Why Train Calves?

Training Bodybuilding
101

[quote]pumped340 wrote:
Also how long did it take you to go from that ~13.5in to 14.75in? How much weight did you gain during that time?

unfortunately I don’t have many options over the summer for calf exercises (mostly free weights) but hopefully when I get back to a real gym in the fall things could change :[/quote]
May 21, 2008 - BW 170 16%bf, calves 13.5" (and I might have been exaggerating just a bit)
April 28, 2010 - BW 212 14%bf, calves a bit over 14.75"

I actually got up to 14.75 in a year the first time, slacked off on the calves, got back to them (hadn’t lost any size), re-comped down to 12%bf and lost some calf size (almost 3/8" of fat), and now they’re back up to just over 14.75"

102

[quote]forlife wrote:

[quote]its_just_me wrote:
Sorry, your advice doesn’t count, you already have big calves remember?

;)[/quote]

Big calves that have grown even bigger ;)[/quote]

Damn you!

103

[quote]forlife wrote:
I don’t think perfect form is as important as consistent form. As long as you’re using the same form every workout, you should be able to gauge progress on your calves. One trick I use on standing calf raises is to be sure my heels touch the floor on every rep. That way, I know I’m not cheating on ROM and can more accurately gauge progress from one week to the next.

Follow PX’s advice, using consistent form, and see where you are after 2-3 months. As long as you’re using a heavy enough load (and ideally increasing it a bit every workout), 4x/week for 3-4 sets of 6-15 reps should be enough to see progress over that period of time.[/quote]

I think the issue with ROM isn’t really about going down low enough, it’s about getting high enough off the platform. I’ve heard a lot about focusing on the peak of the movement and it seems like a lot of people barely hit that. Do you do each of your sets as hard as you can?

[quote]JayPierce wrote:
The way I perform reps: No bounce, explosive as possible. Hold for a two-count, squeezing as hard as possible on every rep. Controlled negative.

I start with 100lbs and rep until they won’t move any more. ROM starts long, but shortens by the time I’m done with the set. Bump up the weight, wait 2min and do it again. Five sets. Then I move to the other movement (I alternate starting exercises).

Walking with the pack on is great because I get steady-state and extra calf work at the same time. Don’t try it after pyramids, someone will have to come get you (if you did the pyramids right).[/quote]

I’ve only been doing the one max set, but have recently started doing it similar with ROM. I felt like the bottom of the movement could keep going a lot even though I couldn’t do full ROM so I’ve started doing as many reps as possible going all the way to the top but then get a few more in with the range being more limited.

[quote]JayPierce wrote:

[quote]pumped340 wrote:
Also how long did it take you to go from that ~13.5in to 14.75in? How much weight did you gain during that time?

unfortunately I don’t have many options over the summer for calf exercises (mostly free weights) but hopefully when I get back to a real gym in the fall things could change :[/quote]
May 21, 2008 - BW 170 16%bf, calves 13.5" (and I might have been exaggerating just a bit)
April 28, 2010 - BW 212 14%bf, calves a bit over 14.75"

I actually got up to 14.75 in a year the first time, slacked off on the calves, got back to them (hadn’t lost any size), re-comped down to 12%bf and lost some calf size (almost 3/8" of fat), and now they’re back up to just over 14.75"[/quote]

Just out of curiosity do you measure your calves standing or holding your leg up parallel to the floor? I mentioned this is another thread but I notice about 1/2in difference between the two

104

[quote]pumped340 wrote:
I think the issue with ROM isn’t really about going down low enough, it’s about getting high enough off the platform. I’ve heard a lot about focusing on the peak of the movement and it seems like a lot of people barely hit that. Do you do each of your sets as hard as you can?[/quote]

I mentioned hitting the bottom of the ROM on a standing calf raise because you get physical feedback on every rep (i.e., feeling your heels touch the floor). I go up as high as possible on the top of the ROM, and don’t have any problem feeling that end of the range.

The key is to move through the entire ROM rather than cutting it short. Another thing you can do to maximize ROM is to align your toes with the bar rather than extending your toes past the bar. The further back your heels are, the larger the ROM will be.

Aside from cutting short ROM, the biggest mistake I see people make is to bounce rather than steadily moving through the entire ROM with control.

105

[quote]pumped340 wrote:

Just out of curiosity do you measure your calves standing or holding your leg up parallel to the floor? I mentioned this is another thread but I notice about 1/2in difference between the two[/quote]

seated with my foot flat on the floor, calf perpendicular.

106

[quote]forlife wrote:

[quote]pumped340 wrote:
I think the issue with ROM isn’t really about going down low enough, it’s about getting high enough off the platform. I’ve heard a lot about focusing on the peak of the movement and it seems like a lot of people barely hit that. Do you do each of your sets as hard as you can?[/quote]

I mentioned hitting the bottom of the ROM on a standing calf raise because you get physical feedback on every rep (i.e., feeling your heels touch the floor). I go up as high as possible on the top of the ROM, and don’t have any problem feeling that end of the range.

The key is to move through the entire ROM rather than cutting it short. Another thing you can do to maximize ROM is to align your toes with the bar rather than extending your toes past the bar. The further back your heels are, the larger the ROM will be.

Aside from cutting short ROM, the biggest mistake I see people make is to bounce rather than steadily moving through the entire ROM with control.[/quote]

My ROM shortens considerably over the course of a set, but I think the most important thing is to squeeze the contraction as hard a possible.

I also angle my feet outward because I feel it over the entire back of my calf that way.

Bouncing is definitely a huge mistake. Calves, by nature, are probably the best at using stretch-reflex vs. any other muscle in the body.

107

[quote]forlife wrote:

[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:
This is the point. Regardless of how much weight you can calf press (seated calf press is only half the equation but I assume you also do standing stuff or donkey press) you aren’t hitting the muscle properly. [/quote]

I do both seated and standing calf presses, what is your point? I specifically said that I have personally seen growth in my calves, but that my calves are already genetically large.

AGAIN, I was referring to people that claim it is impossible for their calves to grow, despite training correctly. I never said their claim is correct, only that they make the claim.[/quote]

I dont think these people exist. SOMETHING is wrong. Rate of growth is one thing, but NO growth whatsoever indicates a problem

I said “you” to describe all people. I wasnt picking on you. Excuse that.

108

[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:

[quote]forlife wrote:

[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:
This is the point. Regardless of how much weight you can calf press (seated calf press is only half the equation but I assume you also do standing stuff or donkey press) you aren’t hitting the muscle properly. [/quote]

I do both seated and standing calf presses, what is your point? I specifically said that I have personally seen growth in my calves, but that my calves are already genetically large.

AGAIN, I was referring to people that claim it is impossible for their calves to grow, despite training correctly. I never said their claim is correct, only that they make the claim.[/quote]

I dont think these people exist. SOMETHING is wrong. Rate of growth is one thing, but NO growth whatsoever indicates a problem

I said “you” to describe all people. I wasnt picking on you. Excuse that.
[/quote]

Those people exist. Black people should not train calves, they won’t grow no mater how hard they try.

Of course I’m kidding. Here is an interview from Kai I just read:

Kai Greene: When I was first training in real gyms as a teenager, there was a female personal trainer who saw potential in me and offered to train me. After a few workouts, I noticed we hadn’t done a thing for calves, so I asked her when we were going to. She said, ‘Oh, don’t worry about calves; black bodybuilders can’t build them. Let’s focus on things that can be more productive for you.’ that didn’t make any sense to me that if I trained my calves they wouldn’t grow at all. Everything else I trained had grown. So on my own, I would do few sets of seated and standing calf raises. Many years later, my calves aren’t phenomenal, but they’re certainly not weak, either. They would be, if I had listened to that trainer as a teenager and believed what she said.

What come in my mind at this time? If the OP is clearly believing what he is saying, he is not in the correct minding of building a great body. Yes he may build 16 inch arms, but he will never touch the greatness that make a man stand over the other, the true Alpha Male.

Bodybuilding is a lot more than building muscle, it’s pushing yourself further while breaking your own limits. That’s include building bigger calves even if it’s not easy.

109

Maybe if I say this enough times it will sink in. It’s not a question of the “OP clearly believing what he is saying”.

I was conveying what I have heard from others on these boards, and calling them on it. If it really is impossible for them to improve their calves, why are they wasting their time training their calves in the first place? The training itself is a tacit admission that training calves works.

Get it?

That said, I agree with your post.

110

on the subject of calves, Should you ramp up with calves? or do heavy straight sets?

111

[quote]eyegainweightbig wrote:
on the subject of calves, Should you ramp up with calves? or do heavy straight sets?[/quote]

Oh come on. You hijacked a whole thread in the beginners section and now you ask this. Based on what C_C and I said in that thread, what do you THINK the answer is going to be?

112

[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:

[quote]eyegainweightbig wrote:
on the subject of calves, Should you ramp up with calves? or do heavy straight sets?[/quote]

Oh come on. You hijacked a whole thread in the beginners section and now you ask this. Based on what C_C and I said in that thread, what do you THINK the answer is going to be? [/quote]

113

[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:

[quote]eyegainweightbig wrote:
on the subject of calves, Should you ramp up with calves? or do heavy straight sets?[/quote]

Oh come on. You hijacked a whole thread in the beginners section and now you ask this. Based on what C_C and I said in that thread, what do you THINK the answer is going to be? [/quote]
Ramping up probably. I thought calves were different though because everybody emphasizes pounding them and I thought maybe one set to failure wasn;t enough. I won’t ask anymore questions in this thread about it.

114

[quote]eyegainweightbig wrote:

[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:

[quote]eyegainweightbig wrote:
on the subject of calves, Should you ramp up with calves? or do heavy straight sets?[/quote]

Oh come on. You hijacked a whole thread in the beginners section and now you ask this. Based on what C_C and I said in that thread, what do you THINK the answer is going to be? [/quote]
Ramping up probably. I thought calves were different though because everybody emphasizes pounding them and I thought maybe one set to failure wasn;t enough. I won’t ask anymore questions in this thread about it.[/quote]

It may not be. So you’d do more work. People tend to get the best results training calves with very high frequency. I like 4x per week but not on leg day with standing and seated work split up.

/hijack

115

[quote]Cephalic_Carnage wrote:

[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:

[quote]eyegainweightbig wrote:
on the subject of calves, Should you ramp up with calves? or do heavy straight sets?[/quote]

Oh come on. You hijacked a whole thread in the beginners section and now you ask this. Based on what C_C and I said in that thread, what do you THINK the answer is going to be? [/quote]

[/quote]

You cheated. You cant answer the questions if you take part in wrting the test.

116

[quote]Cephalic_Carnage wrote:

[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:

[quote]eyegainweightbig wrote:
on the subject of calves, Should you ramp up with calves? or do heavy straight sets?[/quote]

Oh come on. You hijacked a whole thread in the beginners section and now you ask this. Based on what C_C and I said in that thread, what do you THINK the answer is going to be? [/quote]

[/quote]

I think you’ve got calf training confused with the meaning of life.

117

[quote]kingbeef323 wrote:

[quote]Cephalic_Carnage wrote:

[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:

[quote]eyegainweightbig wrote:
on the subject of calves, Should you ramp up with calves? or do heavy straight sets?[/quote]

Oh come on. You hijacked a whole thread in the beginners section and now you ask this. Based on what C_C and I said in that thread, what do you THINK the answer is going to be? [/quote]

[/quote]

I think you’ve got calf training confused with the meaning of life.
[/quote]

I was trying to think like Professor X there.

As for calf-training, I recommend you do it like me:
Sit in front of playstation and play a game. This is your first warm-up set.
Then stand up and walk to the kitchen to get some food. This is your second warm-up.

Now that your calves are all warmed up, you can walk up the stairs (whichever stairs are close by) for a hard set of 3.

If no stairs are available, get back to playing games on your playstation, but make sure to point your feet up in the air and move them up and down some for 20 reps (controlled negatives).

There, do that every day and your calves should get to 21’ in no time. Worked for me, so it should work for everyone.

118

[quote]Cephalic_Carnage wrote:

[quote]kingbeef323 wrote:

[quote]Cephalic_Carnage wrote:

[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:

[quote]eyegainweightbig wrote:
on the subject of calves, Should you ramp up with calves? or do heavy straight sets?[/quote]

Oh come on. You hijacked a whole thread in the beginners section and now you ask this. Based on what C_C and I said in that thread, what do you THINK the answer is going to be? [/quote]

[/quote]

I think you’ve got calf training confused with the meaning of life.
[/quote]

I was trying to think like Professor X there.

As for calf-training, I recommend you do it like me:
Sit in front of playstation and play a game. This is your first warm-up set.
Then stand up and walk to the kitchen to get some food. This is your second warm-up.

Now that your calves are all warmed up, you can walk up the stairs (whichever stairs are close by) for a hard set of 3.

If no stairs are available, get back to playing games on your playstation, but make sure to point your feet up in the air and move them up and down some for 20 reps (controlled negatives).

There, do that every day and your calves should get to 21’ in no time. Worked for me, so it should work for everyone.

[/quote]
Playstation is for the noobs. The big dudes rep out Ps3…

119

[quote]forlife wrote:
Maybe if I say this enough times it will sink in. It’s not a question of the “OP clearly believing what he is saying”.

I was conveying what I have heard from others on these boards, and calling them on it. If it really is impossible for them to improve their calves, why are they wasting their time training their calves in the first place? The training itself is a tacit admission that training calves works.

Get it?

That said, I agree with your post.[/quote]

You’ve got backpedalling down to a science, grats.

120

[quote]pumped340 wrote:

[quote]celtics2022 wrote:

For reference: Kai Greene doing 225 for 11 reps at 4:00

[/quote]

This is what I was talking about above. What do you guys count as full reps? He’s barely even going halfway up with that weight. It’s seriously hard to gauge strength progress because half the time when you’re going up in weight the ROM is just going down. I was doing 255 on some machine back in november and the other day did 230 for the same reps because my ROM was just larger and it was just as hard.

Also, do you guys use your hands on the seated calf raises? I always did but then I took them off of the handles and put them on the side so they couldn’t help at all and the reps were practically cut in half. I was doing 110x11 or something like that (again, calves only about 15in) and without hands at all I only got 6x115. [/quote]

Kai actually answers the OP’s exact question, brilliantly, I might add, toward the end of this video. Good post!