Steroids: Why or Why Not?

Training
442

[quote]conservativedog wrote:
If you have not seen the film Bigger, Stronger, Faster* a 2008 documentary film directed by Christopher Bell about the use of anabolic steroids then I highly recommend it.

Stephen Holden of The New York Times released a positive review shortly before the film’s release, noting that it takes a look at steroid use from numerous perspectives and that “although the movie doesn’t defend steroid use, neither does it go on the attack.” Holden said that the film "left [him] convinced that the steroid scandals will abate as the drugs are reluctantly accepted as inevitable products of a continuing revolution in biotechnology. Replaceable body parts, plastic surgery, anti-depressants, Viagra and steroids are just a few of the technological advancements in a never-ending drive to make the species superhuman.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bigger,_Stronger,_Faster*[/quote]

I watched this 2 or 3 years ago. Its great. Very informative, and if you can watch this whole thing and still demonize steroids afterwards, you’re a narrow-minded puppet.

443

[quote]audiogarden1 wrote:

[quote]conservativedog wrote:
If you have not seen the film Bigger, Stronger, Faster* a 2008 documentary film directed by Christopher Bell about the use of anabolic steroids then I highly recommend it.

Stephen Holden of The New York Times released a positive review shortly before the film’s release, noting that it takes a look at steroid use from numerous perspectives and that “although the movie doesn’t defend steroid use, neither does it go on the attack.” Holden said that the film "left [him] convinced that the steroid scandals will abate as the drugs are reluctantly accepted as inevitable products of a continuing revolution in biotechnology. Replaceable body parts, plastic surgery, anti-depressants, Viagra and steroids are just a few of the technological advancements in a never-ending drive to make the species superhuman.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bigger,_Stronger,_Faster*[/quote]

I watched this 2 or 3 years ago. Its great. Very informative, and if you can watch this whole thing and still demonize steroids afterwards, you’re a narrow-minded puppet.[/quote]

x2. I watched this before I knew anything about teh juice, but it still swayed me to look at AAS in a different light.

444

[quote]Waittz wrote:

[quote]Mr. Walkway wrote:

[quote]Waittz wrote:

[quote]MattyXL wrote:
For the most part this has been an absolute great read. I’m 37 and only now have considered the use of AAS. Im still progressing, especially in terms of strength but at this point, it seems like the next level to take. Then on the other hand, while this is a passion, it is not my livelihood and will never get paid for it, but besides from the joy my family and some friends bring me, nothing makes me happier than gains in the gym. I dont look at it as a shortcut, as I have been at it long enough (Over 10 years, though admittedly the first 5 I had no idea what I was doing) I simply look at it as the next step.

My main worries are the dependence aspect of it, more specifically will I ever want to get off? The emotional aspect, as I have dealt with psychological issues my whole life (i.e. depression). This is my main stumbling block and probably the main reason when AAS is at arms length I back off, I cant put my wife through any more shit with regards to my head issues. I also would be lying if I was not worried about the other side effects that are accompanied by AAS use, while it is possibly overblown its still there. Anyways this was/is a very good thread[/quote]

You bring up alot of good points. The times I have considered it I was going to take the Caveman approach. Do 1 or 2 low/moderate dose controlled cycles a year. Problem is that I have problems with addiction and substance abuse in the past so AAS like any drug is basically 100% off limits for me.

Kind of what prompted my question to Walkway. Most of the guys I know who use, claim they are not addicted, but use year round and have no planned ‘out’ so to speak. Big red flag for a guy like me with depency issues. [/quote]

I am addicted yes. I’ve never done another drug in my life however, and I haven’t consumed alcohol in 7 years.

I’ve given away all the bottles of painkillers i received after my numerous oral surgeries for example…

I have an addictive personality as well, but I believe aas is justifiable [/quote]

Didnt mean to make it sound like I was labeling you as addicted. Just trying to say that I know alot of people who never plan to be off or stop, which freaks me out since I have had my issues with addiction. Having an addictive personality is much different than actually having an addiction that breeds a phyiscal and mental dependancy.

To echo what Matt said, AAS is the Dark Side of the force for me and I know it. There would be no going back and ill admit most likely abuse. [/quote]

You haven’t tried drugs till you’ve tried testosterone. The first cycle I did I had a euphoric high like nothing I’ve ever known or felt. It’s the most powerful feeling in the world. It was like a light switch went on. It is literally like feeling the essence of masculinity running through your veins. If you have an addictive personality, then once you get on the train, you ain’t ever coming off.

But you will fucking love the ride!

445

[quote]audiogarden1 wrote:

[quote]willden wrote:

[quote]SavagedNatiion wrote:
People are so fearful of this powerful thing, I can’t even compare the amount of DWIs, Homicides, suicides, violent accidents occur while consuming alcohol and recreational drugs yet, steroids are villified.[/quote]

What does this have to do with anything? Drugs like heroin or meth aren’t villified? The number of people using alcohol compared to AAS isn’t even close anyway. Most people can drink just fine with no negative effects at all other than a hangover.

I absolutely do believe tren rage exists. There’s just way too many stories out there. Maybe not from just running test, but yeah it depends on what you’re running. [/quote]

No one mentioned hardcore drugs.

And proportionate to the number of people who use alcohol regularly, im sure it has caused faaar more problems than steroids.

Less people die in steroid related incidents than in shark attacks each year. That sounds pretty safe to me. Sure there are sides, but theres enough knowledge and other medication/supplements out there to minimize them to the point of being negligible in most cases.

In general, steroids at least have the advantage of not being completely mood-altering and impairing your ability to make smart choices. [/quote]

It depends how you look at it. I think the health consequences of steroids are under-reported. If you end up with a shorted lifespan due to heart issues, or liver cancer from tamoxifen decades later, it’s not going to get reported correctly. Plus when steroids were developed testing was not as good as it is now. There have not really been any proper studies of the long term effects. For example, new research has suggested that boldenone can cause DNA damage in liver cells, and in rare cases make a testicle explode. Nobody knew that shit before, apart from the unlucky few.

446

[quote]MassiveGuns wrote:

[quote]Waittz wrote:

[quote]Mr. Walkway wrote:

[quote]Waittz wrote:

[quote]MattyXL wrote:
For the most part this has been an absolute great read. I’m 37 and only now have considered the use of AAS. Im still progressing, especially in terms of strength but at this point, it seems like the next level to take. Then on the other hand, while this is a passion, it is not my livelihood and will never get paid for it, but besides from the joy my family and some friends bring me, nothing makes me happier than gains in the gym. I dont look at it as a shortcut, as I have been at it long enough (Over 10 years, though admittedly the first 5 I had no idea what I was doing) I simply look at it as the next step.

My main worries are the dependence aspect of it, more specifically will I ever want to get off? The emotional aspect, as I have dealt with psychological issues my whole life (i.e. depression). This is my main stumbling block and probably the main reason when AAS is at arms length I back off, I cant put my wife through any more shit with regards to my head issues. I also would be lying if I was not worried about the other side effects that are accompanied by AAS use, while it is possibly overblown its still there. Anyways this was/is a very good thread[/quote]

You bring up alot of good points. The times I have considered it I was going to take the Caveman approach. Do 1 or 2 low/moderate dose controlled cycles a year. Problem is that I have problems with addiction and substance abuse in the past so AAS like any drug is basically 100% off limits for me.

Kind of what prompted my question to Walkway. Most of the guys I know who use, claim they are not addicted, but use year round and have no planned ‘out’ so to speak. Big red flag for a guy like me with depency issues. [/quote]

I am addicted yes. I’ve never done another drug in my life however, and I haven’t consumed alcohol in 7 years.

I’ve given away all the bottles of painkillers i received after my numerous oral surgeries for example…

I have an addictive personality as well, but I believe aas is justifiable [/quote]

Didnt mean to make it sound like I was labeling you as addicted. Just trying to say that I know alot of people who never plan to be off or stop, which freaks me out since I have had my issues with addiction. Having an addictive personality is much different than actually having an addiction that breeds a phyiscal and mental dependancy.

To echo what Matt said, AAS is the Dark Side of the force for me and I know it. There would be no going back and ill admit most likely abuse. [/quote]

You haven’t tried drugs till you’ve tried testosterone. The first cycle I did I had a euphoric high like nothing I’ve ever known or felt. It’s the most powerful feeling in the world. It was like a light switch went on. It is literally like feeling the essence of masculinity running through your veins. If you have an addictive personality, then once you get on the train, you ain’t ever coming off.

But you will fucking love the ride![/quote]

Ive had friends who’ve described it exactly like this. Waking up in the morning and feeling like your arms were going to explode before you even got out of bed. (in a good way)

Still cant bring myself to try it though for the same reasons many have mentioned; Dependance.

Im afraid that one of 2 things will happen when i come off; Ill get completely unmotivated from the initial losses or itll just make me jump right back into it.

447

[quote]MassiveGuns wrote:

[quote]audiogarden1 wrote:

[quote]willden wrote:

[quote]SavagedNatiion wrote:
People are so fearful of this powerful thing, I can’t even compare the amount of DWIs, Homicides, suicides, violent accidents occur while consuming alcohol and recreational drugs yet, steroids are villified.[/quote]

What does this have to do with anything? Drugs like heroin or meth aren’t villified? The number of people using alcohol compared to AAS isn’t even close anyway. Most people can drink just fine with no negative effects at all other than a hangover.

I absolutely do believe tren rage exists. There’s just way too many stories out there. Maybe not from just running test, but yeah it depends on what you’re running. [/quote]

No one mentioned hardcore drugs.

And proportionate to the number of people who use alcohol regularly, im sure it has caused faaar more problems than steroids.

Less people die in steroid related incidents than in shark attacks each year. That sounds pretty safe to me. Sure there are sides, but theres enough knowledge and other medication/supplements out there to minimize them to the point of being negligible in most cases.

In general, steroids at least have the advantage of not being completely mood-altering and impairing your ability to make smart choices. [/quote]

It depends how you look at it. I think the health consequences of steroids are under-reported. If you end up with a shorted lifespan due to heart issues, or liver cancer from tamoxifen decades later, it’s not going to get reported correctly. Plus when steroids were developed testing was not as good as it is now. There have not really been any proper studies of the long term effects. For example, new research has suggested that boldenone can cause DNA damage in liver cells, and in rare cases make a testicle explode. Nobody knew that shit before, apart from the unlucky few.
[/quote]

I completely agree with you but i refuse to believe that proportionate to the number of users, alcohol doesnt have drastically more negative effects/consequences.

448

[quote]audiogarden1 wrote:

[quote]conservativedog wrote:
If you have not seen the film Bigger, Stronger, Faster* a 2008 documentary film directed by Christopher Bell about the use of anabolic steroids then I highly recommend it.

Stephen Holden of The New York Times released a positive review shortly before the film’s release, noting that it takes a look at steroid use from numerous perspectives and that “although the movie doesn’t defend steroid use, neither does it go on the attack.” Holden said that the film "left [him] convinced that the steroid scandals will abate as the drugs are reluctantly accepted as inevitable products of a continuing revolution in biotechnology. Replaceable body parts, plastic surgery, anti-depressants, Viagra and steroids are just a few of the technological advancements in a never-ending drive to make the species superhuman.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bigger,_Stronger,_Faster*[/quote]

I watched this 2 or 3 years ago. Its great. Very informative, and if you can watch this whole thing and still demonize steroids afterwards, you’re a narrow-minded puppet.[/quote]

Really? My takeway was a guy who was taking massive amounts of steroids, but basically no matter how much he took he couldn’t reach his goal of becoming a pro wrestler. In the process he pretty much sacrificed everything else.

They make some good points about it in sports and why is it cheating to be your best. But I think they missed the boat. Its banned really to level the playing field. Once you allow steroids and other drugs in sports, it becomes an arms race and people will start doing massively unhealthy things in order to earn money.

449

[quote]willden wrote:

[quote]audiogarden1 wrote:

[quote]conservativedog wrote:
If you have not seen the film Bigger, Stronger, Faster* a 2008 documentary film directed by Christopher Bell about the use of anabolic steroids then I highly recommend it.

Stephen Holden of The New York Times released a positive review shortly before the film’s release, noting that it takes a look at steroid use from numerous perspectives and that “although the movie doesn’t defend steroid use, neither does it go on the attack.” Holden said that the film "left [him] convinced that the steroid scandals will abate as the drugs are reluctantly accepted as inevitable products of a continuing revolution in biotechnology. Replaceable body parts, plastic surgery, anti-depressants, Viagra and steroids are just a few of the technological advancements in a never-ending drive to make the species superhuman.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bigger,_Stronger,_Faster*[/quote]

I watched this 2 or 3 years ago. Its great. Very informative, and if you can watch this whole thing and still demonize steroids afterwards, you’re a narrow-minded puppet.[/quote]

Really? My takeway was a guy who was taking massive amounts of steroids, but basically no matter how much he took he couldn’t reach his goal of becoming a pro wrestler. In the process he pretty much sacrificed everything else.
[/quote]

Well not everybody who views this movie will do so through your lense of ignorance.

I imagine you take little of value away from most things.

450

[quote]willden wrote:

[quote]audiogarden1 wrote:

[quote]conservativedog wrote:
If you have not seen the film Bigger, Stronger, Faster* a 2008 documentary film directed by Christopher Bell about the use of anabolic steroids then I highly recommend it.

Stephen Holden of The New York Times released a positive review shortly before the film’s release, noting that it takes a look at steroid use from numerous perspectives and that “although the movie doesn’t defend steroid use, neither does it go on the attack.” Holden said that the film "left [him] convinced that the steroid scandals will abate as the drugs are reluctantly accepted as inevitable products of a continuing revolution in biotechnology. Replaceable body parts, plastic surgery, anti-depressants, Viagra and steroids are just a few of the technological advancements in a never-ending drive to make the species superhuman.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bigger,_Stronger,_Faster*[/quote]

I watched this 2 or 3 years ago. Its great. Very informative, and if you can watch this whole thing and still demonize steroids afterwards, you’re a narrow-minded puppet.[/quote]

Really? My takeway was a guy who was taking massive amounts of steroids, but basically no matter how much he took he couldn’t reach his goal of becoming a pro wrestler. In the process he pretty much sacrificed everything else.

They make some good points about it in sports and why is it cheating to be your best. But I think they missed the boat. Its banned really to level the playing field. Once you allow steroids and other drugs in sports, it becomes an arms race and people will start doing massively unhealthy things in order to earn money.[/quote]
Massive amounts of anything can mess you up

451

[quote]audiogarden1 wrote:

[quote]willden wrote:

[quote]audiogarden1 wrote:

[quote]conservativedog wrote:
If you have not seen the film Bigger, Stronger, Faster* a 2008 documentary film directed by Christopher Bell about the use of anabolic steroids then I highly recommend it.

Stephen Holden of The New York Times released a positive review shortly before the film’s release, noting that it takes a look at steroid use from numerous perspectives and that “although the movie doesn’t defend steroid use, neither does it go on the attack.” Holden said that the film "left [him] convinced that the steroid scandals will abate as the drugs are reluctantly accepted as inevitable products of a continuing revolution in biotechnology. Replaceable body parts, plastic surgery, anti-depressants, Viagra and steroids are just a few of the technological advancements in a never-ending drive to make the species superhuman.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bigger,_Stronger,_Faster*[/quote]

I watched this 2 or 3 years ago. Its great. Very informative, and if you can watch this whole thing and still demonize steroids afterwards, you’re a narrow-minded puppet.[/quote]

Really? My takeway was a guy who was taking massive amounts of steroids, but basically no matter how much he took he couldn’t reach his goal of becoming a pro wrestler. In the process he pretty much sacrificed everything else.
[/quote]

Well not everybody who views this movie will do so through your lense of ignorance.

I imagine you take little of value away from most things. [/quote]

Yes like your stupid posts for example- I take very little value from them. Your takeaway was the health effects aren’t as bad as the media reports? Pretty sure everyone on this board already knew that without having to watch a documentary.

452

[quote]willden wrote:

[quote]audiogarden1 wrote:

[quote]willden wrote:

[quote]audiogarden1 wrote:

[quote]conservativedog wrote:
If you have not seen the film Bigger, Stronger, Faster* a 2008 documentary film directed by Christopher Bell about the use of anabolic steroids then I highly recommend it.

Stephen Holden of The New York Times released a positive review shortly before the film’s release, noting that it takes a look at steroid use from numerous perspectives and that “although the movie doesn’t defend steroid use, neither does it go on the attack.” Holden said that the film "left [him] convinced that the steroid scandals will abate as the drugs are reluctantly accepted as inevitable products of a continuing revolution in biotechnology. Replaceable body parts, plastic surgery, anti-depressants, Viagra and steroids are just a few of the technological advancements in a never-ending drive to make the species superhuman.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bigger,_Stronger,_Faster*[/quote]

I watched this 2 or 3 years ago. Its great. Very informative, and if you can watch this whole thing and still demonize steroids afterwards, you’re a narrow-minded puppet.[/quote]

Really? My takeway was a guy who was taking massive amounts of steroids, but basically no matter how much he took he couldn’t reach his goal of becoming a pro wrestler. In the process he pretty much sacrificed everything else.
[/quote]

Well not everybody who views this movie will do so through your lense of ignorance.

I imagine you take little of value away from most things. [/quote]

Yes like your stupid posts for example- I take very little value from them. Your takeaway was the health effects aren’t as bad as the media reports? Pretty sure everyone on this board already knew that without having to watch a documentary.
[/quote]

Lol, says the guy who’s been over-blowing the health issues related to steroids from the start.

453

I did not take the time to read all 18 pages in the thread. What I can offer you is my own personal experience.

I always wanted to be a freak. I knew from early on that steroids were part of the game. I never had a moral issue with them.

Is it cheating? If your a bodybuilder, I think not (unless you are doing natty shows and claiming natty, then it’s chickenshit). Drugs are tied so heavy to the sport.

If it’s strength sports, it depends. If you are in a drug tested powerlifting fed and using, again, that’s bullshit. If you are in strongman or an untested fed, you have to realize that you will be competing against many other people who are using them. You will never be as big and strong without them, as you will with them.

With regards to health risks, I think they are severely overblown. As someone who is on HRT and has ran 1 or 2 cycles a year for 7 years, my bloodwork has never been an issue. My wife just became pregnant without us trying to conceive (she wanted to come off birth control, 2 months later she was preggers). There are health risks to being this bodyweight however. The heart is not meant to support 270, 300, 330lbs of fat OR muscle.

For me, the pro list is so long and the con list is so short. It’s a personal choice that everyone has to make. I respect any of the people who choose to stay natural as that is hard thing to do with this lifestyle.

454

[quote]Monopoly19 wrote:
I did not take the time to read all 18 pages in the thread. What I can offer you is my own personal experience.

I always wanted to be a freak. I knew from early on that steroids were part of the game. I never had a moral issue with them.

Is it cheating? If your a bodybuilder, I think not (unless you are doing natty shows and claiming natty, then it’s chickenshit). Drugs are tied so heavy to the sport.

If it’s strength sports, it depends. If you are in a drug tested powerlifting fed and using, again, that’s bullshit. If you are in strongman or an untested fed, you have to realize that you will be competing against many other people who are using them. You will never be as big and strong without them, as you will with them.

With regards to health risks, I think they are severely overblown. As someone who is on HRT and has ran 1 or 2 cycles a year for 7 years, my bloodwork has never been an issue. My wife just became pregnant without us trying to conceive (she wanted to come off birth control, 2 months later she was preggers). There are health risks to being this bodyweight however. The heart is not meant to support 270, 300, 330lbs of fat OR muscle.

For me, the pro list is so long and the con list is so short. It’s a personal choice that everyone has to make. I respect any of the people who choose to stay natural as that is hard thing to do with this lifestyle. [/quote]

Are you on HRT because eventually PCT stopped working for you, or you just decided to blast and cruise…or just age? Also curious if you ever regret that now you’re essentially a slave to weekly injections for life…have you tried to restart with HCG or anything like that?

455

[quote]willden wrote:

[quote]Monopoly19 wrote:
I did not take the time to read all 18 pages in the thread. What I can offer you is my own personal experience.

I always wanted to be a freak. I knew from early on that steroids were part of the game. I never had a moral issue with them.

Is it cheating? If your a bodybuilder, I think not (unless you are doing natty shows and claiming natty, then it’s chickenshit). Drugs are tied so heavy to the sport.

If it’s strength sports, it depends. If you are in a drug tested powerlifting fed and using, again, that’s bullshit. If you are in strongman or an untested fed, you have to realize that you will be competing against many other people who are using them. You will never be as big and strong without them, as you will with them.

With regards to health risks, I think they are severely overblown. As someone who is on HRT and has ran 1 or 2 cycles a year for 7 years, my bloodwork has never been an issue. My wife just became pregnant without us trying to conceive (she wanted to come off birth control, 2 months later she was preggers). There are health risks to being this bodyweight however. The heart is not meant to support 270, 300, 330lbs of fat OR muscle.

For me, the pro list is so long and the con list is so short. It’s a personal choice that everyone has to make. I respect any of the people who choose to stay natural as that is hard thing to do with this lifestyle. [/quote]

Are you on HRT because eventually PCT stopped working for you, or you just decided to blast and cruise…or just age? Also curious if you ever regret that now you’re essentially a slave to weekly injections for life…have you tried to restart with HCG or anything like that?[/quote]

I should have mentioned in my first post. I had bloodwork done for some reason when I was 20 years old. My test levels were in the tank, around 300 or so. Of course, my Dr said that was “normal” and I honestly didn’t know any better.

After coming off my 3rd or 4th cycle and running a traditional PCT, I got bloodwork 10 or 12 weeks later. My levels were in the shitter. I decided then that I was going on HRT. I was tired of feeling like ass coming off.

Do I like the fact that I’m committed to shots once a week for the rest of my life? Who in their right mind would? When I’m done with my serious training and lifting I will probably switch over to androgel or something similar. If for some reason I started to have other health problems that were tied to my usage I would stop. This is the only reason I can think of that would make me discontinue the protocol.

I don’t think there is anyway that after all this time my levels would go back to “normal”. One of my very good friends and training partners, who is also on HRT, had to recently come off for 8 months to conceive a child. During this time he did what the doc told him to do. HCG, nova, clomid and even some adex mixed in. After the first 5 months, he actually started feeling better. He got blood work done in month 8 and he was at like a 120 or something stupid low. Now that he and his wife are 3 months pregnant, he got back on :slight_smile:

456

[quote]Monopoly19 wrote:
I did not take the time to read all 18 pages in the thread. What I can offer you is my own personal experience.

I always wanted to be a freak. I knew from early on that steroids were part of the game. I never had a moral issue with them.

Is it cheating? If your a bodybuilder, I think not (unless you are doing natty shows and claiming natty, then it’s chickenshit). Drugs are tied so heavy to the sport.

If it’s strength sports, it depends. If you are in a drug tested powerlifting fed and using, again, that’s bullshit. If you are in strongman or an untested fed, you have to realize that you will be competing against many other people who are using them. You will never be as big and strong without them, as you will with them.

With regards to health risks, I think they are severely overblown. As someone who is on HRT and has ran 1 or 2 cycles a year for 7 years, my bloodwork has never been an issue. My wife just became pregnant without us trying to conceive (she wanted to come off birth control, 2 months later she was preggers). There are health risks to being this bodyweight however. The heart is not meant to support 270, 300, 330lbs of fat OR muscle.

For me, the pro list is so long and the con list is so short. It’s a personal choice that everyone has to make. I respect any of the people who choose to stay natural as that is hard thing to do with this lifestyle. [/quote]

Better get a DNA test. Your chances of conceiving on hrt are tiny…

457

[quote]MassiveGuns wrote:

[quote]Monopoly19 wrote:
I did not take the time to read all 18 pages in the thread. What I can offer you is my own personal experience.

I always wanted to be a freak. I knew from early on that steroids were part of the game. I never had a moral issue with them.

Is it cheating? If your a bodybuilder, I think not (unless you are doing natty shows and claiming natty, then it’s chickenshit). Drugs are tied so heavy to the sport.

If it’s strength sports, it depends. If you are in a drug tested powerlifting fed and using, again, that’s bullshit. If you are in strongman or an untested fed, you have to realize that you will be competing against many other people who are using them. You will never be as big and strong without them, as you will with them.

With regards to health risks, I think they are severely overblown. As someone who is on HRT and has ran 1 or 2 cycles a year for 7 years, my bloodwork has never been an issue. My wife just became pregnant without us trying to conceive (she wanted to come off birth control, 2 months later she was preggers). There are health risks to being this bodyweight however. The heart is not meant to support 270, 300, 330lbs of fat OR muscle.

For me, the pro list is so long and the con list is so short. It’s a personal choice that everyone has to make. I respect any of the people who choose to stay natural as that is hard thing to do with this lifestyle. [/quote]

Better get a DNA test. Your chances of conceiving on hrt are tiny…
[/quote]

nope…

458

[quote]willden wrote:

[quote]Monopoly19 wrote:
I did not take the time to read all 18 pages in the thread. What I can offer you is my own personal experience.

I always wanted to be a freak. I knew from early on that steroids were part of the game. I never had a moral issue with them.

Is it cheating? If your a bodybuilder, I think not (unless you are doing natty shows and claiming natty, then it’s chickenshit). Drugs are tied so heavy to the sport.

If it’s strength sports, it depends. If you are in a drug tested powerlifting fed and using, again, that’s bullshit. If you are in strongman or an untested fed, you have to realize that you will be competing against many other people who are using them. You will never be as big and strong without them, as you will with them.

With regards to health risks, I think they are severely overblown. As someone who is on HRT and has ran 1 or 2 cycles a year for 7 years, my bloodwork has never been an issue. My wife just became pregnant without us trying to conceive (she wanted to come off birth control, 2 months later she was preggers). There are health risks to being this bodyweight however. The heart is not meant to support 270, 300, 330lbs of fat OR muscle.

For me, the pro list is so long and the con list is so short. It’s a personal choice that everyone has to make. I respect any of the people who choose to stay natural as that is hard thing to do with this lifestyle. [/quote]

Are you on HRT because eventually PCT stopped working for you, or you just decided to blast and cruise…or just age? Also curious if you ever regret that now you’re essentially a slave to weekly injections for life…have you tried to restart with HCG or anything like that?[/quote]

Just about everyone that is serious about lifting are slaves to daily and hourly things from pre and post workout shakes to counting macros each meal to doing brutal leg and back workouts twice per week. A once weekly injection does not sound like much compared to all of tge other things we slave ourselves to, especially when it means we will progress better. Now, I have never injected so I cant speak from experience, but it cant take more than 10 seconds to complete. It takes just as long to mix shake.

This being said, the probelem for many is tge legality imo. If tgis shit were legal everyone would be on it including me. Look at hoe many non roid users used the various prohormoneswhen they were legal.

459

the legality is not really that big of an issue…unless you are getting raws and brewing…

460

Everyone who hasn’t experienced steroids will have a certain amount of ignorance since they will not have the personal experience. At the same time, steroid users who gain 20+lbs from their first cycle will have plenty of thoughts to rationalize the fair use of the drug.

461

[quote]anthropocentric wrote:
Everyone who hasn’t experienced steroids will have a certain amount of ignorance since they will not have the personal experience. At the same time, steroid users who gain 20+lbs from their first cycle will have plenty of thoughts to rationalize the fair use of the drug. [/quote]

of those “20+lbs” the vast majority is subcutaneous + intramuscular water retention, increased glycogen retention etc…

that’s why I “lol” whenever someone is like “brah! I gained like 25 lbs off one cycle of the sterons!”