The Bodybuilding Bible

Training Bodybuilding
461

brick: Agree with all of that and surely this is basically a summary of why “training age/experience” dictates how specialised/different your programme could potentially be?

[quote]rasturai wrote:
If I were you…if your lifts are still going up using 3’s, then keep going at it. There will come a point where you will stall and you can switch it up later and with that new found strength you can use it to your advantage, up the reps a bit and gain some more muscle mass and switch between the two. Remember in the long term that strength will help your mass…show me a small guy who can squat 515x10, bench 500, deadlift 700.[/quote]

I agree in the sense of not thinking I’ll lose too much by sticking to 3’s in those exercises, but I like to think that as the “big money” exercises I could keep up similarly quick increases using the 6-8 rep range, especially if I am growing whilst using that rep range as apose to my CNS just becoming my effecient… etc.

So I think a good experiment well be to ditch 3reps and try 6 reps for 3-4 weeks or so and see if my numbers are still progressing, leave it if so… I kind of am being converted to believing that up to a certain “unspecified strength level” you can get there at a reasonably similar pace to if i was powerlifting. Basically, I still have so much strength potential that either approach should yield RELATIVELY fast strength gains still.

EDIT: Having read the CT Articles, printed them out and used them to draw up rough guidelines- it all fits except for the sets method. Whilst he doesn’t mention ramping so far in what I’ve read could it be said that if I were to ramp up with the same reps as my set then I would infact be doing 3-4 sets that could be considered working (as he reccomends in those articles), even if only the last two really push you to limits, hence the “all-out”. The distinction I’m struggling with is that when ramping: relatively all sets below the last 1-2 could be considered much easier and therefore either warm ups or ramp sets and not “working”. I’m probably overthinking this, but I do enjoy ramping up/prefer it to straight sets, just got a little confused on this last thing here.

Basically- is the bodybuilding bible method the same as that of Thibs writing in the “begginner articles” and “build a damn good programme” articles you reccomended or are you reccomending the same approach but using “low” overall volume (aka. pump down the volume article).

462

[quote]jake_j_m wrote:
brick: Agree with all of that and surely this is basically a summary of why “training age/experience” dictates how specialised/different your programme could potentially be?

[quote]rasturai wrote:
If I were you…if your lifts are still going up using 3’s, then keep going at it. There will come a point where you will stall and you can switch it up later and with that new found strength you can use it to your advantage, up the reps a bit and gain some more muscle mass and switch between the two. Remember in the long term that strength will help your mass…show me a small guy who can squat 515x10, bench 500, deadlift 700.[/quote]

I agree in the sense of not thinking I’ll lose too much by sticking to 3’s in those exercises, but I like to think that as the “big money” exercises I could keep up similarly quick increases using the 6-8 rep range, especially if I am growing whilst using that rep range as apose to my CNS just becoming my effecient… etc.

So I think a good experiment well be to ditch 3reps and try 6 reps for 3-4 weeks or so and see if my numbers are still progressing, leave it if so… I kind of am being converted to believing that up to a certain “unspecified strength level” you can get there at a reasonably similar pace to if i was powerlifting. Basically, I still have so much strength potential that either approach should yield RELATIVELY fast strength gains still.

EDIT: Having read the CT Articles, printed them out and used them to draw up rough guidelines- it all fits except for the sets method. Whilst he doesn’t mention ramping so far in what I’ve read could it be said that if I were to ramp up with the same reps as my set then I would infact be doing 3-4 sets that could be considered working (as he reccomends in those articles), even if only the last two really push you to limits, hence the “all-out”. The distinction I’m struggling with is that when ramping: relatively all sets below the last 1-2 could be considered much easier and therefore either warm ups or ramp sets and not “working”. I’m probably overthinking this, but I do enjoy ramping up/prefer it to straight sets, just got a little confused on this last thing here.

Basically- is the bodybuilding bible method the same as that of Thibs writing in the “begginner articles” and “build a damn good programme” articles you reccomended or are you reccomending the same approach but using “low” overall volume (aka. pump down the volume article).[/quote]

You don’t remember some of what you read in THIS thread being that you read all of it.

CT DOES discuss ramping up/the flat pyramid in his article titled Locked and Loaded, which I also recommended somewhere on this forum.

You read this thread and all the appropriate articles you need to design a program.

How about you stop writing and work out for a few weeks and then report back?

463

Don’t worry I wasn’t intending to write and not train… first “new” programme day today. Already started to write up programme for the rest of the week.

I was overthinking it, looking forward to getting to the gym and trying it.

464

Brick and others,

Can you give me some feedback on this approach for exercises after my first main exercise?

I’ve been doing a scheme where I raise the weight each set by 5-10 lbs. I do three sets, and I try to do 10, 8, and 8 reps. If I don’t reach my target reps on the third set, I try again until I can. Once I hit that target reps for the third set I contemplate bumping the weight on all three sets up by 5-10 lb increments for the next week but that doesn’t sit right with me.

I was thinking it would be better to raise the weight on the third set higher alone because raising the weight on the preceeding set would be fatigue me from performing optimally on my top set. At some point, when my top set is far off from my first two, then I’d bump those two up a bit.

Your feedback is really appreciated.

465

[quote]earthquake wrote:
Brick and others,

Can you give me some feedback on this approach for exercises after my first main exercise?

I’ve been doing a scheme where I raise the weight each set by 5-10 lbs. I do three sets, and I try to do 10, 8, and 8 reps. If I don’t reach my target reps on the third set, I try again until I can. Once I hit that target reps for the third set I contemplate bumping the weight on all three sets up by 5-10 lb increments for the next week but that doesn’t sit right with me.

I was thinking it would be better to raise the weight on the third set higher alone because raising the weight on the preceeding set would be fatigue me from performing optimally on my top set. At some point, when my top set is far off from my first two, then I’d bump those two up a bit.

Your feedback is really appreciated.

[/quote]

Dude, I’ve gone over my approach for warming up, flat pyramiding/ramping, and progression so many times and informed you some time ago that 10 pounds of progress is a bit much for most people, and if you could add 10 pounds to an exercise so frequently, some of us would be lifting Hummers by now.

466

I didn’t mean the progression was every week.

I was just unsure if I was adding the weight in the right set, or if it should be in all.

467

Can’t edit post because its not up but I know how to warm up and ramp according to this thread. Going back to find the progression thing to see if it answers my question.

468

Hey Brick, just wanted to add that I have been having great luck with your approach. Since alot of people are posting about wanting to ramp up in threes heres an example of a typical workout I would do. Not optimal for pure bodybuilding but its worked great for strength and size so far.

Bench Press Variation. ie Floor Press, Pin Presses, Incline Presses, Flat Bench - Ramp Up in 3’s Westside Style

Decline Bench or incline bench - Ramp up BB style Reps in between 10 and 12

Flat DB Press or incline db press or flys - Same

Side Raises, or upright rows - BB

Some type of tri ext - BB

469

[quote]Hazzyhazz24 wrote:
Hey Brick, just wanted to add that I have been having great luck with your approach. Since alot of people are posting about wanting to ramp up in threes heres an example of a typical workout I would do. Not optimal for pure bodybuilding but its worked great for strength and size so far.

Bench Press Variation. ie Floor Press, Pin Presses, Incline Presses, Flat Bench - Ramp Up in 3’s Westside Style

Decline Bench or incline bench - Ramp up BB style Reps in between 10 and 12

Flat DB Press or incline db press or flys - Same

Side Raises, or upright rows - BB

Some type of tri ext - BB [/quote]

I’ve been intrigued by that kind of approach, but I figure I can’t judge pure bodybuilding until i actually give it a fair shot so I’m making my first exercise 6-8 reps always.

470

So this is what I found, and I hope my question is more specific and that I communicated what I want to ask better.

[quote]Bricknyce wrote:
On Progression and Periodization
…

Week 1: 100 x 10
Week 2: 100 x 11
Week 3: 100 x 12
Week 4: 105 x 9
Week 5: 105 x 10
Week 6 (back-off week): 105 x 10 (no attempt to break last week’s record)
Week 7 (back-off week): 105 x 10 (no attempt to break last week’s record)
Week 8 (back to the grind): 105 x 11

[/quote]

[quote]Bricknyce wrote:
Sample quad workout:

…

Work sets:
255 x 8 - 10
285 x 8 - 10
315 x 8 - 10

[/quote]

Were each of these examples above only the top set? In the sample quad workout you have 3 sets, 2 of which lead up to your top set in your exercises. Is this the set you are talking about in your progression & periodization post?

471

Yes, that’s the set I’m referring to, and obviously as top sets get heavier, so do the sets before it. As I said, I go up by 5 to 10 percent of the top set.

472

[quote]Hazzyhazz24 wrote:
Hey Brick, just wanted to add that I have been having great luck with your approach. Since alot of people are posting about wanting to ramp up in threes heres an example of a typical workout I would do. Not optimal for pure bodybuilding but its worked great for strength and size so far.

Bench Press Variation. ie Floor Press, Pin Presses, Incline Presses, Flat Bench - Ramp Up in 3’s Westside Style

Decline Bench or incline bench - Ramp up BB style Reps in between 10 and 12

Flat DB Press or incline db press or flys - Same

Side Raises, or upright rows - BB

Some type of tri ext - BB [/quote]

If that works for you, you should do it.

Like I said, I’m just too simplistic in my approach, and I don’t like to “blend” stuff and make hybrid routines.

MAYBE my current routine is a “jack of all trades” routine because it’s a general fitness routine that has max effort, bodybuilding (on “assistance” exercises), speed work, and sprints all in one week. But I do this knowing that I’m not going to be a powerlifter or bodybuilder. I just didn’t approach things with a “hybrid” approach when I was about getting strong as hell and bigger. Like I said, I did half the year on Westside, and half the year bodybuilding.

473

[quote]Bricknyce wrote:
Yes, that’s the set I’m referring to, and obviously as top sets get heavier, so do the sets before it. As I said, I go up by 5 to 10 percent of the top set. [/quote]

I’m taking a guess that the stronger athletes/BB’ers have the preceeding sets weight closer to the top set weight than non-advanced trainees right? I’m asking because I can’t seem to get that much quality work done when they are so close together.

I feel I could get a heavier, better quality top set out if my preceeding sets aren’t as heavy, like pumped340 said a while ago.

If my sets were

80 lbs
90 lbs
100 lbs

and I added 5 lbs to each set making it:

85 lbs
95 lbs
105 lbs

then that would almost take more away from my top set. On the other end if I spaced my sets out more in the first example, then I could probably get a higher load & quality set out.

Any flaws with this thinking?

I thought only the first exercise in the session needed the bigger jumps in weight. I’m just wondering what wuold happen if I ‘conserved’ more on my secondary exercises.

474

[quote]Bricknyce wrote:

[quote]Hazzyhazz24 wrote:
Hey Brick, just wanted to add that I have been having great luck with your approach. Since alot of people are posting about wanting to ramp up in threes heres an example of a typical workout I would do. Not optimal for pure bodybuilding but its worked great for strength and size so far.

Bench Press Variation. ie Floor Press, Pin Presses, Incline Presses, Flat Bench - Ramp Up in 3’s Westside Style

Decline Bench or incline bench - Ramp up BB style Reps in between 10 and 12

Flat DB Press or incline db press or flys - Same

Side Raises, or upright rows - BB

Some type of tri ext - BB [/quote]

If that works for you, you should do it.

Like I said, I’m just too simplistic in my approach, and I don’t like to “blend” stuff and make hybrid routines.

MAYBE my current routine is a “jack of all trades” routine because it’s a general fitness routine that has max effort, bodybuilding (on “assistance” exercises), speed work, and sprints all in one week. But I do this knowing that I’m not going to be a powerlifter or bodybuilder. I just didn’t approach things with a “hybrid” approach when I was about getting strong as hell and bigger. Like I said, I did half the year on Westside, and half the year bodybuilding. [/quote]

Very true I too agree that if your trying to go for pure strength requires a different approach then pure hypertrophy but I dont plan on being a Mr. Anything or an Elite power lifter anytime soon and do this as a hobby of mine. I enjoy doing things the way I do and Im deff not running in circles because I do make progress. If more people would use an approach that was enjoyable to them and sensible more people would make progress. My routine might not be optimal for one specific goal but I really dont think it matters since I only do this for enjoyment and not a living. If in the future I decide to compete in powerlifting then I would use an approach that is geared more towards powerlifting ala conjugate method. Right now my goal is to get stronger on the main exercises and build some muscle mass i think my routine is good enough for both goals. Not optimal for either or, but it works.

475

[quote]earthquake wrote:

[quote]Bricknyce wrote:
Yes, that’s the set I’m referring to, and obviously as top sets get heavier, so do the sets before it. As I said, I go up by 5 to 10 percent of the top set. [/quote]

I’m taking a guess that the stronger athletes/BB’ers have the preceeding sets weight closer to the top set weight than non-advanced trainees right? I’m asking because I can’t seem to get that much quality work done when they are so close together.

I feel I could get a heavier, better quality top set out if my preceeding sets aren’t as heavy, like pumped340 said a while ago.

If my sets were

80 lbs
90 lbs
100 lbs

and I added 5 lbs to each set making it:

85 lbs
95 lbs
105 lbs

then that would almost take more away from my top set. On the other end if I spaced my sets out more in the first example, then I could probably get a higher load & quality set out.

Any flaws with this thinking?

I thought only the first exercise in the session needed the bigger jumps in weight. I’m just wondering what wuold happen if I ‘conserved’ more on my secondary exercises.[/quote]

That’s a wonder to me too.

476

[quote]Bricknyce wrote:

[quote]earthquake wrote:

I thought only the first exercise in the session needed the bigger jumps in weight. I’m just wondering what wuold happen if I ‘conserved’ more on my secondary exercises.[/quote]

That’s a wonder to me too. [/quote]

Thanks for all your help Brick. I am going to give a shot to jumping the weights a bit more on the previous sets then.

477

[quote]earthquake wrote:
I’m taking a guess that the stronger athletes/BB’ers have the preceeding sets weight closer to the top set weight than non-advanced trainees right? I’m asking because I can’t seem to get that much quality work done when they are so close together.

I feel I could get a heavier, better quality top set out if my preceeding sets aren’t as heavy, like pumped340 said a while ago.

If my sets were

80 lbs
90 lbs
100 lbs

and I added 5 lbs to each set making it:

85 lbs
95 lbs
105 lbs

then that would almost take more away from my top set. On the other end if I spaced my sets out more in the first example, then I could probably get a higher load & quality set out.

Any flaws with this thinking?

I thought only the first exercise in the session needed the bigger jumps in weight. I’m just wondering what wuold happen if I ‘conserved’ more on my secondary exercises.[/quote]

Have you tried it both ways?

Lets say I’m doing bench and I want my work set to be 165. This is how I’d do it.

Barx10
95x4
115x3
135x3
155x2
165xwhatever
135xwhatever for burnout

Play around with what you’re doing to see what works for you. As long as the weights are moving up, you’re getting stronger.

Try your approach for a bit and see how it feels and works for you then report back!

478

[quote]earthquake wrote:

[quote]Bricknyce wrote:

[quote]earthquake wrote:

I thought only the first exercise in the session needed the bigger jumps in weight. I’m just wondering what wuold happen if I ‘conserved’ more on my secondary exercises.[/quote]

That’s a wonder to me too. [/quote]

Thanks for all your help Brick. I am going to give a shot to jumping the weights a bit more on the previous sets then.[/quote]

From my limited experience: You can either make the gaps larger and do slightly more reps on each one or you can space them closer together and do less reps. I like the latter because the initial weight isn’t a surprise like with the large jump.

It’s not rocket science. Just do what feels right and it’s right if you’re progressing. Do that for a bit, then do something else if you think of it. However you progress better is what works better for your body.

479

Brick,

Would you ever recommend not eating any starchy carbs and grains at all? Could a person realistically do well by getting all of their carbs from fruits and vegetables?

480

[quote]ANIMAL M0THER wrote:
Brick,

Would you ever recommend not eating any starchy carbs and grains at all? Could a person realistically do well by getting all of their carbs from fruits and vegetables?[/quote]

Why are you thinking of doing this?

I don’t recommend this because I haven’t seen a successful athlete or bodybuilder do this.