Will Androgel Help Me?

Training
41

[quote]PV Wolf wrote:
gdm wrote:
PV Wolf wrote:
gdm wrote:
PV Wolf wrote:
Ok - 2 weeks on 5g of Androgel has done
nothing at all for motivation, energy, mood, libido etc. 2 questions : might raising the dose help and if I stop altogether, will I suffer the withdrawal period even though I am showing no effects of being on it.

thanks for reading

PV Wolf,

I’m having the same results as you: no discernible effects at all after almost two weeks on 5g/day. I became desperate a few days ago and bumped it up to 10g/day and I think I’m actually starting to feel worse.

At any rate, at 10gms/day I’ll be done with whatever I have left (including refills) in about 1.5 months. It seems that quite a few people on this board had the same bad results.

I strongly doubt you will feel much in the way of withdrawals if you have noticed no positive benefits so far. That suggests that your T levels have not budged much at all so natural T suppression should not have been stunted to any large degree. That is only my opinion as I obviously don’t have firsthand experience as yet.

Very discouraging so far.

gdm

Hey GDM - any luck with the 10g ? hope so - give a shout when you can. PV

PV,

I was on 10gms for about a week and noticed no differences. I since went back to 5gms because it appears that my insurance company will only pay for renewals based on the time period that corresponds with me using 5gms a day. So much for my little experiment.

I’m going to ride this out for at least a couple of months at 5gms and
see what happens. It sounds like you are not seeing any benefits so far either. I think 2 months is a reasonable amount of time to wait. If T levels haven’t budged much at that point then I’m through with this stuff.

The clinical trial brief I read (at the androgel.com site) stated that T levels for 94% of participants reached normal levels withing 24 hours. I didn’t see anything in this brief that indicated how the participants improved (fatigue symptoms, libido, etc) progressively over the period of time that they used the gel. I think Head Hunter mentioned he called Solvay and they told him that it could take up to 2 months to notice anything.

I’ll post again soon, hopefully with some good news.

gdm

Hey - latest numbers taken after 2 weeks on 5g - total = 330 (up 100 pts)
free = 7 (down 2 points ). As I mentioned, no real changes in symptoms.
PV
[/quote]

There’s also a Test method where you put the strip inside your mouth and on your cheek. Might give that a try.

HH

42

Okay, after two months of Androgel at 5gms a day (and a very brief period(1 week) at 10gms a day), here are the test results:

Total: 789 (up from about 300)
Free: 25 (up from about 7)

All the previous negative symptoms I had are improving at a rapid clip, especially in the last couple of weeks. I have also lost several pounds of bodyfat and my strength levels are up for the first time in a long time. The most noticeable change has been my energy levels as they have greatly improved.

I’m soldiering on at 5gms and hopefully things will get even better. The moral of the story is that you should give the gel at least a couple of months. I almost jumped ship after a few weeks and that would have been a big mistake.

PV - how is it going? I hope to hear some good news from you.

gdm

43

[quote]gdm wrote:
Okay, after two months of Androgel at 5gms a day (and a very brief period(1 week) at 10gms a day), here are the test results:

Total: 789 (up from about 300)
Free: 25 (up from about 7)

All the previous negative symptoms I had are improving at a rapid clip, especially in the last couple of weeks. I have also lost several pounds of bodyfat and my strength levels are up for the first time in a long time. The most noticeable change has been my energy levels as they have greatly improved.

I’m soldiering on at 5gms and hopefully things will get even better. The moral of the story is that you should give the gel at least a couple of months. I almost jumped ship after a few weeks and that would have been a big mistake.

PV - how is it going? I hope to hear some good news from you.

gdm [/quote]

Great News GDM - I did what you almost
did, I stopped because I did not think it was working. And of course I still feel like crap. I still have my Androgel - maybe I need to jump back
into it. Sounds like your improvement
was quite noticeable when it finally
kicked in.

Best - PV

44

[quote]gdm wrote:
Okay, after two months of Androgel at 5gms a day (and a very brief period(1 week) at 10gms a day), here are the test results:

Total: 789 (up from about 300)
Free: 25 (up from about 7)

All the previous negative symptoms I had are improving at a rapid clip, especially in the last couple of weeks. I have also lost several pounds of bodyfat and my strength levels are up for the first time in a long time. The most noticeable change has been my energy levels as they have greatly improved.

I’m soldiering on at 5gms and hopefully things will get even better. The moral of the story is that you should give the gel at least a couple of months. I almost jumped ship after a few weeks and that would have been a big mistake.

PV - how is it going? I hope to hear some good news from you.

gdm [/quote]

Hi again GDM - just a few more questions
I forgot to ask : any side effects ?
And how are you sleeping ? Your post has got me ready to go for it again.
Would you be doing 10g per days if not for your insurance issues ? And lastly-
how are the depression symptoms ?
Thanks very much for taking the time
to post.
PV

45

It may also be worth looking into supplements to both help block SHBG uptake and help avoid aromatization of the testosterone you do have…

46

[quote]PV Wolf wrote:
gdm wrote:
Okay, after two months of Androgel at 5gms a day (and a very brief period(1 week) at 10gms a day), here are the test results:

Total: 789 (up from about 300)
Free: 25 (up from about 7)

All the previous negative symptoms I had are improving at a rapid clip, especially in the last couple of weeks. I have also lost several pounds of bodyfat and my strength levels are up for the first time in a long time. The most noticeable change has been my energy levels as they have greatly improved.

I’m soldiering on at 5gms and hopefully things will get even better. The moral of the story is that you should give the gel at least a couple of months. I almost jumped ship after a few weeks and that would have been a big mistake.

PV - how is it going? I hope to hear some good news from you.

gdm

Hi again GDM - just a few more questions
I forgot to ask : any side effects ?
And how are you sleeping ? Your post has got me ready to go for it again.
Would you be doing 10g per days if not for your insurance issues ? And lastly-
how are the depression symptoms ?
Thanks very much for taking the time
to post.
PV

[/quote]

PV,

I haven’t noticed any side effects from the 5gms yet. Interestingly, even though I have been sleeping well I have found that I don’t need as much sleep and feel just as well rested.

The 5gms have brought me to where I want to be so I don’t think I will be doubling the dose, even if I had the discretion to do so. 10gms might take me over the upper thresholds for both total and free levels. I don’t see an additional benefit to going to 10gms or even 7.5gms.

As for depression symptoms, I definitely feel much better now and I think this is a result of having more energy and resuming some of the activities that I foresook during my “down” times. I don’t think I am completely out of the hole yet but symptoms are improving.

I’ll post back again in about a month or so after my next blood test or if I notice any additional changes worth noting.

You may want to give the gel another shot before you move on to other therapies, especially if you already have the gel sitting around.

God bless.
gdm

47

My experience has been pretty similar to gdm’s:

Had low total T readings between 250 ? 270 ng/dl. Free T level also at low end. Had all associated symptoms of low T; low libido, low energy, low stamina, irregular sleep, slowed recovery from workouts, and general feeling of being slightly depressed). PCP prescribed 5g/day Androgel back in April. After one month my total T level was at ~370 ng/dl. Doc then up’d to 7.5g/day. I then started feeling better in all symptom areas mentioned above (particularly libido).

Had another blood test end of June and to my surprise total T was up to 1550 ng/dl. Doc then dropped daily dose down to 5gms again. I’m going again this week for another blood test to see where I?ve stabilized at this dosage.

Overall, I am feeling much better in all areas then before I started Androgel 3-4 months ago. It definitely takes some time for absorption rates to stabilize. And, since everyone’s trans-dermal absorption rate responds differently, it’ll take a few months to find the ideal dosage.

48

Your 1550 ng/dl sounds like a false reading to me. Androgel at prescribed levels rarely will take you out of the normal limits. I have had a couple of false readings before due to my putting the A on my arms and then going for a blood test. If the needle comes in contact with any A residue that is on your skin, you will get a false reading. It is best to shower and not to put on any A before you go for a blood test.

49

[quote]pearson wrote:
My test is normal (548), but i’m easily fatigued, and want to recover easier from exercise. i have no health problems. will androgel help me, and if so what dose should i take?[/quote]

548 is not bad. Your doctors should look for other reasons why your so tired. Remember taking testosterone has side effects. You have to consider them too, it can cause terrible acne it can cause prostate problems or enhance those that are there, if you have male pattern baldness it can enhance that. Depending on the dosage it can cause, gynecomastia, headache, hypertension, low HDL, decrease in libido, nervousness.

If you have good doctors then ask for a complete work up. How old are you anyway?
Are suffering from anxiety or depression both of which can make you tired. How are your blood lipids? whats your diet like.

ANd just to insure you, i had low testosterone, this was back 4 /5 years ago and i still build muscle , go figure. I was right on the board of low/normal.

Also from what i know sometimes guys with low testosterone have gonads that are shrinking , but other don’t. The ones that don’t have a different kind of problem a good doc should know how to treat that.

Anyway. androgel isn’t going to make you feel like superman if you take it. Since if your depressed it may, may make matters worst again that depends on dosage and on your physiology.

50

[quote]gdm wrote:
PV Wolf wrote:
gdm wrote:
Okay, after two months of Androgel at 5gms a day (and a very brief period(1 week) at 10gms a day), here are the test results:

Total: 789 (up from about 300)
Free: 25 (up from about 7)

All the previous negative symptoms I had are improving at a rapid clip, especially in the last couple of weeks. I have also lost several pounds of bodyfat and my strength levels are up for the first time in a long time. The most noticeable change has been my energy levels as they have greatly improved.

I’m soldiering on at 5gms and hopefully things will get even better. The moral of the story is that you should give the gel at least a couple of months. I almost jumped ship after a few weeks and that would have been a big mistake.

PV - how is it going? I hope to hear some good news from you.

gdm

Hi again GDM - just a few more questions
I forgot to ask : any side effects ?
And how are you sleeping ? Your post has got me ready to go for it again.
Would you be doing 10g per days if not for your insurance issues ? And lastly-
how are the depression symptoms ?
Thanks very much for taking the time
to post.
PV

PV,

I haven’t noticed any side effects from the 5gms yet. Interestingly, even though I have been sleeping well I have found that I don’t need as much sleep and feel just as well rested.

The 5gms have brought me to where I want to be so I don’t think I will be doubling the dose, even if I had the discretion to do so. 10gms might take me over the upper thresholds for both total and free levels. I don’t see an additional benefit to going to 10gms or even 7.5gms.

As for depression symptoms, I definitely feel much better now and I think this is a result of having more energy and resuming some of the activities that I foresook during my “down” times. I don’t think I am completely out of the hole yet but symptoms are improving.

I’ll post back again in about a month or so after my next blood test or if I notice any additional changes worth noting.

You may want to give the gel another shot before you move on to other therapies, especially if you already have the gel sitting around.

God bless.
gdm

[/quote]

Hey GDM - thanks for the reply. I need to think it over a bit only cause I am taking zoloft for the past 8 days and I dont know if I can mix it with Androgel use - I am going to ask my doc today.
Do you have any experince w/ mixing
A-gel w/ AD meds ?
I’m glad you’re doing well. Keep me posted and I will do likewise.

best - PV

51

Are you guys who use Androgel or Testim taking any aromatase inhibitors? My doctor is willing to prescribe it for me, but didn’t even know, for example, what arimidex was?!!?

Are you all just low BF% to begin with? I understand that less body fat means fewer aromatization sites.

Has this been a problem for any of you?

BTW I’m 35 and generally hover around 300ng/dL total test when I’ve been clean for a few months.

52

[quote]gdm wrote:
Okay, after two months of Androgel at 5gms a day (and a very brief period(1 week) at 10gms a day), here are the test results:

Total: 789 (up from about 300)
Free: 25 (up from about 7)

All the previous negative symptoms I had are improving at a rapid clip, especially in the last couple of weeks. I have also lost several pounds of bodyfat and my strength levels are up for the first time in a long time. The most noticeable change has been my energy levels as they have greatly improved.

I’m soldiering on at 5gms and hopefully things will get even better. The moral of the story is that you should give the gel at least a couple of months. I almost jumped ship after a few weeks and that would have been a big mistake.

PV - how is it going? I hope to hear some good news from you.

gdm [/quote]

Hi GDM- well, I am about a month into
10g per/day of Androgel, except for a few days where the libido was considerably
better, I am not feeling much better at all. Did you notice anything positive at 1 month in ? thanks and hope you’re still feeling good. PV

53

Testosterone levels fluctuate throughout the day and even from one blood sample to another taken at the same time. You can’t just fixate on the number.

Androgel is expensive. It’s also bad because you have to spread it all over the place, and larger surface area means more likelihood of some of it getting converted to estrogen.

Ask your doctor for a compounded testosterone cream. I did, and I think it will make things much better because I will only have to cover a small area of skin to get the same effect.

54

[quote]gdm wrote:
Okay, after two months of Androgel at 5gms a day (and a very brief period(1 week) at 10gms a day), here are the test results:

Total: 789 (up from about 300)
Free: 25 (up from about 7)

All the previous negative symptoms I had are improving at a rapid clip, especially in the last couple of weeks. I have also lost several pounds of bodyfat and my strength levels are up for the first time in a long time. The most noticeable change has been my energy levels as they have greatly improved.

I’m soldiering on at 5gms and hopefully things will get even better. The moral of the story is that you should give the gel at least a couple of months. I almost jumped ship after a few weeks and that would have been a big mistake.

PV - how is it going? I hope to hear some good news from you.

gdm [/quote]

Hey GDM- I got my numbers last week. After just over a month on 10g, I am
at : 639 total, 18.5 free (up from 234
and 9) so the numbers are good and I am
feeling some definite improvement but not yet my old self. Libido is way up but I am still tired with a good bit of brain fuzz and low feeling remaining.
Hope you are continuing your good results. PV

55

An interesting thread… a few folks trying to work through depression and wondering if testosterone will help.

If someone is depressed, male or female, and the doctor puts them on SSRI’s, then they often feel emotionally empty if that works at all. But their libido gets killed and that alone is depressing. So things can go from bad to worse.

Will HRT help? Yes it will, however, some depressions are tough to kick. But if you can have a sex life, feel better, gain strength and loose some fat, these are all things that will help one kick depression. And the feeling that things are getting better in that regard will certainly improve mood.

An improved sex life also changes your brain chemistry in very positive ways.

Stated another way, if you are depressed and your hormones are putting you down, that is something that you can fix.

56

[quote]KSman wrote:
An interesting thread… a few folks trying to work through depression and wondering if testosterone will help.

If someone is depressed, male or female, and the doctor puts them on SSRI’s, then they often feel emotionally empty if that works at all. But their libido gets killed and that alone is depressing. So things can go from bad to worse.

Will HRT help? Yes it will, however, some depressions are tough to kick. But if you can have a sex life, feel better, gain strength and loose some fat, these are all things that will help one kick depression. And the feeling that things are getting better in that regard will certainly improve mood.

An improved sex life also changes your brain chemistry in very positive ways.

Stated another way, if you are depressed and your hormones are putting you down, that is something that you can fix.[/quote]

well said - the bottom line is that
low T is something very concrete that I can hopefully say “thats what is causing
these problems” I know it could be alot of things but my T was low, Androgel has brought it up and I feel
a little better, not cured but lets
see what the next month brings…
thanks for the replies. PV

57

[quote]KSman wrote:
…
An improved sex life also changes your brain chemistry in very positive ways.

Stated another way, if you are depressed and your hormones are putting you down, that is something that you can fix.[/quote]

Right on, KSman. Orgasm release dopamine for pleasure, and that’s gotta make anyone feel good. Appreciate your presence and posting here.

bigdawg

58

What messes up women who are suffering from menopause, is getting put on SSRI’s then loosing more sexual ability. With men, there is less of an event and the changes are so slow, many do not even know that they have lost.

When I had my transient libido surge when starting test cyp, it was WTF!!! “So that is what things were like when I was young.” You don’t know what you have lost.

And the cruel thing, as others have pointed out, is that this increased libido is transient and you then know what you are missing. I am struggling to understand if that is from the body/brain simply getting used to that, or lower free testosterone as estrogen increases which increases SHBG and the increased estrogens direct -ve effects.

Adding to the confusion is what is known about deca dick and the effects of (too much) progesterone; combined with a few things on the net that statements that a small bit of progesterone increases libido in men. Further there are statements that an increase in estrogen as a transient effect on libido. So the increase of estrogen might itself be contributing to the transient libido, before it does its -ve things.

I wish that there was some hard info on these things. I would like to find something that simply states that free testosterone is the dominant driver of libido.

I would like to see the results of a pre HRT blood panel, then have the guy show up for a blood panel right when he feels that he simply needs to line the ladies up and do them all, then another blood panel after 3 months when things settle done. That would really have some interesting data. The on could use that second blood panel as a therapeutic objective.

59

PV - have you been tested for Lyme disease? It can lead to chronic symptoms such as lethargy, joint soreness and cloudiness.

60

Is everybody on Androgel? I just went in and had my test done and am awaiting results.

Tired, sluggish, anxiety. I’m On Effexor EX, but it does not help with the tiredness. I talked my doc into doing bloodwork today. Hopefully I’m good, but if not, I know he will help me out.