Dear all,
Apologies for spamming the forum with questions. Following the standard 5-3-1 sets, I am adding some of the additional 5-3-1 work at the end. Last cycle was First Set Last, this cycle is up/down ladder.
I have noticed that on the additional work, my strength has dropped off dramatically (especially on the upper body lifts). For example, last night was Bench night and I did:
205# x 12 (this was the 5-3-1 5+@ 85%TM)
185# x 11 (75%TM)
160# x 10 (65%TM)
Squat:
275# x 10 (this was the 5-3-1 5+@ 85%TM)
250# x 12 (75%TM)
215# x 15 (65%TM)
In the past, I have been easily able to do 225# for 20 reps (with some still left in the tank), but I find that my legs are jelly. My questions are 1) Is this normal and; 2) Should I be leaving 1-2 in the tank on the 531 work set in order to achieve more on the additional work sets? Maybe rest more?
Be concerned when you start struggling on your PR set. You’re entirely too caught up in your assistance work judging by your recent posts. Of course its normal to be fatigued after an all out set at 85-95%.
[quote]AMeadows21 wrote:
Be concerned when you start struggling on your PR set. You’re entirely too caught up in your assistance work judging by your recent posts. Of course its normal to be fatigued after an all out set at 85-95%.[/quote]
Thanks for the input/response. I wouldn’t say that I am getting ‘hung up’ on the assistance. What I am trying to do is to ensure that the assistance isn’t hindering the main lift work. The beyond book implicitly suggests that the additional work (FSL, Jokers, Up/down ladders etc.) are a core part of the programme, and not just ‘assistance’.
The question is therefore: If I have 3 PR sets (Up/down ladder), should I focus on setting a PR on the the first (i.e. 531 PRset) set, or focus on setting a PR across the ‘additional’ sets as well?
[quote]AMeadows21 wrote:
Be concerned when you start struggling on your PR set. You’re entirely too caught up in your assistance work judging by your recent posts. Of course its normal to be fatigued after an all out set at 85-95%.[/quote]
Thanks for the input/response. I wouldn’t say that I am getting ‘hung up’ on the assistance. What I am trying to do is to ensure that the assistance isn’t hindering the main lift work. The beyond book implicitly suggests that the additional work (FSL, Jokers, Up/down ladders etc.) are a core part of the programme, and not just ‘assistance’.
The question is therefore: If I have 3 PR sets (Up/down ladder), should I focus on setting a PR on the the first (i.e. 531 PRset) set, or focus on setting a PR across the ‘additional’ sets as well?[/quote]
In my opinion the the real heart of 5/3/1 is the last main set where you try and set a rep PR. I don’t think you should sacrifice your ability to go big on that set for anything. Everything after is supplemental in my opinion. Even if you’re still doing the main lift. That doesn’t mean you can’t still push those other sets. They just shouldn’t be the priority. It’s just a way of getting extra volume in. The main work is most important. Don’t save yourself for something after.
[quote]AMeadows21 wrote:
In my opinion the the real heart of 5/3/1 is the last main set where you try and set a rep PR. I don’t think you should sacrifice your ability to go big on that set for anything. Everything after is supplemental in my opinion.
[/quote]
That’s how it reads to me as well. FSLs & Jokers are all auto-regulated from what I understand.
I will echo what AMeadows21 has already said, if you are setting rep records on the PR set don’t worry about the down sets. And I find the same thing as you where comparing my PR set to down sets. For example I may hit a PR set of 10 on squat then get only about 10 reps on FSL (with significantly lighter weight). But I am fine with this because I continue to get stronger and my numbers go up every month.
[quote]Ecchastang wrote:
Are you taking all of those sets to failure? [/quote]
I am principally going until I no longer feel I can complete another rep (i.e., I would not complete the next rep).[/quote]
No wonder you aren’t getting higher reps then. But don’t worry about that, its that 1+, 3+ and 5+ set that counts the most anyway.
Hey all. I just wanted to say thanks for the input. I am trying to put my maximum focus into making a PR set. Each time I look at the previous weight or predicted 1RM and try to beat it. Its a great feeling to see the weights continually going up each week.
[quote]some_dude wrote:
Personally, I’m not entirely sure why you’re doing sets of 12, 15 and 20 on the back-off sets.[/quote]
I thought the idea of the FSL and up down ladder was to achieve a PR with the weights used on the first set(s)? i.e. 1 set of squats at 65% of training max is 100kg - then max squats with 100kg?
