Westside/PLing Training Thread

Training Powerlifting
5351

Nie PR bro hell 200 then 2 plates

on the flaring. IMO its OK and many do. keep them tucked and then flare at the end in the lock out Ive seen lot of guys do it. If thats how you can move BIG ass weight do it.

[quote]jthsiao wrote:
Monday, 7/2/2007: ME Upper

A. Paused Pin Press
135 x 8
155 x 5
175 x 1
185 x 1
190 x 1 (PR +5lbs)
195 x 0
195 x 1 (PR +5lbs)
155 x 5

B. Chest-Supported Row
100 x 8
100 x 8
100 x 8
100 x 8

C. Pull-Up
BW x 5
BW x 4
BW x 3
BW x 3

D. Lean-Away Lateral Raise
30 x 8
30 x 8
30 x 8
30 x 8

E. Standing Dumbbell External Rotation
15 x 12
15 x 12
15 x 12
15 x 12

It’s nice hitting a new PR on a pressing movement. Pretty soon, I won’t have to dwell in the land of 100’s and can move into the land of 200’s! Woohoo!

However, my form on the press still needs quite a bit of work. I’m starting to bring the bar lower, down around the diaphragm, but on the max efforts, I still flare out my elbows and try to recruit my shoulders and triceps instead of keeping my elbows tucked.

I focused specifically on that in my back-off set after the max attempts, and was a bit better. I guess technique will just have to come with more repetitions and time.[/quote]

5352

Nie PR bro hell 200 then 2 plates

on the flaring. IMO its OK and many do. keep them tucked and then flare at the end in the lock out Ive seen lot of guys do it. If thats how you can move BIG ass weight do it.

Phill

[quote]jthsiao wrote:
Monday, 7/2/2007: ME Upper

A. Paused Pin Press
135 x 8
155 x 5
175 x 1
185 x 1
190 x 1 (PR +5lbs)
195 x 0
195 x 1 (PR +5lbs)
155 x 5

B. Chest-Supported Row
100 x 8
100 x 8
100 x 8
100 x 8

C. Pull-Up
BW x 5
BW x 4
BW x 3
BW x 3

D. Lean-Away Lateral Raise
30 x 8
30 x 8
30 x 8
30 x 8

E. Standing Dumbbell External Rotation
15 x 12
15 x 12
15 x 12
15 x 12

It’s nice hitting a new PR on a pressing movement. Pretty soon, I won’t have to dwell in the land of 100’s and can move into the land of 200’s! Woohoo!

However, my form on the press still needs quite a bit of work. I’m starting to bring the bar lower, down around the diaphragm, but on the max efforts, I still flare out my elbows and try to recruit my shoulders and triceps instead of keeping my elbows tucked.

I focused specifically on that in my back-off set after the max attempts, and was a bit better. I guess technique will just have to come with more repetitions and time.[/quote]

5353

Id say go OVER the goal weight on the partials and slwly move down. all the while trying to get stronger on the bottom. they should in theory meet somewhere and the lockout will be buttr from the heavy partials

You can get this shit

Phill

[quote]skidmark wrote:
2007-7-2

RE Upper cycle 2
Bench
barx20
135x10
185x6
210 3x5

Bench lockouts (4th pin - 8" above chest)
300x1
275 2x4

OH Press
150 3x5

OH Lockouts (12th pin - 6’ high)
200x2
185 2x5

JM Press
175 5x5

Notes: Feel like I’m running out of time to meet my goal weights. 6 months left but I haven’t moved in some lifts for a few months. Going to do partials until reach goal weight and then increase range of motion. Dunno if it will be faster progress, but at least I’ll be moving the goal weight through some range of motion.[/quote]

5354

6/2/07 DE Upper

DE 12" log push jerk
125 8x3 30 seconds rest between all sets

Incline DB press neutral grip
55sx8
65sx5
55x8

BO lateral raise 3x15

Pushups elbows tucked
BWx25

Solid DE day, log felt good, I like the log DE work, helping me work on technique. I brought my elbows in more and it really helped on the press

Benching is frustrating, I fell the DBs are helping alot of the stablizing muscles, and getting a good load on my shoulders and triceps… The first set of 55’s felt LIGHT than the 65s felt REAL heavy… odd, oh well keep working at it, as long as I am getting transfer over to my overhead is all that matters.

happy with the 25 reps on the pushups I’ll start adding sets here in the weeks to come.

I ussally do a set of biceps on Upper day but nothing leaves my biceps SORE like stones and tire flips.

Odd notes: my FEET are sore, have been for weeks. All the push jerks, stones, tire flips, farmers walk can put some good stress on the feet.

On one of the log reps I let it drop down to my chest a little fast, and it HURT pretty bad. Turns out my chest has a damn good amount of brusing, probaly mainly from the tire flips. Good stuff

5355

Supplement/diet talk

Do any of you use Power Drive?

I just bought some for the first time and have been using it for about a week now, I must say I like it!

Do you figure it is worth it to take after every training day, or just ME days?

I figure with it being 17 bucks for 31 servings with training 5 days a week makes one container last 1 1/2 months its cheap enough to not worry about wasting it.

I want to get better condtioned and could use to lose 10lbs of fat, if I had to choose I would rather be better condtioned. I don’t think a drastic diet change would be a good idea considering I still need to make significant strength gains and don’t want to sacrafice that. I was thinking of switching that to a bigger servings of 88% ground beef and lots of veggies to see how it goes.

I am thinking it might be best to worry about all this and experiment after my last comp August 22nd and just do more high rep work, sled work, and event stuff to get condtioning up in the mean time which might accomplish all goals anyways.

Maybe I could just cut down my carbs a bit? I’ve been eating some whole wheat pasta veggies and chicken pasta (no sauce) with added flax for lunch and dinner for awhile now.

5356

[quote]Modi wrote:
skidmark wrote:
Notes: Feel like I’m running out of time to meet my goal weights. 6 months left but I haven’t moved in some lifts for a few months. Going to do partials until reach goal weight and then increase range of motion. Dunno if it will be faster progress, but at least I’ll be moving the goal weight through some range of motion.

Skid, I think you have plenty of time to hit those goals. My question would be are you eating enough? Your training looks solid, but if you aren’t taking in enough calories that could be the problem.

If that’s not the case, we may have to blame it on old age, but I don’t want to go there yet… [/quote]

Hold on - lemme put my teeth in before I answer…There.

Yah - calories is the problem. Been eating well the last few days though and I feel it in my lifts. Being consistent with the protein drink 2 or 3 times a day and getting 4 squares.

Guess I’m just getting panicky in my old age.

5357

7-2-07

Decline Bench (5RM)

135x5
185x5
225x5
245x5
255x5

Ooops, need to make my jumps between sets more even. Next week will be around 30# jumps each set.

Front Squats (5x5)
205x5x5

These were ALOT better. I quit looking at the mirror and just focused on driving up with my elbows high.

DB Rows
110x5x5 each arm

Bulgarian Split Squats w/ 70# DBs
70x8 x 3sets each leg

DB Floor Press w/ Mini wrapped around back
60# DBs x 8
65#x8
70# x8

I’ve maxed out on the 100# DBs on the floor press, so I used the mini for extra resistance. My gym doesn’t have a power rack or else I’d do the barbell version. There’s no place to rack the weight where I can reach it off the floor. I thought about setting the bar across 2 benches, but I’d still need a handoff.

Watched this video before I went to the gym. Awesome to see Ronnie front squat. Now if only he’d clean up his form, he could build some REAL muscle (sarcasm).

5358

07/02/07

Bench Press
45x10
95x5
135x4
155x3
185x2
205x1
240x1
240x1
240x1

Bent Over Row
135x5
205x5x5

Dip
BWx5
BW+112.5x5
BW+112.5x5
BW+112.5x5
BW+112.5x4
BW+112.5x4

Hanging Leg Raise
17,14,10
45 Degree Hyperextension
17,14,10

I’ve gained 27 pounds in the last year. According to the BMI, I am now obese (5’8" 197lbs). I think it’s funny that I’m “obese” and my abs are still visible.

5359

[quote]Kalle wrote:
Supplement/diet talk

Do any of you use Power Drive?

I just bought some for the first time and have been using it for about a week now, I must say I like it!

Do you figure it is worth it to take after every training day, or just ME days?

I figure with it being 17 bucks for 31 servings with training 5 days a week makes one container last 1 1/2 months its cheap enough to not worry about wasting it.[/quote]

Yes I use it I actually usually use it in the mornings even a half serving. Think it really helps keep me going in all this work etc but without loading up on caffeine etc.

Your plan seems very sound I know CT talks about it for CNS recovery etc.

If you need the weight as well I would just try and up the conditioning work IMO prior to any diet changes. No reason you cant get better conditioned at the same weight No?? get stronger in the process. Dropping intake isnt going to aid you trying to get strong and conditioned the higher work load may even call for more intake.

Phill

5360

[quote]ChaseT wrote:
I’ve gained 27 pounds in the last year. According to the BMI, I am now obese (5’8" 197lbs). I think it’s funny that I’m “obese” and my abs are still visible.[/quote]

Congrats on joining the obesity epidemic :slight_smile: is a great feeling no??

Phill

5361

[quote]Phill wrote:
Id say go OVER the goal weight on the partials and slwly move down. all the while trying to get stronger on the bottom. they should in theory meet somewhere and the lockout will be buttr from the heavy partials

You can get this shit

Phill

skidmark wrote:
2007-7-2

RE Upper cycle 2
Bench
barx20
135x10
185x6
210 3x5

Bench lockouts (4th pin - 8" above chest)
300x1
275 2x4

OH Press
150 3x5

OH Lockouts (12th pin - 6’ high)
200x2
185 2x5

JM Press
175 5x5

Notes: Feel like I’m running out of time to meet my goal weights. 6 months left but I haven’t moved in some lifts for a few months. Going to do partials until reach goal weight and then increase range of motion. Dunno if it will be faster progress, but at least I’ll be moving the goal weight through some range of motion.

[/quote]

Not a bad idea. My problem is that I can barely move the goal weight (right now) even through a partial range. Squats and deads, yes, I can do. But the upper body goals are tough.

You think I should go for reps or just try to max in the partial ROM and then increase the ROM? My thought was to get five reps, drop the pins, go for 5’s again, drop the pins and so on until I had the bugger through the full ROM. I believe 3’s or 5’s will carry me down to the next angle where I can at least get one rep. But it’s only a belief based on my squat experience.

Also not sure if I should do this on ME days too or stick with full ROM. Don’t feel fried from today, but doing it on ME days too might be too much…

Part of my plateau problem has been lessened by that self-inflicted ART session I did last microcycle. Busted up a lot of stickage in the lat and tricep. The nerve impulses are making it through and I have more strength in the arm and shoulder as a result. My pressing today was nearly pain free and the shoulder didn’t hitch up. Still weaker than left side but another few sessions of that and I might see faster progress than in the past.

Thanks Phill (and Modi) for your advice.

edit:
Damn! I knew 210 was too light! Just went back and did bench 225 3x5.

5362

Damn fine work on that pressing going back and nailing that.

IMO add it to ME day its a very heavy move either use it as a first or Id pic it as a second ME of the day doing partials

Reps GO friggin heavy IMO Id go for 1-3 say once you can get three drop the pins or what ive done with success is work up to a load say off the top of head youd do a lock out with 315. then drop the pins two inches. keep working up until you can hit that weight again at the new level, once you can drop the pins. etc.

I like triples though for pressing mine actually started moving once I was doing them instead of all singles. But for partial work GO friggin HEAVY IMO

Phill

[quote]skidmark wrote:
Phill wrote:
Id say go OVER the goal weight on the partials and slwly move down. all the while trying to get stronger on the bottom. they should in theory meet somewhere and the lockout will be buttr from the heavy partials

You can get this shit

Phill

Not a bad idea. My problem is that I can barely move the goal weight (right now) even through a partial range. Squats and deads, yes, I can do. But the upper body goals are tough.

You think I should go for reps or just try to max in the partial ROM and then increase the ROM? My thought was to get five reps, drop the pins, go for 5’s again, drop the pins and so on until I had the bugger through the full ROM. I believe 3’s or 5’s will carry me down to the next angle where I can at least get one rep. But it’s only a belief based on my squat experience.

Also not sure if I should do this on ME days too or stick with full ROM. Don’t feel fried from today, but doing it on ME days too might be too much…

Part of my plateau problem has been lessened by that self-inflicted ART session I did last microcycle. Busted up a lot of stickage in the lat and tricep. The nerve impulses are making it through and I have more strength in the arm and shoulder as a result. My pressing today was nearly pain free and the shoulder didn’t hitch up. Still weaker than left side but another few sessions of that and I might see faster progress than in the past.

Thanks Phill (and Modi) for your advice.

edit:
Damn! I knew 210 was too light! Just went back and did bench 225 3x5.[/quote]

5363

[quote]Phill wrote:

…

I like triples though for pressing mine actually started moving once I was doing them instead of all singles. But for partial work GO friggin HEAVY IMO

Phill

[/quote]

Yeah - my body reacts to a single like “WTF?!” but responds to a triple by making it the new normal. Triples it is.

Awesome to have you guys around. All y’all.

5364

[quote]Phill wrote:
Nie PR bro hell 200 then 2 plates

on the flaring. IMO its OK and many do. keep them tucked and then flare at the end in the lock out Ive seen lot of guys do it. If thats how you can move BIG ass weight do it.

jthsiao wrote:
Monday, 7/2/2007: ME Upper

A. Paused Pin Press
135 x 8
155 x 5
175 x 1
185 x 1
190 x 1 (PR +5lbs)
195 x 0
195 x 1 (PR +5lbs)
155 x 5

B. Chest-Supported Row
100 x 8
100 x 8
100 x 8
100 x 8

C. Pull-Up
BW x 5
BW x 4
BW x 3
BW x 3

D. Lean-Away Lateral Raise
30 x 8
30 x 8
30 x 8
30 x 8

E. Standing Dumbbell External Rotation
15 x 12
15 x 12
15 x 12
15 x 12

It’s nice hitting a new PR on a pressing movement. Pretty soon, I won’t have to dwell in the land of 100’s and can move into the land of 200’s! Woohoo!

However, my form on the press still needs quite a bit of work. I’m starting to bring the bar lower, down around the diaphragm, but on the max efforts, I still flare out my elbows and try to recruit my shoulders and triceps instead of keeping my elbows tucked.

I focused specifically on that in my back-off set after the max attempts, and was a bit better. I guess technique will just have to come with more repetitions and time.

[/quote]

Louie Simmons is having his guys arc their benches back toward the shoulders ever since another gym’s lifters have been outbenching his (I read) and they were doing it that way. Can’t remember the name of the gym now, of course. Or where I read it.

Which makes it hearsay. Buyer beware!

5365

Lower ME July 2nd 07

Slight elbow and shoulder pain today slight but much like that I used to have so took pressing and pulling easier by feel.

I really think the off week after this one will do me some good its about time for one been a long while

Everything done in Giant sets

1A) Safety Squat ( to 14 inch box squat)
Still hate these man they really try and fold you over up high
Bar x ton
155 x 10
245 x 8
335 x 5
385 x 5 ( rep PR)
425 x 2 (5 lb 2 rep PR I guess almost hate top start keeping 2RM�??s LOL)
445 x 1 But wont count it Cheated Damn it

OK these were good Hard but good the 385 was very solid killer but solid 5 reps. 425 I had 3 I think but called it and wanted to get greedy and go for a Post op load PR

I have NO clue where I got this bad habit all the sudden last time and this time.Did it again took hand off and went to brace on leg instead of grinding it out as it got hard on upper back. This time knew it right when it happens and didn�??t even really do it ground it out but I aint counting it need to keep hand on bar

Some good PR�??s

1B) Incline Bench from bottom pins at chest dead stop each rep (havent done incline BB in a LONG time, months)
Bar x ton
95 x 10
135 x 5
160 x 5
185 x 5
210 x 1, 2
185 x 4
OK some discomfort on the 210 called it there man have a LONG way to g pressing wise these will help I think just getting that load going from a dead stop no eccentric.

1C) Chins
Slow tempo no explosion for arms sake
BW - blue band x 5 (8 sets)

3 set Giant set work hard not failure

2A) GM�??s
225 x 5
315 x 5 ( 2 sets)

2B) Wide Grip dips
BW x 8
BW + 50 x 5 ( 2 sets)

2C) Leg press
10 plates x 5
14 plates x 5 (2 sets)

2C) ab roller
3 sets

This was a KILLER w/o, I LIKED IT About an hour and half most of it the first 3 exercises.

Again pressing needs to come a LONG way, but have to be smart with the arm, Safety squat coming along keep it up, quads are for sure my limiter on the squatting. Tomorrow will be light event stuff for sure work on technique etc.

May be something to this full body ME I might try this after this next two weeks and the meet. Something like the following
Mon: ME total
Tues: Assistance Total (light, higher rep, RE and recovery)
Wed: Off
Thurs: Heavy Events
Friday:OFF
Sat: Light, speed, endurance, technique events
Sun: Off

Thoughts??

Phill

5366

7-2-07 Heavy Bench DELOAD

A. Bench
135 x 5, 185 x 3, 225 x 2, 255 x 1, 275 x 1(not very fast on this), 275 x 1 (grinded out the top!)

B1) DB SKullcrush: 40 x 10, 50 x 6, 55 x 5

B2) Cable Row: 200 x10, 10 220 x 8

Face Pull: 50 x 15, 15
BW Dip x 5

In and out in forty minutes!

NOTES: Wow, 275 (90%) was fuckin’ tough! Just let it go and did a little bit and gotta out the gym. I need this rest.

Higher reps (15) on face pulls is where its at. Makes a difference even up from my usual 10-12 reps.

stay strong

boom

5367

[quote]Kalle wrote:
elliotnewman1 wrote:
Phill wrote:
elliotnewman1 wrote:
ME Lower

Front Squat off Parrallel Box
80KG 1x3reps
90 1x3 reps
100(225lbs) 1x3reps(PR)

RDL
80 1x6reps
100 1x6 reps
110 1x6 reps(PR)

Single leg 45 degree back ext
BW 4x6repx(per leg)

Some calf work

Front squats were murder on my shoulders today(anyone else get that?). The PR is misleading…the weight was a joke on my legs(v easy) but didnt push another set because of my shoulders(ps i dont have shoulder problems, just not used to having the bar in that position)

Pleased with the PR on RDL’s, never gone past 100KG before.

Ell

LOL well hell yes thats part of it. Really try and get that bar in tight to wear its choking you its on your neck this will allow you to get elbows higher and it will rest on your shoulders more and keep that head high, back up. Dont fold over but yes its killer on shoulders. Liberal chalk helps as well

Phill

Haha, yeah i figured i couldn’t be the only one to find front squats hard on the shoulders, form felt good though, guess they just need to toughen up.

Ell

What grip are you using for front squats? Clean grip or bodybuilder?

If I use a clean grip and keep my elbows REAL HIGH it dosn’t hurt my shoulders much, its all about finding the “notch” the bar fits on thats comfortable and it is probaly diffrent on everyone!

[/quote]

I used a bb grip, just dont have the flexibilty to do it the Olympic way at the moment. I started off with my thumbs under the bar, but at 90KG it was getting painful. So for the 100KG i had my thumbs on top of the bar, arms crossed, elbows high.(doesn’t feel like the most stable of positions, but i wanted to hit something respectable)

5368

[quote]elliotnewman1 wrote:
I used a bb grip, just dont have the flexibilty to do it the Olympic way at the moment. I started off with my thumbs under the bar, but at 90KG it was getting painful. So for the 100KG i had my thumbs on top of the bar, arms crossed, elbows high.(doesn’t feel like the most stable of positions, but i wanted to hit something respectable)
[/quote]
I’ve found the same to be true. Anything over 225lb and my thumbs get crushed, so I have to put them on top of the bar. It’s much less stable that way, but unless the mobility fairy drops by while I’m sleeping, I don’t see being able to use the Oly grip anytime soon.

5369

DE Upper
Sp BP with 1 set of chains
57.5kg 8 sets of 3reps

BP 95kg with 1 set of chains
1x5reps

Close grip bench press
60kg 5x10reps

Wide pull downs
49 1x12reps
56 1x8 reps

plate drops(onto abs)
10 4x12reps

Bit of a crap workout today. Speed benching was good…feel fast with the chains.

However, i hadn’t done a regular bench in a while so did one set after the speed work and quickly realised i’ve been doing too much board pressing for max effort work! I felt weak at the bottom and had to conciously pull the bar down to my chest, it just didnt wanna go all the way down.

Im thinking board pressing is more beneficial when using a bench shirt?

I got really tired quickly after that set and finished the session with hardly any back work done.

Now this has got me thinking(this might be long, sorry:)). Firstly, in all the westside articles by Louie Simmons, he never really mentions taper weeks and implies that that is the beauty of the Westside system…ie the comtinual rotation of exercises into and out of your schedule allows you to train balls out virtually week in week out. Given that most coaches recommend a taper every 4th week, either Louie is onto something or the Westside guys do taper a bit at some point n they just dont make a big deal about it.

Any comments?

I’ve been using this system for about 4 months now and havn’t tapered once, hitting max efforts every week and feeling great. On any other training routine i have ever used i have usually wanted the taper week every 4th or 5th week, otherwise id feel shit(so im having a good run). However, both Monday and Tuesday this week i have felt a bit lacklustre(could just be one of those things of course).

Anyway im figuring i have 3 options:

  1. Procede as normal and hopefully find the past 2 days were just a random occurence(you aint ever gona be 110% for every session)

  2. Take a few days off(sensible, but man i hate not training!).

  3. Do the thing Poliquin recommended in his last article here on T-Nation…drive myself into the ground for 2 weeks(overtrain massively), feel like shit, have 5 days off and then annihilate the weights when i come back.(This sounds fun, but i dont know how it’d work with westside; Poliquins article was aimed more at hypertrophy than strength, but my incling says it’ll work here too)…

Elliot

5370

[quote]Phill wrote:

Mon: ME total
Tues: Assistance Total (light, higher rep, RE and recovery)
Wed: Off
Thurs: Heavy Events
Friday:OFF
Sat: Light, speed, endurance, technique events
Sun: Off

Thoughts??

Phill
[/quote]
Looks pretty reasonable to me. I think it will be good for your strongman training, but obviously your bench is going to suffer if your always putting it after a squat variation. If you are going to do this set up long term, maybe switch the order every week or every 3 weeks…