Wendler's 5/3/1 Program - Part 3

Training Powerlifting
661

[quote]Mikeee wrote:
Yep can definitely do weighted pullups I will probably substitute the deadlift day with a pullup following the 5/3/1 guidelines, thanks TheDudeAbides

Another question I have the “training 3 days a week” ebook by wendler, I was wondering is it worth investing in the actual 5/3/1 ebook since the 3 days a week does go thru 5/3/1 in fairly good detail[/quote]

As the dude mentioned, make sure you factor both your body weight and additional weight into the calculations. Also keep in mind that if 65% of your training max is lower than your bodyweight you’ll have to use some kind of assistance machine or bands (though hard to gauge tensions).

The 5/3/1 book is definitely worth the investment. Goes more indepth, offering a few different templates, instructions on how to do both assistance and main lifts, a collection of the more commonly asked questions about the program, and some more. In all fairness you can get just as much or more from the 3-day book and these 5/3/1 threads or JW’s Q@A over at elite, but at the expense of your time - the book is much more organized then a collection of posts.

662

any word on when the 5/3/1 for football is going to come out?

Right now I am playing Semi-Pro (nice word for amatuer) anyways we practice tues and thurs and starting next week saturday too. I also have 1 day of some dumbass Marine Corps PT (long ass distance run, or some other gay shit, 4 yrs 1 month down, 11 months left, YAY). I have been using the 4 days a week routine, even for the last 3 weeks during football. Upper body days dont bother me, Im a DB, so it isnt a big deal, but on Deads and Squat Days, I have pretty much only been doing the 5/3/1 and then getting out of the gym. Maybe a couple sets of GHRs on dead day or a few sets of Good Mornings, thats it. So far that has been ok, but I want to continue to get stronger throughout the season (main reason im playing football right now is to get me back in decent football shape, I plan on attempting to walk on somewhere when I EAS from the Marines). With the addition of Saturday practices, I am curious on how you guys might break up the days. Should I switch to 3 days a week?

Thanks again

Bryan

663

[quote]Keving14 wrote:

[quote]Mikeee wrote:
Yep can definitely do weighted pullups I will probably substitute the deadlift day with a pullup following the 5/3/1 guidelines, thanks TheDudeAbides

Another question I have the “training 3 days a week” ebook by wendler, I was wondering is it worth investing in the actual 5/3/1 ebook since the 3 days a week does go thru 5/3/1 in fairly good detail[/quote]

As the dude mentioned, make sure you factor both your body weight and additional weight into the calculations. Also keep in mind that if 65% of your training max is lower than your bodyweight you’ll have to use some kind of assistance machine or bands (though hard to gauge tensions).

The 5/3/1 book is definitely worth the investment. Goes more indepth, offering a few different templates, instructions on how to do both assistance and main lifts, a collection of the more commonly asked questions about the program, and some more. In all fairness you can get just as much or more from the 3-day book and these 5/3/1 threads or JW’s Q@A over at elite, but at the expense of your time - the book is much more organized then a collection of posts.[/quote]

My Big Four lifts: weighted pullup, press, deadlift, front squat.

For the 65% and 75%(weighted pullups), I just use BW to simplify things.

664

[quote]Doenitz79 wrote:

[quote]Keving14 wrote:

[quote]Mikeee wrote:
Yep can definitely do weighted pullups I will probably substitute the deadlift day with a pullup following the 5/3/1 guidelines, thanks TheDudeAbides

Another question I have the “training 3 days a week” ebook by wendler, I was wondering is it worth investing in the actual 5/3/1 ebook since the 3 days a week does go thru 5/3/1 in fairly good detail[/quote]

As the dude mentioned, make sure you factor both your body weight and additional weight into the calculations. Also keep in mind that if 65% of your training max is lower than your bodyweight you’ll have to use some kind of assistance machine or bands (though hard to gauge tensions).

The 5/3/1 book is definitely worth the investment. Goes more indepth, offering a few different templates, instructions on how to do both assistance and main lifts, a collection of the more commonly asked questions about the program, and some more. In all fairness you can get just as much or more from the 3-day book and these 5/3/1 threads or JW’s Q@A over at elite, but at the expense of your time - the book is much more organized then a collection of posts.[/quote]

My Big Four lifts: weighted pullup, press, deadlift, front squat.

For the 65% and 75%(weighted pullups), I just use BW to simplify things.[/quote]

So with the higher % stuff would you calculate of of the weight u strapped or your bw + weight u strapped?

665

[quote]Mikeee wrote:

Another question I have the “training 3 days a week” ebook by wendler, I was wondering is it worth investing in the actual 5/3/1 ebook since the 3 days a week does go thru 5/3/1 in fairly good detail[/quote]

I have both. They are very different books. JW really expanded on “Variation X” from Training 3 Days. From my understanding, there is an updated version coming out.

Still worth the minimal price.

666

[quote]No_Excuses wrote:
any word on when the 5/3/1 for football is going to come out?

Right now I am playing Semi-Pro (nice word for amatuer) anyways we practice tues and thurs and starting next week saturday too. I also have 1 day of some dumbass Marine Corps PT (long ass distance run, or some other gay shit, 4 yrs 1 month down, 11 months left, YAY). I have been using the 4 days a week routine, even for the last 3 weeks during football. Upper body days dont bother me, Im a DB, so it isnt a big deal, but on Deads and Squat Days, I have pretty much only been doing the 5/3/1 and then getting out of the gym. Maybe a couple sets of GHRs on dead day or a few sets of Good Mornings, thats it. So far that has been ok, but I want to continue to get stronger throughout the season (main reason im playing football right now is to get me back in decent football shape, I plan on attempting to walk on somewhere when I EAS from the Marines). With the addition of Saturday practices, I am curious on how you guys might break up the days. Should I switch to 3 days a week?

Thanks again

Bryan
[/quote]
Jim Wendler was on a podcast last Friday. I want to say he said about two weeks.

667

[quote]danjo228 wrote:

[quote]No_Excuses wrote:
any word on when the 5/3/1 for football is going to come out?

Right now I am playing Semi-Pro (nice word for amatuer) anyways we practice tues and thurs and starting next week saturday too. I also have 1 day of some dumbass Marine Corps PT (long ass distance run, or some other gay shit, 4 yrs 1 month down, 11 months left, YAY). I have been using the 4 days a week routine, even for the last 3 weeks during football. Upper body days dont bother me, Im a DB, so it isnt a big deal, but on Deads and Squat Days, I have pretty much only been doing the 5/3/1 and then getting out of the gym. Maybe a couple sets of GHRs on dead day or a few sets of Good Mornings, thats it. So far that has been ok, but I want to continue to get stronger throughout the season (main reason im playing football right now is to get me back in decent football shape, I plan on attempting to walk on somewhere when I EAS from the Marines). With the addition of Saturday practices, I am curious on how you guys might break up the days. Should I switch to 3 days a week?

Thanks again

Bryan
[/quote]
Jim Wendler was on a podcast last Friday. I want to say he said about two weeks.[/quote]

Thanks

668

[quote]TheDudeAbides wrote:

[quote]Mikeee wrote:
I know this may have been answered in many of the 5/3/1 threads but id rather not go searching through so many pages, so sorry in advance.

I cannot deadlift or do its variations due to a back injury.

So what would you do to 5/3/1 which is based around the big 4? (bench, squat, military and dl)[/quote]

Weighted chin-ups. Figure out your max (bodyweight + weight) then do the calculations. I don’t have a link, but I know Jim has ‘approved’ it.[/quote]

Did we all read that right deadlift replaced with dips?

I think you might have gotten mixed up with bench somehow, either that or the logic is “if you cant deadlift then just forget about it”.

669

Have any of you guys done this yet - I finished the 5 week of deads. Got 6 reps of 420 on my last set. Loaded up the bar for my BBB 5x10x50% (242.5). On the last rep of the last set, the bar slipped from my hands. I use a double overhand grip for my assistance sets. I had noticed my grip wasn’t all there today. When I unloaded the bar, I realized I loaded it to 277.5 instead of 242.5…

Not sure what I was thinking or lack thereof… musta been that extra rep of my top “5” set… I’m going to be so sore tomorrow… I realized that the weight I loaded was 56% of my working max (495) but looking back at the volume increase over what I was supposed to do makes me think I’m doing something right…

670

[quote]Mikeee wrote:
ust use BW to simplify things.

So with the higher % stuff would you calculate of of the weight u strapped or your bw + weight u strapped?
[/quote]

Yes. For example, you weigh 200lb and your best weighted chin is 100lb.

Your 1RM is 300lb.

5/3/1 max: 0.9 x 250=270

Week 1: 3 x 5

0.65 x 270=176(Just do 3-4 BW reps)
0.75 x 270=203(Add a 2.5lb plate)
0.85 x 270=230(Add 30lb)

Week 2: 3 x 3

0.7 x 270=189(Just do maybe 2 BW reps)
0.8 x 270=216(Add 16lb)
0.9 x 270=243(Add 43lb)

Week 3: 5/3/1

0.75 x 270=203(like in the first week)
0.85 x 270=230(like in the first week)
0.95 x 270=257(add 57lb)

Add 5lb after every cycle, so your second cycle would be 275lb, followed by 280lb, 285lb, 290lb etc.

But take note that you are factoring in your 200lb BW.

Hope this helps. Do feel free to clarify things. And yes, you need to crunch in a lot of numbers when you calculate your weighted chin 5/3/1 template.

If you don’t have fractional plates, just round it off. For instance, add 22lb(10kg)or even 25lb if the template says you need to add 23lb. Don’t sweat the small stuff.

671

thanks Doenitz79

672

[quote]Raided wrote:

[quote]TheDudeAbides wrote:

[quote]Mikeee wrote:
I know this may have been answered in many of the 5/3/1 threads but id rather not go searching through so many pages, so sorry in advance.

I cannot deadlift or do its variations due to a back injury.

So what would you do to 5/3/1 which is based around the big 4? (bench, squat, military and dl)[/quote]

Weighted chin-ups. Figure out your max (bodyweight + weight) then do the calculations. I don’t have a link, but I know Jim has ‘approved’ it.[/quote]

Did we all read that right deadlift replaced with dips?

I think you might have gotten mixed up with bench somehow, either that or the logic is “if you cant deadlift then just forget about it”.[/quote]

Where does it mention dips until your post?

673

[quote]Woppa wrote:

[quote]Raided wrote:

[quote]TheDudeAbides wrote:

[quote]Mikeee wrote:
I know this may have been answered in many of the 5/3/1 threads but id rather not go searching through so many pages, so sorry in advance.

I cannot deadlift or do its variations due to a back injury.

So what would you do to 5/3/1 which is based around the big 4? (bench, squat, military and dl)[/quote]

Weighted chin-ups. Figure out your max (bodyweight + weight) then do the calculations. I don’t have a link, but I know Jim has ‘approved’ it.[/quote]

Did we all read that right deadlift replaced with dips?

I think you might have gotten mixed up with bench somehow, either that or the logic is “if you cant deadlift then just forget about it”.[/quote]

Where does it mention dips until your post?[/quote]

Lol… I honestly read the post over and over and kept reading it as dips, thinking to myself “why would he be doing dipss??”.
Sorry guys.

674

Hey Wendler, you out there? Second month with 5/3/1. Just got a PR on my bench today, week three. 115X4 (dumbells). I know you say in your book that I can’t use dumbbells. I use them anyway…the bb puts a strain on my shoulders.

Anyway, thanks for the great program. I’m having a blast with it.

675

I just did a barbell complex in my off week, and I am in love. I hate traditional cardio and hiit so this seems like a great alternative for me, but I was wondering if you guys thought it might have a negative affect on my lifting if i did it twice a week with the program?

676

I did a few light complexes during the deload week I just finished and I’m also looking for a way to fit them in since I really liked them.

I’m thinking I’ll start them a few times a week staying light and see how I feel.

677

[quote]OT wrote:
I just did a barbell complex in my off week, and I am in love. I hate traditional cardio and hiit so this seems like a great alternative for me, but I was wondering if you guys thought it might have a negative affect on my lifting if i did it twice a week with the program?[/quote]

Wendler mentions hill sprints for his conditioning work in the ebook. I think complexes are comparable with hill sprints in terms of impacting lifting work.

678

i don’t think it will be an issue, just do the complexes after you lift. I used to do a complex in the morning and lift at lunch. starting my next training session (bbb) I will end the session with a complex. I am trying to cook off some lard. I’ll let you know how it affects my main lifts

679

About deloading during 5/3/1, let me share with you my experience.

I don’t deload after three weeks as I find it disrupts the momentum I have built up during the first three weeks.

I do two cycles back to back. After that six weeks, I take a full week off any strenous physical activity completely.

During the first cycle, I go for rep maxes for every lift, every week.

During the second cycle, I only go for rep maxes on the third week. I usually stay two reps short of my rep max during the first two weeks.

In sum, out of the six week-bloc, I max only on the first, second, third and sixth week.

It has worked very well for me so far.

To elaborate:

During the first, second and third week, I keep my assistance work in check by not training to true failure.

During the fourth and fifth week, as I said earlier, I do not do max reps for the main lifts, but I up the intensity for assistance lifts slightly, but still they are kept in check to conserve energy for the last week.

For the sixth week, I go for broke for both main and assistance lifts. This week, I just go all out since I have an entire week of total slacking coming after. I can hit 3-4 different PRs for each session this week.

As for the training parameters for my assistance lifts, they are very fluid. Can be 5x5 for one session, can be 3 x 10 the next.

Just sharing.

680

[quote]Doenitz79 wrote:
About deloading during 5/3/1, let me share with you my experience.

I don’t deload after three weeks as I find it disrupts the momentum I have built up during the first three weeks.

I do two cycles back to back. After that six weeks, I take a full week off any strenous physical activity completely.

During the first cycle, I go for rep maxes for every lift, every week.

During the second cycle, I only go for rep maxes on the third week. I usually stay two reps short of my rep max during the first two weeks.

In sum, out of the six week-bloc, I max only on the first, second, third and sixth week.

It has worked very well for me so far.

To elaborate:

During the first, second and third week, I keep my assistance work in check by not training to true failure.

During the fourth and fifth week, as I said earlier, I do not do max reps for the main lifts, but I up the intensity for assistance lifts slightly, but still they are kept in check to conserve energy for the last week.

For the sixth week, I go for broke for both main and assistance lifts. This week, I just go all out since I have an entire week of total slacking coming after. I can hit 3-4 different PRs for each session this week.

As for the training parameters for my assistance lifts, they are very fluid. Can be 5x5 for one session, can be 3 x 10 the next.

Just sharing.[/quote]

Thats quite interesting, if not a little in-depth for 5/3/1’s simplicity. Iv found deloading every 4th week to be great - I never actually feel that beat up or tired, but the week after I deload I ALWAYS hit rep PR’s (and big ones at that). Interesting how different things work for different people.