does anyone know about any pro bodybuilders who are all natural, ive been thinking i have franco, and jay as my role models but i also should have some natural guys to look up to, anyone know?
[quote]BearMode wrote:
does anyone know about any pro bodybuilders who are all natural, ive been thinking i have franco, and jay as my role models but i also should have some natural guys to look up to, anyone know?[/quote]
I do not like the whole seperation between natural and ‘regular’ BB’rs, for a couple reasons:
First, it’s almost impossible to tell who is 100% natural, I’m not naive and I find it hard to trust someone from face value when I don’t know them.
Secondly, it’s pointless racking your brain over it, since the guys competing in the olympia would most definitely still be bigger than all the pro natural bodybuilders if they also chose to stay natural themselves.
They have the best genetics, which is why they have the chance to be in the OLYMPIA not some natural show where instead they would only earn 5-10% of the money they currently make, whats the point?
So I would say to just keep an open mind and listen to all the big guys, ‘natural’ or not.
Jeff Willet looked good, particularly when not in contest condition but still lean:
(Previously posted by Sarev0k)
stu?
[quote]Goodfellow wrote:
[quote]BearMode wrote:
does anyone know about any pro bodybuilders who are all natural, ive been thinking i have franco, and jay as my role models but i also should have some natural guys to look up to, anyone know?[/quote]
I do not like the whole seperation between natural and ‘regular’ BB’rs, for a couple reasons:
First, it’s almost impossible to tell who is 100% natural, I’m not naive and I find it hard to trust someone from face value when I don’t know them.
Secondly, it’s pointless racking your brain over it, since the guys competing in the olympia would most definitely still be bigger than all the pro natural bodybuilders if they also chose to stay natural themselves.
They have the best genetics, which is why they have the chance to be in the OLYMPIA not some natural show where instead they would only earn 5-10% of the money they currently make, whats the point?
So I would say to just keep an open mind and listen to all the big guys, ‘natural’ or not.
[/quote]
The thing i think about is how many people with outstanding genetics are out there…? People think bodybuilding is weird as it is, it has a small following. Could be thousands of Ronnie type genetic freaks out there that don’t even know it.
One thing that the nay-sayers don’t seem to account for is that there’s a very high likelihood of the guys having the best genetics, as naturals, going on to use steroids. And thus in very many cases we never see what they could have done naturally.
A while back we had yet another of the “Butt’s Ceiling” threads (in fairness to Mr Butt, he is not now maintaining that his equations pose a limit, but there’s a fairly rabid group that uses his equations as their Scripture and they DO insist that they represent a limit.) In this thread, I cited someone I knew personally who as a natural exceeded the equations: a young guy at my gym. I did have very reasonable basis to consider him natural because we had discussed steroid use, he was eager to start, finally we decided on what would be a good start for him, and after this, and at the time of that thread, he was really seriously disappointed that his order had apparently been held up in Customs or for some other cause never arrived.
Well, I just ran into him day before yesterday – he’d moved out of town during the interim.
NOW he is on the juice and is looking seriously good, and is planning to compete.
But did we ever find out what his potential was as a natural? No. But having some knowledge of his training history – he’d only rather recently really gotten things together – I have no doubt he had considerable further potential left.
I’m not saying the guys with the best genetics – not that he represents the very best, but he does represent being quite good – who also really love bb’ing are always going to turn to the juice while still relatively early in their careers: there will be exceptions. But the percentage of them that do is, I think, relatively high.
And also, what naturals can accomplish winds up being underestimated I think by looking at their contest-condition size. The last trace of bodyfat and water really costs them a lot. It’s ordinary for them to look far better in lean but not extreme condition.
The Butt-disciples who err here by saying the contest weight of modern natural bb’ers such as Willet compares very similarly to that of say Steve Reeves are completely neglecting the above consideration. The modern naturals are dieted down at least 20 lb more than the old-timers were.
I agree 100% with Bill. While I don’t consider myself a bodybuilder (did one contest a few years ago…wasn’t for me, eventhough I won the Heavyweight division) and I’ve never used any PED.
I’ve leaned down as low as humanely possible for me a few times. Last year I got down to under 4% at a body weight of 210 lbs and I looked almost “sick.” I did it again this year, but stopped at 5% (12 site Biosignature assessment) at a body weight of 235 lbs. I looked much fuller, almost as lean, and felt 10 times better. Plus, my performance in the gym and quality of life didn’t suffer up until the point I stopped.
I’m 32 years old now and haven’t missed more than 2 weeks of training since I was 15 years old, except for a couple of football injuries. I’ve been able to reach some pretty decent levels of muscle mass and leaness in that time. If I had used early in my 20’s (or whenever), yes, I would most certainly be “further along” now, but at what cost? I’m perfectly happy with what I’ve accomplished being natural. I will say, that I wouldn’t have guessed (10 years ago) I would have been able to reach my current physique levels without using.
I’d say that Jim Cordova has an impressive physique for a natural…at least, he used to be natural…I don’t think any of those guys are natural?
I agree on Jeff Willet, the guy is an IFBB pro after all, and natural.
I also think Jim Cordova looks incredible.
In my first post above, I didn’t mean to say “nobody is natural”…far from it. There are plenty of great looking natural bb’s out there.
Also, Jim Cordova could be natural…who the hell knows who is and who isn’t
Tom Venuto, Jeff and Jim have already been mentioned.
[quote]K-Man32 wrote:
[quote]Goodfellow wrote:
[quote]BearMode wrote:
does anyone know about any pro bodybuilders who are all natural, ive been thinking i have franco, and jay as my role models but i also should have some natural guys to look up to, anyone know?[/quote]
I do not like the whole seperation between natural and ‘regular’ BB’rs, for a couple reasons:
First, it’s almost impossible to tell who is 100% natural, I’m not naive and I find it hard to trust someone from face value when I don’t know them.
Secondly, it’s pointless racking your brain over it, since the guys competing in the olympia would most definitely still be bigger than all the pro natural bodybuilders if they also chose to stay natural themselves.
They have the best genetics, which is why they have the chance to be in the OLYMPIA not some natural show where instead they would only earn 5-10% of the money they currently make, whats the point?
So I would say to just keep an open mind and listen to all the big guys, ‘natural’ or not.
[/quote]
The thing i think about is how many people with outstanding genetics are out there…? People think bodybuilding is weird as it is, it has a small following. Could be thousands of Ronnie type genetic freaks out there that don’t even know it.
[/quote]
People who have the best genetics for bodybuilding would be very easy to spot even if they don’t lift a whole lot. They’re the kind of people that put most gym-goers to shame at a very young age with very little experience.
They’re not 5-10 and 145lbs at the age of 15, that’s for sure.
[quote]countingbeans wrote:
stu?[/quote]
x2
Having personally spoken with Jim on many occasions, and crediting him with being the guy who talked me into competing in the first place, I can tell you that as amazingly-awe-inspiring as he seems in the magazines, in person, you realize that he’s a hell of a lot smaller (5’7, maybe 160 lbs) than you initially thought. It honestly makes me crazy reading all these threads online about how there’s no way he’s natural. Brian Whitacre, another Natural Champion who I’ve had correspondences with, and look up to quite a bit, is 5’9, and competes at under 160 lbs (lightweight). Shredded beyond shredded, but aside from the sunken cheeks, no one would ever accuse him of using PEDs no matter how insane he looks onstage (or in magazines).
What you have to realize is that not only do these guys have great genetics, but they pay so much attention to details it would blow your mind. I consider myself damn smart, and very analytical about my training. Well Jim is right up there, constantly researching, reading, comparing notes,… there’s a reason he’s at the top of his game. If half of the people on these forums posting “what’s my bodyfat?”, or “should I bulk or cut (even though I’ve only been lifting a year)?” threads understood that, they’d cease worrying about who’s natural and who’s not, and concern themselves more with crossing their T’s and dotting their I’s.
The perfect example, when I first started dating my girl,… we had just come home from a large dinner gathering with a bunch of her friends. We were both stuffed, even though a couple of hours had passed. Maybe it was 3, 4 in the morning. I return from walking my dog, assuming Catherine’s sleeping, and quietly go into the kitchen to down some Metabolic Drive and a few Tbsp of natural Peanut Butter before bed. I assume I must have made too much noise, because she walks into the kitchen and completely shocked exclaims “You’re still hungry?!”. My answer? “No, but I NEED to do this”. (That’s all I have to say to explain my own BBing achievements)
S
[quote]Sharp4850 wrote:
[quote]K-Man32 wrote:
[quote]Goodfellow wrote:
[quote]BearMode wrote:
does anyone know about any pro bodybuilders who are all natural, ive been thinking i have franco, and jay as my role models but i also should have some natural guys to look up to, anyone know?[/quote]
I do not like the whole seperation between natural and ‘regular’ BB’rs, for a couple reasons:
First, it’s almost impossible to tell who is 100% natural, I’m not naive and I find it hard to trust someone from face value when I don’t know them.
Secondly, it’s pointless racking your brain over it, since the guys competing in the olympia would most definitely still be bigger than all the pro natural bodybuilders if they also chose to stay natural themselves.
They have the best genetics, which is why they have the chance to be in the OLYMPIA not some natural show where instead they would only earn 5-10% of the money they currently make, whats the point?
So I would say to just keep an open mind and listen to all the big guys, ‘natural’ or not.
[/quote]
The thing i think about is how many people with outstanding genetics are out there…? People think bodybuilding is weird as it is, it has a small following. Could be thousands of Ronnie type genetic freaks out there that don’t even know it.
[/quote]
People who have the best genetics for bodybuilding would be very easy to spot even if they don’t lift a whole lot. They’re the kind of people that put most gym-goers to shame at a very young age with very little experience.
They’re not 5-10 and 145lbs at the age of 15, that’s for sure.[/quote]
That simply is NOT true. Genetics need to be thought of as not just what someone has with zero training but also how quickly they adapt. A whole lot of people with great genetics may be skinny with no training, but they will also be the first to blow up when they do train and eat enough.
Exactly.
For example, one could consider how skinny Flex Wheeler was.
[quote]The Mighty Stu wrote:
Having personally spoken with Jim on many occasions, and crediting him with being the guy who talked me into competing in the first place, I can tell you that as amazingly-awe-inspiring as he seems in the magazines, in person, you realize that he’s a hell of a lot smaller (5’7, maybe 160 lbs) than you initially thought. It honestly makes me crazy reading all these threads online about how there’s no way he’s natural. Brian Whitacre, another Natural Champion who I’ve had correspondences with, and look up to quite a bit, is 5’9, and competes at under 160 lbs (lightweight). Shredded beyond shredded, but aside from the sunken cheeks, no one would ever accuse him of using PEDs no matter how insane he looks onstage (or in magazines).
What you have to realize is that not only do these guys have great genetics, but they pay so much attention to details it would blow your mind. I consider myself damn smart, and very analytical about my training. Well Jim is right up there, constantly researching, reading, comparing notes,… there’s a reason he’s at the top of his game. If half of the people on these forums posting “what’s my bodyfat?”, or “should I bulk or cut (even though I’ve only been lifting a year)?” threads understood that, they’d cease worrying about who’s natural and who’s not, and concern themselves more with crossing their T’s and dotting their I’s.
The perfect example, when I first started dating my girl,… we had just come home from a large dinner gathering with a bunch of her friends. We were both stuffed, even though a couple of hours had passed. Maybe it was 3, 4 in the morning. I return from walking my dog, assuming Catherine’s sleeping, and quietly go into the kitchen to down some Metabolic Drive and a few Tbsp of natural Peanut Butter before bed. I assume I must have made too much noise, because she walks into the kitchen and completely shocked exclaims “You’re still hungry?!”. My answer? “No, but I NEED to do this”. (That’s all I have to say to explain my own BBing achievements)
S[/quote]
Great post. Just as important as having the genetics to be huge are having the genetics to appear to be huge.
are they any great natural pros who are 6 feet or taller who place well in competitions? im curious because im 6 feet and id like to find a natural guy i can look up to
Brian Wiefering