Wendler 5/3/1 Program - pt 2.

Just found a review of Jim seminar last weekend in chicago,
this review was made by miked on stronglifts.com …so credit to him!

I tought some 5/3/1 junkie and peoples that like Jim work would like to read!!


Made it to the Wendler Seminar in Chicago, and he went over a few things that may be of interest:

For people who want to be strong, with an emphasis on getting bigger -

My notes basically say “5/3/1 + 5x10 + 30 min walking/3 days + increase caloric liquids”

5/3/1 routine for the strength, the 5x10 of whatever big lift you’re doing that day, 30 mins of walking to keep some of the fat off and ensure you’re not completely de-conditioned, and liquid calories are just easier to ingest.


Conditioning:

Hard condition occurs on lower body day (sprints, hills, prowler…)
Light condition on Upper days as not to effect the lower body days
Basic limiting of cals/carbs, nothing crazy here

Sample for someone wanting to get into fantastic athletic shape, while trying to build/maintain strength:

30-40 mins easy conditioning in the morning
5/3/1 lifting at some point during the day, 3-4 days a week
Followed by hard conditioning, 4 days a week
Very strenuous


He went over the importance of having easy conditioning, or (gasp!) steady state cardio, giving the example of an elite college football athlete who had an unusually high resting heart rate. They had him on a treadmill walking for extended periods of time and his heart rate plummeted.
1)Easy conditioning helps people adapt
2)Positively impacts strength by not overtaxing your recovery
3)Work capacity increases because of it


People who want to be conditioned while gaining strength:

Get to a satisfactory level of conditioning (maybe 2 hard conditioning workouts a week), and simply maintain that amount, while building strength around it.
Amount of hills/trips on prowler should not increase but be maintained at a level that keeps you conditioned while allowing you to make strength gains. Some experimentation is necessary of course.


Box Squat vs. Free Squat

-Believes Box Squat is great to teach squat, and is good for people with bad knees
-The carryover or usefulness, however, only really applies to multi-ply lifters
-He concluded by saying that if you’re not a multi-ply lifter and can safely free squat, then pick the free squat 100% of the time

Later, I asked him why so much emphasis on box squatting is prevalent in sports training.
He said because it’s easy to teach, and they need some type of squatting movement. Instead of working out free squat kinks, they might as well save time, and get strong on box squats. Also, they can recover fast usually.


Quick technique points:

Recommends trying the false grip for OH press (not bench). He says that helped him immensely with shoulder/bar tracking problems

Clean: Demonstrated the “ugliest clean ever”, which involves simply getting the bar from the floor to the shoulders any way possible. Not triple extension or hip whip. Just grab it, jump, pull it onto the shoulders.
Made the point that technique is only really significantly important for people training to lift a lot of goddamned weight or an oly-lifter

Squat: Basically what Mehdi/Rippetoe recommends. Except he says that one should drive the elbows under the bar and push up into it. Basically gets the same job as elbows up: it keeps the chest up, but then again, it works for him, so…

nice review. id still like to see Wendler doing his drunken monkey reverse curl cleans…in a flannel shirt of course. damn i should have gone to Chicago.

[quote]twistacannon15 wrote:
Wasn’t really sure where to put this but since I am doing this program I’ll ask here…

When doing high rep deadlifts or squats does anybody notice a weird odor come from their body when they get up to 10 reps? I only ask this because recently on my squat and deadlift days when I get up to around 8 or 9 reps I get a whiff of this odor that I think is coming from my sweat. This has happened to me for the last couple months so I was just curious if anybody else had any experiences with this. Thanks.[/quote]

Jim covers this in the book.

[quote]The Austrian Oak wrote:
twistacannon15 wrote:
Wasn’t really sure where to put this but since I am doing this program I’ll ask here…

When doing high rep deadlifts or squats does anybody notice a weird odor come from their body when they get up to 10 reps? I only ask this because recently on my squat and deadlift days when I get up to around 8 or 9 reps I get a whiff of this odor that I think is coming from my sweat. This has happened to me for the last couple months so I was just curious if anybody else had any experiences with this. Thanks.

That’s the best part of the 5/3/1 program. Once you hit 10 reps on the main lifts, you automatically shit your pants.

Name me one other program out there that can offer that.[/quote]

This post made me shit my pants from laughing so hard. Fuck, this is funny.

Jim,

was it that post that made you shit your pants, or were you doing higher rep squats/deads (~10) while reading it, and therefore perhaps experiencing the same thing as twistcannon15?

we need to get to the bottom of this, and help him figure this stench out.

in my experience, the body shouldnt produce a stench on squats/deads unless approaching 1300lbs or so.

[quote]dez6485 wrote:
no man, youre going to have to give the specific weight, not some %. if you give the actual weight, we might be able to figure out exactly whats going on here…

maybe its a 275 stench, a 315 stank, a 365 reek, 405 odor, etc. we need specifics to know what we’re dealing with here, because all of these are very different things. [/quote]

for example yesterday I deadlifted 270x10. This was a PR for me. By the 8th rep I started smelling this particular odor. I know this is not a tremendous amount of weight and remember I am not complaining about this smell or saying its affecting my lifting just simply curious why its occurring.

dude, thats a 270x10 nibbler, its pretty common. just kind of nibbles on your nose like a cute little mouse, right?

[quote]dez6485 wrote:
nice review. id still like to see Wendler doing his drunken monkey reverse curl cleans…in a flannel shirt of course. damn i should have gone to Chicago.[/quote]

Yeah, he was definitely wearing a flannel shirt.

yea i saw a few pics from Chicago

[quote]twistacannon15 wrote:
dez6485 wrote:
haha. wow. thats one of the weirdest comments/questions ive ever seen on this site. fucking awesome.

are you serious?

what weight are you using when you get a whiff of this odor? there must be a correlation.

yea man i am dead serious lol. It happens when I’m going for a rep PR in either the squat or deadlift when at about 90-95% of my training max. I started to notice it a few months back with squats but I went for a rep PR in deadlift today and on the second to last rep I got a whiff of it. It truly is the strangest thing.
[/quote]

Hey twist, does the smell seem similar to ammonia? If so I get that often when I train hard.

[quote]twistacannon15 wrote:
dez6485 wrote:
no man, youre going to have to give the specific weight, not some %. if you give the actual weight, we might be able to figure out exactly whats going on here…

maybe its a 275 stench, a 315 stank, a 365 reek, 405 odor, etc. we need specifics to know what we’re dealing with here, because all of these are very different things.

for example yesterday I deadlifted 270x10. This was a PR for me. By the 8th rep I started smelling this particular odor. I know this is not a tremendous amount of weight and remember I am not complaining about this smell or saying its affecting my lifting just simply curious why its occurring.
[/quote]

I think you need to stop now. Delete your account and start over.

In all seriousness, I don’t think the number of reps or weight has anything to do with the smell. I think it’s related to the amount of effort you’re putting forth.

Just wanted to say thanks to Jim for 5-3-1. I turned 40 this year and decided to start lifting with no previous PL experience. I started 5-3-1 in the middle of June with a raw PL total of 965 after lifting for about 6 months with no real program. We tested maxes this week and I totaled 1105. Looking forward to see where I am at a year from now.

Thanks Jim.

Jack

I just started my first cycle of 5/3/1 and I have found that, for myself, it seems like the 2 sets before my max set seem to be not enough to sufficiently warm up.

For example,

Bench Press

65% 115lbs x 5
75% 130lbs x 5
85% 150lbs x 4-5

Is it possible to do more warm up sets in between these ‘working sets’? This seems to only be a problem for my bench press though as for my other lifts, it’s perfectly fine.

However, what I did last week for my squat was something like this I ramped up to my 85% squat weight.

E.g. bar x 5
100lbs x 5
135lbs x 5
150lbs x 3
180lbs x 1
200lbs x 1
215lbs x 13

This seems to work a lot better for me than just doing 3 working sets… but then again, if I do that I’m not doing 5/3/1…

I was wondering, if I could ramp up to the final set instead of doing the ‘warm up working sets’ and aim for a rep PR as it seems to work much better for me in ensuring that I am ready for my final set.

Hopefully Jim can give me some feedback. Thanks!

^There are three warm-up sets and three working sets in 5/3/1.

Aww c’mon… Now if you don’t do exactly 3 warm-up sets, you are not doing 5/3/1?

In the eBook, JW says “Warming up prior to training is important. I usually recommend …”. He goes on to say that you shouldn’t need to many warm-up sets but just enough to prepare yourself.

I agree that Airness shouldn’t monkey around with the work sets though.

[quote]Airness wrote:
I just started my first cycle of 5/3/1 and I have found that, for myself, it seems like the 2 sets before my max set seem to be not enough to sufficiently warm up.[/quote]

The two sets prior to the max set are working sets, rather than a warm up. You want the two sets prior to your max to be (on the first week) sets of 5 and you want to warm up for them. Jim recommends a general warmup and mobility stuff before lifting, and warming up with the lift with 40%, 50% and 60% (except during deload: http://asp.elitefts.com/qa/default.asp?qid=93789&tid= ). Obviously, if you need more than this then do it, but I would not change the 3 working sets if you think it is a warming up issue.

[quote]jsdool wrote:
Aww c’mon… Now if you don’t do exactly 3 warm-up sets, you are not doing 5/3/1?[/quote]

Just telling the guy what he needed to hear tersely. Sort of like when you petulantly told that one guy to fuck off a few pages back. No dictates here.

[quote]jsdool wrote:
Aww c’mon… Now if you don’t do exactly 3 warm-up sets, you are not doing 5/3/1?

In the eBook, JW says “Warming up prior to training is important. I usually recommend …”. He goes on to say that you shouldn’t need to many warm-up sets but just enough to prepare yourself.

I agree that Airness shouldn’t monkey around with the work sets though.[/quote]

in your opinion, are 3 warm up sets REALLY too much? they certainly arent heavy enough that they should be taxing, and take away from your work sets. so why the apparent aversion to them?

no one said if you didnt do exactly 3 warm ups you werent doing 5/3/1. the question that was asked showed that the guy seemed to just be jumping to the work sets, and the answer he received on the 40, 50, 60% warm up sets was the exact answer he shouldve gotten.

[quote]dez6485 wrote:
yea i saw a few pics from Chicago[/quote]

Where?