Strongman = CrossFit (More or Less)

Training Powerlifting
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[quote]Modi wrote:
Just playing Devil’s Advocate here…Don’t kick me out of the mancave just yet.

I recently had a discussion with trainer who has begun doing the WOD’s himself. He is a pretty strong guy, and carries an above average amount of muscle.

I used the very same argument with him: “Crossfitters try to be good at everything and great at nothing.”

His reponse was “And?”

His point was that for the general public who often have no goals other than to “get in shape”, is being good at everything all that bad?

The majority of us post in the strength forum because we compete in a specific sport, and yes, we want to be the best, or at least be as good as our genetics will allow.

But for someone who has no desire to compete and just wants to “lose a little weight, get a little stronger, look a little better” (<-- 95% of the general population) Is Crossfit such a bad option?

I hear your argument but I still have concerns with the setup. Who clears these trainer, coaches or whatever to teach Olympic lifts and gymnastic exercises. How do they screen or recognize injury. And for someone who wants to lose a little weight there are lots of more practical paths to take.

Your welcome in the mancave for sure, but I just don’t see any method to Crossfit. And I can’t find anyone who can give me a solid answer on it. I’m sure your trainer friend has it’s reasons, but I will stick to “cross-training” for my clients.

82

try that again

I hear your argument but I still have concerns with the setup. Who clears these trainer, coaches or whatever to teach Olympic lifts and gymnastic exercises. How do they screen or recognize injury. And for someone who wants to lose a little weight there are lots of more practical paths to take.

Your welcome in the mancave for sure, but I just don’t see any method to Crossfit. And I can’t find anyone who can give me a solid answer on it. I’m sure your trainer friend has it’s reasons, but I will stick to “cross-training” for my clients.

83

[quote]Barachiel wrote:
try that again

I hear your argument but I still have concerns with the setup. Who clears these trainer, coaches or whatever to teach Olympic lifts and gymnastic exercises. How do they screen or recognize injury. And for someone who wants to lose a little weight there are lots of more practical paths to take.

Your welcome in the mancave for sure, but I just don’t see any method to Crossfit. And I can’t find anyone who can give me a solid answer on it. I’m sure your trainer friend has it’s reasons, but I will stick to “cross-training” for my clients.
[/quote]

All good questions, and points.

I don’t think he uses the WOD’s for his clients, just for his own workouts lately, and I don’t even know how long he has been/will be using them. He is a very capable trainer from what I know.

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[quote]Barachiel wrote:
I hear your argument but I still have concerns with the setup. Who clears these trainer, coaches or whatever to teach Olympic lifts and gymnastic exercises. How do they screen or recognize injury. And for someone who wants to lose a little weight there are lots of more practical paths to take.

Your welcome in the mancave for sure, but I just don’t see any method to Crossfit. And I can’t find anyone who can give me a solid answer on it. I’m sure your trainer friend has it’s reasons, but I will stick to “cross-training” for my clients.

[/quote]

I’ll continue with Modi’s path of being devils advocate:

At the gym I train at, all 3 of the trainers are USAW certified for teaching olympic lifting and 2 have competitive experience. 2 have a masters degree in an exercise related field, the other a BS, all 3 have a CSCS, crossfit certification, and a few others to boot.

My point isn’t to brag, but rather to ask, how many average trainers in ANY gym do you know that can match this? The average crossfit trainer is much better educated than your average sportsplex trainer, in my experience.

If you’re beef is really “who clears crossfit trainers”, then why aren’t you crusading against ISSA, AMFPT, and other second rate certifications that mean nothing?

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[quote]slimjim wrote:
Crossfit = here’s a bunch of random shit to do today. Let’s make guys smaller and look gay and woman look hot as fuck.

Strongman = here’s a bunch of specific events that you have trained for using planned routines. Let’s make make real fucking man. [/quote]

Fixed.

Now beacuse Dave Tate went to ave a talk with ‘crossfitters’, its like crossfit is automatically associated with strongman/powerlifting/Weightlifting etc Which is W-R-O-N-G.

Crossfit is better then nothing for MOST man. That’s the shear reality of what crossfit is. In an ideal world all woman are doing crossfit to be hot as fuck. period. Crossfit could be PERHAPS used for some proper warming up before a REAL workout. That’s what most people on these forums believe, and probably they are right. Nuff said.

86

For the record, 3WL I do, and I AM.

Did you know in major chains such as LAFit, Ballys, 24, they recognize a 4 yr degree in Kinesiology and a cert from ISSA as the same thing!!! THE SAME THING!!! WTF!!!

And trust me I am working on it, even if I have to pursue legislation. But before I get on my soapbox, let me take a breath respond to the latter portion of your post.

For the record yes I have a degree, yes I’m CSCS. I’ve trained college and pro athletes, celebs, breast cancer survivors, physical therapy patients with surgically fused lumbar vertabrae, blah, blah, blah, . . .

I actually started training people when I was sixteen. Not bragging, I just love this business. And I always will.

BUT I will say this for the chains, demon spawn that they can be. At least you have to produce the cert. A crappy weekend cert, yes, but a cert.

I haven’t seen any kind of structure for Crossfit except paying the fee.

Once again, I do not knock Crossfit as a whole, merely it’s presentation. And in reflection to your other statement of education. Is any of those educational degrees or certs required before being certified as Crossfit or do they just pay the fee and show up to the class like anywhere else?

Crossfit is no better or worse. It’s a great idea, but it seems to have no focus. Every training style has their all stars, doesn’t make them the rule, more often than not, the excpetion.

I mean free running has some great athletes to. Doesn’t mean I’m going to put an MMA client on that either.

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[quote]Barachiel wrote:

BUT I will say this for the chains, demon spawn that they can be. At least you have to produce the cert. A crappy weekend cert, yes, but a cert.

I haven’t seen any kind of structure for Crossfit except paying the fee.

Once again, I do not knock Crossfit as a whole, merely it’s presentation. And in reflection to your other statement of education. Is any of those educational degrees or certs required before being certified as Crossfit or do they just pay the fee and show up to the class like anywhere else?

[/quote]

The class is supposedly 2 days and pretty decent. It’s a lot of form and “what to do if” kind of stuff, and the guys here recognize that it isn’t the best thing out there, but it’s the same way with anything. You can have your CSCS and still be a fucking idiot.

Difference is, I’ve yet to see a crossfit trainer put a client on a wobble board to do curls, or squat on a swiss ball. This is the sad reality that is the average trainer, and on that note, crossfit is infinitely better.

Am I saying it should be used for every case and every scenario? Fuck no. But, neither are any of the crossfit coaches I know.

88

Agree with Marvel Girl, and Barachiel, think crossfit is handy GPP, but the cult has taken a life of its own. Glassman is the smartest operator since Athur Jones, and before him Jolly Joe Weider.

If it makes some people fitter that’s great, but the price many of us have to pay by listening to the message from the new mesiah, is really hard to take.

of personal sadness to me is that I found a complex taught by Don Babitt top US throwing coach, and taught to me by Koji Murofushi, is now called “the Bear”, but maybe that makes crossfit’s workout my warmup, hey that’s a catchy phrase…damm already gone…

probably should’nt mention Koji is the 2004 Hammer champ or crossfit will claim him too…

89

This kind of reminds me of that South Park episode where Randy buys a prius and becomes infected with the “smug”

90

Alright guys I just want to clear the air about what this thread was originally supposed to be about.

Strongman comps are comprised of events, and each event has to be learned and perfected. But not every Strongman competition has the same event’s and sometimes the event’s change during the competition if equipment fails or if weather in inclimate. SO YOU HAVE TO BE READY FOR ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING under the umbrella that is strongman.
Can we at least agree on this?

CrossFit competitions have specific events and workouts that need to be trained for and perfected, just like any other strength sport. The difference, just like strongman, is that there are alot more events than a power meet or olympic lifting meet. SO YOU HAVE TO BE READY FOR ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING under the umbrella that is CrossFit. Does that mean you have to be ready to do concentration curls and tricep kick backs? Hell no, that is not CrossFit.

In CrossFit the stopwatch is crucial, same as strongman. Are there any other strength sports where a stopwatch is even used? Maybe but I can’t think of any. In stronman # of reps in an alotted time is important. Same thing in CrossFit. In strongman max weight on a single lift is important, but guess what, That lift could be a Log press, an apolons axle, max height over head, squat, deadlift, and a host of other things. Guess what I am about to say now. CrossFitters have to be ready to Deadlift, squat, strict press etc. To me the similarities are obvious.

Does this make sense to any of you guys? There is no other strength sport that I can think of that is more closely related to CrossFit than Strongman.

Do I think Strongman = CrossFit. No. Didn’t you guys see the (more or less) part? HaHa.

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[quote]fattymcfatso wrote:
Alright guys I just want to clear the air about what this thread was originally supposed to be about.

Strongman comps are comprised of events, and each event has to be learned and perfected. But not every Strongman competition has the same event’s and sometimes the event’s change during the competition if equipment fails or if weather in inclimate. SO YOU HAVE TO BE READY FOR ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING under the umbrella that is strongman.
Can we at least agree on this?

CrossFit competitions have specific events and workouts that need to be trained for and perfected, just like any other strength sport. The difference, just like strongman, is that there are alot more events than a power meet or olympic lifting meet. SO YOU HAVE TO BE READY FOR ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING under the umbrella that is CrossFit. Does that mean you have to be ready to do concentration curls and tricep kick backs? Hell no, that is not CrossFit.

In CrossFit the stopwatch is crucial, same as strongman. Are there any other strength sports where a stopwatch is even used? Maybe but I can’t think of any. In stronman # of reps in an alotted time is important. Same thing in CrossFit. In strongman max weight on a single lift is important, but guess what, That lift could be a Log press, an apolons axle, max height over head, squat, deadlift, and a host of other things. Guess what I am about to say now. CrossFitters have to be ready to Deadlift, squat, strict press etc. To me the similarities are obvious.

Does this make sense to any of you guys? There is no other strength sport that I can think of that is more closely related to CrossFit than Strongman.

Do I think Strongman = CrossFit. No. Didn’t you guys see the (more or less) part? HaHa.

[/quote]

Does this mean man is more or less woman? Takes the fun right out of sex.

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Crossift is just a brand name.

I fail to see the fuss both positive or negative about it.

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Crossfit=hot dog eating contest (more or less)

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[quote]T3hPwnisher wrote:
Crossfit=hot dog eating contest (more or less)[/quote]

Good try, but it would have to be more random, like just a straight up eating contest where you don’t know what you will be eating.

Altough I would prefer hot dogs. Especially a Bahama Mama from 7-11 with chili and cheese sauce, those are the bomb.com.

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This thread popped up the same time the Dave Tate thread surfaced and here’s my take on the whole thing. I think there’s some relevance here.

Dave Tate is a smart business man. Why not get on board with people who are potential customers? There are several hundred crossfit gyms around the country and I have a feeling Dave would love to have squat racks, jumpstretch bands, bars, weights, foam rollers and such rocking the Elite FTS logo.

I would pay a little lip service to them if it meant a potential revenue stream in a training concept that is on an upswing.

Don’t mean to piss in the old cornflakes and maybe I missed this aspect of the argument earlier, but this is about moving product folks.

Fatty has asserted in this thread and the Tate thread that he owns a crossfit gym. It’s good publicity for him to have everyone discussing the training concept, good or bad.

Dolla, dolla, dolla bills y’all…

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[quote]drdgmuro wrote:
This thread popped up the same time the Dave Tate thread surfaced and here’s my take on the whole thing. I think there’s some relevance here.

Dave Tate is a smart business man. Why not get on board with people who are potential customers? There are several hundred crossfit gyms around the country and I have a feeling Dave would love to have squat racks, jumpstretch bands, bars, weights, foam rollers and such rocking the Elite FTS logo.

I would pay a little lip service to them if it meant a potential revenue stream in a training concept that is on an upswing.

Don’t mean to piss in the old cornflakes and maybe I missed this aspect of the argument earlier, but this is about moving product folks.

Fatty has asserted in this thread and the Tate thread that he owns a crossfit gym. It’s good publicity for him to have everyone discussing the training concept, good or bad.

Dolla, dolla, dolla bills y’all…[/quote]

A winner is YOU!

I love how people think that anyhting is about anything other than the stacks.

Why does crossfit exist? To produce money. no altruistic shit. As said previously cross fit is everything, just training in the most general sense. Circuit training is not crossfit. it’s circuit training. but the “crossfit” brand name includes circuit training, max lifts, 5x5, rowing and pretty much every other worth while mode of training.

Essentially glassman has claimed training to be his idea and put a name on it. WHY? to sell that shit. Now he has a highly marketed and recognizable name that he sells to whoever for $3000USD[lev 1 cert and year of affiliate fee].

The dude has made himself a license to print money without doing one of the biggest things that most coaches do, programming. That guy has basically sold a “training method” without doing any of the paperwork. basically, the program is “do any of these exercises as hard as you can till your done.”

Crossfit is nothing new. it’s just strength and conditioning with a catchy name, a bad boy attitude and a shiny package.

So to get back to the irrelevant subject of the post is CF like strongman? god no. Strongman is a sport, with specific parameters. crossfit is a brand name, with no parameters.

does TIDE = washing your clothes?
does FORD = racing?

No. CF is just a brand name. A way to make money. It is a FITNESS CHAIN with really dope equipment and [from my experience] as poor a trainer as any other chain.

-chris

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“I’d like to start a religion. That’s where the money is.” - L. Ron Hubbard

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[quote]fattymcfatso wrote:
T3hPwnisher wrote:
Crossfit=hot dog eating contest (more or less)

Good try, but it would have to be more random, like just a straight up eating contest where you don’t know what you will be eating.

Altough I would prefer hot dogs. Especially a Bahama Mama from 7-11 with chili and cheese sauce, those are the bomb.com.
[/quote]

You missed the part where I said “more or less”

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I don’t so CrossFit I do a combination of Ross Training and Gym Jones training…

scratches head and walk away

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I’m guessing that I am not winning this one guys. I still feel the way I did when I started this thread and you probably do to. It was fun debating this stuff with people who have similar interests though. Believe it or not even though I do CrossFit, I am not too different from the rest of this community. Thanks for all your input and opinions.