I hit back everyday in some shape or form, I have learned however for my back to grow, a higher rep range is needed. Heavy DB rows (for me anyway 125 - 150) I have found that not as useful for growth than DB Rows in the 85 - 105 range for 15-20 reps. Ill throw in a heavy set here and there but generally 3-4 sets of the 15-20 range I respond to very well for size and creating a base for my bench.
I have been running a Solov Jr. Bench cycle, and EVERY set of bench is SS with either chins, DB Rows or Face Pulls. Almost every pushing set I do I will do a set of pulling. I have found you that you have to train rear delts seperately, with high reps and high frequency. They can take a beating like alot of other upper back movements. I also like seated DB cleans, but sometimes aggravates my wrists.
Absolutely love Meadows Rows, and find that both high reps and low reps target my lower lats really well. CS Rows are great as well but again I find that reps in the 15-20 rep range are more effective for me.
I have a new found admiration for the lat pulldown, I had dropped it for years preferring to do chins and weighted chins, but as far as targeting specific areas of your back I do feel they are better than chins, and I love chins.
I guess what I am trying to say is I fell high reps, and high frequency with a medium load is what I find ideal for training back size.
^ Yes. Since following each bench press session with an equal number of face pull sets, my shoulders feel better than ever and my numbers have gone up well.
[quote]kgildner wrote:
^ Yes. Since following each bench press session with an equal number of face pull sets, my shoulders feel better than ever and my numbers have gone up well.[/quote]
For a while, I was doing this with chins or rows. It boiled down to 10 sets of either movement through out the workout. Great way to sneak in volume.
I wish my gym had heavier DBs than 100s so I could keep doing kroc rows. They’ve been enough if I go strict though. I think I’ll go back to working old school t-bar rows/bb rows for a while
looking huge matty
here’s mine
edit: don’t ignore traps! I took the advice of “don’t work traps directly ever” and am now paying the price trying to catch up. My deadlift strength off the floor has risen steadily ever since I started shrugging recently
I see that High Frequency 531 is working for you! (I lurk). That back is looking wide.
I totally agree with regards to the direct training of your traps, while rows and other movements of the same ilk will certainly hit them you got to do some heavy ass shrugging to get that yoke that so many of us want. Heavy Shrugging has improved my lockout on the dead greatly as well.
[quote]MattyXL wrote:
I have a new found admiration for the lat pulldown, I had dropped it for years preferring to do chins and weighted chins, but as far as targeting specific areas of your back I do feel they are better than chins, and I love chins.
[photo]35062[/photo][/quote]
Aw, what do you know? Your back is only freaking humongous. Genetics/Roids.
Also
“Big guys don’t know how to train because they were born that way”
and
“No one can get that big without boatloads of drugs”
and
“Didn’t “insert name of author” say something different which is the final word in all things training?”
Thanks man, I appreciate everyone who follows along. High frequency 5/3/1 actually made my lower back grow a lot in that month, before that program I very rarely pushed back extension type movements. It’s a great program and I’ll definitely go back on it for a few months once I get my knees sorted out.
Also, I want mountain traps like Prof X has got. I did some shrugs the other day and 225 was a good work weight lol. Traps and hams/glutes are by far the weakest link in my deadlift
[quote]browndisaster wrote:
I wish my gym had heavier DBs than 100s so I could keep doing kroc rows. They’ve been enough if I go strict though. I think I’ll go back to working old school t-bar rows/bb rows for a while
looking huge matty
here’s mine
edit: don’t ignore traps! I took the advice of “don’t work traps directly ever” and am now paying the price trying to catch up. My deadlift strength off the floor has risen steadily ever since I started shrugging recently[/quote]
Just bring an adjustable DB handle to the gym. Make your own heavy DBs.
Mike my shoulders are jacked too, I find shoulder width neutral grip helps, I don’t worry about my chin, I just go from hang and drive my elbows into my sides, flex lats and lower slowly, when I add to much weight, I feel my arms more than lats. Nice work Matty, everything you said is exactly what I’ve been saying, and your chin grip as well, Good work bro, it’s winter up here in the north, and I got three inches of hair on my back, but eveybody who showed a pic of a big back, BB’s and PL’s , said same thing, high volume, higher reps,handled with control, exercise preferance isn’t the big factor, as long as your consitant with above princibles, I get guys all the time saying “this program sucks, three weeks and I haven’t got any bigger” they’ll just never get it, this is good post, I like when BB’s and PL’s share info. 2cents
I think high frequency work is the overall key here as stated over and over. Something else I noticed is that most people who complain they cant get their backs to grow are half assing there pullups and pulldowns. They do that 1/4 to 1/2 rep bull shit. Guys that do pull ups and only go half way down get zero lat activation. Getting that full stretch at the bottom (dead hang) is key to activating the lats. Same goes for pulldowns as well. IMO.
Jumping on the high frequency bandwagon here (actually I’ve been an advocate for a looong time already).
AnytimeJake–I pretty well agree, it’s good to see BBs and PL’s sharing info on the same side for once hahaha
MattyXL–You do dumbbell rows for 15-20…I’m surprised that you haven’t trying to run up the weight on those high rep rows Kroc style (or maybe you had and decided against it, since you mentioned heavy rows ~140+ didn’t help, but it sounded like you were low repping those??). I friggin love Kroc rows, they made my back a lot thicker. I’m not doing them currently, but I do love to go back to them. Anyway, you’re a thick bastard so awesome job you roid monkey (Joking joking…for anybody with sarcasm fail)
[quote]tattoo’d’popeye wrote:
I think high frequency work is the overall key here as stated over and over. Something else I noticed is that most people who complain they cant get their backs to grow are half assing there pullups and pulldowns. They do that 1/4 to 1/2 rep bull shit. Guys that do pull ups and only go half way down get zero lat activation. Getting that full stretch at the bottom (dead hang) is key to activating the lats. Same goes for pulldowns as well. IMO.[/quote]
I’ve actually had the opposite experience with chins. I do them more like this
