I’ve never gone by a straight multiplication, and above 20% BF, I’d recommend you use your lean body mass, rather than total.
It’s not math, in this case, it’s your body. No formula can tell you how you’ll feel with 2000 calories, you just have to find out.
[quote]samdan wrote:
I’ve never gone by a straight multiplication, and above 20% BF, I’d recommend you use your lean body mass, rather than total.
It’s not math, in this case, it’s your body. No formula can tell you how you’ll feel with 2000 calories, you just have to find out.[/quote]
BING BING BING BING!
Where’d all these smart folks come from?!! Sweet!
Good advice here! Take note…
[quote]Pauli D wrote:
BING BING BING BING!
Where’d all these smart folks come from?!! Sweet!
Good advice here! Take note…[/quote]
Awwww shucks… Must be all the sauerkraut… How did I ever forget about sauerkraut? I fully believe that that stuff is God’s gift to AD’ers.
If you aren’t eating sauerkraut, go and get some immediately. Paired with some pork and low carb tortillas (the kind I have are 18g carb, 11g fiber for 7g net) and some omega-3 mayo, you have the greatest AD meal that ever fit in your hand. The cabbage is pure fermented fiber goodness.
Sauerkraut is good -of this there is no doubt!
Sauerkraut is tasty AND is beneficial for fat mobilization.
The vinegar in sauerkraut is comprised of acetic acid.
Acetic acid turns on the gene that produces the proteins that help the body break down fats. And, as a bonus, acetic acid also helps prevent fat buildup to begin with. Thus acetic acid (from the vinegar in sauerkraut) aids fat burning and thwarts fat gain …all in one fell swoop!
Eat up, you kraut lov’n AD’ers
[quote]samdan wrote:
Pauli D wrote:
BING BING BING BING!
Where’d all these smart folks come from?!! Sweet!
Good advice here! Take note…
Awwww shucks… Must be all the sauerkraut… How did I ever forget about sauerkraut? I fully believe that that stuff is God’s gift to AD’ers.
If you aren’t eating sauerkraut, go and get some immediately. Paired with some pork and low carb tortillas (the kind I have are 18g carb, 11g fiber for 7g net) and some omega-3 mayo, you have the greatest AD meal that ever fit in your hand. The cabbage is pure fermented fiber goodness.[/quote]
Do you count the carbs in the kraut or is this food considered “FREE”
Free! Free! Free!
Don’t worry about it…unless you start ordering it straight from the manufacturer --or “mainlining it” (for goodness’ sake)
[quote]broken4head wrote:
samdan wrote:
Pauli D wrote:
BING BING BING BING!
Where’d all these smart folks come from?!! Sweet!
Good advice here! Take note…
Awwww shucks… Must be all the sauerkraut… How did I ever forget about sauerkraut? I fully believe that that stuff is God’s gift to AD’ers.
If you aren’t eating sauerkraut, go and get some immediately. Paired with some pork and low carb tortillas (the kind I have are 18g carb, 11g fiber for 7g net) and some omega-3 mayo, you have the greatest AD meal that ever fit in your hand. The cabbage is pure fermented fiber goodness.
Do you count the carbs in the kraut or is this food considered “FREE”[/quote]
[quote]Pauli D wrote:
Free! Free! Free!
Don’t worry about it…unless you start ordering it straight from the manufacturer --or “mainlining it” (for goodness’ sake)
broken4head wrote:
samdan wrote:
Pauli D wrote:
BING BING BING BING!
Where’d all these smart folks come from?!! Sweet!
How about freebasing it? Well, maybe not. Thanks Pauli. I love this thread. I have honestly learned more from you guys then Dr. Di’s book.
According to the Sauerkraut I have right now, it is 1g carb (1g fiber) per serving, which is like 2 tablespoons. Due to an unfortunate peanut butter incident, I don’t actually own a tablespoon, and I’ll be damned if I’m going to measure 3 tsp per tbsp. In the meantime, my hand makes a great measuring device. Whatever comes up with my fist is my new serving!
Best part of sauerkraut HAS to be it’s ready-to-serve nature. I’ve got spinach and broccoli, but I have to like… cook it… I just take a can of tuna, about the same amount of sauerkraut, about a tbsp of omega-3 mayo, a splash of olive oil and eat it with some chop sticks. Instant tuna salad. Hmmm… Maybe I can hit up the organic food store and get some flax meal in there…
hmmm that would be only 1700 cals if i do just by my lean mass.
260x10=2600cals —> 65/30/5 ----> 188fat/195pro/30cho or less
and since my bodyfat is so high, would every 12-13days be a good idea before i do a 1-2day carb up?
how long of a carb up do you think i should do considering my bodyfat, if i do a carbup every 12-13 days?
what are some training plans you guys do?
[quote]samdan wrote:
I’ve never gone by a straight multiplication, and above 20% BF, I’d recommend you use your lean body mass, rather than total.
It’s not math, in this case, it’s your body. No formula can tell you how you’ll feel with 2000 calories, you just have to find out.[/quote]
Well you wouldn’t use LBMx12, you’d probably do x18 or so since you’re taking your fat out of the equation.
Right now, I’m doing a bunch of more “energy” work (EDT, circuits, HIIT, etc) than strength work, but I’m currently taking it REALLY easy on a shoulder separation that needs to grow some fucking balls and heal up so I can do my god damn front squats again…
I’d recommend you do some kind of workout that starts with 1 set of EDT exercises (links below), ie pick 1 set of two exercises to do in the EDT style. Start with that, but go light with the weights the first time you do it. The first time I did EDT, I spoke to Jesus. The 2nd time, upon finishing my set, I stared at the floor for 2-3 minutes, trying to figure out why I couldn’t focus my eyes. Felt fuckin’ awesome.
After EDT, you might throw in a heavy set and some accessory work so that you can stimulate different mechanisms in your body, but I’d recommend some sprint intervals on a treadmill afterwards if you feel like your body can handle it. If you really like EDT, you can go all out. Rig up a couple set pairs that you can do with your gym, and just do EDT for your workout. If you do 2-3 EDT sets per workout, you won’t need to do the cardio.
As far as your carb-ups I’d recommend, at most, a 24-hour carb up each week. Don’t try to go 2 weeks at a time without carbs if you don’t have to. I don’t have carb cravings at all because I know that every Saturday I get to cut loose a little. Feel like pizza one day? Write it down, do it on Saturday. Just knowing that I’m never more than a few days removed from something I want is comforting to me. Another big thing will be how you react to low carbs and then getting spiked. If you feel like shit, you might drop to a 12-hour carb up and you’ll basically just have one maybe two meals with carbs.
Your macro ratios though… I’d recommend kicking some fats into the protein section. Maybe like 50/45/30. Fats make you feel satiated, but they lack volume which has a decent psychological effect. If you feel like you’re having to do a significant amount of “forcing” yourself to eat more to meet the 2600 calories, you might try dropping to 2000-2300 and see what happens.
EDT Information:
I think I’m going to drop the AD soon. I gained 1.8lb this week and 1/4in. on my waist even with strength improvements and a slight decrease in calories. I don’t know if it’s the diet or if I’m gaining too quickly for my strength gains but maybe something different would prove beneficial? Unfortunately the only healthy carbs available here are various fruits and oatmeal.
[quote]pumped340 wrote:
I think I’m going to drop the AD soon. I gained 1.8lb this week and 1/4in. on my waist even with strength improvements and a slight decrease in calories. I don’t know if it’s the diet or if I’m gaining too quickly for my strength gains but maybe something different would prove beneficial? Unfortunately the only healthy carbs available here are various fruits and oatmeal. [/quote]
Best wishes, P340.
I’m sure you’ll do well in your future endeavors.
~Paul
[quote]Pauli D wrote:
pumped340 wrote:
I think I’m going to drop the AD soon. I gained 1.8lb this week and 1/4in. on my waist even with strength improvements and a slight decrease in calories. I don’t know if it’s the diet or if I’m gaining too quickly for my strength gains but maybe something different would prove beneficial? Unfortunately the only healthy carbs available here are various fruits and oatmeal.
Best wishes, P340.
I’m sure you’ll do well in your future endeavors.
~Paul[/quote]
Thanks man. I think part of it is an overall calorie issue as well, gaining too quickly for my strength increases. I would like to stay with this style of eating until at least around Christmas or so though but we’ll see how it goes. Once I switch I will likely go in the opposite direction with carb cycling and see how that works out, although I’ll have to get leaner first.
Just read through the thread as I have decided to get back on the AD. I have always responded best to low carb and find that this seems to have the best long term approach to it, if that makes sense.
Starting up a new DC blast (2 way split, 4 days of 45 minute low intensity cardio on off days as well) and I think this training works very well with the AD. However, I am looking to do a little bit of a body recomp with the diet and drop a little fat while hopefully holding my weight. My stats and a a pic from a couple months ago are in my profile if anyone wants to check it out.
I based this diet off of Palumbo’s cutting diet, however, I am using the numbers that are closer to the 250lb bodybuilder since I want this to be more of a recomp than a contest diet. I am roughly 200 lbs by the way.
So heres my meal plan. If Pauli or DH felt compelled to respond I would be very grateful. You guys are very knowledgeable and you deserve my respect.
Meal 1: 6 Omega 3 eggs (simple right)
Meal 2: 8 ounce pork loin, bag of frozen broccoli, 1 tbsp EVOO
Meal 3: 50 gram protein (whey/casein blend), 2 TBSP flax seed meal, 1 TBSP EVOO
Meal 4: 8 ounce chicken breast, 1/2 cup of mixed nuts
Meal 5: 6 Omega 3 eggs
Meal 6: 50 gram protein (whey/casein blend), 2 TBSP peanut butter
Extras: Probably some BCAAS/Creatine/Leucine during workout. Maybe around 10 fish oil caps during the day.
Refeed: Since I want to do a bit of a recomp I am sticking with a Palumbo cheat meal once a week that will be heavily carb-based. Occasionally it might be china buffet or pizza if some friends are in town, but normally I will try to make relatively healthy and limited to one meal.
Pauli, I know you have voiced against peanut butter and protein shakes, but I am a poor graduate student. Plus, I have a 2 hour total commute to school each day so the protein shakes are a borderline necessity since all my classes are a minimum of 3 hours long. If the peanut butter is that big of a deal I can replace it with EVOO, but the PB sure tastes better.
Are there any holes in this plan that need to be addressed?
Ajweins correct me if I’m wrong but didn’t you said carb cycling worked very well for you and you were able to eat more carbs with carb cycling than you ever thought you’d be able to or something? I thought that gave you good results.
Hey peeps, I hope were all well?
I’ve been enjoying the AD thread for some years but never signed up and got involved as all the information presented answered every question I ever had until now, brought about in part by Dr D’s e-mails and articles, I hope someone can clarify these points or whether it makes much of a difference in the grand scheme of things…
Pre/PWO nutrition - Dr D states you shouldn’t use whey exclusivley because the speed of digestion causes a rapid gluconeogenesis response which is not preferable at this time, even though we want a strong insulin response at this time and that a blend is more preferable but even someone as knowledgeable as DH uses hydro whey/isolate around workouts (from the old AD thread).
What’s the final word on this protocol and if a blend is preferable what kind of ratio are we talking? Atm, becaue of the above I’ve switched from straight isolate to using Isolate/MPC (70/30) and some bcaa both pre/post.
I refeed every 5th day last meal of the day (more Poliquin esque than AD) which means the refeed sometimes falls 2-3 hours after a workout, not all the time, I train every other day so sometimes it falls on a refeed day, sometimes not! Poliquin recommends the refeed is done on a day off from training and Dr D recommends no carbs for several hours after a workout to keep insulin sensity elevated and he also states pwo carbs are counterproductive, would a gap of a mere 2-3 hours count somewhat as pwo carbs??
Do I adhere and move the refeed/workout to another day or just carry on with the planned refeed every 5th day even if it falls on a training day, would it make much of a difference - some even recommend that a refeed falls on a training day, I am very confused on best practice for this!!
Finally, I prefer to set my diets up based on a configuration of bodyweight and not as a precent energy as is portrayed in the AS. With that in mind how much protein/fat per pound of bodyweight is recommended on this diet whether cutting or bulking (I’m currently cutting), what does 30-50% protein typically represent based on bodyweight, are we looking at 1-1.5? - Poliquin recommends a lot of protein, typically 1.5-2 gms per pound but this seems way too much for the AD, would that not teach your body how to process protein for energy over fats and while you often see Protein recommendation from Poliquin, I’ve never seen any fat recommendations from him.
Thank you for your time all, I look forward to getting involved in this and future AD threads 
All the best,
Emz
Emz, about your PWO nutrition question, I asked CT that same thing since he’s the master of workout nutrition. The answer he gave me is that Anaconda and MAG-10 will be like a dream come true for low/no-carbers. Basically, the thing about Anaconda is that it is able to create an insulin response post-workout without actually having any carbs.
Now we just have to wait for Anaconda…
[quote]pumped340 wrote:
Ajweins correct me if I’m wrong but didn’t you said carb cycling worked very well for you and you were able to eat more carbs with carb cycling than you ever thought you’d be able to or something? I thought that gave you good results. [/quote]
I enjoyed carb cycling and got good results from it, however, at this point in my life I need something very simple. Eating different things different days isn’t practical for me at this point due to schooling.
Also, I carb cycled during the summer, when I was working a manual labor job 40 hours a week plus training. So my body seemed to handle the carbs better. Now I am either sitting in a car or sitting in a classroom or sitting in my chair at home studying. I seriously get zero physical activity other than my cardio or weight training workouts. I do think the AD is a type of carb cycling anyway. Keto plus refeed has worked best when I wanted to lean up.
[quote]samdan wrote:
Emz, about your PWO nutrition question, I asked CT that same thing since he’s the master of workout nutrition. The answer he gave me is that Anaconda and MAG-10 will be like a dream come true for low/no-carbers. Basically, the thing about Anaconda is that it is able to create an insulin response post-workout without actually having any carbs.
Now we just have to wait for Anaconda…[/quote]
Hey man! It’s not so much the insulin response I was questioning, it’s the gluconeogenic reponse from the ingestion of fast proteins I was looking to clarify - Dr D recommends a blend of both fast/slow pwo and not exclusively whey because of this which runs counter to what most actually do on the AD!! Confusion abounds…
[quote]Emz wrote:
Hey man! It’s not so much the insulin response I was questioning, it’s the gluconeogenic reponse from the ingestion of fast proteins I was looking to clarify - Dr D recommends a blend of both fast/slow pwo and not exclusively whey because of this which runs counter to what most actually do on the AD!! Confusion abounds…[/quote]
Ah, okay… Missed that part. I can’t say I’m an expert, but going back to things that CT talks about a lot, he seems to espouse getting fast proteins plus BCAA’s post-workout. Usually he’s recommending them in the form of Surge Recovery (which has BCAA’s plus whey hydrolysate), but the problem for AD people comes in the form of a high number of carbs in Surge.
Workout nutrition studies seem to have sprung up big time lately, and CT seems to be one of the smartest guys who’s really testing the ideas in the field. You can try asking CT directly in his peri-workout nutrition thread (Forums - T Nation - The World's Trusted Community for Elite Fitness, he actually does a damn good job of responding quickly), or you might even just be able to read through the last 5-8 pages (pages 37-39 seem to ask similar questions from a lot of different angles).
Hope that helps you.