much.
I’ve always felt the same way about the benefits of creatine to just about everyone. Pretty hard to convince people this is true though. The fact that people on sites like this have trepidation about even using it in the first place shows how much the media has skewed public perspective. My dad thinks creatine is a steroid, and he’s got a Physics PHD (in other words, not an idiot). If TNation members think creatine is dangerous, imagine what the general population thinks. I’ve had people warn me that ‘that stuff will kill you’. [/quote]
That’s why “average joes” are just that…“average”. I do find it amazing that those kind of people will not listen to sound advice from people who have their shit together but will believe nearly everything they see on a fucking infomercial. ( I have friends & relatives like this) o well I say, more Creatine and awesomeness for me.
[/quote]
Politics plays a serious part in this as well. There was a case of a high school football player, I think in Texas (not positive), who was practicing for hours in 100+ degree weather, his coach wouldn’t let him get water, and he died. Creatine ended up being blamed by the media, and politicians latched on, wagging their finger as they often do at the supplement industry. Politicians hate the supplement industry because anything that’s legally sold as a supplement doesn’t make money for big drug companies. Big drug companies fund politicians. The more supplements like PH’s that end up becoming controlled substances, the more money gets funneled into politicians pockets. Creatine has been vilified for this reason. Washington would love for it to be controlled. If the general public thinks creatine is a terrible thing that’s killing young people, there will be no objection.
[quote]flipcollar wrote:
[quote]StrengthDawg wrote:
[quote]flipcollar wrote:
STB, thanks for the explanation of the way you cycle creatine. I’ve essentially just done 5-6g a day for as long as I can remember, with the goal of just making sure I get enough. Not particularly worried about having too much.
I’ve always felt the same way about the benefits of creatine to just about everyone. Pretty hard to convince people this is true though. The fact that people on sites like this have trepidation about even using it in the first place shows how much the media has skewed public perspective. My dad thinks creatine is a steroid, and he’s got a Physics PHD (in other words, not an idiot). If TNation members think creatine is dangerous, imagine what the general population thinks. I’ve had people warn me that ‘that stuff will kill you’. [/quote]
That’s why “average joes” are just that…“average”. I do find it amazing that those kind of people will not listen to sound advice from people who have their shit together but will believe nearly everything they see on a fucking infomercial. ( I have friends & relatives like this) o well I say, more Creatine and awesomeness for me.
[/quote]
Politics plays a serious part in this as well. There was a case of a high school football player, I think in Texas (not positive), who was practicing for hours in 100+ degree weather, his coach wouldn’t let him get water, and he died. Creatine ended up being blamed by the media, and politicians latched on, wagging their finger as they often do at the supplement industry. Politicians hate the supplement industry because anything that’s legally sold as a supplement doesn’t make money for big drug companies. Big drug companies fund politicians. The more supplements like PH’s that end up becoming controlled substances, the more money gets funneled into politicians pockets. Creatine has been vilified for this reason. Washington would love for it to be controlled. If the general public thinks creatine is a terrible thing that’s killing young people, there will be no objection.[/quote]
I remember this, I could be mistaken but I think the media saw that the players had elevated levels of Creatinine and equated it with Creatine. I believe elevated Creatinine levels in the blood is a sign of Kidney trouble…but the media took the name similarity and ran with it
I took it one time and ate a dudes face.
[quote]DixiesFinest wrote:
I took it one time and ate a dudes face.[/quote]
I heard that face protein is good for about 4# of lean muscle gains man…but if you stack it with the cree-a-teen it’s good for about 6.
[quote]StrengthDawg wrote:
[quote]DixiesFinest wrote:
I took it one time and ate a dudes face.[/quote]
I heard that face protein is good for about 4# of lean muscle gains man…but if you stack it with the cree-a-teen it’s good for about 6.
[/quote]
10 if you freebase it and shoot it up.
[quote]strengthstudent wrote:
Your body won’t get used to it or build a tolerance. Creatine synthesis occurs naturally. It is constructed from the amino acids glycine, arginine, and methionine. It is stored as phosphocreatine, which is a major substrate for anaerobic metabolism. You have creatine inside you at all times, even if you do not supplement with it. Supplementing just increases the amount you store. Cycling and loading are products of clever marketing targeting the uninformed.[/quote]
You shouldn’t stay on anything for a long time.
[quote]Caltene wrote:
[quote]strengthstudent wrote:
Your body won’t get used to it or build a tolerance. Creatine synthesis occurs naturally. It is constructed from the amino acids glycine, arginine, and methionine. It is stored as phosphocreatine, which is a major substrate for anaerobic metabolism. You have creatine inside you at all times, even if you do not supplement with it. Supplementing just increases the amount you store. Cycling and loading are products of clever marketing targeting the uninformed.[/quote]
You shouldn’t stay on anything for a long time.[/quote]
What about food? Water? Those good options for long term use?
[quote]Caltene wrote:
[quote]strengthstudent wrote:
Your body won’t get used to it or build a tolerance. Creatine synthesis occurs naturally. It is constructed from the amino acids glycine, arginine, and methionine. It is stored as phosphocreatine, which is a major substrate for anaerobic metabolism. You have creatine inside you at all times, even if you do not supplement with it. Supplementing just increases the amount you store. Cycling and loading are products of clever marketing targeting the uninformed.[/quote]
You shouldn’t stay on anything for a long time.[/quote]
x2. Even though there is absolutely zero evidence to sugeest any side effects from creatine other than weight gain, anything that causes any kind of water retention should not be taken forever.
[quote]MattyXL wrote:
[quote]flipcollar wrote:
[quote]StrengthDawg wrote:
[quote]flipcollar wrote:
STB, thanks for the explanation of the way you cycle creatine. I’ve essentially just done 5-6g a day for as long as I can remember, with the goal of just making sure I get enough. Not particularly worried about having too much.
I’ve always felt the same way about the benefits of creatine to just about everyone. Pretty hard to convince people this is true though. The fact that people on sites like this have trepidation about even using it in the first place shows how much the media has skewed public perspective. My dad thinks creatine is a steroid, and he’s got a Physics PHD (in other words, not an idiot). If TNation members think creatine is dangerous, imagine what the general population thinks. I’ve had people warn me that ‘that stuff will kill you’. [/quote]
That’s why “average joes” are just that…“average”. I do find it amazing that those kind of people will not listen to sound advice from people who have their shit together but will believe nearly everything they see on a fucking infomercial. ( I have friends & relatives like this) o well I say, more Creatine and awesomeness for me.
[/quote]
Politics plays a serious part in this as well. There was a case of a high school football player, I think in Texas (not positive), who was practicing for hours in 100+ degree weather, his coach wouldn’t let him get water, and he died. Creatine ended up being blamed by the media, and politicians latched on, wagging their finger as they often do at the supplement industry. Politicians hate the supplement industry because anything that’s legally sold as a supplement doesn’t make money for big drug companies. Big drug companies fund politicians. The more supplements like PH’s that end up becoming controlled substances, the more money gets funneled into politicians pockets. Creatine has been vilified for this reason. Washington would love for it to be controlled. If the general public thinks creatine is a terrible thing that’s killing young people, there will be no objection.[/quote]
I remember this, I could be mistaken but I think the media saw that the players had elevated levels of Creatinine and equated it with Creatine. I believe elevated Creatinine levels in the blood is a sign of Kidney trouble…but the media took the name similarity and ran with it
[/quote]
This is why I don’t watch TV anymore. Creatine and creatanine sound alike… so they must be the same thing. Anytime kids start passing out, its 100 degrees outside, and their kidneys start failing, it is Rhabdo+terrible fucking coaching. Recent studies have come out that say creatine HELPS retain water in extreme heat… which makes complete and total logical sense because the only real side effect of taking it is water retention. How does it somehow gain this magical property to retain water in your cells but, only when it is not hot out and only when you are not doing any physical activity.
Shit like this drives me nuts.