Wow, really great articles and programs. Exaclty what I was looking for. Will be choosing one of them or combining elements from both.
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Skim perhaps… the fat component of 2% and full negate the insulin response largely
Again… what do carbs do that protein / fats can’t ?
Insulin release ? No
Energy substrate ? No
Build muscle ? No
Protein sparing ? No
Calories ? No
The Golden Era guys were low carb, too. Carb load on weekends.
How much of the weight carbs help put on is pure muscle as compared to a Carnivore style eating plan ?
More nuanced than you’re admitting. Ive gained quite a bit of lean tissue using it
Or are you suggesting eating carnivore while in a caloric surplus with proper training doesn’t build muscle ?
Honestly, the easiest thing to do is starting strength and eat eat eat. If you want to be a bodybuilder, fine. But start with getting your strength and size up so you have something to work with.
Big muscles come from big weight. Get your strength at least past novice gains, then when you are building, you will have weight to create muscle both on your body and on the bar.
There is a lot to distract you out there. Some things look cool on youtube. But basics are basics for a reason, and a small guy gets big with the big four
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The routine I already know what I am going to do. After being on a no carb/minimal carb animal diet, I have noticed how easy it is to lose fat compared to building muscle. I am considering following following a carnivore/animal based diet, and consuming the cleanest mass gaining shake I can afford to get in those carbs that can help me gain that mass a bit quicker. I know the words mass gainers and clean dont really mix, but any recommendations? I was considering BSN mass gainer or Transparent Labs.
Not optimal for hypertrophy though
If you’re determined to have carbs… try white rice. Easily digested and can eat a lot of it. Maybe 1 bolus a day. Those gainers are trash.
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Seems like you got it all figured out.
That’s what I was thinking too, but it’s seeming like that’s NOT the case. I find it an interesting interpretation.
Like, don’t carnivorous animals also eat the eggs of animals?
Not animal based, but carnivore. Aside from one meal a week and Metabolic Drive, I don’t consume non-animal foods. That particular photo actually came at the end of a VERY carnivore cruise, wherein I consume 54 steaks and 102 eggs in the span of 7 days, according to my kid’s tally, alongside a LOT of meaty delights. I documented it here
And if you’re curious about my specific approach to nutrition and my journey to here, check out these write ups
Glad you dug those programs. I would NOT combine them: I’d pick one OR the other. My preference would be Mass Made Simple to start, but they both work.
Come on man be serious. Animal flesh, including both muscle tissue, organs and even bones.
Lions eat the stomach content of their kills are they now omnivores?
Wrong
Wrong. I have already written about this, and they were on steroids.
Again, show me examples of someone who was 150 lbs. and skinny fat who got to 185 lbs. following a carnivore diet. It does not happen.
Being 200+ lbs and leaning out does not count. Being obese and losing fat does not count.
I am talking about putting on size. The body does not want to be carrying excess size/muscle. Eating just meat is not going to let you get big. Maintaining is different it can be done on less food.
I don’t know. Its not something I was concerned about.
So if an animal kills and eats a lactating mammal, is it a concern if it eats the mammary glands?
What are your thoughts on eggs and carnivores?
How exactly would man have salvaged milk from a kill? The use of dairy is tied to the domestication of animals, a relatively recent development.
This is ironic when compared to the arguments against eating fruits, vegetables, and grains, which have been part of human diets for much longer.
Thanks man, I feel like I’m going insane seeing the shift in this forum lately. Its starting to feel culty because a few assisted guys had some success with some fringe diet or training approach, and now no one dear bother challenge it 
Who in particular?
Concern for who? Animals are trying to survive.
How often are animals killing a lactating animal? A few months out of the year?
Assuming a large kill by say Lions or Wolves how much is actually being salvaged when being eaten and shared?
I’ll allow them. They are not dairy.
To me it is simple. A big argument in favor of carnivore, including Shawn Baker, is that it is how man evolved to eat. Ancestral man hunted and thrived on meat. That they were basically carnivores (which is wrong). If that is the case, then animal products that can be hunted or gathered would just be animal meat, including organs, blood, bone/marrow, and eggs. Early man was not milking wild animals.
The argument against grains, vegetables, and fruit (aside from them trying to kill you) is that it is a recent development to have them in abundance thanks to agriculture. However, if that is the case, then why would dairy be allowed if that is a more recent development? Which is an argument that Shawn Baker has used himself against dairy
I feel like anyone who’s arguing over dairy vs milk or carbs vs. zero carbs or whatever this is in this thread and just overlooking that some untrained newbie is talking tren and HGH. 
I’m not interested in started beef (pun intended) with anyone in particular and I can honestly say I don’t have particular posters in mind. It’s just more a general trend I’m feeling, and this particular forum frustrated me for the reason mentioned above and yeah I came across too harsh. I know you mention your diet from time to time but I’ve never gotten the impression you try to push it on anyone but just factually report your experience and acknowledge the merits of other approaches that seem to give others benefit.
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The thing is I have tried it. I used to post here years ago when it was more BB oriented. Prof.X, Pushharder, Waylander, Bushido etc. I came back to post my results from an almost yearlong diet “journey”.
I have pretty much always eaten “paleo,” more so avoiding dairy due to its effects on my skin. I then tried an “Animal-Based” diet, eating animal protein, fruit, and easily digestible starches. I then went to a carnivore diet. I got down to 168 lbs. I was really lean but could not put on weight. I tracked everything and was eating as much as 3,600 calories but still could not hit 170 lbs.
If I ate too much fat, my caloric intake would drop as I was not hungry. If I increased protein, I could not eat enough. I know that if I added dairy especially milk, I would put on weight but, as I said my skin would not like it and it is not carnivore.
Carnivore just does not allow for eating in a consistent surplus.
So… a caloric surplus of just meat; proteins and animal fats, won’t allow one to gain muscle because those magical carbs aren’t present? That’s rich… people don’t need a massive excess of calories to grow, and fats are twice the energy source of carbs.
Um… the Golden Era guys said as much but I’ll take your word for it.
And you’re suggesting fats don’t mitigate an insulin spike?
Now for like the 5th time… what is so special about carbs that one can’t put on muscle without them? Also… how much of the carb weight gain is myofibrils and not fat or fluid retention?
Why ask me this? What did I say that has anything to do with this?
I have no good experience with an extremely low carbohydrate diet as it concerns improved body composition. It failed me.
I avoided all fruits and wheat grains when on a contest diet. And before Met Rx I used no protein supplements.