CT & Professor X's Discussion

Training Bodybuilding
223

[quote]Fulmen wrote:
Tex Ag wrote:
My argument is that size alone, be it body part or weight, is not the end-all measure of knowledge. Yet, when push comes to shove, this is what is being used to determine creditability.

We’re concerning bodybuilding, not powerlifting or anything else. What else do you think would be used for credibility in bodybuilding?

I want to be a bodybuilder. I see a guy with 14" arms, and status quo physique pressing 400 or whatever. Then the guy with 20" arms and great physique is on the other side doing his preachers or whatever.

Sure, the small guy is impressive in his lifts, but I don’t give a shit about lift numbers because I’m a BODYBUILDER. I’ll get my advice from the guy with the 20" arms package since that’s my focus. Simple logic, Tex.

However, if my goals were to powerlift, who do you think I would go to?

Sigh.[/quote]

What if the guy with 14" arms use to have 10" arms?

224

[quote]austin_bicep wrote:
HotCarl28 wrote:
So i was looking through X’s profile because i keep hearing how big he is and i was very surprised when i came to his pictures

because he is black… i was expecting (for some reason) a long haired white man, and instead got a bald black man

how old are u X? and why havne’t u yet competed in a show?

that’s alittle weird cause i checked his pics today and had the same question…how old are you X, you kinda remind me of a cross between johnnie jackson and flex wheeler. you’re a big man.[/quote]

I’m 30 years old…and thank you. I want to get into shape to compete but doing so isn’t exactly a top priority. I already have a career. I do this because I love it, not really for a trophy.

225

[quote]firebug9 wrote:

Sorry I thought it was relavent to the discussion, as I was speaking to the fact that just because someone is smaller does not mean they have any less to offer in advise.

I will step out of the conversation now.

[/quote]

There is no reason to step out of the conversation. I wish more women were brash enough to actually jump into some of these discussions without needing someone to hold their hand. I am just making the point that this is not a discussion about powerlifting. Had that continued, every “I don’t want to be huge” guy would be logging into this thread as well.

As far as responding to your post, doubleh did a great job when he wrote this:

[quote]Just a quick comment and I’ll step out, b/c as Prof X said, this thread is supposed to be about bodybuilding.

Relative strength, ie poundage lifted vs BW, is supposed to be, as Tex Ag said, an equalizer. But consider a few things: BW isn’t all it’s cracked up to be. Is a 200-lb guy benching 450 more impressive than a 275-lb guy benching 500? Most “relative strength” people would say yes, absolutely.

But what if I told you the 200-lb guy was 5’5" with T-rex arms, meaning he has a tiny ROM and great leverage for the lift, and the 275-lb’er was 6’4" with long arms? BW isn’t everything, and in the end (to me at least), it’s about how much weight you put up, not your “relative strength index”.

Furthermore, the law of diminishing returns means more and more boundaries need to be pushed to lift heavier and heavier weight. In other words, we all know it’s easier to go from 200-300 than 300-400, or 400-500, etc - in any lift, regardless of BW. So when we’re talking world-class lifts being performed, a heavier BW is necessary to be able to continue to progress.

That being said, I’d still be DAMN impressed to see a 165-lb guy squat 800. :O[/quote]

226

[quote]Tex Ag wrote:
I guess what is being said is we do not have a way of understanding one’s credentials beyond size. Okay.

As far as taking the conversation beyond bodybuilding, the length of this tread has wavered beyond bodybuilding in its discussion about information on this site and how it has been interpreted, misinterpreted and handed out in several different forums and discussions.

I did not know that all of a sudden the conversation would be limited to one particular forum within the entirety of the website. I spoke up because this thread was dealing with an issue -information and interpretation- that effects the entire site.
[/quote]

Pictures.

It would help if the guys running around telling newbies not to ever train arms had their pictures up somewhere. It would eliminate a ton of misinformation. No one is saying the guy with 18" arms has more to say than the guy with 17" arms. What is being said is the guy who has no muscle mass to speak of and who wouldn’t stand out from the average sedentary person needs to quit giving out so much training advice when they are clearly only regurgitating what they’ve read somewhere.

Experience gets treated like it isn’t important around here.

227

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
He can correct me if I’m wrong, but I think you guys are tatooing these numbers on Professor X when that isn’t the actual point he’s making. He’s not saying if you bench 399 you have no business speaking until it’s 401. He’s also not putting hard measurements on it either, meaning as soon as you get that last quarter inch on whatever bodypart or that last 5 pounds of mass you are now qualified to have an opinion.

I can’t imagine him not respecting anybody who has made and is making SIGNIFICANT progress in any of these areas. He makes these statements as illustrations of how somebody who has paid no dues under the iron and has little to commend their authority should be more circumspect in how they leap to respond in some of these threads.

[/quote]

There is no reason to correct this. This is what I was saying.

228

[quote]Professor X wrote:

Pictures.

It would help if the guys running around telling newbies not to ever train arms had their pictures up somewhere. It would eliminate a ton of misinformation. No one is saying the guy with 18" arms has more to say than the guy with 17" arms. What is being said is the guy who has no muscle mass to speak of and who wouldn’t stand out from the average sedentary person needs to quit giving out so much training advice when they are clearly only regurgitating what they’ve read somewhere.

Experience gets treated like it isn’t important around here.[/quote]

Agreed

229

[quote]Professor X wrote:
Tex Ag wrote:
I guess what is being said is we do not have a way of understanding one’s credentials beyond size. Okay.

As far as taking the conversation beyond bodybuilding, the length of this tread has wavered beyond bodybuilding in its discussion about information on this site and how it has been interpreted, misinterpreted and handed out in several different forums and discussions.

I did not know that all of a sudden the conversation would be limited to one particular forum within the entirety of the website. I spoke up because this thread was dealing with an issue -information and interpretation- that effects the entire site.

Pictures.

It would help if the guys running around telling newbies not to ever train arms had their pictures up somewhere. It would eliminate a ton of misinformation. No one is saying the guy with 18" arms has more to say than the guy with 17" arms. What is being said is the guy who has no muscle mass to speak of and who wouldn’t stand out from the average sedentary person needs to quit giving out so much training advice when they are clearly only regurgitating what they’ve read somewhere.

Experience gets treated like it isn’t important around here.[/quote]

i almost never train my arms, but then again, my arms are pathetic, so maybe i am not the best example.

230

[quote]heavythrower wrote:

i almost never train my arms, but then again, my arms are pathetic, so maybe i am not the best example.[/quote]

The difference is, anyone with eyes can tell you lift weights. I am willing to bet the same can’t be said for most of the people on the forum. That hasn’t stopped newbies from giving other newbies retarded advice.

I am willing to bet more than a few people could learn something from you.

231

[quote]Professor X wrote:
firebug9 wrote:

Sorry I thought it was relavent to the discussion, as I was speaking to the fact that just because someone is smaller does not mean they have any less to offer in advise.

I will step out of the conversation now.

There is no reason to step out of the conversation. I wish more women were brash enough to actually jump into some of these discussions without needing someone to hold their hand. I am just making the point that this is not a discussion about powerlifting. Had that continued, every “I don’t want to be huge” guy would be logging into this thread as well.

As far as responding to your post, doubleh did a great job when he wrote this:

Just a quick comment and I’ll step out, b/c as Prof X said, this thread is supposed to be about bodybuilding.

Relative strength, ie poundage lifted vs BW, is supposed to be, as Tex Ag said, an equalizer. But consider a few things: BW isn’t all it’s cracked up to be. Is a 200-lb guy benching 450 more impressive than a 275-lb guy benching 500? Most “relative strength” people would say yes, absolutely.

But what if I told you the 200-lb guy was 5’5" with T-rex arms, meaning he has a tiny ROM and great leverage for the lift, and the 275-lb’er was 6’4" with long arms? BW isn’t everything, and in the end (to me at least), it’s about how much weight you put up, not your “relative strength index”.

Furthermore, the law of diminishing returns means more and more boundaries need to be pushed to lift heavier and heavier weight. In other words, we all know it’s easier to go from 200-300 than 300-400, or 400-500, etc - in any lift, regardless of BW. So when we’re talking world-class lifts being performed, a heavier BW is necessary to be able to continue to progress.

That being said, I’d still be DAMN impressed to see a 165-lb guy squat 800. :O[/quote]

Well Prof X, I have never been one to be shy ;). Here is a copy of the pm I sent to doubleh in response to his:

I agree that ROM is also important, but Prof X point was that if you do not look the part then you have no right to give advise. I want to know how he defines look the part. I would love to squat 500 pounds, but I do not want to have to look like Harriet Hall to do so. When relatively speaking I could learn from someone who squats say 4 times their body weight and acheive my goal – same thing with bodybuilding. Some one with 14" arms might have started with 10 – so now do they have something to offer, well maybe. They have increased their arm size by almost half, I think I might listen to them then.

Also here is a link to Wade Hooper Squating 804 in the gym:

I think that yes looking the part is important too – no matter what part it is you are trying to look. But truthfully if you did not know Arnold before today and saw him in a gym would you ask him for advise with how he looks right now? But don’t you think he might have a thing or two to offer? That is one thing to think about as well.

I understand trying to mimic those you want to look like, but the person next to them might have been their secret all along and they look nothing like a bb.

We are quick to discount people based on looks without learning what they might actually be capable of.

Malinda

232

[quote]Professor X wrote:

Experience gets treated like it isn’t important around here.[/quote]

That’s unfortunate. I’ve learned a wealth of information on the forums, but most of my learning and experience has come training. Training for a few years now has been the best thing for me. My mentor is my father who used to lift and after he set me up with a program and guided me along the way, that is where I’ve learned the most.

i am now able to decide when i lift, how much I lift, sets, reps, and everything else. This came from practice. i discovered what works for me and i put it to use. What annoys me is that everyone is so set on sticking to the rules. oh, Chad Waterbury says this, so I have to do that, and so on and so forth. If people would think for themselves and listen to the wisdom that others have put forth, I think many people would get much better results and there would be a lot more intermediate aqnd advanced lifters than begginers.

I think goals are very important too. Mine are extremely high. I’ve said it before and many might laugh, but I want to become a pro bodybuilder, I’ve wanted to ever since i was little boy, started lifting at 14.5 years old now 17. i’m a pretty big guy and you’d know i lift if you see me. When kids ask at school what are you going to do when you leave high school, and i tell them that i’m going to be a pro bodybuilder.

that’s my dream. I’ve realized that to accomplish my dream I NEED to think for myself and LISTEN to my body, no one knows what will work best for me, but me, that doesn’t mean i won’t benefit from others advices, only that I am my best source of information.

233

I just want to point out that for a man going from 10 inch arms to 14 inch arms is likely not impressive. If they’re a midget or something maybe, but then they would look the part. It’s like a guy who’s 400 pounds of obesity. Loosing 100 pounds of that isn’t going to mean I will refer to him when I want to get leaner, despite having much less than 100 pounds to lose.

Also, people who can squat 4 times their bodyweight usually don’t look like people at the same weight who can’t do that, and at any rate they are pretty rare and can prove themselves if they want.

Finally about Arnold; he’s old, it’s usually wise to listen to what older people have to say as they have accrued quite a bit of wisdom even if it’s no longer apparent what they have achieved. Totally different story that those who haven’t done anything yet.

234

[quote]will to power wrote:
I just want to point out that for a man going from 10 inch arms to 14 inch arms is likely not impressive. If they’re a midget or something maybe, but then they would look the part. It’s like a guy who’s 400 pounds of obesity. Loosing 100 pounds of that isn’t going to mean I will refer to him when I want to get leaner, despite having much less than 100 pounds to lose.

Also, people who can squat 4 times their bodyweight usually don’t look like people at the same weight who can’t do that, and at any rate they are pretty rare and can prove themselves if they want.

Finally about Arnold; he’s old, it’s usually wise to listen to what older people have to say as they have accrued quite a bit of wisdom even if it’s no longer apparent what they have achieved. Totally different story that those who haven’t done anything yet. [/quote]

Well those were just numbers – so if it was from 15 to 18 would it matter? And who said it had to be a Man, do Women have less to offer? Really, do We? Many of us have much more stacked against us genetically speaking. So if a female were to increase her arm size by 30% or so you would not listen because it came from a Girl?

And yeah that was my point – he is old and to look at him now you would not know that he had ever been a high acheiving bodybuilder so if you had no clue who he was, would you truely listen to what he had to say? Honestly would you? I would be willing to be the answer is NO, and that would be too bad, because you judged the book by its cover and would have been wrong. The point is that unless you talked to him and by the account given you would not give him the time of day, you would never know what knowledge he might have to offer. That is all I was pointing out.

235

[quote]firebug9 wrote:
…Prof X point was that if you do not look the part then you have no right to give advise. I want to know how he defines look the part. [/quote]

Looking the part would mean showing some evidence of work in the gym long enough to have an opinion. There is no stereotype, however, I bet most of us would know it when we see it.

I am not kidding when I say that some of the people giving advice here don’t even workout. All of us should want that to stop.

[quote]

Also here is a link to Wade Hooper Squating 804 in the gym:

I think that yes looking the part is important too – no matter what part it is you are trying to look. But truthfully if you did not know Arnold before today and saw him in a gym would you ask him for advise with how he looks right now? But don’t you think he might have a thing or two to offer? That is one thing to think about as well.[/quote]

Do you see his legs? Does he look like he’s sedentary? I personally would only worry about what he has to say if my goal was to squat that much but I doubt many would look at him and think he didn’t lift at all. I would not speak to him about how to gain more size on my triceps, however.

While this may generically be true, there are far too many little guys who have made a huge effort to downplay the significance of those who have put the time in and built the size.

Bodybuilding is still the one area where muscular size is still the determining factor of success. Why try to change that?

I remember training around Tony Dodd (an NPC competitor from a couple of years back) and watching how people responded to him. He had earned that level of respect (or awe…whatever you want to call it) and some 140lbs kid shouldn’t expect the same.

236

[quote]will to power wrote:
I just want to point out that for a man going from 10 inch arms to 14 inch arms is likely not impressive. If they’re a midget or something maybe, but then they would look the part. It’s like a guy who’s 400 pounds of obesity. Loosing 100 pounds of that isn’t going to mean I will refer to him when I want to get leaner, despite having much less than 100 pounds to lose.

Also, people who can squat 4 times their bodyweight usually don’t look like people at the same weight who can’t do that, and at any rate they are pretty rare and can prove themselves if they want.

Finally about Arnold; he’s old, it’s usually wise to listen to what older people have to say as they have accrued quite a bit of wisdom even if it’s no longer apparent what they have achieved. Totally different story that those who haven’t done anything yet. [/quote]

Well said. Along with that, I just want to emphasize that it is not that impressive to me to see some small guy lift 250lbs. That is not a lot of weight and “relative strength” means jack shit to me. The guy benchpressing 600lbs is going to be more impressive even if he weighs 300lbs or more.

Those weight classes don’t exist because smaller guys are better lifters.

237

[quote]Professor X wrote:
firebug9 wrote:
…Prof X point was that if you do not look the part then you have no right to give advise. I want to know how he defines look the part.

Looking the part would mean showing some evidence of work in the gym long enough to have an opinion. There is no stereotype, however, I bet most of us would know it when we see it.

I am not kidding when I say that some of the people giving advice here don’t even workout. All of us should want that to stop.

Also here is a link to Wade Hooper Squating 804 in the gym:

I think that yes looking the part is important too – no matter what part it is you are trying to look. But truthfully if you did not know Arnold before today and saw him in a gym would you ask him for advise with how he looks right now? But don’t you think he might have a thing or two to offer? That is one thing to think about as well.

Do you see his legs? Does he look like he’s sedentary? I personally would only worry about what he has to say if my goal was to squat that much but I doubt many would look at him and think he didn’t lift at all. I would not speak to him about how to gain more size on my triceps, however.

We are quick to discount people based on looks without learning what they might actually be capable of.

Malinda

While this may generically be true, there are far too many little guys who have made a huge effort to downplay the significance of those who have put the time in and built the size.

Bodybuilding is still the one area where muscular size is still the determining factor of success. Why try to change that?

I remember training around Tony Dodd (an NPC competitor from a couple of years back) and watching how people responded to him. He had earned that level of respect (or awe…whatever you want to call it) and some 140lbs kid shouldn’t expect the same.[/quote]

Trust me I have seen Wade’s legs up close :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye: They are nice and the hard work shows – but most people still doubt that he can squat the kind of weight he does until I show them the video. That was my point there.

Trust me his tri’s are not small either. But my point is that yes althought the respect must be earned I think it can be earned in more than one way.

Until today I had never seen your pictures – but you have earned my respect because of your knowledge. I do not doubt that there are people on this site with nothing but book knowledge handing out advise – and alot of it is bogus and will get someone hurt. Unfortunately it is almost impossible to stop that from happening in todays internet society. Each and everyone of us needs to learn on our own how to diciefer the information we are reading. How to sift thru it and take what is usable – even from the articles.

Like I said above if some one saw Arnold in the gym today and had no idea who he was (I know alittle unlikely) or even lets say Matt Mendenhall who was very good in his day they would be very unlikely to listen to a word he had to say…

Malinda

238

[quote]firebug9 wrote:
will to power wrote:
I just want to point out that for a man going from 10 inch arms to 14 inch arms is likely not impressive. If they’re a midget or something maybe, but then they would look the part. It’s like a guy who’s 400 pounds of obesity. Loosing 100 pounds of that isn’t going to mean I will refer to him when I want to get leaner, despite having much less than 100 pounds to lose.

Also, people who can squat 4 times their bodyweight usually don’t look like people at the same weight who can’t do that, and at any rate they are pretty rare and can prove themselves if they want.

Finally about Arnold; he’s old, it’s usually wise to listen to what older people have to say as they have accrued quite a bit of wisdom even if it’s no longer apparent what they have achieved. Totally different story that those who haven’t done anything yet.

Well those were just numbers – so if it was from 15 to 18 would it matter? And who said it had to be a Man, do Women have less to offer? Really, do We? Many of us have much more stacked against us genetically speaking. So if a female were to increase her arm size by 30% or so you would not listen because it came from a Girl?
[/quote]

I specified a man because I would listen to a woman who went from 10 to 14 inch arms, and yes to a man who went from 15 to 18 inches. Women do not have less to offer, and I’ve never seen a woman offer advice on gaining muscle when she didn’t know what she was talking about. Even my grandmother gives the right advice; eat a lot and work hard :slight_smile:

I agree it’s only a number, and changes based on height and many other things, but I think you understand the idea that is being put forward; is this person’s advice based on what they know or what they’ve read?

As I said, I would honestly listen to him. Time takes away from all of us, and what you look like in your old age is not necessarily a good representation of what you have achieved in the past. I know you’re likely to not believe my saying this because really most people wouldn’t but you can take it or leave it.

Incidentally, if someone tried to talk to me in real life even if I did think they had nothing to offer I would not brush them off, so it’s not like he wouldn’t have a chance to give his account.

239

[quote]Professor X wrote:
will to power wrote:
I just want to point out that for a man going from 10 inch arms to 14 inch arms is likely not impressive. If they’re a midget or something maybe, but then they would look the part. It’s like a guy who’s 400 pounds of obesity. Loosing 100 pounds of that isn’t going to mean I will refer to him when I want to get leaner, despite having much less than 100 pounds to lose.

Also, people who can squat 4 times their bodyweight usually don’t look like people at the same weight who can’t do that, and at any rate they are pretty rare and can prove themselves if they want.

Finally about Arnold; he’s old, it’s usually wise to listen to what older people have to say as they have accrued quite a bit of wisdom even if it’s no longer apparent what they have achieved. Totally different story that those who haven’t done anything yet.

Well said. Along with that, I just want to emphasize that it is not that impressive to me to see some small guy lift 250lbs. That is not a lot of weight and “relative strength” means jack shit to me. The guy benchpressing 600lbs is going to be more impressive even if he weighs 300lbs or more.

Those weight classes don’t exist because smaller guys are better lifters.[/quote]

Why is it more impressive for a fat 300lb man to lift twice his body weight and a guy that is lean and weighs 165 and lifts the same 600lbs? I don’t get that, I really just dont.

So you are telling me that Jeff Lewis is more impressive with his rolls upon rolls than Wade Hooper is? I was scared to walk to close to Joe Lewis – the gravitational pull was strong and I did not want to be sucked into that.

You really find this more impressive:

240

[quote]firebug9 wrote:

Like I said above if some one saw Arnold in the gym today and had no idea who he was (I know alittle unlikely) or even lets say Matt Mendenhall who was very good in his day they would be very unlikely to listen to a word he had to say…

Malinda
[/quote]

…and you may have a point there, however, I can only speak for myself. I have NEVER discounted an older lifter unless they simply looked like an average clueless weekend warrior. Most older lifters, even if they back off from training a little, still retain that look. Charles Glass is a good example.

The man is MUCH smaller than he used to be, but I doubt any of us with any experience would assume he wasn’t serious about training (at least at one time). Arnold isn’t tiny either. Sure, he is nowhere near what he used to be, but I am guessing most of us who have done this for a while could tell that he has a great deal of experience just from his overall shape.

It is a huge jump to relate how an older bodybuilder (who spent years building muscle) looks and how some newbie looks who never built any muscle to begin with.

Hell, the stretch marks alone would give it away.

I grew up asking every lifter who seemed to have more experience than me tons of questions. They were who I hung around and I chose those who were older and never quit training…because I knew this was a life long pursuit.

Now, I get the feeling there are tons of pole thin newbies hanging around other pole thin newbies based on how many acronyms they can toss out.

241

[quote]will to power wrote:
firebug9 wrote:
will to power wrote:
I just want to point out that for a man going from 10 inch arms to 14 inch arms is likely not impressive. If they’re a midget or something maybe, but then they would look the part. It’s like a guy who’s 400 pounds of obesity. Loosing 100 pounds of that isn’t going to mean I will refer to him when I want to get leaner, despite having much less than 100 pounds to lose.

Also, people who can squat 4 times their bodyweight usually don’t look like people at the same weight who can’t do that, and at any rate they are pretty rare and can prove themselves if they want.

Finally about Arnold; he’s old, it’s usually wise to listen to what older people have to say as they have accrued quite a bit of wisdom even if it’s no longer apparent what they have achieved. Totally different story that those who haven’t done anything yet.

Well those were just numbers – so if it was from 15 to 18 would it matter? And who said it had to be a Man, do Women have less to offer? Really, do We? Many of us have much more stacked against us genetically speaking. So if a female were to increase her arm size by 30% or so you would not listen because it came from a Girl?

I specified a man because I would listen to a woman who went from 10 to 14 inch arms, and yes to a man who went from 15 to 18 inches. Women do not have less to offer, and I’ve never seen a woman offer advice on gaining muscle when she didn’t know what she was talking about. Even my grandmother gives the right advice; eat a lot and work hard :slight_smile:

I agree it’s only a number, and changes based on height and many other things, but I think you understand the idea that is being put forward; is this person’s advice based on what they know or what they’ve read?

And yeah that was my point – he is old and to look at him now you would not know that he had ever been a high acheiving bodybuilder so if you had no clue who he was, would you truely listen to what he had to say? Honestly would you? I would be willing to be the answer is NO, and that would be too bad, because you judged the book by its cover and would have been wrong. The point is that unless you talked to him and by the account given you would not give him the time of day, you would never know what knowledge he might have to offer. That is all I was pointing out.

As I said, I would honestly listen to him. Time takes away from all of us, and what you look like in your old age is not necessarily a good representation of what you have achieved in the past. I know you’re likely to not believe my saying this because really most people wouldn’t but you can take it or leave it.

Incidentally, if someone tried to talk to me in real life even if I did think they had nothing to offer I would not brush them off, so it’s not like he wouldn’t have a chance to give his account.[/quote]

I have no reason not to believe you. But I also believe that society as a whole would not listen to him. I also believe that in general alot of people – even on this board would not listen to a female on the same subject. If she was Hott they would give her the time of day but the information would go in one ear and out the other. Just my opinion.

I live with this daily at work. The guys I work with don’t listen to how a squat should be done. Hell one guy was deadlifting at work ON THE SMITH machine blew three discs and had to have back surgery before he listened to me. By the way he was lifting my second warm up and out weighs me by 65 lbs…and was an athlete in high school and college. Go figure.

And yes I do understand the point that is trying to be made. I also think that we are all of the same belief. I find the conversation interesting and would love to investigate every angle ;P.

242

[quote]firebug9 wrote:

Why is it more impressive for a fat 300lb man to lift twice his body weight and a guy that is lean and weighs 165 and lifts the same 600lbs? I don’t get that, I really just dont.[/quote]

See, I didn’t say “the same 600lbs”. How many 165lbs guys are lifting 600lbs? A lot? 10? To answer you more directly, however, it is EASIER to lift 200-300lbs than it is to lift in excess of 500-600lbs. It takes less time and less overall size and leverage to reach a smaller weight regardless of what you weigh personally, so no, someone’s relative strength is not a major concern to me. I am impressed by big weights being lifted and could really care less how much the guy lifting it weighs.

[quote]
So you are telling me that Jeff Lewis is more impressive with his rolls upon rolls than Wade Hooper is? I was scared to walk to close to Joe Lewis – the gravitational pull was strong and I did not want to be sucked into that.

You really find this more impressive:
Jeff Lewis 2007 Mens Nationals - YouTube [/quote]

I am not into powerlifting anymore. At one time, after seeing Anthony Clark lift at my gym, I was into it…but that turned more into bodybuilding. I don’t know who Jeff Lewis is and I would be lying if I wrote that I cared much. I RESPECT powerlifting but it isn’t my pursuit.