[quote]Pj92x wrote:
A guy here called Liam openly sells gear, he is a trainer and was natural up until around two years ago. He told us he was taking gear and he said it was what we all know, a miracle drug that will add mass on you no matter what.[/quote]
I would say this is false considering the large number of people on steroids who are NOT that built.
We will have to disagree here. [/quote]
In one of the AAS studies didn’t they find people given steroids who didn’t work out gained 6-12 pounds of muscle? I am looking for it now and will post it up. I am pretty sure it was 6-12 pounds of LBM while living a regular, working, couch potato life. The people who worked out but were given a sugar pill or whatever it was gained something like 2-5 pounds and the people given AAS and worked out gained a lot more.
Will anyone who knows the study I am talking about post it? I think it may of been done in Japan.[/quote]
I guess that’s possible although but I would think those people already had a deficiency or disorder of some type. I have known plenty guys who used AAS and didn’t work out and it didn’t to jack shit for them. HGH maybe??
[quote]Pj92x wrote:
A guy here called Liam openly sells gear, he is a trainer and was natural up until around two years ago. He told us he was taking gear and he said it was what we all know, a miracle drug that will add mass on you no matter what.[/quote]
I would say this is false considering the large number of people on steroids who are NOT that built.
We will have to disagree here. [/quote]
In one of the AAS studies didn’t they find people given steroids who didn’t work out gained 6-12 pounds of muscle? I am looking for it now and will post it up. I am pretty sure it was 6-12 pounds of LBM while living a regular, working, couch potato life. The people who worked out but were given a sugar pill or whatever it was gained something like 2-5 pounds and the people given AAS and worked out gained a lot more.
Will anyone who knows the study I am talking about post it? I think it may of been done in Japan.[/quote]
Again, opinions are like… Well you get it. You opinion isn’t any more valid than anyone else’s and vice versa.[/quote]
This isn’t about having an opinion. It is about the need to use that opinion to degrade someone openly on a constant basis.
There is a HUGE difference between the two.
[quote]Progress in the gym isn’t the most important thing in life. In fact it’s far from it.
[/quote]
Who has said otherwise?
[/quote]
I was just pointing out that some purple find them to be rambling, incoherent whatever whatever’s and some find the opposite. That’s fine.
You’re the one constantly bringing up progress and insinuating that others don’t have the right or place to question Kali/CT because they don’t have as much “progress” which frankly doesn’t matter one bit.
I have no interest in arguing with you. This site had been pretty much argument free since you left and has had a big shift in attitude towards the positive and constructive… so I hope it can stay that way now that you’re back. I hope you’ve figured out personal issues that lead up your hiatus and that your accident injuries are cleared up. Good luck with your goals big man, welcome back.
You’re the one constantly bringing up progress and insinuating that others don’t have the right or place to question Kali/CT because they don’t have as much “progress” which frankly doesn’t matter one bit. [/quote]
I didn’t write anything about not having the right.
I wrote specifically about how people who have achieved less feel the need to DEGRADE someone who has achieved more.
[quote]Pj92x wrote:
A guy here called Liam openly sells gear, he is a trainer and was natural up until around two years ago. He told us he was taking gear and he said it was what we all know, a miracle drug that will add mass on you no matter what.[/quote]
I would say this is false considering the large number of people on steroids who are NOT that built.
We will have to disagree here. [/quote]
In one of the AAS studies didn’t they find people given steroids who didn’t work out gained 6-12 pounds of muscle? I am looking for it now and will post it up. I am pretty sure it was 6-12 pounds of LBM while living a regular, working, couch potato life. The people who worked out but were given a sugar pill or whatever it was gained something like 2-5 pounds and the people given AAS and worked out gained a lot more.
Will anyone who knows the study I am talking about post it? I think it may of been done in Japan.[/quote]
Is this the one you’re referring to?
http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJM199607043350101[/quote]
All the no exercise people got stronger in the bench press and squat by not working out at all? Come on. They might have been in the “no exercise” group but do you really think these guys signed up for a study where they get free steroids and they are just going to sit on the couch for 2 and a half months?
Also, 600mg’s a week right out of the gate is a lot of test.
[quote]Pj92x wrote:
A guy here called Liam openly sells gear, he is a trainer and was natural up until around two years ago. He told us he was taking gear and he said it was what we all know, a miracle drug that will add mass on you no matter what.[/quote]
I would say this is false considering the large number of people on steroids who are NOT that built.
We will have to disagree here. [/quote]
In one of the AAS studies didn’t they find people given steroids who didn’t work out gained 6-12 pounds of muscle? I am looking for it now and will post it up. I am pretty sure it was 6-12 pounds of LBM while living a regular, working, couch potato life. The people who worked out but were given a sugar pill or whatever it was gained something like 2-5 pounds and the people given AAS and worked out gained a lot more.
Will anyone who knows the study I am talking about post it? I think it may of been done in Japan.[/quote]
Is this the one you’re referring to?
http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJM199607043350101[/quote]
All the no exercise people got stronger in the bench press and squat by not working out at all? Come on. They might have been in the “no exercise” group but do you really think these guys signed up for a study where they get free steroids and they are just going to sit on the couch for 2 and a half months?
Also, 600mg’s a week right out of the gate is a lot of test.[/quote]
Not really. I once took 140,000 mg’s of test. I got so swole that I couldn’t move. They had to cut a hole in my wall and cart me out on a fork lift. They took me to the hospital where I was treated with a continous soy IV drip and fifteen hours a day of watching romantic comedies.
[quote]Pj92x wrote:
A guy here called Liam openly sells gear, he is a trainer and was natural up until around two years ago. He told us he was taking gear and he said it was what we all know, a miracle drug that will add mass on you no matter what.[/quote]
I would say this is false considering the large number of people on steroids who are NOT that built.
We will have to disagree here. [/quote]
In one of the AAS studies didn’t they find people given steroids who didn’t work out gained 6-12 pounds of muscle? I am looking for it now and will post it up. I am pretty sure it was 6-12 pounds of LBM while living a regular, working, couch potato life. The people who worked out but were given a sugar pill or whatever it was gained something like 2-5 pounds and the people given AAS and worked out gained a lot more.
Will anyone who knows the study I am talking about post it? I think it may of been done in Japan.[/quote]
I guess that’s possible although but I would think those people already had a deficiency or disorder of some type. I have known plenty guys who used AAS and didn’t work out and it didn’t to jack shit for them. HGH maybe??
[/quote]
Well, if the placebo group gained 2-5lbs of muscle then that means breathing air is cheating also.
[quote]Pj92x wrote:
A guy here called Liam openly sells gear, he is a trainer and was natural up until around two years ago. He told us he was taking gear and he said it was what we all know, a miracle drug that will add mass on you no matter what.[/quote]
I would say this is false considering the large number of people on steroids who are NOT that built.
We will have to disagree here. [/quote]
In one of the AAS studies didn’t they find people given steroids who didn’t work out gained 6-12 pounds of muscle? I am looking for it now and will post it up. I am pretty sure it was 6-12 pounds of LBM while living a regular, working, couch potato life. The people who worked out but were given a sugar pill or whatever it was gained something like 2-5 pounds and the people given AAS and worked out gained a lot more.
Will anyone who knows the study I am talking about post it? I think it may of been done in Japan.[/quote]
Is this the one you’re referring to?
http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJM199607043350101[/quote]
All the no exercise people got stronger in the bench press and squat by not working out at all? Come on. They might have been in the “no exercise” group but do you really think these guys signed up for a study where they get free steroids and they are just going to sit on the couch for 2 and a half months?
Also, 600mg’s a week right out of the gate is a lot of test.[/quote]
Not really. I once took 140,000 mg’s of test. I got so swole that I couldn’t move. They had to cut a hole in my wall and cart me out on a fork lift. They took me to the hospital where I was treated with a continous soy IV drip and fifteen hours a day of watching romantic comedies. [/quote]
Damn, they put you on EAP?
That is pretty crazy. I haven’t seen the Extreme Atrophy Protocol implemented in years. Most medical facilities aren’t equipped for such an aggressive treatment… You were lucky.
[quote]Pj92x wrote:
A guy here called Liam openly sells gear, he is a trainer and was natural up until around two years ago. He told us he was taking gear and he said it was what we all know, a miracle drug that will add mass on you no matter what.[/quote]
I would say this is false considering the large number of people on steroids who are NOT that built.
We will have to disagree here. [/quote]
In one of the AAS studies didn’t they find people given steroids who didn’t work out gained 6-12 pounds of muscle? I am looking for it now and will post it up. I am pretty sure it was 6-12 pounds of LBM while living a regular, working, couch potato life. The people who worked out but were given a sugar pill or whatever it was gained something like 2-5 pounds and the people given AAS and worked out gained a lot more.
Will anyone who knows the study I am talking about post it? I think it may of been done in Japan.[/quote]
No, I do not believe that is the one, all though it is a very similar type of study. My point is people who moan about people bringing up steroids are being incredibly disingenuous about how much of their muscle is a result of injecting shit into themselves, of course, the hormones they are taking is just a small part of why they have 20+ inch arms.
Anyone who says otherwise is clearly just a hater trying to put CT and Kali down.
Bostin L is the coolest bodybuilder in the world. He is a nice guy, who is open about his usage and tells you exactly what he is on. Plus he is kinda cute.
In one year on juice you can go from this - to this. How much harder did he work before he was on steroids compared to after? Sigh.
[quote]Pj92x wrote:
In one year on juice you can go from this - to this. How much harder did he work before he was on steroids compared to after? Sigh.[/quote]
How does that explain all of those athletes on steroids who look nothing like that, some of whom look less developed than many serious natural trainers?
That same guy you posted would have also still made progress in one year training naturally so, no, all of those gains can not be attributed to steroids.
He made more gains than he likely would have, that’s all. He was already bigger in his before picture than most of the guys I see crying about other people’s steroid use.
[quote]Pj92x wrote:
A guy here called Liam openly sells gear, he is a trainer and was natural up until around two years ago. He told us he was taking gear and he said it was what we all know, a miracle drug that will add mass on you no matter what.[/quote]
I would say this is false considering the large number of people on steroids who are NOT that built.
We will have to disagree here. [/quote]
In one of the AAS studies didn’t they find people given steroids who didn’t work out gained 6-12 pounds of muscle? I am looking for it now and will post it up. I am pretty sure it was 6-12 pounds of LBM while living a regular, working, couch potato life. The people who worked out but were given a sugar pill or whatever it was gained something like 2-5 pounds and the people given AAS and worked out gained a lot more.
Will anyone who knows the study I am talking about post it? I think it may of been done in Japan.[/quote]
No, I do not believe that is the one, all though it is a very similar type of study. My point is people who moan about people bringing up steroids are being incredibly disingenuous about how much of their muscle is a result of injecting shit into themselves, of course, the hormones they are taking is just a small part of why they have 20+ inch arms.
Anyone who says otherwise is clearly just a hater trying to put CT and Kali down.
Bostin L is the coolest bodybuilder in the world. He is a nice guy, who is open about his usage and tells you exactly what he is on. Plus he is kinda cute.
In one year on juice you can go from this - to this. How much harder did he work before he was on steroids compared to after? Sigh.[/quote]
You know that everyone responds differently to steroids right?
You also know that Loyd was was/is on TONS of stuff.
[quote]Pj92x wrote:
A guy here called Liam openly sells gear, he is a trainer and was natural up until around two years ago. He told us he was taking gear and he said it was what we all know, a miracle drug that will add mass on you no matter what.[/quote]
I would say this is false considering the large number of people on steroids who are NOT that built.
We will have to disagree here. [/quote]
In one of the AAS studies didn’t they find people given steroids who didn’t work out gained 6-12 pounds of muscle? I am looking for it now and will post it up. I am pretty sure it was 6-12 pounds of LBM while living a regular, working, couch potato life. The people who worked out but were given a sugar pill or whatever it was gained something like 2-5 pounds and the people given AAS and worked out gained a lot more.
Will anyone who knows the study I am talking about post it? I think it may of been done in Japan.[/quote]
No, I do not believe that is the one, all though it is a very similar type of study. My point is people who moan about people bringing up steroids are being incredibly disingenuous about how much of their muscle is a result of injecting shit into themselves, of course, the hormones they are taking is just a small part of why they have 20+ inch arms.
Anyone who says otherwise is clearly just a hater trying to put CT and Kali down.
Bostin L is the coolest bodybuilder in the world. He is a nice guy, who is open about his usage and tells you exactly what he is on. Plus he is kinda cute.
In one year on juice you can go from this - to this. How much harder did he work before he was on steroids compared to after? Sigh.[/quote]
You know that everyone responds differently to steroids right? In one year HE went from that to that… That doesn’t mean you or I would have the same results… Or even be able to handle the doses. He was using.
You also know that Loyd was was/is on TONS of stuff. [/quote]
I don’t buy that at all. As I said guys who left high school with me and were 120lb nerds shitty genetics got incredibly swole from taking gear. I have average genetics and they had much worse than mine. Genetics mean the difference from getting big and getting on stage at the olympia, but you can juice your shitty 120 pound body into a 200lb lean ass kicking machine in a couple years. Easily.
The steroid culture in the gym here is very open and I have seen lots of really small, small shouldered guys gets huge using the same shitty routines they used when they were natural. Steroids do the hard work. Steroids are a miracle drug and people who deny that either got sold some terrible gear or they don’t want to admit it.
I have seen it and for people to deny really is strange.
[quote]Pj92x wrote:
I don’t buy that at all. As I said guys who left high school with me and were 120lb nerds shitty genetics got incredibly swole from taking gear. I have average genetics and they had much worse than mine. Genetics mean the difference from getting big and getting on stage at the olympia, but you can juice your shitty 120 pound body into a 200lb lean ass kicking machine in a couple years. Easily.
The steroid culture in the gym here is very open and I have seen lots of really small, small shouldered guys gets huge using the same shitty routines they used when they were natural. Steroids do the hard work. Steroids are a miracle drug and people who deny that either got sold some terrible gear or they don’t want to admit it.
I have seen it and for people to deny really is strange.[/quote]
There is a lot wrong with your post but I don’t feel like arguing with you. Your young and know everything… I remember those days. You will mature down the road and see things a little clearer soon enough.
[quote]Pj92x wrote:
I have average genetics .[/quote]
If you don’t mind explaining…what does this mean exactly and how do you know?[/quote]
Well I have small bone structure, small hands, small wrists, small shoulders and elbows and knees. Yet I always had reasonable amounts of lean mass for a skinny person. I am not fast or explosive and I suffered head trauma on multiple occasions as a kid which resulted in lowish testosterone, I could probably get HRT but I have no interest in it.
Basically I have small structure and lowish testosterone yet I am visibly able to gain muscle quicker than a very skinny “ectomorph” (not using that as a real thing but to describe the body type that label puts in your mind)
All my male relatives have the same pointy elbows, we all have the same tiny wrists and narrow shoulders, we all seem to have most of our fat stored in our lower chest and thighs. I have relatives in the armed forces, some who work in IT and some who play conference level soccer, which would imply these characteristics on all of us despite vastly varying diets, activity level etc would indicate a genetic factor.
We are about average when it comes to lean mass and how we adapt to training compared to people who balloon up very easily due to their hormones and we are bigger and more athletic than the very skinny guys who can’t seem to ever gain weight.
[quote]Pj92x wrote:
I have average genetics .[/quote]
If you don’t mind explaining…what does this mean exactly and how do you know?[/quote]
Thanks prof, I was going to point this out as well.
He has all these nerd buddies who are now ripped 200+ pound dudes but they have “shitty genetics”?!? Huh?[/quote]
1 of them was on my football team in highschool and was a mate. Others are just buddies, from the gym, people I did boxing with who also go to the gym. And yeah there are like 5-6 guys who were regulars who were just skinny fat dudes who i would see all the time who went on to jump on the gear and get pretty damn big.
When you are taking stuff, shitty genetics will stop you from getting to be as big as ronnie and those insane specimens but like I say, I have seen guys get 200 pounds plus training like they always did, lots of isolation work, lots of volume. The only difference is what they were taking.
I for one think its great science has got us to a point where if you want to, you can take something like that and change your shitty body.
Hey Brick, I’ve been following that thread too, but don’t really have anything considerable to contribute other than to say you’ve done some good work man.
Your stuff over the last year or so has inspired me to seriously consider TRT and re-examine my attitude.
[/quote]
Thanks a lot!
Have you been diagnosed with low T?
Do you mean re-examine your attitude to this hobby? I remember you saying in a thread some time ago that you were burnt out with lifting because of the nature of your job. [/quote]
Well I haven’t been diagnosed or examined for it yet, but I seem to have a lot of the typical symptoms. A guy I used to lift with who is a lot more knowledgeable than me had at one point estimated that I was in the high range of normal (about 10 years ago), but typical to the aging process, a lot has changed.
As far as attitude toward this hobby- Yeah, that among other things. The work stuff seems palatable and definitely played a part, but only part. Honestly, I’ve worked harder at other points in life, had less time, and accomplished more in all areas. My attitude has been an all or none, beast out or get out kind of thing. That is a double edged sword I ended up cutting myself with.
In that same thread I posted an opinion about Stu that was unfounded and ignorant. After looking back on it a couple of times I started to pay a little more attention to what was being said. Turns out that he, you and a few other guys on here are goldmines of experience based info on time management/life stuff/lifting, and I had become essentially a jaded asshole who makes no progress.
So yeah, attitude. I need to change it a bit. Humble it down a little and get right sized.
It’s kind of funny to think that injecting steroids will cause your body to just magically get so much bigger. No extra food, no accommodation for gain- just take this and synthesize something out of nothing.
If I remember correctly there were some guys on the steroid forum who did this at the advise of a former guru here- And ended up with gyno, still didn’t know how to lift, and were a few hundred dollars lighter by the time it was all said and done.
No miracles there. Just dudes with tits and less cash.
