I was looking for some supplements that might possibly get me a boost. wannabebig mentioned a few to me and while i was shopping around today i saw a lot of “all in one” supplements. Do any of these look decent to you guys? I’m usually scared of proprietary blends because they can be sketch.
ill post pics of lables here in a minute
the first supplement is called like t-male plus or something like that by natures plus
this one is called enpulse by rival-us
I don’t know much about a lot of those compounds, but I’m always a bit weary of the ‘shotgun-approach’-type of supps.
What I DO know…
Test: zinc, eat more meat, take vitamin D, omega-3
Cortisol: Rhodiola rosea
Estradiol: eating less sugar
also, all the magnesium forms are kind of shitty in those products (oxide/aspartate). Look for glycinate, orotate, taurate, etc…
[quote]PB Andy wrote:
also, all the magnesium forms are kind of shitty in those products (oxide/aspartate). Look for glycinate, orotate, taurate, etc…[/quote]
Really? I thought mag aspartate had pretty good absorption considering it is the chelate used in Biotest, and every other manufacturer, ZMA.
[quote]paulieserafini wrote:
okay so I have low testosterone, high estradiol and high am cortisol.
[/quote]
Personally, I would stay away from the herb route. I took trib ( 45% saponins, 750mg 2x per day) and my test more than doubled in 6 weeks BUT E2 and SHBG were off the charts as well. If you are going to take trib anyway, I would take it with high dose nettle root and DIM.
IMO I think it likely you could boost your test just by doing what Andy said taking zinc (high dose first week then maintenance dose afterward), upping fats/cholesterol and IDK about E2… Do you microwave food in plastic a lot or drink a lot of bottled water? That could skew your labs.
High AM cortisol, relatively, isnt that much of an issue. The values for the rest of the day may be though…
What are your actual lab values?
[quote]PB Andy wrote:
…
Estradiol: eating less sugar
…[/quote]
oh wow. So of the past 5 or 6ish months i’ve been eating higher carb from fruites, white rice etc. but i’ve dropped around 20ish lbs and lowering bodyfat consistiently. Should i still examine this as a possible cause for my higher estradiol and look at more higher protein/fat diets?
[quote]MAF14 wrote:
[quote]PB Andy wrote:
also, all the magnesium forms are kind of shitty in those products (oxide/aspartate). Look for glycinate, orotate, taurate, etc…[/quote]
Really? I thought mag aspartate had pretty good absorption considering it is the chelate used in Biotest, and every other manufacturer, ZMA.[/quote]
Hmmm maybe it is… I know magnesium oxide is shit, I thought the same for aspartate. It does end in ‘ate’ though so I’m probably just wrong on that one.
why is your test low?
Why is your E high?
Why morning cortisol issues?
You should answer those questions first rather than just start dosing with something.
[quote]paulieserafini wrote:
[quote]PB Andy wrote:
…
Estradiol: eating less sugar
…[/quote]
oh wow. So of the past 5 or 6ish months i’ve been eating higher carb from fruites, white rice etc. but i’ve dropped around 20ish lbs and lowering bodyfat consistiently. Should i still examine this as a possible cause for my higher estradiol and look at more higher protein/fat diets?[/quote]
could be, could be lots of other things too such as poor GI health due to low fiber intake, or aromatose (things that block this are selenium, zinc, melatonin, green tea, citrus flavonones). You can also promote the C-2 pathway by taking B-vitamins or DIM (found in broccoli/cauliflower). Also, don’t drink so too much alcohol if you are doing that.
i actually have 4 bottles of a KILLER test booster/estrogen dropper/prolactin/shbg inhibitor/horny goat weedy goodness that i made on a website. i picked the ingredients and exactly how much of each to put. theres no comparison to the premade shit. and i got 4 months worth for under $100.
What sort of test do you order to get hormones checked? What do I tell my doctor?
<— Complete noob when it comes to this stuff
4 in the morning, 3 at night. 5 days on 2 off, bottle lasts a month. i have yet to try it im kind scared its pretty powerful hahah
[quote]therajraj wrote:
What sort of test do you order to get hormones checked? What do I tell my doctor?
<— Complete noob when it comes to this stuff[/quote]
testosterone
free testosterone
estradiol (here in canada we have a shitty estradiol test it isnt sensitive so its pretty much useless for us, but i get it anyway)
prolactin
shbg
[quote]wannabebig250 wrote:
[quote]therajraj wrote:
What sort of test do you order to get hormones checked? What do I tell my doctor?
<— Complete noob when it comes to this stuff[/quote]
testosterone
free testosterone
estradiol (here in canada we have a shitty estradiol test it isnt sensitive so its pretty much useless for us, but i get it anyway)
prolactin
shbg[/quote]
In Canada don’t we have to have a reason for these tests to be ordered?
What did you tell your doctor to get him to order them?
[quote]therajraj wrote:
[quote]wannabebig250 wrote:
[quote]therajraj wrote:
What sort of test do you order to get hormones checked? What do I tell my doctor?
<— Complete noob when it comes to this stuff[/quote]
testosterone
free testosterone
estradiol (here in canada we have a shitty estradiol test it isnt sensitive so its pretty much useless for us, but i get it anyway)
prolactin
shbg[/quote]
In Canada don’t we have to have a reason for these tests to be ordered?
What did you tell your doctor to get him to order them?[/quote]
lol no everything is covered by OHIP. i just say i want blood tests and she orders them. i got like 4 pages worth of shit and all i had to pay for was vitamin d.
[quote]MAF14 wrote:
[quote]paulieserafini wrote:
okay so I have low testosterone, high estradiol and high am cortisol.
[/quote]
Personally, I would stay away from the herb route. I took trib ( 45% saponins, 750mg 2x per day) and my test more than doubled in 6 weeks BUT E2 and SHBG were off the charts as well. If you are going to take trib anyway, I would take it with high dose nettle root and DIM.
IMO I think it likely you could boost your test just by doing what Andy said taking zinc (high dose first week then maintenance dose afterward), upping fats/cholesterol and IDK about E2… Do you microwave food in plastic a lot or drink a lot of bottled water? That could skew your labs.
High AM cortisol, relatively, isnt that much of an issue. The values for the rest of the day may be though…
What are your actual lab values?[/quote]
like 60mg of zinc a day for a week and 30mg a day every week after?
those results are insane what trib brand were you taking?
as far as plastic when i was deployed jan2011-sept2012. the only water available was plastic bottled water and a lot of time it was stored in middle east dessert heat.
a couple months ago i gave up all plastic water. and drink out of bpa free bottles and have a filter on my sink.
and to answer your question these are the labs
Labs done 22MAY2012
Thyroglobulin, quantitative:____(26.6)…ng/ml…range: .5 - 55.0
Antithyrogloulin Ab_____________(<20)…IU/mL…range: 0 - 40
Testosterone, free and total
Testosterone, Serum_____________(330)…ng/dL…range: 348 - 1197 (obviously low)
Free Testosterone (direct)______(10.5)…pg/mL…range: 9.3 - 26.5
t4 free (direct_________________(1.34)…ng/dl…range:.82 - 1.77
DHEA-Sulfate____________________(429.6)…ug/dL…range: 211.0 - 492.0
TSH_____________________________(2.910)…uIU/mL…range: .450 - 4.500
Estradiol_______________________(40.8)…pg/mL…range: 7.6 - 42.6
Androstenedione LCMS____________(77)…ng/dL…range: 44 - 186
prostate-specific Ag, serum_____(.3)…ng/mL…range: 0.0 - 4.0
Reverse T3, serum______________(24.3)…ng/dL…range: 13.5 - 34.2
Estrogens, Total_______________(104)…pg/mL…range: adult male 40 - 115
Thyroid Peroxidase (tpo) Ab____(12)…IU/mL…range: 0-34
Triiodothyronine, Free, Serum__(3.7)…pg/mL…range: 2.0 - 4.4
Cortisol - AM__________________(26.7)…ug/dL…range: 6.2 - 19.4 (HIGH)
LABS 16 MARCH 2012 HIGHLIGHTS
FSH____________________________(2.4)…range: 1.5-12.4
prolactin tot__________________(8.37)…range: 4.6 - 21.4
Estradiol______________________(48.45)…range: 7.63 - 42.60
25OH VIT D TOT_________________(32)…range: 30 - 100
25OH VIT D2____________________(<4)
DHEA SO4_______________________(416)…range: 110-510
LH_____________________________(4.7)…range: 1.7 - 8.6
[quote]hipsr4runnin wrote:
why is your test low?
Why is your E high?
Why morning cortisol issues?
You should answer those questions first rather than just start dosing with something. [/quote]
I really really really have no answer other than im stressed out all the time. I cant tell the difference if im truly stressed out with life anymore or the stress is a symptom of my shitty hormone levels.
[quote]wannabebig250 wrote:
4 in the morning, 3 at night. 5 days on 2 off, bottle lasts a month. i have yet to try it im kind scared its pretty powerful hahah[/quote]
lol my fear would be they didn’t put the amount requested for all the stuff
[quote]paulieserafini wrote:
[quote]MAF14 wrote:
[quote]paulieserafini wrote:
okay so I have low testosterone, high estradiol and high am cortisol.
[/quote]
Personally, I would stay away from the herb route. I took trib ( 45% saponins, 750mg 2x per day) and my test more than doubled in 6 weeks BUT E2 and SHBG were off the charts as well. If you are going to take trib anyway, I would take it with high dose nettle root and DIM.
IMO I think it likely you could boost your test just by doing what Andy said taking zinc (high dose first week then maintenance dose afterward), upping fats/cholesterol and IDK about E2… Do you microwave food in plastic a lot or drink a lot of bottled water? That could skew your labs.
High AM cortisol, relatively, isnt that much of an issue. The values for the rest of the day may be though…
What are your actual lab values?[/quote]
like 60mg of zinc a day for a week and 30mg a day every week after?
those results are insane what trib brand were you taking?
[/quote]
Zinc looks good to me. I like zinc picolinate when not taking all in one ZMA’s. Poloiquin recommends 50mg zinc per day but I think 30mg should be enough.
I was taking just a generic bulk powder. Tastes awful though.
Cortisol was higher than it should be. In most cases its best for it to be at the top of the normal range but yours was a bit higher.
E2 can be lowered with Calcium D Glucarate, DIM and Sulforphane (sp?) IF they’re xeno estrogens (coming from outside the body).
Again, I would really avoid the herbal routes, they arent going to solve the problem only mask them.
Post your values in your own thread in the T-Replacement forum.
