What Naturals are Truly Capable of...

Training
1041

[quote]atypical1 wrote:

[quote]ryan.b_96 wrote:
I really like the scientific side of bodybuilding just as much as the actual training. Now i know these thread normally turn to shit really quick, but im hopping to have a decent discussion with minimal flaming.

now this is someone with elite genetics and access to just about any drug he wanted of that era. yet we have people on here who claim to have natural powerlifting friends who are 5’7, 225lb and walk around at 6% bodyfat. FUCKING PLEASE…[/quote]

For me this first post set the stage wrong for me. First he’s talking about bodybuilding then he mentions powerlifting. I honestly don’t know any powerlifters who can tell you their bodyfat percentages because it doesn’t matter. So you can take the xx % bodyfat with a huge grain of salt. Bodybuilders to care and do track it so it’s going to be much more accurate and meaningful.

You’re also going to have a different conversation (as Stu pointed out) if you’re talking about aesthetics than if you’re talking about performance. But I do think that you need to be careful about all the assumptions because there’s always exceptions to the rule.

I do like the idea that setting limits does inhibit what you’re going to do. While it’s good to have a healthy dose of reality thrown in there you are probably best off not caring what someone tells you you’re capable of and just going for what you can.

james[/quote]

i only brought up a powerlifting because someone specifically claimed that they had a friend who was a natural powerlifter, that walked around at 5’7 225bs while maintaining 6% bodyfat. the ridiculousness of that claim is why i bought it up.

again X has turned this into a “limit” thread. notice how limits where never mentioned in the OP. i just posted stats of what some of the best natural bodybuilders have done, along with some experts opinions of what nattys are capable of. nothing more.

me posting these does not limit anyone. if your going to stop trying to do your best simply because you are near to achieving what top nattys pros have done, well then maybe your not cut out for this :wink:

1042

LET’S MAX THIS BITCH OUT!!!

1043

[quote]jskrabac wrote:

[quote]BrickHead wrote:

[quote]SteelyD wrote:

[quote]J. Prufrock wrote:
If I was just looking to get as big as possible, I would listen to X. However, that would most likely end up with me carrying much more fat than I’d like. [/quote]

So at the risk of being a “PX Nuthugger”, I’ll say this:

PX never said “go get fat”. (That I’m aware of).

The good doctor, while comfortable in his own level of fatness, has to my knowledge never said “go get fat”.

This is what I, as a newb, took from his earlier posts/threads. I always understood it as ‘take it to where you feel comfortable’, the ‘put the brakes on’. I think, IIRC, he said ‘damage control’. No? I mean, if your goal is BB comp or physique oriented and you are not worried about 1RM liftsand you just keep getting fat, then really you’re not really listening to the message. If you want to put on weight fast and you understand that you’re going to smooth out, then the message is eat for the goal.

It’s one way of doing it. Certainly not “The Only” way. Maybe not the best way, or even a good way (for everyone). Just ‘one’ way.

I know I am somewhat retarded and probably one of the least knowledgeable people on these boards, but I swear I’ve never read “Go get fat” from the “Works of PX”.

Now, can we fucking move on now? I really want to talk about biceps or something else besides this damned fat vs lean bullshit.[/quote]

Your post is sensible and I think you know I think good of you.

However, although X of course never said “get fat” --who would actually say this?–his advice will and has lead quite a few people to get fat.
[/quote]

I can vouch for that. I bought into the whole “gotta hold a heavy weight so my body gets used to moving around at that weight” mentality. In the end, I needed to diet for 10 whole months to get stage ready, and I actually had alot of medical issues at the heavy bodyweight. [/quote]

There are many ppl from tnation that had this exact thing happen only to diet the fat off and see the results of getting strong and eating s ton did not yield extra muscle. Now they stay lean and grow look better all the time yet make consistent progress

1044

[quote]ryanbCXG wrote:

[quote]jskrabac wrote:

[quote]BrickHead wrote:

[quote]SteelyD wrote:

[quote]J. Prufrock wrote:
If I was just looking to get as big as possible, I would listen to X. However, that would most likely end up with me carrying much more fat than I’d like. [/quote]

So at the risk of being a “PX Nuthugger”, I’ll say this:

PX never said “go get fat”. (That I’m aware of).

The good doctor, while comfortable in his own level of fatness, has to my knowledge never said “go get fat”.

This is what I, as a newb, took from his earlier posts/threads. I always understood it as ‘take it to where you feel comfortable’, the ‘put the brakes on’. I think, IIRC, he said ‘damage control’. No? I mean, if your goal is BB comp or physique oriented and you are not worried about 1RM liftsand you just keep getting fat, then really you’re not really listening to the message. If you want to put on weight fast and you understand that you’re going to smooth out, then the message is eat for the goal.

It’s one way of doing it. Certainly not “The Only” way. Maybe not the best way, or even a good way (for everyone). Just ‘one’ way.

I know I am somewhat retarded and probably one of the least knowledgeable people on these boards, but I swear I’ve never read “Go get fat” from the “Works of PX”.

Now, can we fucking move on now? I really want to talk about biceps or something else besides this damned fat vs lean bullshit.[/quote]

Your post is sensible and I think you know I think good of you.

However, although X of course never said “get fat” --who would actually say this?–his advice will and has lead quite a few people to get fat.
[/quote]

I can vouch for that. I bought into the whole “gotta hold a heavy weight so my body gets used to moving around at that weight” mentality. In the end, I needed to diet for 10 whole months to get stage ready, and I actually had alot of medical issues at the heavy bodyweight. [/quote]

There are many ppl from tnation that had this exact thing happen only to diet the fat off and see the results of getting strong and eating s ton did not yield extra muscle. Now they stay lean and grow look better all the time yet make consistent progress[/quote]

That’s awesome that some can do that.

Is that the only way everyone should approach growing and making progress?

1045

[quote]SteelyD wrote:

[quote]ryanbCXG wrote:

[quote]jskrabac wrote:
I can vouch for that. I bought into the whole “gotta hold a heavy weight so my body gets used to moving around at that weight” mentality. In the end, I needed to diet for 10 whole months to get stage ready, and I actually had alot of medical issues at the heavy bodyweight. [/quote]

There are many ppl from tnation that had this exact thing happen only to diet the fat off and see the results of getting strong and eating s ton did not yield extra muscle. Now they stay lean and grow look better all the time yet make consistent progress[/quote]

That’s awesome that some can do that.

Is that the only way everyone should approach growing and making progress?[/quote]

I think we can all agree that there’s no single way to do things, but while you’ve got a lot of posters who will offer thoughts on their approaches and results, most don’t try to turn everything thread into a support post for why they’ve exceeded everyone else’s progress, and give the impression that all of the best developed people followed a similar path.

By this point, we all know what X’s approach to training was and we all know his opinion on matters such as how well the top competitive natural bodybuilders have done and it’s lack of relevance to everyone else.

I’m not attacking him with this reply, but he doesn’t need to steer every single thread back towards those matters in his own inimitable style. Hence the ‘X-Nation’ moniker I see this site has earned on FB and other online forums.

S

1046

[quote]SteelyD wrote:

[quote]ryanbCXG wrote:

[quote]jskrabac wrote:

[quote]BrickHead wrote:

[quote]SteelyD wrote:

[quote]J. Prufrock wrote:
If I was just looking to get as big as possible, I would listen to X. However, that would most likely end up with me carrying much more fat than I’d like. [/quote]

So at the risk of being a “PX Nuthugger”, I’ll say this:

PX never said “go get fat”. (That I’m aware of).

The good doctor, while comfortable in his own level of fatness, has to my knowledge never said “go get fat”.

This is what I, as a newb, took from his earlier posts/threads. I always understood it as ‘take it to where you feel comfortable’, the ‘put the brakes on’. I think, IIRC, he said ‘damage control’. No? I mean, if your goal is BB comp or physique oriented and you are not worried about 1RM liftsand you just keep getting fat, then really you’re not really listening to the message. If you want to put on weight fast and you understand that you’re going to smooth out, then the message is eat for the goal.

It’s one way of doing it. Certainly not “The Only” way. Maybe not the best way, or even a good way (for everyone). Just ‘one’ way.

I know I am somewhat retarded and probably one of the least knowledgeable people on these boards, but I swear I’ve never read “Go get fat” from the “Works of PX”.

Now, can we fucking move on now? I really want to talk about biceps or something else besides this damned fat vs lean bullshit.[/quote]

Your post is sensible and I think you know I think good of you.

However, although X of course never said “get fat” --who would actually say this?–his advice will and has lead quite a few people to get fat.
[/quote]

I can vouch for that. I bought into the whole “gotta hold a heavy weight so my body gets used to moving around at that weight” mentality. In the end, I needed to diet for 10 whole months to get stage ready, and I actually had alot of medical issues at the heavy bodyweight. [/quote]

There are many ppl from tnation that had this exact thing happen only to diet the fat off and see the results of getting strong and eating s ton did not yield extra muscle. Now they stay lean and grow look better all the time yet make consistent progress[/quote]

That’s awesome that some can do that.

Is that the only way everyone should approach growing and making progress?[/quote]

I hope that’s not the impression you got from that post becuse no where have I ever said that. I am merely pointing out that is possible to build a damn good physique without getting sloppy. Take the approach that fits your own psychology

1047

[quote]Mtag666 wrote:
I know he’s a powerlifter but Stormthebeach is about 280 and better conditioned/more athletic than the vast majority of people, so weighting more doesn’t always = out of shape.
[/quote]

FYI, he’s recently dieted down to 265 so he can represent the US at the IPF World’s.

1048

So just to make sure the point of this thread is made clear…

SteelyD Thinks I can bench 800 lbs! Sup bitchessssssss

1049

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:
So just to make sure the point of this thread is made clear…

SteelyD Thinks I can bench 800 lbs! Sup bitchessssssss[/quote]

no! You must set a realistic goal by examining what the top nattys have accomplished!

I have now limited your progress by telling you there is a limit. That’s how it works!

you might as well just quit lifting

1050

[quote]rds63799 wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:
So just to make sure the point of this thread is made clear…

SteelyD Thinks I can bench 800 lbs! Sup bitchessssssss[/quote]

no! You must set a realistic goal by examining what the top nattys have accomplished!

I have now limited your progress by telling you there is a limit. That’s how it works!

you might as well just quit lifting[/quote]

But see I’m only limited by being told about my limits. So if someone just tells me they loaded the bench with 795 lbs, but in reality loaded up 850, I wouldn’t know the difference, and Bench it easily.

The only way limits limit is if I’m aware, right?

1051

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:

[quote]rds63799 wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:
So just to make sure the point of this thread is made clear…

SteelyD Thinks I can bench 800 lbs! Sup bitchessssssss[/quote]

no! You must set a realistic goal by examining what the top nattys have accomplished!

I have now limited your progress by telling you there is a limit. That’s how it works!

you might as well just quit lifting[/quote]

But see I’m only limited by being told about my limits. So if someone just tells me they loaded the bench with 795 lbs, but in reality loaded up 850, I wouldn’t know the difference, and Bench it easily.

The only way limits limit is if I’m aware, right?
[/quote]

you’re blowing my mind Spidey

1052

[quote]rds63799 wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:

[quote]rds63799 wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:
So just to make sure the point of this thread is made clear…

SteelyD Thinks I can bench 800 lbs! Sup bitchessssssss[/quote]

no! You must set a realistic goal by examining what the top nattys have accomplished!

I have now limited your progress by telling you there is a limit. That’s how it works!

you might as well just quit lifting[/quote]

But see I’m only limited by being told about my limits. So if someone just tells me they loaded the bench with 795 lbs, but in reality loaded up 850, I wouldn’t know the difference, and Bench it easily.

The only way limits limit is if I’m aware, right?
[/quote]

you’re blowing my mind Spidey[/quote]

bruce willis was natty in unbreakable right?

1053

There is no spoon :slight_smile:

S

1054

[quote]Mr. Walkway wrote:

[quote]rds63799 wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:

[quote]rds63799 wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:
So just to make sure the point of this thread is made clear…

SteelyD Thinks I can bench 800 lbs! Sup bitchessssssss[/quote]

no! You must set a realistic goal by examining what the top nattys have accomplished!

I have now limited your progress by telling you there is a limit. That’s how it works!

you might as well just quit lifting[/quote]

But see I’m only limited by being told about my limits. So if someone just tells me they loaded the bench with 795 lbs, but in reality loaded up 850, I wouldn’t know the difference, and Bench it easily.

The only way limits limit is if I’m aware, right?
[/quote]

you’re blowing my mind Spidey[/quote]

bruce willis was natty in unbreakable right?[/quote]

If you consider having the strength of another human siphoned into you natural!

1055

[quote]rds63799 wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:

[quote]rds63799 wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:
So just to make sure the point of this thread is made clear…

SteelyD Thinks I can bench 800 lbs! Sup bitchessssssss[/quote]

no! You must set a realistic goal by examining what the top nattys have accomplished!

I have now limited your progress by telling you there is a limit. That’s how it works!

you might as well just quit lifting[/quote]

But see I’m only limited by being told about my limits. So if someone just tells me they loaded the bench with 795 lbs, but in reality loaded up 850, I wouldn’t know the difference, and Bench it easily.

The only way limits limit is if I’m aware, right?
[/quote]

you’re blowing my mind Spidey[/quote]
The vegetated ones are the strongest of our kind

1056

This thread just for really deep

1057

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:

But see I’m only limited by being told about my limits. So if someone just tells me they loaded the bench with 795 lbs, but in reality loaded up 850, I wouldn’t know the difference, and Bench it easily.

The only way limits limit is if I’m aware, right?
[/quote]

My friend and I were deadlifting the other day and he lifted 485 for a single when he thought it was 465. He counted the 45lb plates as 20kg plates, the 35lb as 15kg and the 25lb as 10kg (due to training previously in a gym that had kg plates).

I also added 15kg to my best deadlift because I stopped allowing my mind and fear of injury get in the way. Ain’t got time for fear anymore. Since adopting this method my gains have been coming thick and fast.

I often blame my injured shoulders and knees for holding me back, but now I’m done with that and believe my mind had an equal part to play.

I watched a new CT Fletcher vid this morning and he said to “unchain your mind”. My version of his statement is that it’s not the mind that is chained, but the mind that has the body chained.

1058

[quote]James Brown wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:

But see I’m only limited by being told about my limits. So if someone just tells me they loaded the bench with 795 lbs, but in reality loaded up 850, I wouldn’t know the difference, and Bench it easily.

The only way limits limit is if I’m aware, right?
[/quote]

My friend and I were deadlifting the other day and he lifted 485 for a single when he thought it was 465. He counted the 45lb plates as 20kg plates, the 35lb as 15kg and the 25lb as 10kg (due to training previously in a gym that had kg plates).

I also added 15kg to my best deadlift because I stopped allowing my mind and fear of injury get in the way. Ain’t got time for fear anymore. Since adopting this method my gains have been coming thick and fast.

I often blame my injured shoulders and knees for holding me back, but now I’m done with that and believe my mind had an equal part to play.

I watched a new CT Fletcher vid this morning and he said to “unchain your mind”. My version of his statement is that it’s not the mind that is chained, but the mind that has the body chained.[/quote]
I’m certain the method does, in fact, work though to a certain extent obviously.

1059

[quote]James Brown wrote:
I watched a new CT Fletcher vid this morning and he said to “unchain your mind”.[/quote]
I’m pretty sure that’s from The Matrix

1060

[quote]Consul wrote:

[quote]Mtag666 wrote:
I know he’s a powerlifter but Stormthebeach is about 280 and better conditioned/more athletic than the vast majority of people, so weighting more doesn’t always = out of shape.
[/quote]

FYI, he’s recently dieted down to 265 so he can represent the US at the IPF World’s.
[/quote]

Oh yea he mentioned that in his log on bbing.com I forgot.