[quote]Nomancer wrote:
It seems that you have the time to go through the archives here.[/quote]
It’s funny you said that…I’ve spent probably 5 hours today, and 3 or 4 hours yesterday reading the archives.
This site is amazing. Some of the specialists are absolutely on point, motivating and interesting.
I just need some help with direction, focus.
I know it’s out there!
Thanks again,
Johndogg
Remember that you can’t really spot reduce. The only way to get rid of moobs is to drop bodyfat, period.
When you’re lifting, ignore isolation movements while you’re in your building phase. Go with heavy compound movements. Using DBs for bench is just fine – some might even say superior. Doing heavy dumbbell deadlifts from the floor can have a kick-ass effect on the same muscle structure used for squatting. Don’t forget lunges and step-ups.
Also bear in mind that part of the reason that elite athletes don’t overtrain is that they’re not necessarily doing the same thing day after day. If they’re weight-training one day, they may be running sprints the next or doing endurance work the next day.
I’m not sure how you feel about total body routines, but you might want to give one a look.
[quote]Northcott wrote:
Also bear in mind that part of the reason that elite athletes don’t overtrain is that they’re not necessarily doing the same thing day after day. If they’re weight-training one day, they may be running sprints the next or doing endurance work the next day.
I’m not sure how you feel about total body routines, but you might want to give one a look.[/quote]
I have never been a fan of total body routines…I always felt like I could focus my energies better on a split routine. Having said that, I’ve never found a total body routine I’ve felt comfortable with. Having read some of Waterbury’s workouts, I think I will give one a shot. The stuff he says just “makes sense” to me. It “clicks”, if you will. Since I have the time, energy and focus, I am eyeing the Waterbury High Frequency System. I had read that it was designed with the average lifter’s schedule in mind. I had also read an article on creating my own high frequency system. Would it be better for me to just follow Chad’s WHFS, like the holy text, or should I amend it since I can have no problem filling out 2 workouts+ each day? I love the idea of frequency training, alternating exercises, and working antaganistic muscles. The balance of working very hard leg exercises in a superset with an easy upperbody exercise (when finding an antaganist is not possible) all makes alot of sense to me.
I just want to know which direction to head. In the WHFS, he doesn’t start 2-workout days until week 3. Should I jump to his week 3? Or is there a way to get the benefits of week 1, with the 2-day frequency of week 3 (as long as I alternate exercises, reps?) And where does cardio fit in?
I plan on using Waterbury’s method to the fullest extent, I just don’t know exactly which way to go.
I did some upperbody work yesterday (chest,back,arms, light shoulder)…I will do Day 1 of WHFS today, and will alternate out a few exercises that I did yesterday with similar but different movements/different reps today.
I’ll report how it goes.
Any other help would be greatly appreciated.
And while it’s embarrasing, I’m posting my “before” picture. (This is where I am, currently after a few workouts…*note- it’s not my ultimate “before” picture…I did used to be 285lbs…I am currently between 205-210.) Alot of guys have put it all out there on this site, and have helped motivate me. When my “after picture” motivates someone else, it’ll be worth it. It will also keep me in check and in focus, when I check this thread.
Thanks,
Johndogg
I’ve read in depth of the importance of a post-workout carb/protein intake.
Unfortunately, I won’t have access to Surge, or any protein supplement for a few months. Any reccomendation on any type of “cocktail” that could get me what I need, post-workout?
Can of tuna and an apple?
Ideas greatly appreciated.
-Johndogg
I think the reason why WHFS tapers up, and isn’t 2x workouts 7 days a week is to prevent over training.
Overtraning is REAL, its just at one end on the spectrum.
PWO drink: Chocolate milk.
You could build your own, 2:1 carbs to protein ratio, idealy the faster the carbs and the faster the protein the better.
Milk is a bit better than eggs. Whey is even better.
You don’t want to be doing WHFS on a severly restricted diet either, and you might not want to have 2 PWO drinks when reducing fat.
If you’re not going to do WHFS you might want to look into interval sprints.
Even if you do WHFS, do morning cardio. I think the article is 100 Workouts to Fit (Slim?) City.
[quote]Nomancer wrote:
PWO drink: Chocolate milk.
You could build your own, 2:1 carbs to protein ratio, idealy the faster the carbs and the faster the protein the better.
Milk is a bit better than eggs. Whey is even better.
You don’t want to be doing WHFS on a severly restricted diet either, and you might not want to have 2 PWO drinks when reducing fat.
If you’re not going to do WHFS you might want to look into interval sprints.
Even if you do WHFS, do morning cardio. I think the article is 100 Workouts to Fit (Slim?) City.[/quote]
So, I think I may have found a good, cheap, canned PWO drink in my island search for good stuff today. This was largely based on what I’ve read and what alot of you guys have said. Let me know what you think.
It’s called “Supligen”, by Nestle. It’s made in Jamaica, and is shipped here quite often. It is cheap and easy to get (rare for here) I have found that I prefer the “Peanut” flavor, and it says on the label it is a “Liquid Meal Supplement for Strength and Energy - Made with REAL Peanut Butter” (I was skeptical, but the stats look great for a PWO drink…after working out total body today, I felt great after drinking it)Here are the contents and stats:
Ingredients: Water,Skimmed milk solids,sucrose,peanut butter,corn syrup solids,soya oil,defatted soya flour,disodium phosphate,soya lecithin,carrageenan, iron pyrophosphate,vitamin C,nicotinamide,vitamin e,calcium pantothenate,vitamins B1,B2,B6,A,D3,folic acid,vitamin B12.
Nutritional Facts:
Calories 395
Calories from Fat 117
Total Fat 13g - 20%
Saturated Fat 2g
Polyunsaturated Fat 0g
Monounsaturated Fat 0g
Cholesterol 7mg
Sodium 237mg
Potassium 22mg
Total Carbohydrate 53g
Dietary Fiber 1g
Protein 16g
I understand there is some sugar and such in there, but I suppose that’s okay PWO. Also, with the fat grams and calories, I could only see myself having one a day, in an effort to lose fat. I saw that skim milk and peanut butter were main ingredients, which seems like a great idea post workout.
Later on, I will post today’s workout (my first serious effort in a total body workout in a long time), which I used Waterbury’s advice on building your own program. I will also post my diet, so you guys can rip it apart and make me eat right. 
Thanks again, and let me know what you think.
-Johndogg
[quote]Johndogg wrote:
Nutritional Facts:
Calories 395
Calories from Fat 117
Total Fat 13g - 20%
Saturated Fat 2g
Polyunsaturated Fat 0g
Monounsaturated Fat 0g
Cholesterol 7mg
Sodium 237mg
Potassium 22mg
Total Carbohydrate 53g
Dietary Fiber 1g
Protein 16g
I understand there is some sugar and such in there, but I suppose that’s okay PWO. Also, with the fat grams and calories, I could only see myself having one a day, in an effort to lose fat. I saw that skim milk and peanut butter were main ingredients, which seems like a great idea post workout.
[/quote]
Not enough protein, too much fat. You don’t want fat in a peri-workout drink.
CHOCOLATE MILK. Or, just buy regular milk and add in sugar to make it complient with a workout drink.
Also, if you’re trying to loose fat, drink your drink during your workout, and you don’t neccessairly need a lot of carbs (IF you are trying to loose fat).
[quote]Nomancer wrote:
Not enough protein, too much fat. You don’t want fat in a peri-workout drink.
CHOCOLATE MILK. Or, just buy regular milk and add in sugar to make it complient with a workout drink.
Also, if you’re trying to loose fat, drink your drink during your workout, and you don’t neccessairly need a lot of carbs (IF you are trying to loose fat).[/quote]
What about, as opposed to the Supligen being a PWO drink, I have it in the morning. I had read of the benefits of morning carbs/calories during a fitness program… I’d love to find a place for these on occasion. Milk is come and go down here (thanks to terrible shipping times, standards) and it’s also not cheap.
Any other suggestions? Do you think the Supligen would be a good first meal?
Thanks again for your responses,
Johndogg
Workout- 3pm
My first attempt at a total body, waterford style workout…
I used alternating supersets
Superset A- 60 sec. rest
DB Squats - 4sets/6 reps
One armed DB standing shoulder press- 4 sets/6 reps
Set B- 60 sec. rest
Leg press - 3 sets/8reps
tricep push down - 2 sets/12reps
Set C- 60 sec. rest
Seated fly - 2 sets/12 reps
Calf raises- 2 sets/12 reps
Set D- 60 sec. rest
Good mornings- 2 sets/12 reps
EZ Bar curl- 2 sets/12 reps
Set E- 60 sec. rest
Behind the head lat pulldown- 3/8 reps
3 different crunch sets in between
Food:
8 a.m. - 2 cups of coffee
8:20 a.m.- cooked turkey bacon- 154 cals, 12 fg, 1 carb, 10 protein
11am- tuna pita w/ low fat miracle whip, chopped onion and spicy mustard
415cal,4fg,53c,40p
2pm- 1 cup lowfat cottage cheese w/ blueberries- 185cal,3.5fg,18c,28p
3pm-workout
4:30-PWO supligen shake-395cal,13f,53c,16p
4:45-small apple-65cal,0f,17c,0p
5:15-Baked Tilapia w/ butternut squash-
183cal,1f,24c,20p
6pm-lowfat cottage cheese w/ mixed berries- 220 cal,3.5f,27c,28p
7:30- 1 hard boiled egg - 78cal,5f,1c,6p
Day totals (calculated by Fitday.com): 1745 calories, 42 fat grams, 193 carbs, 153 protein
I do believe my carbs need to be lower (in the morning i didn’t know I was going to have a 53-carb drink after working out). I could use a boost in protein, and it will be interesting how I do with that, without a buckt of whey like I used to have at home.
Also, remember, I’m around 1800 calories in an effort to lose fat.
Let me know if with that workout, even 1800 good calories seems too low. I feel fine right now.
ALL INPUT APPRECIATED. I wouldn’t be throwing this all out there if I didn’t want an honest response. I’m no doctor, obviously.
Thanks again everyone,
Johndogg
Hi all…
So, today I ate similar to yesterday. I had worked out 3 days in a row, so I did cardio this evening, and gave lifting a day off.
About an hour after dinner, I did a sprint interval cardio session. I have a hard time running and watching a clock. So, there’s a relatively straight and flat road, with telephone poles (with lights) every 30 yds. For today, I walked briskly to the first pole, about 300 yds. from my place. I then jogged the first increment, sprinted to the next, and alternated. I continued on a 30yd jog/30yd sprint workout until about the 5th sprint…i then walked about 40 yds (i was freakin cooked!), and headed back, and did the same 30-yd jog/30-yd sprint sequence upon return (albeit not quite as fast as the way out 
). I then walked the 300-yds home.
How does this sound, and was it at an okay time in the day? I like the intensity of the sprint workout, and the shortness in time (20 mins or so? including the walking?).
I want to burn fat, and figured this to be the way to go (especially on a lifting day off).
Is this something I could incorporate into my lifting days (on occasion), or would that be too much?
Cheers guys, this site has been awesome.
-Johndogg
UPDATE
So, things are going well. I’m catching my stride a bit in the gym. I don’t have a specific set routine, but I’ve read on here that it could be good that way.
Here’s an idea of what I’ve been doing…
Day 1- total body workout (balanced routine, extra chest set at the end)
Day 2- sprint cardio (2 min. warm up, 2 min cool down)30 sec jog, 30 sec sprint for 15 minutes
Day 3- total body (extra leg work at the end)
Day 4- total body (different reps, movements, extra arm work at end)
Day 5- sprint cardio
Day 6- rest
Day 7- bigger arms workout
Day 1- rest
Day 2- total body workout am (extra focus on chest)/pm light cardio (just to get the blood flowing)
I’ve also found some more good food supplies on the island. I’ve been eating Tilapia, Tuna (tuna steak and canned) hard boiled eggs, fresh fruit, cottage cheese and veggies. I also found…GET THIS…a respected BEEF GUY on the island. I had an amazing steak the other night…my first steak in 9 MONTHS!!! So that is good news to me, anyway.
My numbers on average the last 2 weeks have been around 215 g of protein, 80 carbs, and around 1600-1800 calories (trying to lose fat here!)
I was also wondering, as I was thinking of placing an internet order, as to the supplements you’d reccomend. I have long thought that my problem in developing my chest might be related to maybe not enough testosterone, so I’ve thought of ordering Alpha Male.(Are estrogen blockers shit? Is there anything else that could help my test levels legally?) I am also planning on ordering HOT-ROX Extreme, some Spike for the longer days, the new Grow! protein that Biotest is now selling, some german creatine, and maaaybe some Surge…Not sure if Surge is appropriate for losing fat/weight, but let me know.
Previously(when I was working out before coming down here, Tribulus worked for me slightly, I was big into Whey Protein, I used creatine but not totally effectively, and I used Ripped Fuel as well for a little bit.
Any help on any topic I’ve discussed, or any random advice, let me know!
Make sure you aren’t starving youself. If you eat too little, you’ll loose your muscle and not burn as much energy as you would otherwise.
You know what supps might work best for you, but in no order, here is what I’d consider:
protein powder: if you get a whey type powder (like Grow! Whey) you can use this PWO with some sugar added in, or mabey have a few pieces of fruit.
For night time, have a scoop of whey with a solid P+F meal and mabey a fiberous but very low carb vegtable, or flax seed(not too big of a meal or too much fat) but this should last you part of the night like casien type proteins would.
fish oil
HOT-ROX Extreme, but make sure you’re recording your progress before and during so you don’t waste money if it isn’t working
The rest of the stuff in the store is up to you. Most of it will help you, but I’d focus on these for now.
Good luck, and that sucks about not having a job.
When you are dieting, Surge during a workout would be good to keep muscle and not loose it.
You can’t mix:
Alpha Male (AM) & HOT-ROX Extreme (HRX)
Alpha Male & Maximum Strength HOT-ROX
Alpha Male & TRIBEX Gold
Alpha Male & Carbolin 19 (Carbolin 19)
Alpha Male & Spike
HOT-ROX Extreme & Carbolin 19
HOT-ROX Extreme & Maximum Strength HOT-ROX
HOT-ROX Extreme & Alpha Male
HOT-ROX Extreme & Spike
Maximum Strength HOT-ROX & Carbolin 19
Maximum Strength HOT-ROX & Alpha Male
Maximum Strength HOT-ROX & HOT-ROX Extreme
Maximum Strength HOT-ROX & Spike
Spike & Alpha Male
Spike & HOT-ROX Extreme
Spike & Maximum Strength HOT-ROX
Spike & Carbolin 19
Everything else should be fine though.
HOT-ROX Extreme is better than Maximum Strength HOT-ROX, unless you don’t respond well to yohimbe
So, if you want to use a T-booster, you can’t use Alpha Male and HOT-ROX. You would have to use TRIBEX Gold. Dieting isn’t friendly on testosterone levels, so this may be benificial.
EDIT: Added Spike to the list. I’ll just copy and paste this whenever someone asks a question on what they can or can’t mix.
[quote]Nomancer wrote:
When you are dieting, Surge during a workout would be good to keep muscle and not loose it.
You can’t mix:
Alpha Male (AM) & HOT-ROX Extreme (HRX)
Alpha Male & Maximum Strength HOT-ROX
Alpha Male & TRIBEX Gold
Alpha Male & Carbolin 19 (Carbolin 19)
HOT-ROX Extreme & Carbolin 19
HOT-ROX Extreme & Maximum Strength HOT-ROX
HOT-ROX Extreme & Alpha Male
Maximum Strength HOT-ROX & Carbolin 19
Maximum Strength HOT-ROX & Alpha Male
Maximum Strength HOT-ROX & HOT-ROX Extreme
Everything else should be fine though.
HOT-ROX Extreme is better than Maximum Strength HOT-ROX, unless you don’t respond well to yohimbe
So, if you want to use a T-booster, you can’t use Alpha Male and HOT-ROX. You would have to use TRIBEX Gold[/quote]
Thanks for the great advice. I used the original HOT-ROX back in the day, and it worked pretty well…So I’m assuming the newest version, HOT-ROX Extreme, would do good things for me. I have also had fair success with Yohimbe, so that shouldn’t hurt. I took a Tribulus supplement about a year and a half ago, and didn’t notice much…I’m open to trying TRIBEX, though…I do believe it works, I just think I might have gotten a shitty supply (before my T-Nation Biotest awakening!).
After reading your advice, and reading other posts, I think I will start with something like this:
HOT-ROX Extreme & TRIBEX Gold (I’m pretty sure that is okay).
Grow! Whey Protein
Surge
Creatine
Spike for the slow days
Now, a couple of things… I figure that right now, HOT-ROX Extreme will benefit me more than Alpha Male…obviously I won’t know until I try both. Would it be wise to get both bottles, work on one, see what it does, and then go to the other? I understand one is to boost my testosterone levels, the other is to help fat loss/lean muscle, I just feel like I want both to happen (As everyone out there does too). Havin said that, would HOT-ROX Extreme + TRIBEX Gold be as close as I could get to that?
Also, I agree with what you posted for Surge. Using it during workout should be beneficial. Makes perfect sense.
Is throwing Spike in there a bad idea (I got the idea that it didn’t really affect other supps)?
Should I hold off on creatine? I could mix it with crystal light or something and not have an issue with calories.
The benefits of the protein are huge, I know. I figure once I get these products (probably 2-3 weeks), I will have lost a fair amount of weight/fat. At that point, I am currently planning on staying at the same calorie level with my food, around 1600-1800 useful cals, but adding 2 protein shakes and a surge workout drink. That should get my caloric intake right where I need it to be to burn fat like a machine and put on muscle. (If I’m wrong- I’ll change it! But that’s the “plan” for now).
Thanks again…I’m pumped that I rededicated myself, and that I found this site…together, the results could be scary. There’s more information here than I ever could have imagined.
-Johndogg
I know alot of people aren’t going to like this but look where you are. You’re not living in the US any more, the food choices are going to be different. Take advantage of the foods that are there because you are likely not going to encounter many of them again when you leave. If you try to say to me that the foods aren’t healthy and aren’t good for your goals you aren’t eating them at the right time or in the right amounts. Take a look at the big guys on the island who are natives, I am sure that they don’t make anywhere close to as much money as you do and yet they are still ripped. Make do with what you have.
I’m surprized you have overlooked the most obvious source of beneficial EFA’s available to you. Coconuts. I spent some time on Grand Cayman long ago, I was broke, but resourceful. Need protein? … try the local meat. Dry rub goat jerk. The goat is low fat and the dry rub is low cal and spicy as hell. There is no excuse for poor earing habits or no workouts no matter where you are. You don’t have to be female to be a mother of invention.
[quote]Yo Momma wrote:
I’m surprized you have overlooked the most obvious source of beneficial EFA’s available to you. Coconuts. I spent some time on Grand Cayman long ago, I was broke, but resourceful. Need protein? … try the local meat. Dry rub goat jerk. The goat is low fat and the dry rub is low cal and spicy as hell. There is no excuse for poor earing habits or no workouts no matter where you are. You don’t have to be female to be a mother of invention.[/quote]
Good points…Since I started this thread a couple weeks back, I’ve opened my eyes and found TONS more than I realized…I’ve had some goat ribs in a jerk rub, and it was pretty solid…some local guys cook them up on Fridays…also, about the coconuts… Coconut meat, water etc. is beneficial would you say?
Thanks,
Johndogg
[quote]bigscarymonster wrote:
I know alot of people aren’t going to like this but look where you are. You’re not living in the US any more, the food choices are going to be different. Take advantage of the foods that are there because you are likely not going to encounter many of them again when you leave. If you try to say to me that the foods aren’t healthy and aren’t good for your goals you aren’t eating them at the right time or in the right amounts. Take a look at the big guys on the island who are natives, I am sure that they don’t make anywhere close to as much money as you do and yet they are still ripped. Make do with what you have.[/quote]
You’re right. And I’m starting to do exactly what you’ve said…I’ve tried all sorts of stuff…fish and otherwise…local fruits and veggies…
I’m workin on it fellas! It just took me opening my mind more (obviously I’m open minded to be living here in the first place), and loof around.
I’m progressing and learning.
Thanks for the straight forward advice.
-Johndogg
Don’t mix Spike with HOT-ROX (see my edit above).
Remember, these aren’t magic pills. You only just started working out and dieting so don’t use these for either an excuse to slack on your diet, or to rely on them. They are just an aid.
You seem to have made good progress in your knowledge though.
So, I ditched the Spike…I made an order of the following:
HOT-ROX Extreme
German Creatine
Tribulus-500
ZMA
5LB Grow! Whey Protein
I figure I’ll give the HOT-ROX a go first, how it goes, then decide afterwards if I want to go into the Alpha Male. HOT-ROX is pretty good stuff (from what I understand). (I’m assuming TRIBEX, HOT-ROX and ZMA can be used in the same day?)
And I hear ya…I know these are just aids…I wouldn’t have come down from almost 300 lumpy pounds to where I was on just supplements.l…that takes hard work man, albeit not the same type of work I’m gunning for now.
I’ll keep y’all posted- Thanks for the help so far, it’s been great.
-Johnny