5/3/1 for Military Training

szappa · June 25, 2014, 7:32pm

I’ve been running 5/3/1 4 days per week for the last year with some great success, but I recently learned I was accepted to Navy Officer Candidate School and need to focus my training more on my conditioning and running. I was thinking about reducing my weight training to 3 times per week, using either a 5/3/1 full-body training setup or the 5/3/1 3 days per week option. I was curious:

How I could set up my programming? Either:
Monday- Lift and 2-5 mile run
Tuesday- Off
Wednesday- Lift and 2-5 mile run
Thursday- Off
Friday- Lift and
Saturday- 2-5 mile run
Sunday- 2-5 mile run

OR

Monday- Lift
Tuesday- 2-5 mile run
Wednesday- Lift
Thursday- 2-5 mile run
Friday- Lift
Saturday- 2-5 mile run
Sunday- Off

And I was also curious which would be the better setup… the full body 3x per week option, or the ABC, DAB, CDA, BCD Setup?

I’m using this week to de-load and to plan my training routine… Any help would be greatly appreciated!

breakingiron · June 25, 2014, 8:19pm

Recently completed Marine Corps OCS. I would follow a full body 5/3/1 set up, with bodyweight assistance exercises. It could be as simple as MWF lifting and TThS running. I would only do the minimum reps on the last set, and focus on getting the most out of your bodyweight work.

The big BW exercises to work on would be push ups, pull ups, sit ups or crunches, burpies, flutterkicks, lunges and Russian twists. Do supersets of a upperbody exercise with a core exercise.

Right now, try to avoid too much hypertrophy, unless you are very small. It will make all of the running and bodyweight training there harder, so don’t do BBB. Also, this much training will put a beating on your body, so make sure you take one day completely off to recover. Do you do ruck marches at Navy OCS? And how is your swimming?

szappa · June 25, 2014, 8:26pm

[quote]breakingiron wrote:
Recently completed Marine Corps OCS. I would follow a full body 5/3/1 set up, with bodyweight assistance exercises. It could be as simple as MWF lifting and TThS running. I would only do the minimum reps on the last set, and focus on getting the most out of your bodyweight work.

The big BW exercises to work on would be push ups, pull ups, sit ups or crunches, burpies, flutterkicks, lunges and Russian twists. Do supersets of a upperbody exercise with a core exercise.

Right now, try to avoid too much hypertrophy, unless you are very small. It will make all of the running and bodyweight training there harder, so don’t do BBB. Also, this much training will put a beating on your body, so make sure you take one day completely off to recover. Do you do ruck marches at Navy OCS? And how is your swimming?[/quote]

Thanks for the response,

So I’ll do the 5/3/1 full body setup, and use the bodyweight exercises for assistance. I agree with you that I need to be as lean as possible in order to make the bodyweight training a lot more effective.

I’m not sure if there’s ruck marches for Navy OCS… although I feel like there may be because our PT sessions are led by Marine Corps D.I.'s

How was your experience with OCS? Any tips or other advice for it?

Regards,

Steve

breakingiron · June 25, 2014, 8:44pm

I commission in a few months so I can’t compare it to the rest of military life, but compared to civilian life I can easily say it was the hardest thing ive ever done. But it was also simultaneously the most fun that I never, ever want to have again.

I not sure how similar the two OCS’s are, but the biggest piece of advice I can give you is don’t be a piece of shit, be a team player. Too many guys just trycto coast and never help out, then expect everyone to help them when its their turn to have some leadership responsibility.

Get as much knowledge squared away as you can ahead of time. Chain of command, rank structure, general orders, ect. The more you know before you leave, the more sleep you can get instead of studying. But be prepared for some sleepless nights and just tough it out.

Buy some boots ahead of time if you’re allowed and get your feet conditioned to them. Blisters nearly fucked me and got me sent home.

And the most important advice is be prepared to and okay with failing. Its impossible to not struggle on something. Just keep your confidence up and maintain your bearing. If you make a decision, unless it’s completely and absolutely wrong, attack it with 100% dedication. Even it you’re not sure it’ll work, pretend you think it will.

When do you report?

szappa · June 25, 2014, 11:03pm

[quote]breakingiron wrote:
I commission in a few months so I can’t compare it to the rest of military life, but compared to civilian life I can easily say it was the hardest thing ive ever done. But it was also simultaneously the most fun that I never, ever want to have again.

I not sure how similar the two OCS’s are, but the biggest piece of advice I can give you is don’t be a piece of shit, be a team player. Too many guys just trycto coast and never help out, then expect everyone to help them when its their turn to have some leadership responsibility.

Get as much knowledge squared away as you can ahead of time. Chain of command, rank structure, general orders, ect. The more you know before you leave, the more sleep you can get instead of studying. But be prepared for some sleepless nights and just tough it out.

Buy some boots ahead of time if you’re allowed and get your feet conditioned to them. Blisters nearly fucked me and got me sent home.

And the most important advice is be prepared to and okay with failing. Its impossible to not struggle on something. Just keep your confidence up and maintain your bearing. If you make a decision, unless it’s completely and absolutely wrong, attack it with 100% dedication. Even it you’re not sure it’ll work, pretend you think it will.

When do you report?[/quote]

That sounds like all really solid advice, and a lot like what I’ve been hearing from other people on forums who have been through the same things. I’ve been studying my gouge book every night, making flash cards and writing down almost every piece of information to help me remember it.

The boots idea is the first I’ve heard, and hadn’t even thought about… I’ll definitely look into getting a pair because I could imagine how bad blisters would be during training. FML…

I’m still waiting on my official letter from the Navy that will have my OCS report date on it, but right now my recruiter is saying early fall or end of the summer is probably when I’ll have to report. Until then, I’m just trying to be as well prepared and ahead of the game as possible.

Steve

breakingiron · June 26, 2014, 1:36am

Wow man that’s soon. How is your running and BW stuff already? If that is a huge problem, I might actually recommend switching to a twice a week 5/3/1 variation, and then doing another 2 days of BW/running workouts. Something like

Monday- Squat, Bench, Rows, Abs
Tuesday- BW Work w/ running intervals
Wednesday- Off or light cardio (swimming/walking), stretching
Thursday- Deadlift, Press, Pull Ups, Abs
Friday- BW Work w/ running intervals
Saturday- Long Run
Sunday- Rest

If you’ve already got a solid base for BW work and cardio (60 push ups, 12 pull ups, 70 curl ups, sub 11:00 1.5 mile) then your original plan will probably work fine. But if you have a lot of work to get those into place, then you will have to up the amount of BW work you do.

Jim_Wendler · June 26, 2014, 2:28am

Train like an athlete. Learn what teamwork is. Shut your mouth.

szappa · June 26, 2014, 9:52pm

[quote]breakingiron wrote:
Wow man that’s soon. How is your running and BW stuff already? If that is a huge problem, I might actually recommend switching to a twice a week 5/3/1 variation, and then doing another 2 days of BW/running workouts. Something like

Monday- Squat, Bench, Rows, Abs
Tuesday- BW Work w/ running intervals
Wednesday- Off or light cardio (swimming/walking), stretching
Thursday- Deadlift, Press, Pull Ups, Abs
Friday- BW Work w/ running intervals
Saturday- Long Run
Sunday- Rest

If you’ve already got a solid base for BW work and cardio (60 push ups, 12 pull ups, 70 curl ups, sub 11:00 1.5 mile) then your original plan will probably work fine. But if you have a lot of work to get those into place, then you will have to up the amount of BW work you do. [/quote]

My BW stuff is pretty decent… I can definitely hit those numbers. I know they can always be improved but I feel like I have an okay base already set. I’ll probably go with:

Monday- 5/3/1 Full Body Lift
Tuesday- 3 to 5 mile run
Wednesday- 5/3/1 Full Body Lift
Thursday- 3 to 5 mile run
Friday- 5/3/1 Full Body Lift
Saturday- 3 to 5 mile run or off
Sunday- 3 to 5 mile run or off

How does that look?

szappa · June 26, 2014, 9:54pm

[quote]Jim Wendler wrote:
Train like an athlete. Learn what teamwork is. Shut your mouth. [/quote]

Jim,

Thanks for the response… what’s your best advice to train like an athlete? I’m thinking of utilizing mostly chins and push-ups for my 5/3/1 assistance exercises. Do you have any advice?

Thanks,

Steve

szappa · June 26, 2014, 10:18pm

Which workout setup sounds more optimal?

Monday- AM 3 to 5 mile run and PM FB Lift
Tuesday- 3 to 5 mile run
Wednesday- AM 3 to 5 mile run and PM FB Lift
Thursday- 3 to 5 mile run
Friday- AM 3 to 5 mile run and PM FB Lift
Saturday- 3 to 5 mile run
Sunday- Off

OR

Monday- FB Lift
Tuesday- 3 to 5 mile run
Wednesday- FB Lift
Thursday- 3 to 5 mile run
Friday- FB Lift
Saturday- 3 to 5 mile run
Sunday- 3 to 5 mile run

ksull · June 27, 2014, 12:10am

531 Simplest Strength. 531 second edition.
Push the sled or something maybe a car and do the hill sprints like the book says.
Eat like the book says.
Do the mobility. Running requires a great deal of this. No maintenance leads to injury.
Read NOV.
Recently I ran eight miles with a friend on a somewhat hilly route at a 8 minute pace no problems. They run 3 - 4 + days a week to do that. I stopped running ‘long’ with regularity just before starting 531 about a year ago. Before that I mainly did repeats on one day, a hard run of less than five miles and a long run if I was preparing for an event.
It just works.
Still getting stronger.
I’m old.
Best of luck.

idaho · June 27, 2014, 5:08am

[quote]Jim Wendler wrote:
Train like an athlete. Learn what teamwork is. Shut your mouth. [/quote]

In addition to Mr. Wendler’s advise, especially the “shut your mouth” part, my 02.

I am from a SOF background, so, take this from that perspective:

I see a lot of these threads pop up, especially on the Combat Forum, where I hang out. What training program works best, because,I am joining the Seals, Rangers, Marine SOG, etc, and “I dont want to lose mass” or “will my arms shrink” or “my deadlift PR will go down”. WTF??? Your job, if you succeed, is to kill all enemies of the United States, both foreign and domestic, with a big emphasis on KILL. As an Officer, you will be leading troops into COMBAT, not to the nearest gym.

The biggest challenge ahead of you is your COMBAT MENTAL MINDSET, not your deadlift or squat total. Get your head right, survive the training. Without deciding to win at all costs, no training in the world is going to help you pass.

I wish you success and if do, then worry about your weight totals.

some_dude1 · June 27, 2014, 7:22pm

[quote]szappa wrote:

Jim,

Thanks for the response… what’s your best advice to train like an athlete? I’m thinking of utilizing mostly chins and push-ups for my 5/3/1 assistance exercises. Do you have any advice?

Thanks,

Steve[/quote]

I’m not Jim, but IMO it’s that athletes do what they need to do to win at their chosen sport.

Write down your performance goals, figure out what you need to do to achieve them and be ruthless with your exercise selection.

Example:

My goal is to run faster.

Decision A will cause me to drop body weight (thus improving my running time) and cause my squat/deadlift to plummet.

Decision B will preserve my squat/deadlift but will hinder my running performance.

The answer seems obvious, but most people will subconsciously make decision B. They aren’t willing to do whatever is necessary to reach their goal.

szappa · June 27, 2014, 8:51pm

[quote]idaho wrote:

[quote]Jim Wendler wrote:
Train like an athlete. Learn what teamwork is. Shut your mouth. [/quote]

In addition to Mr. Wendler’s advise, especially the “shut your mouth” part, my 02.

I am from a SOF background, so, take this from that perspective:

I see a lot of these threads pop up, especially on the Combat Forum, where I hang out. What training program works best, because,I am joining the Seals, Rangers, Marine SOG, etc, and “I dont want to lose mass” or “will my arms shrink” or “my deadlift PR will go down”. WTF??? Your job, if you succeed, is to kill all enemies of the United States, both foreign and domestic, with a big emphasis on KILL. As an Officer, you will be leading troops into COMBAT, not to the nearest gym.

The biggest challenge ahead of you is your COMBAT MENTAL MINDSET, not your deadlift or squat total. Get your head right, survive the training. Without deciding to win at all costs, no training in the world is going to help you pass.

I wish you success and if do, then worry about your weight totals. [/quote]

I really appreciate the advice… You’re right. I need to worry about the things that matter the most… the mental aspect of the military and being the best possible Officer I can be. I’ll keep this in mind and take this with me as I begin my journey…

I found out today that I report for training on August 31st. Wish me luck.

Steve

idaho · June 29, 2014, 4:27am