Ok I’m 18 5’9" 274 lbs. somewhat strong.
I need some advice. I want to drop some weight but still gain more strength and muscle mass. is that possible? I have 18 in biceps which are about 1-2 in. of fat. I bench 360lbs for my max.
I just want to drop down to at least 230 lbs as fast as possible. most people just say eat right and cardio. well duh but I need some hardcore advice fast. without me losing my strength.
help please
I would say to lift 3-4 days a week and do cardio on days you are not lifting. Also, make sure your diet is in order. Eat as clean as possible, consume high protein foods like tuna, chicken, beef and use a protein powder in between meals and after your workouts.
Also don’t consume alcohol that will kill most of your weight loss efforts. Your main goal if you are losing weight should be to burn more calories than you are taking in. If you are lifting while losing the weight you are going to lose some strength but if you eat good and lift hard you’ll keep a lot of it. good luck.
I’m an old fuck who cant push your weights…but I would suggest figuring out what got you so damned big in the first place
If you keep up high quality lifts like squats you won’t lose much strength at all. Keep the carbs low. They are likely what got you to being a fat guy.
If it isn’t a vegetable or was once alive or an egg, don’t eat it. Eat eggs and meat and lots of spinach. Try “litvinov” training by dan john and extra 400m sprints.
Those work for me. BTW nothing happens “fast” if it happens right. Give yourself 2 months to see initial results and continue for a year before giving up.
-chris
I agree that you need to make some changes but some crash diet thats gonna drop weight so you can put it right back on isn’t gonna help you. At 5’8 274lbs either your one swole sonuvabitch or pretty chunky. Carrying around that much bodyfat at 18(or at any age) isn’t a good thing, health wise.
You need to make good nutritional choices and learn good habits. Do that and the weight will come off pretty quickly. Check out 7 Habits of Highly Effective Nutritional Programs by Dr. Berardi…
[quote]Thielfe wrote:
I agree that you need to make some changes but some crash diet thats gonna drop weight so you can put it right back on isn’t gonna help you. At 5’8 274lbs either your one swole sonuvabitch or pretty chunky. Carrying around that much bodyfat at 18(or at any age) isn’t a good thing, health wise.
You need to make good nutritional choices and learn good habits. Do that and the weight will come off pretty quickly. Check out 7 Habits of Highly Effective Nutritional Programs by Dr. Berardi…
http://www.T-Nation.com/readTopic.do?id=459493 [/quote]
I agree and would take it a step further and say get Precision Nutrition. Don’t think about being on a diet because fat people are always on diets, lean people “just eat healthy.” It’s an investment in you health.
Regarding training, as long as you use heavy weights and good compound exercise, you should be able to keep your strength.
[quote]wickedpblr666 wrote:
most people just say eat right and cardio. well duh but I need some hardcore advice fast. without me losing my strength.
help please[/quote]
WTF are you looking for, steroids? What do you think is going to get you lean besides eating right and doing cardio? I’ve never tried HOT-ROX but they’re obviously real popular for everyone on this site looking to get cut, but you still have to eat right and do cardio.
The studies that have been done on this subject have shown that you can lose fat quickly and maintain muscle, gain muscle quickly and maintain fat, or do both at a much slower pace. This is the main reason why many people here have a bulk and cut cycle.
However, if you are a beginner, you will have success trying to do both at once. It doesn’t really sound, however, like you’re a beginner.
Pick a goal to work on for at least a month, then switch. I would personally recommend bulking up first. Do whatever works for you.
==Bulking==
You will probably find that you will lose some amount of weight without even trying just by changing your eating habits, even though you have more calories coming in. Make sure you’re mixing up your reps on compound lifts - high reps, low reps, etc.
BCAAs are said to help, and eating 1-1.25 grams protein/lb bodyfat should be a priority. Eating enough vegetables and that much protein is difficult enough, so don’t add carbs in, or they’ll compete with your intake of real food. The only exception: have carbs after your workouts. Also supplement with Fish Oil.
Berardi’s Precision Nutrition would be a great investment. During this time period, if you are not used to doing cardio, start going for walks. You want to get into reasonable shape for your cutting stage without going catabolic.
==Cutting==
If you want, you can bulk for a month, cut for a month, etc. When you cut, focus on maintaining strength, not building it. You can eat around 1 g protein/lb. You’ll want to continue with Berardi’s principles. Try to add 1-2 High Intensity Interval Training (HIIT) sessions a week. Here is the Tabata protocol:
Four Minutes total (good to do at the beginning of the day):
As soon as you cannot do your cycle at max effort, stop. You may want to start with a more moderate cardio approach and work up to Tabata. It’s four minutes of very rough work, but it will burn calories like nothing else. You may think that is silly, but it is supported by research: working out with interval training has been shown to burn more calories throughout the day, and therefore lead to greater weight loss even when you did not burn as many calories in the exercise session. Knowing that it is only 4 minutes will make you work harder.
Remember, the key to training is mixing it up and always improving. Keep the body guessing. Don’t forget to get the rest you need. When you feel like you have to drag yourself to the gym, you may not have let your body rest enough.
Youve received some great adviceJust clean up your diet and that will do a ton. You say you dont want to lose muscle and gain stregth then it wont be FAST. a few lbs a week. Just go for the long haul bro.
eat clean(er) follow the 7 habits maybe take up T-Dawg 2.0 keeping lifting and see where that gets you. add in cardio slowly as needed.
You want the “HARDCORE” solution, thats it, sticking to a solid plan for the long term being consistant and getting AWESOME results.
Hope that helps,
Phill
Hi there,
I am a beginner also so maybe this will help. I first had to start cleaning up my eating. Developing good habits. I started a food log and found where I was eating too much, or too little or all the wrong things. Once you figure out how much you should be eating and then keeping track you will begin to develop a healthier lifestyle.
Although you have been lifting which is good, since muscle burns fat, I don’t think bulking is the way for you to go at the beginning. You need to develop an eating plan. Not only that the results of your efforts will show better. If you read on here everyone says the results come from your diet which is 90% of the effort.
Begin consistent habits, start a food log, start a program log, eat clean, and get rest.
That is the best thing for you right now. Not only that if you haven’t been eating well, eating clean is going to give you your FAST results.
I think I was the only person to mention bulking, so I’ll address this. A food log is an excellent device. And of course, everyone on the thread has been emphasizing the importance of diet.
However, just eating clean will not get you anywhere unless they identify their overall objective. I mentioned that going either way would work, but given his stats and the what tends to be easier for most (bulk, then cut) I personally recommended cutting. Keep in mind, I recommended a clean bulk.
Your objective will dictate whether you a) eat clean, but eat more; or b) eat clean, but eat less. You should be eating clean either way. But you need to make a decision on which way to go.
Your objective will also dictate how you perform your exercises. Unless you try to do both bulking and cutting at once (which is not very effective if you are not a beginner) you are either bulking or cutting at all times. Simply saying “eat clean” is, as you say, only a fraction of the entire equation. A coach once said something to the effect of, `It isn’t 50-50 or 90-10; it’s 100-100.’
At essence, I am not disagreeing with you. People definitely need to have their diet in check. The problem is, you are saying that just eating will give “Fast results” - but what kind of results? Weight loss? Muscle gain?
You will not get anywhere until you decide how you will structure that clean diet and your exercise program; and you cannot do that until you decide what your focus is.
The way you structure your clean diet and your exercise routine depends on your priorities and your goal at that moment. Your diet is one part of a larger program which needs to have a goal. And as I mentioned, even people who are on a clean bulk tend to lose fat eventhough they give themselves a higher-calorie diet.
[quote]OctoberGirl wrote:
Hi there,
I am a beginner also so maybe this will help. I first had to start cleaning up my eating. Developing good habits. I started a food log and found where I was eating too much, or too little or all the wrong things. Once you figure out how much you should be eating and then keeping track you will begin to develop a healthier lifestyle.
Although you have been lifting which is good, since muscle burns fat, I don’t think bulking is the way for you to go at the beginning. You need to develop an eating plan. Not only that the results of your efforts will show better. If you read on here everyone says the results come from your diet which is 90% of the effort.
Begin consistent habits, start a food log, start a program log, eat clean, and get rest.
That is the best thing for you right now. Not only that if you haven’t been eating well, eating clean is going to give you your FAST results.[/quote]
I here ya’ll taking about bulking but i need absolutly none of that now. my muscles are big enough as it is. trust me. i just need to drop weight and keep strength.
what i meant by “doing it fast” was just some hardcore cardio stuff to drop it quicker and the right intake for calories for the exercise.
oh and marlboro man, i got my strength from lifting for 2-3 hrs a day,5 days a week for a couple months at a time. over about a year and a half. i started at 90 lb bench then got to 360 in 1 1/2 years. it’s crazy and i think it was high testosterone levels b-cuz everyone around me took all kinds of products for size and strength and all i did was lift a lot.
any hardcore cardio tips?
[quote]CLewis wrote:
I think I was the only person to mention bulking, so I’ll address this. A food log is an excellent device. And of course, everyone on the thread has been emphasizing the importance of diet.
However, just eating clean will not get you anywhere unless they identify their overall objective. I mentioned that going either way would work, but given his stats and the what tends to be easier for most (bulk, then cut) I personally recommended cutting. Keep in mind, I recommended a clean bulk.
Your objective will dictate whether you a) eat clean, but eat more; or b) eat clean, but eat less. You should be eating clean either way. But you need to make a decision on which way to go.
Your objective will also dictate how you perform your exercises. Unless you try to do both bulking and cutting at once (which is not very effective if you are not a beginner) you are either bulking or cutting at all times. Simply saying “eat clean” is, as you say, only a fraction of the entire equation. A coach once said something to the effect of, `It isn’t 50-50 or 90-10; it’s 100-100.’
At essence, I am not disagreeing with you. People definitely need to have their diet in check. The problem is, you are saying that just eating will give “Fast results” - but what kind of results? Weight loss? Muscle gain?
You will not get anywhere until you decide how you will structure that clean diet and your exercise program; and you cannot do that until you decide what your focus is.
The way you structure your clean diet and your exercise routine depends on your priorities and your goal at that moment. Your diet is one part of a larger program which needs to have a goal. And as I mentioned, even people who are on a clean bulk tend to lose fat eventhough they give themselves a higher-calorie diet.
OctoberGirl wrote:
Hi there,
I am a beginner also so maybe this will help. I first had to start cleaning up my eating. Developing good habits. I started a food log and found where I was eating too much, or too little or all the wrong things. Once you figure out how much you should be eating and then keeping track you will begin to develop a healthier lifestyle.
Although you have been lifting which is good, since muscle burns fat, I don’t think bulking is the way for you to go at the beginning. You need to develop an eating plan. Not only that the results of your efforts will show better. If you read on here everyone says the results come from your diet which is 90% of the effort.
Begin consistent habits, start a food log, start a program log, eat clean, and get rest.
That is the best thing for you right now. Not only that if you haven’t been eating well, eating clean is going to give you your FAST results.
[/quote]
I’m not going to argue with you here.
Bulking isn’t what this person needs to be doing.
He didn’t get to be his weight with good eating habits.
He needs to learn the foundations and work from there. He can get fast results just from a change to a good diet. Not only will he drop the weight it will show the work he has done and improve his overall being.
Once he learns how to eat for his goals he has a great base to work from.
Good luck to the OP!
To the OP, as you can see there will be a lot of information you can get on here. Don’t let reading all the articles take up so much time you don’t have time for doing the work.
Eat clean, get to the gym and be consistent.
[quote]wickedpblr666 wrote:
I here ya’ll taking about bulking but i need absolutly none of that now. my muscles are big enough as it is. trust me. i just need to drop weight and keep strength.
what i meant by “doing it fast” was just some hardcore cardio stuff to drop it quicker and the right intake for calories for the exercise.
oh and marlboro man, i got my strength from lifting for 2-3 hrs a day,5 days a week for a couple months at a time. over about a year and a half. i started at 90 lb bench then got to 360 in 1 1/2 years. it’s crazy and i think it was high testosterone levels b-cuz everyone around me took all kinds of products for size and strength and all i did was lift a lot.
any hardcore cardio tips?[/quote]
Hardcore huh? Hardcore as in your 2-3 hour workouts? Seems you need to learn more before you decide to go harcore.
You’re better off losing the weight at a slower but consistent pace so you can maintain muscle. Losing the weight too fast will cause you to lose a good amount of muscle along with fat. The dramatic weight loss is also going to cause you to lose strength.
I’m a little confused, because in your original post, you said you wanted to gain muscle mass.
At any rate, the same rules I mentioned for cutting apply. Use Berardi’s healthy eating principles, as mentioned above; and for hardcore weightloss, do HIIT in the morning:
(repeated)
When you cut, focus on maintaining strength, not building it. You can eat around 1 g protein/lb. You’ll want to continue with Berardi’s principles. Try to add 1-2 High Intensity Interval Training (HIIT) sessions a week. Here is the Tabata protocol:
Four Minutes total (good to do at the beginning of the day):
As soon as you cannot do your cycle at max effort, stop. You may want to start with a more moderate cardio approach and work up to Tabata. It’s four minutes of very rough work, but it will burn calories like nothing else.
You may think that is silly, but it is supported by research: working out with interval training has been shown to burn more calories throughout the day, and therefore lead to greater weight loss even when you did not burn as many calories in the exercise session. Knowing that it is only 4 minutes will make you work harder.
→ By the way, this same concept can be seen by other authors here on T-Nation. It’s all HIIT, whether you call it HIIT or, in Cosgrove’s case, you call it Afterburn.
[quote]wickedpblr666 wrote:
I here ya’ll taking about bulking but i need absolutly none of that now. my muscles are big enough as it is. trust me. i just need to drop weight and keep strength.
what i meant by “doing it fast” was just some hardcore cardio stuff to drop it quicker and the right intake for calories for the exercise.
oh and marlboro man, i got my strength from lifting for 2-3 hrs a day,5 days a week for a couple months at a time. over about a year and a half. i started at 90 lb bench then got to 360 in 1 1/2 years. it’s crazy and i think it was high testosterone levels b-cuz everyone around me took all kinds of products for size and strength and all i did was lift a lot.
any hardcore cardio tips?[/quote]
[quote]CLewis wrote:
I think I was the only person to mention bulking, so I’ll address this.
[/quote]
YOU ARE NUTS thinking this guy needs to bulk hell even he says so. just looking at his Height weight and the fact that up to 2 inches of his Bicep measure is FAT as he says. UM NO its high time to make some changes not add more fat.
That is unless his goal is a SHW pler etc whcih great go for it get damn big and strong. But that doesnt seem the case.
Oh and yes clean food alone will go a LONG damn ways for someone whos been eating shit. even if they eat the same amount of k/cals. Just the thermic effect of having to digest REAL food will go along way that and the fiber etc.
Not trying to be a dick but man your OUT there in your bulikng recomendation and Im all full getting swole and eating for it.
Phill
[quote]Phill wrote:
CLewis wrote:
I think I was the only person to mention bulking, so I’ll address this.
YOU ARE NUTS thinking this guy needs to bulk hell even he says so. just looking at his Height weight and the fact that up to 2 inches of his Bicep measure is FAT as he says. UM NO its high time to make some changes not add more fat.
That is unless his goal is a SHW pler etc whcih great go for it get damn big and strong. But that doesnt seem the case.
Oh and yes clean food alone will go a LONG damn ways for someone whos been eating shit. even if they eat the same amount of k/cals. Just the thermic effect of having to digest REAL food will go along way that and the fiber etc.
Not trying to be a dick but man your OUT there in your bulikng recomendation and Im all full getting swole and eating for it.
Phill[/quote]
I’ve really gotta agree here. You’d benefit just from eating a clean well balanced diet. Lots of fruits and vegetables(I MEAN LOTS) leans cuts of meat and healthy fats. Here’s the kicker,watch your calories,to make sure they aren’t to low. Your a big dude and 2,000 calories a day isn’t gonna cut it for ya. I’d start around 3,500 maybe even 4000 a day of absolute clean food and adjust from there.
If you feel the need to have a cheat meal then make a ritual, mine is every friday or saturday(depending on the week) I go out with my friends and have a beer(or 12), some wings maybe some pizza or fries,when I wake up the next morning its right back to clean eating.
The thing is and I can’t stress this enough you need to develope solid dietary habits now that are going to sustain you for the rest of your life. Your profile says you have 40% bodyfat, if that is indeed true or even close to that your at a serious health risk for later on in life. Building great dietary habits goes far beyond looking good nekkid or pure performance.
No, believe me - I definitely agree with you completely!
The ONLY reason I recommended what I did is because he asked for 2 specific things: 1) to gain muscle (while losing weight); and 2) for a kind of hardcore cardio. Despite the fact that he only asked for those two things, I ALSO emphasized diet. Read the post, man.
He ASKED for a type of hardcore cardio. That’s why I mentioned on HIIT. However, I STILL mentioned diet there, eventhough he didn’t ask about it.
As I said, depending on what he is eating, bulking while switching to a clean diet (which I recommended) actually makes many people lose weight. I have seen this happen with many, many people.
The ONLY reason I mentioned that he MIGHT (and I specifically said he could CHOOSE to either bulk or cut depending on what he wanted to do) want to bulk first was because HE said he wanted to gain muscle in addition to losing fat in the first post.
Most lifters would agree that it is much easier to get all the muscle you want and maintain it. It is MUCH more difficult to lose the weight first, then to try to bulk up. Now that he has said that he is more interested in losing weight, obviously I agree with you 100%. But I still mention HIIT because he SPECIFICALLY asked for a hardcore cardio workout.
Diet is obvious - although he didn’t ask about it, I definitely emphasized it - but I’m just answering his question - that is - what can he do for hardcore cardio.
[quote]Phill wrote:
YOU ARE NUTS thinking this guy needs to bulk hell even he says so. just looking at his Height weight and the fact that up to 2 inches of his Bicep measure is FAT as he says. UM NO its high time to make some changes not add more fat.
That is unless his goal is a SHW pler etc whcih great go for it get damn big and strong. But that doesnt seem the case.
Oh and yes clean food alone will go a LONG damn ways for someone whos been eating shit. even if they eat the same amount of k/cals. Just the thermic effect of having to digest REAL food will go along way that and the fiber etc.
Not trying to be a dick but man your OUT there in your bulikng recomendation and Im all full getting swole and eating for it.
Phill[/quote]
[quote]CLewis wrote:
No, believe me - I definitely agree with you completely!
…
[/quote]
Yhea I can see that I just think hos best bet is simply clean things up Not cut but clean the diet see where that bring you along with hard training after a few months. Hopefully leaning up a bit and gaining gym performance.
Then sure address goals if its to in the end get bigger more LBM hell no need to cut, gain slow and smart.
Phill