[quote]wressler125 wrote:
It is not an effective form of training, and believe it or not, most of those in the military know this already.
[/quote]
So what’s the point of doing this training then. 2x a day and you reckon they were fat and weak.
But you are talking Cadets. I’m sure there is a big difference between Cadets and the real thing.
[quote]De sleeplijn wrote:
Professor X wrote:
You need to get out more. I see a good portion of big guys who most would relate to being involved in “bodybuilding”. While they may not be the majority, there are enough of them to dispell whatever it is you seem to think you know. I have seen quite a few marines who had some decent size on them and who clearly trained with weights regularly. There is a lot more going on in the military than simply carrying a weapon or doing pushups.
Really? The primary goal of recruit training is so that any Marine, Soldier or Sailor can handle themselves when the shit hits the fan. Every soldier (even the computer based careers) can pick up a rifle and operate as part of the Infantry.
“Simply” carrying a weapon and using it is their primary function and push ups are a staple to every military PT program.
[/quote]
If any soldier simply went off of the training they get from your average PT session, they would be very weak overall. Most of these guys are putting time in the weight room, not simply relying on running laps or doing some push ups. The people I know who ONLY rely on PT for their exercise are the least in shape.
[quote]CHEKonIT wrote:
Remember when Kevin Levrone said he could out sprint a professional sprinter based solely on the fact that he can squat a heavy barbell?
What a fool.
[/quote]
Did anyone ever take him up on that?
[quote]De sleeplijn wrote:
So what’s the point of doing this training then.
[/quote]
Tradition. That is the extent of it. It is the same reason they measure body fat by measuring your neck and waist in some factions of the military. It isn’t because it is accurate, it is because that is simply the way it was done before. You sound like someone who doesn’t have very much experience as far as this is concerned. You are speaking to people who have more.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
If any soldier simply went off of the training they get from your average PT session, they would be very weak overall. Most of these guys are putting time in the weight room, not simply relying on running laps or doing some push ups. The people I know who ONLY rely on PT for their exercise are the least in shape.[/quote]
Yeah, that is right. The guys that do the extra work, other than PT, are going to be in better shape. That’s a given for almost anything.
The PTI’s clearly base the training thinking that is going to be the only physical work some of them will do. They would hope that they play extra sport or do a little extra weights, but it does give them a great base level of fitness.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
You sound like someone who doesn’t have very much experience as far as this is concerned. You are speaking to people who have more.[/quote]
What’s your military background? Or are you referring to the Cadet?
[quote]De sleeplijn wrote:
wressler125 wrote:
I suspected it before, but on this quote alone, I know for a fact that you have never served in any branch of the military. During drills, I was lucky if I WENT every 2.5 hours, let alone stopped.
Are you trying to tell me that you’ve never gone over 2.5 or never gone under. If you’re saying under, read my previous thread a little better.[/quote]
Your a moron, and apparantly I’m correct about you never serving. I’m saying that for every 20 minutes of having to do anything in the army, there will be at least 2.5 hours of sitting around doing nothing time.
[quote]De sleeplijn wrote:
So what’s the point of doing this training then. 2x a day and you reckon they were fat and weak.
[/quote]
The point is to build mental toughness, and because its the most effective thing the military has. Picture 400 men in basic, and you might be lucky to have 12 drill sargeants. You’d be lucky if you could teach 20 men proper lifting technique in the alotted time, so the simple thing to do, is to get the bare minimum, by making everyone do something that is easy to learn… Push ups and sit ups. It’s easy to make 400 men do push ups, but damn near impossible to get 400 men in and out of the weightroom in under an hour. Does this answer your question?
back in school (wow, I’m an old fucking man at 23), when time was tight, I’d load up my backpack full of text books and start pushing the floor for a few hundred reps every day. I’d hit in some squats and lunges, I got pretty creative while taking 10-15 minute breaks in the studying. one arm presses with the loaded up backpack, all sorts of stuff. I know that this isn’t all pushups, but it’s amazing what you can find to do when you really want to.
[quote]De sleeplijn wrote:
It makes you functionally strong but doesn’t necessarily make you big and clumsy like a bodybuilder.
I know a few guys in the Military and they are hard & fit bastards. Getting under a barbell only makes you look tuff. Push ups and military style training will make you the real deal.
[/quote]
Did you register for this site, just to post on this thread?
[quote]Professor X wrote:
De sleeplijn wrote:
So what’s the point of doing this training then.
Tradition. That is the extent of it. [/quote]
Probably true with the US forces. From experience the Australian Army is progressive with their PT. Static stretching at the start being replaced by dynamic warm ups is one example.
Like anything, if there isn’t a real need for it, the Army will scratch it from the program. Wasting PT time would be a huge mistake.
Many Diggers do extra PT on top of what is compulsary. The PTI’s do run a good program though and are constantly updating their qualifications, however, push ups are still a major part of it.
[quote]De sleeplijn wrote:
Professor X wrote:
You sound like someone who doesn’t have very much experience as far as this is concerned. You are speaking to people who have more.
What’s your military background? Or are you referring to the Cadet?[/quote]
I have been in the military for a few years now. You don’t need to know more than that.
[quote]wressler125 wrote:
Your a moron, and apparantly I’m correct about you never serving. I’m saying that for every 20 minutes of having to do anything in the army, there will be at least 2.5 hours of sitting around doing nothing time.
[/quote]
While I don’t have it quite like that, there is enough time to get protein shakes down throughout a normal day. Someone who claims they can’t eat enough to gain (unless in a war zone) isn’t trying hard enough.
[quote]wressler125 wrote:
Did you register for this site, just to post on this thread?[/quote]
No I registered for this site because it is supposed to be a think tank and people can post their views on these threads.
I appologise for posting a different point of view.
What was I thinking?
“Eat more - lift heavy! Fuck ya”
Better?
yeah a friend of a friend of mine HES HUUUUGE And cant even walk up a flight of stairs or wipe his own ass! CAN YO BELIEVE THAT?!?!?!?!?!111ONE111!!
you sound like a moron im sorry to say
most people in the military are either skinny weak bastards or fat weak bastards, that is all
there are a few who are muscular and strong but those are few and far between (at least up here in canada eh)
all the military wants from you is endurence and the ability to move your own body, and even then they honestly dont care.
ive been to recruiters and all of them told me not to worry about my physical fitness as it wouldnt matter. THATS HOW BAD THEY NEED PEOPLE IN THE MILITARY. they dont even care anymore
and calling prof x a bumbling fool who couldnt move around becuase hes so huuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuge… wow… just wow is all i can say to that
that man puts more work into his body then a small city worth of people would ever do. why do you have to rag on the people that MAKE time for their bodys and work on them and improve them? and if you think 135 pound 6 foot tall soldiers are the peak of human evolution i feel sorry for you.
[quote]De sleeplijn wrote:
wressler125 wrote:
Did you register for this site, just to post on this thread?
[/quote]
Ah, so then it only took you 2 days of being a registered member to make a complete ass of yourself.
Your not presenting a different view here. It’s not that you are telling me stuff I haven’t thought about before. It’s just that everything you are saying is misguided and ill-formed.
[quote]deapee wrote:
De sleeplijn wrote:
Professor X wrote:
The sad thing is, you actually wrote this crap with a straight face.
Let’s see you do an obstacle course with that cumbersome 270 pounds.
My money’s on X[/quote]
My god your avatar is insane. Is that Prof X’s avatar from the front?
oh crap now I see the numbnut has already commented on your avatar.
CHEKonIT got it right - as soon as you go over say 20 reps, it is pretty crappy doing pretty much any exercise. If you can squat 1,000 pounds for 50 reps then you aren’t going to get any better doing it for 60, 70, 80 reps or doing it all day. (note that is an extreme example).
If you are doing hundreds of pushups you are wasting your time.
You should be doing 20 with someone on your back. Or one-armed. Or whatever it takes.
You can use them to get some development in the upper body by doing this. Is that what marines do? why bother when they have gyms available?
If desperate though you could get a backpack and use it to load up when doing pushups.
Is this dude even a Marine? I am a former Marine SGT. After bootcamp at Paris Island w/ Lima Co 3032,(3rd battalion rules)I served 1 1/2 years in Okinawa w/ 3rd Marine Div. 1st CAB and 2 years in Lejuene w/ 8th ESB Cco in french creek. Every where I went, even on ship, we lifted weights consistently. We had the baddest gyms I had ever seen.
With the exception of going to the field once or so a month we all trained super hard outside of regular PT. Regular PT just kept me in shape for PT tests. My lifting made me strong everywhere else. Hell we even took a partial weight room stashed in a Conex box to Haiti. We hid all the plates in the storage compartments in the Hummers and 5 tons after the embark inspections, and hid the Dumbells in the other gear boxes we took w/ us.
So to think Marines look jacked becuase of push ups is fine but the big dudes lifted. The only problem is that if you got to heavy for your hieght you had to get a weight waiver from your SGTMAJ after a body fat test. I had a weight waiver for my last 3 years. My SgtMaj, William H Bly, was all about lifting, he would make weak dudes go to the gym for remedial PT all the time. My Battalion CO was a competitive Powerlifter. Both were deisel men. There was even a 24 hour gym on Futema Air Base in Oki.
My final weight while on active duty was about 180 coming back from Haiti, I’m 5’8". We had Panamanian chefs the worked at the main base camp who cooked steaks to order, lobster, pasta, burgers, fresh fruit and so on. They would ship the food out to us 2x a day so one meal was always an MRE. But MRE are awesome for lifters so we loved it. We had an endless supply of those as well so you got more than 1 if you wanted.
We had powerclean, deadlift, and bench competitions every Sunday. The only Sqt Rack was at the main camp. We lived out near a town in GP tents w/ wire perimeters and guard, so we could only Sqt on Sunday anyways. My best Sqt was like 450 on active duty, my best bench was like 335, powerclean ws 225 and DL ws like 405. This is with about every dude in my company involved. Dudes that didn’t lift in the states were now lifters.
Marines fill gyms like wildfire. The only ones who didn’t train were the drunks who didn’t usually last long in the Corps anyhow. I got out in '99 and have been training for PLing since 2003. I now weigh 240 w/ a meet total of 1905(elite by 15lbs. The Corps infected me w/ this iron bug. Semper Fi. Oh yeah we loved to fight too all you who want to knock the skinny Jarheads tell one to thier face how weak they look. Watch how fast he breaks your beautiful physically fit jaw.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
While I don’t have it quite like that, there is enough time to get protein shakes down throughout a normal day. Someone who claims they can’t eat enough to gain (unless in a war zone) isn’t trying hard enough.[/quote]
ARE YOU KIDDING? You have time to write 10-thousand posts on a government-issued computer throughout your “work day.” I’m sure taxpayers would be thrilled to know that a military doctor spends most of his day bitching out people on the net.
Is that why all the pro football, baseball, and other sports players lift weights…so they can ‘look tuff’ – if they wanted to be the ‘real deal’ and not big and clumsy, they should just do pushups, right?
[quote]madmaxs wrote:
Hi,
I have a question:
People often say push-ups will not make one relatively big and strong, yet I have met many Marines/Army soldiers who have gotten relatively big, and quite strong, simply from doing hundreds of push-ups all day long??
If your goal is to be relatively big and strong, are push-ups really a bad way to train?
Thanks
Max [/quote]
You just need progressive resistance. Once you can do about 50 pushups, start working one-arms.