Arnold's Genetics

Training Bodybuilding
101

Gifted/talented/Genetics, those terms simply describe people with an edge in a certain sport, competition, being talented means you can progress at a faster pace then others of not your talents, and perhaps those that are gifted have a higher eventual potential.

However none of those things means much without hardwork.

Tony Hawk SUCKED at skateboarding. Through EVERYDAY practice for hours and dedicating his life to it he became good. Bruce Lee, was extremely weak as a kid and had multiple health problems, through very rigorous training and tons of learning he became strong and one of the best martial artists to have ever lived. In Japan a kid driver in 1980s brought drifting to mountaine racing, starting out driving the guy was a terrible driver and a slow learner, he later became a champion in circuit racing. There are many more examples of such people throughout the world.

The point is an average person will never see his genetic limit. An olympic level athlete thats been training all his life, dedicated all his time to the sport yea he might. People like Einstein were a genious, however an average person with 100 iq is capable of understanding everything he wrote, and some pretty extraordinary things himself.

Once again a person thats an olympic sprinter that trained all his life, and dedicated all his time to the sport is capable with his talent to reach some pretty amazing times. But that doesnt meant that the average guy isnt capable of training to run a second slower than him which would still be top 20% percent of people in the world.

102

Read more thoroughly go heavy…never did I say that I was uncoordinated…in fact I pointed out that the technical aspects of the guitar were my strong point(Satriani is good…but by no means the most difficult to play…by any stretch of the imagination…acoustic folk and classical are some of the hardest pieces I’ve attempted, but I digress)…I have trouble discerning between two distinctly simliar sounds sometimes…and music is affected by a part of the brain. For example, the auditory part of the left hemisphere is larger in musicians with perfect pitch than in musicians without perfect pitch.You ask how many Mozarts were there in the world…well how many arnolds are there in the world…the nature of being world-class in any endeavor is that there are only a handful of people to be there out of the billions that have lived. Throughout your posts you have been condescending to whoever disagrees with you…I compliment your ear and musical ability, yet I’m patronized in return.

from the last time i checked, the average musician looks like they smoked about 2000 lbs of pot throughout their lifetime. can barely reme,ber their own birthday. and have not bit of musical knowledge other than a power cord. What are you saying here? I’m not sure how this proves your point that musical ability is not affected by ones’ genetic makeup. How is it that the world record for beats per minute was set by a 15 yr. old who could have never put in as many hours as a 35yr old professional musician? I’m not saying it is entirely affected by your genetic makeup…but it does determine your limits. BTW…creativity and imagination are derivations of ones’ intelligence…something definitely affected by genetic makeup. Your posts are full of meaningless drivel. You quote Albert Einstein out of context and talk about creating your own music…it means nothing to this argument about genetic limitations.

103

Im sorry, Ive been reading this post for a while because I find it so humorous. I didnt feel compelled to respond until I started taking in what Go Heavy Fool had to say about music…

“first of ALL…the greatest musicians in the word dont understand music at all.”

This is the biggest crock of horseshit that has ever come out of anyones mouth. The greatest musicians of all time read music better than they read english. Im sorry, but the people who play in oh…I dont know… the NY Phil, LA Phil, CSO, Philadelphia are the greatest musicians of all time. Cats these days like Joe Lovano, Whycliffe Gordon, Diana Krall, Itzak Perlman, Yo Yo Man, etc etc all read music, and understand the structure.

Im sorry, but anyone who can make that kind of statement and really think they know anything about music is probably at the bottom of the totem pole when it comes to musical proficiency.

104

[quote]WguitarG wrote:
Read more thoroughly go heavy…never did I say that I was uncoordinated…in fact I pointed out that the technical aspects of the guitar were my strong point(Satriani is good…but by no means the most difficult to play…by any stretch of the imagination…acoustic folk and classical are some of the hardest pieces I’ve attempted, but I digress)…I have trouble discerning between two distinctly simliar sounds sometimes…and music is affected by a part of the brain. For example, the auditory part of the left hemisphere is larger in musicians with perfect pitch than in musicians without perfect pitch.You ask how many Mozarts were there in the world…well how many arnolds are there in the world…the nature of being world-class in any endeavor is that there are only a handful of people to be there out of the billions that have lived. Throughout your posts you have been condescending to whoever disagrees with you…I compliment your ear and musical ability, yet I’m patronized in return.

from the last time i checked, the average musician looks like they smoked about 2000 lbs of pot throughout their lifetime. can barely reme,ber their own birthday. and have not bit of musical knowledge other than a power cord. What are you saying here? I’m not sure how this proves your point that musical ability is not affected by ones’ genetic makeup. How is it that the world record for beats per minute was set by a 15 yr. old who could have never put in as many hours as a 35yr old professional musician? I’m not saying it is entirely affected by your genetic makeup…but it does determine your limits. BTW…creativity and imagination are derivations of ones’ intelligence…something definitely affected by genetic makeup. Your posts are full of meaningless drivel. You quote Albert Einstein out of context and talk about creating your own music…it means nothing to this argument about genetic limitations. [/quote]

drivel? ok! i’ll give you that. they’re not supposed to be intellectual pieces of garbage. if you have noticed i elicit the responses. thats thr drivel in the madness. to provoke rational thought is not a sin, but to accept the undetermined would be a sin.

I don’t particularily like being defined by genetics for 2 reasons.
1- i have always been told how lucky i am and that I’m gifted and the denotes no hard work on my part.
2- i have also been tested on I.Q. and tested very high, but the subject matter on the test was mostly things thst i know, math and visual recognition…once again subjective bullshit!

you have a legitimate gripe with me. you’re supposed too. i challanged the popular thought. i dont win anything for being right and i dont lose anything for being wrong. my thread was to provoke thought, but when you do that, you will provoke more than that when you challange someone else’s beliefs.

as for musical ability, great if you can play…it takes practice more than anything. i started by ear because i was to lazy to learn how to read it. didn’t realize i had “musical ear” until someone told me i did. i can tell you this, that can be genetic or learned. in my case it was learned, because i could not do it when i first started

relate the music to the body and you will understand that you can be born with great arms and you can create them too, there is no rule that says you can’t

as for the body it took my years to develope biceps, they are now my best asset and i was born with the worst ones you have ever seen. but now i get credit for having geneticly gifted biceps BULLSHIT!.. i built those mother fuckers and it took me a long time, more than 5 years

i respect everyones opinion in here, right or wrong, too bad some of you arn’t wise enough to respect mine. i have too much personal progress and developed ability to believe in genetics are responsible for it.

you bigger guys that HAVE BUILT UP YOUR MUSCLES AND HAVE BEEN TOLD THAT YOU DIDNT HAVE TO WORK FOR THEM, maybe you can understand where I’m coming from.

failure is nothing but wisdom to a champion - Go heavy fool

105

[quote]EnTransit wrote:
Im sorry, Ive been reading this post for a while because I find it so humorous. I didnt feel compelled to respond until I started taking in what Go Heavy Fool had to say about music…

“first of ALL…the greatest musicians in the word dont understand music at all.”

This is the biggest crock of horseshit that has ever come out of anyones mouth. The greatest musicians of all time read music better than they read english. Im sorry, but the people who play in oh…I dont know… the NY Phil, LA Phil, CSO, Philadelphia are the greatest musicians of all time. Cats these days like Joe Lovano, Whycliffe Gordon, Diana Krall, Itzak Perlman, Yo Yo Man, etc etc all read music, and understand the structure.

Im sorry, but anyone who can make that kind of statement and really think they know anything about music is probably at the bottom of the totem pole when it comes to musical proficiency. [/quote]

well this is subjective

whatever you say is the greatest is the greatest for you

whatever i say is the greatest is the greatest for me

for me Jimi Hendrix is the greatest guitar player ever. this man would be playing chords and notes and he could not tell you which ones he played.

i myslef play the same way, i cannot tell you what chord or note i am playing but i can hear it then duplicate the same sound on the guitar.

your barking up the wrong tree, i never even heard of the musicians you named

what is your definition of greatness? I’ll take Jimmy.

there are no right or wrong answers to the subjective questions

i don’t know why so many people feel that there are, and then feel the need to argue about it.

why do so many people on here care to prove me right or wrong. you can’t do it with subjective reasoning.

if you could…then i say that Flex wheeler is the best bodybuilder of all time because i say he is. thats your arguement and i guess im right because im using your subjective reasoning.

again, there is a counter arguemnet to anything, anything!

why is there such a need on this form to argue. especially with someone like me. i already told you im not changing my mind and could care less to change yours. this is wasting time

if you were challanging , you would try to figure out why genetics change thru evolution and how they can be affected rather than state you have the end all be all answers to genetics because some scientist said that you’re inferior or superior

106

Man, Im really amazed that you call yourself a musician and dont know any of the names Im talking about. I dont care how you care you put it, but playing shit and not knowing what you are you playing makes you ignorant. Im not gonna run a list of my resume, but Im more than qualified…Im sorry my friend. If you really learned WHAT you were playing…you would be a better musician.

107

ok, this thread has over a 100 replies on it, mostly mine…i started the thread

but, i can’t possibly keep repsonding to people on this thread for that would just take forever…all just to say I made a statement that challanged rational thought and I’m not changing my mind about it and nor do i care to change yours.

i stand by everything i’ve said and my thread served its purpose well to provoke a few minds into viewing something from a different perspective

for those of you who just like to argue for the sake of argueing and could care less about eliciting a logical reponse to me other than …“you are wrong, I’m right because everyone thinks what i think”…let me just say i’m sorry I won’t be able to accomodate you, i work mon thru fri

thanks to the few guys on here that posted examples of determination and dedication becoming the best of the best, and for keeping an open mind…you will go far in life

for the other small% in here with none other to say than “you can’t be the best if you don’t have the ‘RIGHT’ genetics”…god help you

108

[quote]EnTransit wrote:
Man, Im really amazed that you call yourself a musician and dont know any of the names Im talking about. I dont care how you care you put it, but playing shit and now knowing what you are you playing makes you ignorant. Im not gonna run a list of my resume, but Im more than qualified…Im sorry my friend. If you really learned WHAT you were playing…you would be a better musician. [/quote]

-what i learn is all commited to memory
-what i am learning is what i am duplicating by ear
-what i create is where the “real” musician takes over and plays what he hears in his head

most of those people in the last sentence are famous and actually get paid millions or are legends

to play “stairway to heaven” does not make you a musician in my book, but to create it, does

my muscians are Hendrix, Clapton, Vaughn, Garcia, Eric Johnson, Paige, Satriani, Santana, Richards,

guess what everyone of them created their own music and sold millions of albums, how about your musicians? they are a little different I think

no problem

if you wanna jam some time. I can show you how to recognize the key and start the lead, the melody and rhythm can’t be learned but that comes within and is your own…when you can do this…cal yourself a musician

just substitute musician with the term ‘one who creates music’

one who copys music is just that, somebody that copys music

nothing wrong with that, it can help you become a musician

109

Go Heavy Fool,
You should have cut your losses and stopped posting on page 2 like you said you would. You should think twice about telling people to keep an open mind when you don’t seem to be able to open yours. And your preaching was obnoxious on the first few pages, now it’s become offensive.

110

[quote]TigerJim wrote:
Go Heavy Fool,
You should have cut your losses and stopped posting on page 2 like you said you would. You should think twice about telling people to keep an open mind when you don’t seem to be able to open yours. And your preaching was obnoxious on the first few pages, now it’s become offensive.

[/quote]

this is only understood as preaching if you are not a determined individual and you do not believe that you can overcome your genetic dificulties.

you should have never posted in the 1st place, you havn’t said a word about your genetics and your determination…but you’re telling me everything

there will only be a select few that agree with me on this topic, those people are those that have the mind of a champion or those who have overcome things thru believing that they could and were determined to follow thru with it.

i know the masses think thay all just proved me wrong here

what they blindly was prove that they will never be champions until they understand this concept of the power of the mind and the benefits of determination

food for thought is over

if i feel like helping again

i will

hope i have a more intelligent audience next time…
this one was pretty inexpierenced in terms of improvising

111

[quote]TigerJim wrote:
Go Heavy Fool,
You should have cut your losses and stopped posting on page 2 like you said you would. You should think twice about telling people to keep an open mind when you don’t seem to be able to open yours. And your preaching was obnoxious on the first few pages, now it’s become offensive.

[/quote]

for people like you Jim, i hope to offend

for people with strong minds i hope to help

nice talking to you Jim, I learned so much

112

[quote]Go heavy fool wrote:

if you really believe that you are geneticly inferior or superior to someone else, you should probably just kill yourself right now. because there can only be one winner. the other 3 trillion people on earth have no chance

i love the way you guys think, it intrigues me.

for the rest of you that were told that your genetics are no good,

[/quote]

Holy shit! There are 3 trillion people on earth?

We can all be honest, no one posting here was told that “your genetics are inferior and you shouldn’t lift.” I think this thread comes from a self-serving motive, maybe one that you are unaware of.

Neither is anyone buying that coy, faulty exhuberant confidence, lol. I suggest you deal with your own inner turmoil before you trick yourself into believing that you are saving anyone else.

But, I will leave this thread and when I say that, I actually back it up by not posting, lol.

Paz.

113

[quote]TigerJim wrote:
Go Heavy Fool,
You should have cut your losses and stopped posting on page 2 like you said you would. You should think twice about telling people to keep an open mind when you don’t seem to be able to open yours. And your preaching was obnoxious on the first few pages, now it’s become offensive.

[/quote]

one more reply for super Jim

Jim, did it ever occur to you that if i thought I actually had something to lose that I would have never even have bothered posting a thread that will provoke the thoughts off the ill advised in the first place.

the only thing I have to lose is time.

114

Poor genetics is no excuse for anything. Most of us know nothing about our genes, and there is absolutely NO WAY whatsoever to determine the limits of someone’s genetic potential.

The most likely reasons for our failures or setbacks stems from lack of information, malformed ideas, suboptimal attitudes, or poor practice/training habits.

How can you judge someone’s genetics by looking at them?

I feel sorry for all you people who feel you’ll never be successful because of your genetics. Is that what the results from your gene tests showed?

I do not dispute the fact that many achievements come from a combination of genetics and determination. But because we can never measure our genetic potential for certain tasks, using the idea of genetic limitation simply creates false barriers to progress.

Genetic limitation = fine theory, but lousy practice.

116

How does someone get so annoying by the age of sixteen?

What does “heavy” mean to YOU, fool? Doing the whole stack on the leg abduction machine?

117

[quote]bushidobadboy wrote:
HOV wrote:

How can you judge someone’s genetics by looking at them?

.

Well, just take a look at their eye skin and hair color… If you get close enough, you can assess their insertion points too. I see what you are saying about not allowing self-imposed limitations due to false perception of ‘genetic’ limitations, BUT like it or not, genetics DO limit us to some extent. For example, I could never have become an olympic-level oarsman. Why? Because I’m too freakin short. Sure I could have used great determination and dedication to develop my ergo times to match the elite, but LIKE IT OR NOT, I would not be suitable for selection to a top crew because everyone else is at least 6’4" and there’s no place for a short arse like me. SO no matter how hard I worked, I could never attain that particular goal…[/quote]

Sure, I agree with you in that there are some activities where obvious genetic limitations like height are alreayd realized and not possible to overcome. A 6’10" dude unfortunately does not have the genetic ability to become a military fighter pilot because he simply will not fit in the cockpit.

But for the areas where potential is not immediately or practically measureable (like intelligence or maximal strength), I’ll stick with my statement above, because it’s simply a more positive way of approaching an activity.

118

Once I saw an interview in which Franco Columbu was asked: “So what does it take to get a body like that?”

His one word answer: “Generations.”

119

[quote]Go heavy fool wrote:
another, this is someone with not geneticly gifted calves[/quote]

If you’re referring to relatively short attachments, that’s only part of the equation.

I have noted many large-calfed people who were generally unexercised and had medium attachments.

120

[quote]harris447 wrote:
Schwarzfahrer wrote:
Go heavy fool wrote:
i used Arnold as an example of someone with “smaller” genetics. he wasn’t born big nor had natural calves or a big bone structure or “Apollonian physique” flex wheeler would be another. Both built gigantic muscles and were not born that way and had to work hard to get that look.

Actually, you are gravely mistaken that Flex was not genetically gifted. He is assumed to be a true mutant because his body lacks a hormone which has catabolistic effect.
Two thousand years ago, such a specimen would be either

a) dead at the first famine because he couldn’t catabolise his muscles fast enough

or

b) if from a wealthy family, considered a “hero”

Today, on our era of abundant food in the western hemisphere, it is a rather pointless mutation.

Wasn’t the rap on Flex that he was one of the laziest trainers out of all pro bb’ers?
[/quote]

Paul Dillet was apparently another lazy ass, and he had one of the freakiest physiques around.