[quote]Surly Duff wrote:
Cephalic_Carnage wrote:
Surly Duff wrote:
Surly Duff wrote:
C_C, what do you think about this split in the long term? (regarding imbalances that may develop, tendon problems, etc.)
Edit: I was thinking of a Dorian style workout, to reduce some of the volume. It looks like a lot now, but I usually do 3, sometimes 4 warm up sets before my work set. So my total amount of sets for a muscle group is 7-8, including warm ups, done once every 4-5 days.
I plan on working out 4 days a week, (M,Tu,Th,Sa) and just rotating the workouts:
Day 1
close grip bench
shoulder press machine (ramp to 8-12 rm)
cable raise side (warm up 1 x 10, work set 1 x 12-15)
push downs (ramp to 1 x 12)
db exts (1 x 12) Ditch those. You could do some pec deck presses (yes, presses… Check them out on IM) before the pushdowns to get some chest work done as well.
reverse pec dec (rear shoulders)
Day 2
squats (ramp to 5-8 RM)
leg press (1 x 10 warmup, 1 x 10 work set)
leg curls (ramp to 10 Rm)
pull throughs (1 x 15)
reverse crunches 3 sets
ab crunch machine 1 x 15
calves
Day 3
lat pull downs (ramp to 8-12 rm)
wide grip pull ups (as many as I can do) After pulldowns? Probably going to end up using your arms too much then… Either do them first, or not at all.
chins (max reps) Make that rack chins (pronated grip, not supinated) or ditch them entirely. You could do v-handle cable rows (bending forward into the stretch a bit at the hip joint, and ten pulling back… Bit more width than thickness and do them after the thickness exercise and thus have, say, rack chins, kroc rows or yates rows, v-handle rows.
H.S. iso row Do these on the other back day and move kroc/one-arm DB rows here for 12-20 reps or so. Or do yates rows here, 10-15 or something like that.
bb curls (ramp to 8-10 rm) Do your forearm bones and wrists tolerate tolerate bb curls? I’d do alternating offset-grip curls here.
db hammer curls (warm up 1 x10, work set 1 x 10-12)
bb shrugs (ramp to work set) Well… After kroc rows? If you still have anything left in you… I’d make that DB rows with straps, bend forward from the hip joint just a bit, then shrug towards a point behind your head and retract your scapulae while doing so, if that makes sense. Still, both kroc and yates rows fry the traps when done right, so it’s just a matter of whether you’ll still be able to put up any real weight on shrugs or not.
f-arms No need for forearm work after pinwheels and shrugs…
These next 3 days are done similar to the 1st 3; ramp to heavier weight, lower reps on the compound exercises, 1 warm up set + 1 work set on the secondary/isolation exercises.
Day 4
military bb press
db raise side
incline bb press Doing chest after shoulders isn’t the smartest thing you can do, and your chest work is practically non-existant as it is. Do those first in the workout, ditch the free-weight mil presses and replace them with something like Smith High Incline OHP/V-squat push presses/standing DB OHP/… And do them after chest.
rope press downs Rubbish. Make that Dead Stop Extensions from the floor or from the bench (ask if you don’t know how to do them, they’re not skullcrushers even though people like to call them dead skulls) or pjr’s or so.
rev pec dec
Day 5
deadlifts
1 leg curl
walking lunges
leg press
abs
calves
Day 6
db curls Only train bis before back as an advanced guy imo… You need to have your technique down to the point that you’re not using your bis much in your back work for that to work well.
rev bb curls Too easy to tweak your forearms on those…
lats pull downs
db rows Moved to first back day because you did deadlifts on day 5. Do HS low rows here or so.
shrugs
f-arms No need.
Day 6 would imo be better as:
-Pulldowns (HS if you have them)
-HS low/iso rows.
(-you could do hs high rows here for additional backwidth if you wanted, and thus have 3 back exercises)
-Pinwheel Curls with straps
-HS curls or conc curls or whatever.
-shrugs if your traps aren’t still fried from deadlifts. Could do them in the calf raise machine or so, that way you won’t have to use your arms…
I guess the tricep/elbow problems look problematic on day 4, but I can’t think of much of a solution. I’ve tried doing the split with just 1 chest compound exercise, 1 shoulder compound, 1 tricep isolation, and reverse pec dec, but I found it wasn’t enough volume to last until the next workout. I find triceps and biceps to recover pretty quickly, and they really seem to need a second exercise. Just because you’re recovering doesn’t mean you’re not doing “enough”. If necessary, just do a second work set, with a slightly heavier weight than the first if you hit your rep goal on the first set, otherwise keep the same weight.
The main compound exercises are usually done to 5-8 rep max hmmmmmmmm. May or may not be enough if it’s only one work set and one exercise for that muscle-group… If necessary, do 2 sets as above (on chest work, up the reps though so you can keep your chest doing the work rather than shift towards tris and delts) (unless I get more, then I’ll just pound away), and the isolation exercises are done higher reps (10-15) to get the volume in. You could try doing DC RP (rep ranges as done in DC and depending on the exercise… I.e. 15-30RP for extensions and backwidth stuff and laterals, 12-20 base, 11-15 only on exercises which you are very good at, technique-wise, and which are safe.
Don’t do this on all exercises. Just try it for a few assistance movements at first, like Dead Stop Extensions (and get elbow sleeves while you’re at it).
What do you think?
Did you want to have a look through this one? I posted a few pages back, pg. 22 maybe.
Oops, must have missed it.
Ok, thanks for the reply. I saw you were pretty busy, so no worries.
Just to clarify something:
chest is overdeveloped compared to my other body parts (it responds pretty well to training, which is why I could do it after shoulders as noted above and still get a good workout). That’s why I don’t have much chest work at the moment. I’d rather focus on bringing up my tri’s and shoulders, which is why I work them 1st each day. Would you still stand by your original advice after this? (I realize that I should have mentioned this in my 1st writing…)
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Then make day 4
-Delt Press variant
-Incline Press variant (If you go with DB’s, semi-tuck your elbows and use a semi-neutral grip to bring the tris in more if you want.
-Lateral variant
-Dead Stop Extensions (EZ bar, narrow grip, off floor or bench) or PJR’S
-Rev. Pec Deck
I’d, at most, do them as a light warm-up before the actual squat warm-up[quote]