Contemplating HRT- Questions and Concerns

My friend has been on HRT for two years and swears by it. I’m 44 and am thinking about doing it.

Concerns- As a lifelong weightlifter, one of the toughest things for me, mentally, has been watching myself lose muscle mass, even though I still work out as steadily as I did for the last 25 years. I have gone from about 215 to about 195. Still very well-built for my age, but I absolutely hate the occasional comment from people I’ve known all my life…“Don’t you work out anymore?”, “Wow, you lost a lot of weight.”, and so on…

My concern is to try HRT, gain back some mass, and have to go through all that again.

Concern #2- As appealing as it sounds to regain the tight skin, smaller mid-section, and upper body mass of my younger days, am I falling victim to not-aging-gracefully and deciding to cheat?

Question- Do people stay on this for five, ten, fifteen years? Can that possibly be healthy? I’ve read up on HRT and recognize the benefits, like reduced adipose tissue, etc., but has this been in exsistance long enough to know what this does to a person long-term?

Thanks for any help with my decision. In reading through these forums, everyone seems so knowledgable and helpful.

I can’t possibly imagine how tweaking your hormonal profile back to a youthful level would be unhealthy? It’s a life long commitment and from my personal experience well worth it!

I think the fear of long term TRT comes from drug companies wanting to market all of the drugs they come up with to treat the symptoms of an aging hormone profile. If you correct high blood pressure, high cholesterol, ED, weight gain, etc… with TRT how are they supposed to sell drugs?

So, are there people who have done this for 5, 8, even 10 or more years? That’s my main concern- starting it, loving the results, and then having to abandon it because it’s discovered that it’s nbad for you.

JuniorNB,
Good post. Here’s some info from a guy pushing three years of TRT/HRT:
There is no such thing as “trying” TRT, if you have hypogonadism now, you will always have it and simply will be on TRT the rest of your life.
You and I have different definitions of “aging gracefully”; my version is have as much Testosterone as possible to keep my heart strong, my arteries pliable, reduce my chances of developing Alzheimers’, and oh yeah, have no need of the little blue pill to “keep the wife happy”. Your version sounds like, “well, you get old, and that’s the way it is…”
1935 was the year that HRT/TRT hit the mainstream, and even though today a lot of doctors don’t have a clue how to do it right, there are even more that do.
My life is better now than than it was ten years ago, and this is the version of “aging gracefully” I will stay with.
I’m 49 next month.
I agree with brentf13 too.

Thanks, KNB. That’s very helpful and great way to look at it.

I have seen some companies that specialize in HRT treatments (reMani.com and Renewman.com come to mind). What are the pros and cons of dealing with these companies and trying to find a local doctor that knows something about it?

It’s really difficult to find a local Dr that knows anything about TRT. I had a local anti-aging Dr, before I knew what I was doing, put me on 1500IU of HCG every three days. Not a great idea. Find a good Dr or see Crisler.

I think everyone has done a good job of answering your questions, but I’d like to address some of the hidden premises behind those questions because I believe they are responsible for the current sorry state of men’s health care.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m on your side and I applaud your desire to understand what’s going on. But I think there is some really messed up shit here that hasn’t been addressed completely.

First off, don’t confuse philosophy with medicine. Low testosterone is a medical condition, not a philosophical question. It’s forgivable for someone from the general population to make that mistake. It is criminal when doctors do it. Any time a doctor tells you that low testosterone is “part of the natural aging process” you automatically know you’re dealing with an idiot.

Dying is part of the natural process of having clogged coronary arteries but no one has a problem with doing the unnatural thing of replacing them with veins from your leg. It is pure hypocrisy to avoid treating low testosterone simply because it is “natural.” Fuck natural.

As KNB has said, low testosterone is a medical condition that leads to problems like cardiovascular disease, heart disease, osteoporosis, depression and diabetes to name a few. Any time you’re weighing the “risks” of TRT, don’t forget you’re weighing them against early death. It is ok to ask what are the risks of TRT as long as you also ask what are the risks of not taking TRT. We know for a fact that the problems associated with low T can kill you. Weigh that against the purely imaginary problems of taking physiological doses of testosterone.

The so called association between testosterone and prostate cancer is based on one ridiculously flawed study that has been discredited many times. Researchers now believe it is estrogen, not testosterone, that is the problem in prostate cancer.

Another real problem is raised by brentf13. Let me make this perfectly clear… TESTOSTERONE IS NOT A DRUG.
Testosterone is a hormone. You’ve been “on it” your whole life. You’re basically asking what are the health risks of being 20 years old. It’s sort of a ridiculous question. Unfortunately, societal attitudes make it a perfectly understandable question.

No one has ever died from a testosterone overdose. In fact, you would be hard pressed to find anyone anywhere who has ever had a health problem directly attributable to taking testosterone.

As for long term effects, check out this picture of Serge Nubret at age 65.

Serge has been a pro bodybuilder for more than 30 years. He doesn’t talk about it (very understandably) but it is reasonable to assume he has been on gear since the 70’s. Put that picture in your “long term effects” file.

Absolutely not. I’m not trying to blow smoke up your ass and say it has been. What I’m saying is that you’re assuming there must be problems.

My point is that there is no EVIDENCE to suggest anything other than it is healthy. Furthermore, there isn’t even a theoretical model to suggest it is unhealthy.

Your skepticism is natural. It is normal. It is common. It’s even healthy to a certain extent. After all, it brought you here. Unfortunately, it is based on hysteria.

If you really want to get an idea of how messed up societal attitudes are towards testosterone simply look at the fact that the number one steroid in use today is estrogen. Tons of it are produced and consumed every year. Literally tons. No one blinks an eye. Yet its male counterpart, testosterone, is a Schedule II Controlled Substance and your doctor can be sent to jail for giving it to you.

If that ain’t fucked up, I don’t know what is.

Ok, I’m done ranting. I hope I haven’t put you off. You’re in the right place, asking the right questions and your heart is obviously in the right place. It’s all good.

Now do yourself a favor and go get your blood tested.

I’ve been on HRT (Test+AI+HCG) for 1 year and have 0 regrets. Plan on doing it for the rest of my life. In fact, its been so good that my wife is now in the process of getting tested and will go on HRT.

The doctor I go to is on HRT. He is over 50, looks like he’s in his 30s and has been doing it for 10+ years.

One of the reasons HRT is not more widely used is that the drug companies cannot patent testosterone. Instead they create drugs that try to combat all the symptoms of low test that are just plain bad for your body (statins, antidepressants) yet they can make some money on it. Plus keeping testosterone levels in the high normal range drastically lowers your chances of prostate cancer. If you like sex, you want to keep your prostate healthy and inside your body.

If anyone gets a chance to ge a copy of Breakthrough by Suzanne Sommers they should. It’s not just geared towards women. I picked it up to read for my wife but found that the information is pertinent to both men and woman. Oprah’s even starting to talk up bioidentical hormones. I’m not sure if this is good or bad, but it is starting to get more public visibility

Wow. You guys are sure leaning me towards going the HRT route. Is there any way to know if any local doctors deal in HRT or is it a crapshoot?

You can try

and

I’ve seen renewman mentioned several times. Is the consensus that they’re pretty good though a bit more expensive than other options?

Thanks Gary. A few came up that aren’t too far away from me.

I found this compound pharmacist. It appears as if they have their own physician on staff who specializes in male andropause.

Does this sound like someone who deals in the things you talk about on this forum, ie Test, HGH, etc?

http://www.hazledrugs.com/andro_consult.shtml

They’re only $95.00. For that money I’d be making an appointment as soon as possible.

TRT does seem a little overwhelming at first but it’s really simple and easy to manage. Well worth the benefits. Do some reading and get comfortable with it first and then when you decide to go for it do it right. You need T+HCG+AI. Don’t waste your time with a Dr that doesn’t have a clue.

Also remember that things continue to change. For example I inject my T cyp SC rather than IM and I’m having great results. A couple of doctors have moved in that direction already but that’s something that’s still fairly new. More frequent injections by SC route.

More motivation: today my girlfriend was looking at some pics of me from several years ago and asked me why I look so much better now. Answer TRT. I went from skinny to well built and aging skin to young looking skin in a year.

I look about ten years younger. The changes with TRT, eating right, and a good work out program are amazing.

[quote]KNB wrote:
They’re only $95.00. For that money I’d be making an appointment as soon as possible.[/quote]

I printed and filled out the questionaire on their website. (Standard stuff…have you lost muscle mass, gained fat, lost libido, etc). I put it in the mail yesterday. They will be contacting me. It is only about an hour and fifteen minutes from my house. I’ll be setting up a face-to-face consult when they call next week.

Since it’s a compound pharmacy, do you think they’d be open to suggestions as to what I’d like to take? From what I’ve read, Test Cyp, HGH, and an anti-estrogen seems to be the best route. Or maybe they have a set plan that they push. I guess we’ll see in time.

Keep us updated please. I may try them as well… Thanks

[quote]brentf13 wrote:
TRT does seem a little overwhelming at first but it’s really simple and easy to manage. Well worth the benefits. Do some reading and get comfortable with it first and then when you decide to go for it do it right. You need T+HCG+AI. Don’t waste your time with a Dr that doesn’t have a clue.

Also remember that things continue to change. For example I inject my T cyp SC rather than IM and I’m having great results. A couple of doctors have moved in that direction already but that’s something that’s still fairly new. More frequent injections by SC route. [/quote]

Awesome brent. Glad to see your having great results, and most men report the same benefits you did.

Now just imagine if you added Growth Hormone Replacement Therapy into the mix!

I’m glad your pushing the envelope with frequent SQ injects too.

But I would like to stress that if a TD works, its a better route as it mimics the natural pulse release of T more so than injects.

For many, getting a quality TD from a quality compounder is difficult. Another reason to only deal with Dr. Crisler.

He is currently using an advanced form of TD that is a gel that is superior to previous creams/androgel/testim

I think the secret behind HRT is estrogen control. Many aren’t using an AI, or are using inferior/invalid E2 tests as well. It is of the utmost importance to have E2 in line with correct testing.

I look at HRT as a table with four legs - T + hcG/or preferably hmG + AI + GHRT.

I would also like to note that hmG is superior to hcG.

[quote]Wise Guy wrote:
brentf13 wrote:
TRT does seem a little overwhelming at first but it’s really simple and easy to manage. Well worth the benefits. Do some reading and get comfortable with it first and then when you decide to go for it do it right. You need T+HCG+AI. Don’t waste your time with a Dr that doesn’t have a clue.

Also remember that things continue to change. For example I inject my T cyp SC rather than IM and I’m having great results. A couple of doctors have moved in that direction already but that’s something that’s still fairly new. More frequent injections by SC route.

Awesome brent. Glad to see your having great results, and most men report the same benefits you did.

Now just imagine if you added Growth Hormone Replacement Therapy into the mix!

I’m glad your pushing the envelope with frequent SQ injects too.

But I would like to stress that if a TD works, its a better route as it mimics the natural pulse release of T more so than injects.

For many, getting a quality TD from a quality compounder is difficult. Another reason to only deal with Dr. Crisler.

He is currently using an advanced form of TD that is a gel that is superior to previous creams/androgel/testim

I think the secret behind HRT is estrogen control. Many aren’t using an AI, or are using inferior/invalid E2 tests as well. It is of the utmost importance to have E2 in line with correct testing.

I look at HRT as a table with four legs - T + hcG/or preferably hmG + AI + GHRT.

I would also like to note that hmG is superior to hcG. [/quote]

Wiseguy, don’t mean to hijack, but do you have any information or references on hmG? With the inconsistency of the availability and stability of hcg, I would love to hear about more options. Thanks…

[quote]Caged wrote:
Wise Guy wrote:
brentf13 wrote:
TRT does seem a little overwhelming at first but it’s really simple and easy to manage. Well worth the benefits. Do some reading and get comfortable with it first and then when you decide to go for it do it right. You need T+HCG+AI. Don’t waste your time with a Dr that doesn’t have a clue.

Also remember that things continue to change. For example I inject my T cyp SC rather than IM and I’m having great results. A couple of doctors have moved in that direction already but that’s something that’s still fairly new. More frequent injections by SC route.

Awesome brent. Glad to see your having great results, and most men report the same benefits you did.

Now just imagine if you added Growth Hormone Replacement Therapy into the mix!

I’m glad your pushing the envelope with frequent SQ injects too.

But I would like to stress that if a TD works, its a better route as it mimics the natural pulse release of T more so than injects.

For many, getting a quality TD from a quality compounder is difficult. Another reason to only deal with Dr. Crisler.

He is currently using an advanced form of TD that is a gel that is superior to previous creams/androgel/testim

I think the secret behind HRT is estrogen control. Many aren’t using an AI, or are using inferior/invalid E2 tests as well. It is of the utmost importance to have E2 in line with correct testing.

I look at HRT as a table with four legs - T + hcG/or preferably hmG + AI + GHRT.

I would also like to note that hmG is superior to hcG.

Wiseguy, don’t mean to hijack, but do you have any information or references on hmG? With the inconsistency of the availability and stability of hcg, I would love to hear about more options. Thanks…[/quote]

Caged

hmG is Human menopausal gonadtropin.

It is an outside source of FSH(follicle stimulating hormone)

hcG acts as an outside source of LH only.

hmG is compounded with hcG already in it, so your getting both LH and FSH combined, just like you would if you were natural.

It is far superior to using hCG alone.

Problems most run into is price and finding a Dr who will script it.