[quote]budreiser wrote:
has anyone used bands on good mornings?[/quote]
Yes, they take a “shitty, hard as fuck” movement and make it shittier!
[quote]Vladamir wrote:
Usually my close grip floor press and my close grip bench press would improve at the same rate. But after I added in that pre exhaust 1 set of 30+ reps of DB Bench my CGBP is improving at a better rate then CGFP. I do the pre exhaust once a week on DE upperbody day. Since I am in the accumulation phase should I add it in the max effort day? [/quote]
Id keep ME days just the way they are. You should be looking for PRs on those days, I wouldnt want my warm up or pre-exhaust messing up the chances of me hitting one
[quote]cscsDPT17 wrote:
[quote]marlboroman wrote:
I saw this on another thread . has anybody tried this ?
Thats what I have and use instead of a SS bar. It works exactly as a SS bar works (from what I’ve read. I haven’t used a SS bar so take this FWIW)and its a decent amount of weight less than my reg back squat. Since I haven’t used a SS bar I can’t say how much different it is but I originally bought it before I even knew about PL or Westside because I played college baseball and needed some shoulder rest while being able to squat heavy. It has helped me out so I would recommend it if you can’t afford a SS bar. the handles stick out pretty far so you can even have a variation with holding the handles close like a SS bar or holding them further out at the ends which would put the center of mass slightly more forward. Also you can set it up high with the handles down so its real high bar or hold the handles up and put it a little bit lower. This is probably more info than you need but its what I use for variations because I already have it and have no money for other bars. I did dead top squats from a low rack position the other day and my mid back was screamin so it hits the right spots.[/quote]
thanks a heap . this toy may be next years purchase .
[quote]michael_xyz wrote:
Thoughts on pausing quite a lot of the benching for ME?
I do it at times but I think that maybe it might be rather useful for a period of time to just pause a lot of them and see how it goes. Anyone tried this?[/quote]
I hate pausing for anything above 1 rep . I know for a fact that I count faster as the bar gets heavier…haha .
Check 1:55. Using straps as a makeshift SSB. Fucking genius. I’m retarded for not thinking of it, when I do front squats like that all the time.
I dont know …if one of those straps slips out …you’re fucked . but maybe those are better straps than what I got . I front squat like that too; works well for frt squats cuz the straps are more for balance . yeah , maybe I’ll play with that a bit .
I bought Louis’s Book of Methods and it’s a little hard to follow in certain spots, but for me most particularly with how to layout “special” exercises. For instance, Louis says they keep it to 3 to 4 exercises but then for Bench Press training to do, two Tricep exercises (BB & DB), Lats (1 - 2 exercises), Side Delts, Rear Delts, and earlier in the book he said to do front raises, so Front Delts too, Upper Back, and Bicep Hammer Curls. Maybe it’s a lack of creativity on my part but that’s more than four exercises. Given all that, I tried to stick with a minimal amount of accessory work on my first DE Bench Day:
A. DE Bench Press
B. Straight Bar Extensions for 7 x 6 (Louis said 40 reps @ 3-6 per)
C. Chin-Ups 4 sets, max reps each set. Sure he said most at WS don’t really do them but I love chin-ups but will either rotate rows and or do an extra workout with some kind of rowing movement
D. Face Pulls: Worked up to a 10RM
E. Hammer Curls: Worked up to an 8RM
Critiques on my DE Bench Day? What about my ME day work? It seems like it would basically be the same as my DE day accessory work. Based on what I feel some of weak points to be I’d probably do an extra workout a day or two after my ME Bench day to work with my front and lateral deltoids and maybe some Chest Supported or Kroc Rows.
The leg works seems to be a little more straight-forward for me.
[quote]Jaynick77 wrote:
I bought Louis’s Book of Methods and it’s a little hard to follow in certain spots, but for me most particularly with how to layout “special” exercises. For instance, Louis says they keep it to 3 to 4 exercises but then for Bench Press training to do, two Tricep exercises (BB & DB), Lats (1 - 2 exercises), Side Delts, Rear Delts, and earlier in the book he said to do front raises, so Front Delts too, Upper Back, and Bicep Hammer Curls. Maybe it’s a lack of creativity on my part but that’s more than four exercises. Given all that, I tried to stick with a minimal amount of accessory work on my first DE Bench Day:
A. DE Bench Press
B. Straight Bar Extensions for 7 x 6 (Louis said 40 reps @ 3-6 per)
C. Chin-Ups 4 sets, max reps each set. Sure he said most at WS don’t really do them but I love chin-ups but will either rotate rows and or do an extra workout with some kind of rowing movement
D. Face Pulls: Worked up to a 10RM
E. Hammer Curls: Worked up to an 8RM
Critiques on my DE Bench Day? What about my ME day work? It seems like it would basically be the same as my DE day accessory work. Based on what I feel some of weak points to be I’d probably do an extra workout a day or two after my ME Bench day to work with my front and lateral deltoids and maybe some Chest Supported or Kroc Rows.
The leg works seems to be a little more straight-forward for me.
[/quote]
*Louie.
I don’t have much a plan for my RE, I just go in and do something for my weakness, then hit some small muscles. Gotta find your own RE movements that transfer to your lifting, and find rep ranges that work for you.
On ME lower, I hit my big weakness, then one other thing, and abs. ME upper, I hit my chinups, my big weakness, my upperback, then biceps because I want to be sexy.
DE lower I do some strongman events, low volume/intensity, then grip work. DE upper is my C&J day, so I’ll do my log press variation, then rows and upper back.
[quote]louiek wrote:
Check 1:55. Using straps as a makeshift SSB. Fucking genius. I’m retarded for not thinking of it, when I do front squats like that all the time.
- YouTube [/quote]
The thing is, the entire point of the safety squat bar is to change how the bar sits on your back, thus changing the movement entirely so it targets muscles differently than a normal squat. The fact that your shoulders are in a more comfortable position is just a bonus. What he did there was great for his shoulders, but it changed nothing as far as the actual movement.
[quote]black_angus1 wrote:
[quote]louiek wrote:
Check 1:55. Using straps as a makeshift SSB. Fucking genius. I’m retarded for not thinking of it, when I do front squats like that all the time.
- YouTube [/quote]
The thing is, the entire point of the safety squat bar is to change how the bar sits on your back, thus changing the movement entirely so it targets muscles differently than a normal squat. The fact that your shoulders are in a more comfortable position is just a bonus. What he did there was great for his shoulders, but it changed nothing as far as the actual movement.
[/quote]
I think that’s the point of a cambered bar squat. Not a SSB squat.
I’ve heard that squat suits with the straps down is “supposed” to be used for DE squatting. Does anyone here use a squat suit? If so, what kind, how often, etc?
I know briefs are sometimes recommended. Squat suits as a raw lifter for DE seems a bit overboard.
[quote]louiek wrote:
I’ve heard that squat suits with the straps down is “supposed” to be used for DE squatting. Does anyone here use a squat suit? If so, what kind, how often, etc?[/quote]
[quote]michael_xyz wrote:
I know briefs are sometimes recommended. Squat suits as a raw lifter for DE seems a bit overboard.[/quote]
Squat suits (with the straps down) and briefs give similar support. You actually will probably get less support out of a suit with the straps down than a nice pair of briefs.
I know Louie said to do this once, although I don’t remember any of the context in which he said it or why he said it. My guess is to get more practice in the suit and get used to the heavier weights? It could also be to protect the hips if squatting with a wide stance frequently.
FWIW, even though I compete multi ply, I do most of my DE work raw. Then again I can’t squat 1000 pounds so maybe I’m missing out.
I have heard about saving your hips if you do box squats wide.
Clint Darden in a recent video said the same thing; to get some really old/worn out briefs and use them to DE squat. There may be something to it but not sure why you would squat so wide if you were a raw lifter in the first place.
[quote]michael_xyz wrote:
I have heard about saving your hips if you do box squats wide.
Clint Darden in a recent video said the same thing; to get some really old/worn out briefs and use them to DE squat. There may be something to it but not sure why you would squat so wide if you were a raw lifter in the first place.[/quote]
You ever heard the saying “Figure out what works first, figure out why it works later”?
I don’t mean to be a jerk, but do you even lift? There are over 50 pages of information in these threads explaining the West Side principles, and also people detailing their progress using them. Correct me if I’m wrong here – but you’ve never used bands or chains, gear, box squats or even competed? Why do you feel it’s appropriate for you to comment about them?
[quote]frankjl wrote:
[quote]michael_xyz wrote:
I have heard about saving your hips if you do box squats wide.
Clint Darden in a recent video said the same thing; to get some really old/worn out briefs and use them to DE squat. There may be something to it but not sure why you would squat so wide if you were a raw lifter in the first place.[/quote]
You ever heard the saying “Figure out what works first, figure out why it works later”?
I don’t mean to be a jerk, but do you even lift? There are over 50 pages of information in these threads explaining the West Side principles, and also people detailing their progress using them. Correct me if I’m wrong here – but you’ve never used bands or chains, gear, box squats or even competed? Why do you feel it’s appropriate for you to comment about them?[/quote]
Im going to back Michael up just a bit and say that I dont think he’s questioning what they are doing, simply asking why they are doing it, which is what its for.
Now Im going to back up Frankjl…Michael, Ive said this before but I cant remember if it was in the first or second part, so Im going to post it again. Before you ask any questions concerning these principals, the best thing you can do is read part one of this thread at least, 15 times. I have almost every article Mr. Simmons has ever wrote printed out in a binder in my office.
There is more information in the thread, IMO, than in all of those articles put together. STB has it layed out perfectly for a dumbass like me to understand. Many of these questions you ask, although good questions, have already been gone over at least once, including your breif questions. Like Frankjl, my apologies for sounding rude, but re-reading all of these post until your eyes go crossed is one of the best things you can do for your lifting if you believe in the principals of this system. Again, my apologies if i sound rude, the best of luck to all of you
[quote]Chicksan wrote:
Im going to back Michael up just a bit and say that I dont think he’s questioning what they are doing, simply asking why they are doing it, which is what its for.
[/quote]
I gave the kid the benefit of the doubt on many occasions, this last episode was more than I could tolerate. Asking a question, and sharing your opinion like you have experience in the matter are two different things. I was specifically talking about this:
[quote]michael_xyz wrote:
I know briefs are sometimes recommended. Squat suits as a raw lifter for DE seems a bit overboard.[/quote]
This is not the first time I’ve noticed this either. I feel bad for taking a giant shit on this thread which is otherwise full of great questions, answers and information. Cheers to those of us who continue to actually get stronger.
[quote]frankjl wrote:
[quote]louiek wrote:
I’ve heard that squat suits with the straps down is “supposed” to be used for DE squatting. Does anyone here use a squat suit? If so, what kind, how often, etc?[/quote]
[quote]michael_xyz wrote:
I know briefs are sometimes recommended. Squat suits as a raw lifter for DE seems a bit overboard.[/quote]
Squat suits (with the straps down) and briefs give similar support. You actually will probably get less support out of a suit with the straps down than a nice pair of briefs.
I know Louie said to do this once, although I don’t remember any of the context in which he said it or why he said it. My guess is to get more practice in the suit and get used to the heavier weights? It could also be to protect the hips if squatting with a wide stance frequently.
FWIW, even though I compete multi ply, I do most of my DE work raw. Then again I can’t squat 1000 pounds so maybe I’m missing out.[/quote]
Would you suggest DE squatting in briefs if I squat wide and often? I try to squat the westside way for DE, which is wide as shit, and just a traditional wide stance for ME work. And I have noticed my right hip has been getting more and more aggravated if I don’t stretch and do mobility for it.
Regarding raw lifters using the conjugate system, Louie says here: Louie Simmons Frequently Asked Questions about 1/4 of the way down the page, “We train Raw all year round. The only exception would be loose suit bottoms on speed squat day. I would not change anything.”
As long as DE in briefs would have equal carryover to raw lifting (as I’m a Strongman), just as much as DE without briefs, I’ll probably go buy some and give it a shot. Or a suit, perhaps, but that’s probably out of my price range.
[quote]louiek wrote:
Would you suggest DE squatting in briefs if I squat wide and often? I try to squat the westside way for DE, which is wide as shit, and just a traditional wide stance for ME work. And I have noticed my right hip has been getting more and more aggravated if I don’t stretch and do mobility for it.[/quote]
I’d say its a good idea to cycle loose briefs in as a raw lifter if your hips are getting beat it. Sometimes just tight enough to compress the area is enough to save your hips.
[quote]louiek wrote:
Regarding raw lifters using the conjugate system, Louie says here: Louie Simmons Frequently Asked Questions about 1/4 of the way down the page, “We train Raw all year round. The only exception would be loose suit bottoms on speed squat day. I would not change anything.”
As long as DE in briefs would have equal carryover to raw lifting (as I’m a Strongman), just as much as DE without briefs, I’ll probably go buy some and give it a shot. Or a suit, perhaps, but that’s probably out of my price range.[/quote]
I don’t know when that was written, but keep in mind the gear has changed quite a bit since then. Guys used to never wear their shirts or suits until the meet, and get pounds out of them. I can’t speak for what they do at West Side, but having watched their YouTube channel and talked with others who have trained there, I know that they do at least some of their DE Squat work in briefs.
In terms of the carry over to strongman, I have no clue.
[quote]louiek wrote:
I think that’s the point of a cambered bar squat. Not a SSB squat.[/quote]
I’ve never seen a safety bar that doesn’t have a camber.
Wasn’t especially trying to come off as some sort of pseudo expert. I feel that some debate would be better than just someone saying “yes, it works” and that’s that.
Even if Louie Simmons decide to post here and say it. I’m all for giving people credit for their knowledge but you also shouldn’t be blindly following things. Maybe the way I wrote it wasn’t how I would have wanted to express myself. Regardless, I’d argue it is better for some differences in opinion and a discussion than a very simple “yes” or “no” response - unless it’s a very basic/obvious question.
I like the principles and everything but equally I think a lot of the times the answer isn’t simply black and white. These two threads are great but I do feel at times people take the easy route in responses without really analysing the question.