You have a terrible attitude because you are not willing to do what it takes to reach your goals. To look good being a vegitarian is just as bad of a diet as fast food and junk food and like I said if someone said they wouldn’t stop eating fast food or junk food or include a certain healthy food everyone would be saying the same thing it’s just that everyone is so used to idiot vegatarians complaining all the time that they view this differently. The live and let live thing sounds great but it’s the same thing I am not going to go to the local mcdonalds cursing people out for eating that crap but if someone says they want to lose weight or something but are not willing to give it up I definetly would.
[quote]dylan10507 wrote:
You have a terrible attitude because you are not willing to do what it takes to reach your goals. To look good being a vegitarian is just as bad of a diet as fast food and junk food and like I said if someone said they wouldn’t stop eating fast food or junk food or include a certain healthy food everyone would be saying the same thing it’s just that everyone is so used to idiot vegatarians complaining all the time that they view this differently. The live and let live thing sounds great but it’s the same thing I am not going to go to the local mcdonalds cursing people out for eating that crap but if someone says they want to lose weight or something but are not willing to give it up I definetly would.[/quote]
your argument is beyond stupidity.
looking into the velocity diet… seems like the best option for me at the moment.
Holy Meatballs Batman! Can we please drop the vegetarian crap.
If he’s eating eggs, milk, cheese, whey protein powders, etc. and getting fats from oils, nuts, avocados, etc. He’s getting PLENTY of protein and good fats. A lacto-ovo lifestyle may not be the best choice for a pro BB’er but it’s FINE for his goals.
I love a good steak too but I’m not about to force one on someone who doesn’t want it.
I think I’ll go eat a salad now…
Hey guy -
I’m no nutrition pro, but I went vegan in college. I grew up with family owning a meat store and frankly, was sick of meat.
When I say vegan I mean I ate no animal products (ie a real vegetarian).
I’m 5’9" which is short for heavyweights crew, so I had to make weight at 160, which was tough to do.
Row. Row on a Concept2 type erg. Row hard. Row intervals.
Run sprints. Run Distance.
At minimum, do bodysquats and lunges with dumbbells for weights. Cable rows. Dumbell deadlifts, suitcase db deadlifts, and explosive dumbbell cleans— Cosgrove/Waterbury style (just search this site for RFFL).
I ate TONS of natural peanutbutter, almond butter, walnuts, and pasta (early 90’s = high carbs), but for the amount of work I was doing it just burned out. I’m not saying pasta, but hit the green beans and broccoli HEAVY. Use Olive Oil.
Did I say row, sprint/run, and do dumbell complexes (if you’re set on not getting under a bar)?
You have the advantage of the Internet and tons of articles on training for fat-loss and hypertropy-- PLUS you’re eating eggs and whey protein (and BCAAs?).
I was ripped, not hyoooge, but a strong rower and lean-- and I’m a big time FFB (with a nod to Shugart).
Turn up the intensity bro-- there’s really no excuse here AFAIAC, even if you’re a “hard gainer”.
Who recommended a diet solely reliant on meat? Dropping any food group has consequences beyond the impact on protein consumption. That goes for meatONLY diets as well as meatLESS diets.
And the obesity crisis hasn’t got to do with eating the RIGHT kinds of meat alone, people fed a diet high in saturated fats, refined sugar AND refined flour and with limited exercise options and little movement beyond walking to your car in the parking lot are obviously going to be at high risk for obesity.
The bulk of people (pun intended) in good health and with a lot of muscle mass on this site (relative to their height) eat an omnivorous diet that does not limit food groups but considers macronutrients, meal timing and lift weights with progressive overload. Quite frankly your advice could well end up harmful to the OP as he will find out.
Avoiding meat is one thing, using free weights is another. But your advice to begin the velocity diet when he has the muscle mass of a teenage girl and a likely destroyed metabolism through crash dieting is irresponsible.
I recommend the OP contact Chris Shugart (author of the velocity diet) and send his photographs, stats and history and ask him if he would be a good candidate for the V diet.
OP, please PM Shugart and Thibaudeau before doing anything at this point, as he will give you some better advice imo.
Its not as simple as maintaining muscle and losing fat, you have a destroyed metabolism from crash dieting and the lean mass you have with you will not help you in your fat loss goals.
And eigen-sandow, I didn;t single out the east indians for just building routines around curls…I singled them out for three different things, including usually being the worst looking people in the gym…its the combination of the three things I mentioned that makes them stand out. Read my previous post.
[quote]eigieinhamr wrote:
A huge amount of the junk is in the form of fried bad cuts of meat. The kinds of meat people eat mainly in countries with obesity problems present a huge part of the obesity.
Just like a high meat diet doesn’t cause obesity (if you have the right kind of meats, cooked in the right way), a vegetarian diet doesn’t mean a bad body. It’s down to each induvidual diet. Someone might have a diet where their meat choices are terribly bad for them, in the same way vegetarians can make bad choices and have a terrible diet (India, which has a large vegetarian community, has issues with poverty, and therefore the quality of their diet).
Starving Africans that eat nothing but meat from their herds still have a harmfull diet in the same way. Remember vegetarians have been shown to have a longer life span compared to non-vegetarians on average (though I’m not vegetarian on health reasons).[/quote]
OP, I repeat, PM Shugart and Thibaudeau with your stats, pics and history before beginning the velocity diet. Staying vegetarian is a non-optimal but viable option with heavy weights and a good program. What youre being advised to do may not be. I;m out.
Oh, and steely D gave you some solid tips as well.
[quote]rbpowerhouse wrote:
Avoiding meat is one thing, free weights are another. But your advice to begin the velocity diet when he has the muscle mass of a teenage girl and a likely destroyed metabolism through crash dieting is irresponsible.
[/quote]
I’d care to differ, anyone of my baby sisters is stronger then the OP and I’m not trying to be mean or sarcastic.
To the OP: Pour on the veggies and listen to the Vegan tips!
Hey OP, don’t waste your time responding to people who are pulling this thread off topic. If you spent your time replying to all the idiots on this site, you’d never have time to get to the gym and actually achieve your goals.
You said you were looking into the V-diet. It’s a powerful diet to be sure, but I don’t think it’s the thing for you right now. The V-diet works basically because it restricts calories so extremely. It sounds like you’re already running pretty low on calories, especially if you think of 2100 calories as a lot to be taking in. Also, I would guess you’ve been eating really low calories any way to drop down to where you’re at now (congrats on the weight loss, btw). Your body could be burned out on the low-calorie track.
I’m not a vegetarian, and it sounds like there are guys on the site who could help direct you on that, but I think you should keep your protein easily where it’s at in terms of number of grams, and get as much as possible from animal-derived sources (eggs, milk, whey protein, etc). I think nuts are a great source too, especially because they have a lot of good fat in them, and that will help you keep your calories up.
Also, break your meals up, and have 5 or six per day. Three big ones at 600 cals, alternated with 2 little ones of 200 cals, and you’ll end up with 2400 calories/day. Make sure it’s from good sources. You’re probably worried about putting back on the weight you lost, that’s why you don’t want to up the calories. Don’t be worried, eat clean and healthy, hit the gym hard, and you’ll be surprised with how much you can eat and not gain weight.
People here have been preaching free weights, I think that’s the route to go. It sounds like you already are starting that. Awesome. In your sample workout, you had days in the gym broken down by body part. I know that’s how pros train, but it’s not going to work as effectively for you as big, full body workouts. I’ve tried them both, and the latter definately works better for me, especially since you’re not looking to be a body builder.
I think it’s a good idea for you to do 3 full body workouts/week, plus run 3 days/week. I’m puttting down the workouts I do below, because they’ve really been effective for me. There are a ton of good workouts on this site, so read those too, if you’d like. Each one of my workouts has an chest-focused push, back focused pull, overhead press (or something that focuses on shoulders) and one extra bonus exercise. Sets/Reps are 5x5 on day 1, 4x6 on day 3, and 3x10 on day 5. After a couple months, you can rotate around the set/rep scheme to different days, or change the exercises a little.
Day 1 (5x5)
Dumbbell Bench Press
Lat Pulldown (or pullups, if you can only do 5)
Seated Dumbbell shoulder press
Bent over row/seated row
Day 3 (4x6)
Bent over Row
Barbell Bench Press
Seated Barbell Shoulder Press
Dumbbell flyes
Day 5 (3x10)
Squats
Incline Bench Press
Pullups or Lat Pull
reverse dumbbell flyes
Days 2,4 and 6 I jog a mile to a track, and then do some sprint intervals. Something like 3x400m, or 4x200, or 6x100. Then it’s a mile jog home.
Day 7 is off of serious training, but you can still do something physical.
The key to success isn’t in the program as much as it is in the effort, so you need to bust your ass on everything you do. So do it, come back in 6 months with a transformed physique. No one will say shit about you being a vegetarian if you’ve done the work and gotten the results.
wow thanks for the routine thesixteenth… lots of helpful info. :D… i’m currently eating about 2100 on lifting days and maybe about 2000 on nonlifting… i’ll bump it up to 2400 starting next week (should i eat the same amount everyday or just on the lifting days?)
also here’s a pic from today; do you guys think i’ve lost some fat in the midsection:
Hey man, forget about counting calories, etc. Just throw back your veggies and protein with the majority of your meals, and like Dr. Beradi says, fat and protein in the afternoon/night. Carb cutoffs for sure after 6pm will help you drop fat off midsection fast.
Soy, in moderate amounts will not do ANYTHING to you. Some people get carried away after reading a few articles. Even Dr. Beradi has on his PN website stuff now about how moderate amounts of soy will not negatively affect you in the least. Don’t worry about minor things like that, once you get in the protein its all good.
Since you are eating eggs, then you shouldn’t have a problem, because you now have powders, milk, eggs,soy and legumes. I recommend lentils. (btw, i’m vegetarian because I’m Hindu, so the only animal products I use are dairy, and I easily get in my protein with only 4-5 meals).
You seem well grounded in your principles for being vegetarian, so I don’t have to tell you to ignore those who are telling you to eat meat.
Training wise, thesixteenth has given you good advice, so you should follow it. Whether you use machines or free weights, make sure you go heavy. No light crap, that’s just wasting time.
The vegan guy who posted had extremely good advice also, follow that. Make sure you do pushups, pullups, easy things that get you strong and will only aid in your goals.
Drink your water, and don;t overcomplicatee things. Good luck.
[quote]rxghost wrote:
looking into the velocity diet… seems like the best option for me at the moment. [/quote]
LOL!
[quote]Professor X wrote:
rxghost wrote:
looking into the velocity diet… seems like the best option for me at the moment.
LOL![/quote]
i was only taking the advice of another member… guess it’s not for me after all.
Dang, that was fast! Maybe I should have typed “LOL” instead of ranting all over the place 
Good luck with your diet and training, bro.
[quote]rxghost wrote:
Professor X wrote:
rxghost wrote:
looking into the velocity diet… seems like the best option for me at the moment.
LOL!
i was only taking the advice of another member… guess it’s not for me after all.[/quote]
rx-
congrats on the weight loss.
i am a former fat boy so i understand not wanting to get fat again. weight training is the great mitigator of getting fat unless you’re eating lots of crap.
totally cool with vegetarian thing although i am not one.
completely possible to get enough protein as has been stated.
ya gotta do free weights+energy systems work to achieve your goal.
both types of energy systems work would be optimal but if you only have time for one do HIIT/sprints.
by looking at your pics yo-yo dieting has made you insulin resistant (i’m surprised nobody said anything about this). fish oil would help as would the aforementioned weights+cardio. eat TONS of green veggies, obviously get your protein, healthy fats: eggs, most plant fats e.g. nuts, seeds (pumpkin seeds are good for test levels because of high zinc content), olive oil, avocados, the stuff that everyone has said.
Waterbury’s full body programs are great although obviously change after 4-6 weeks. try a full body then move to a upper lower split then try a 5 day split then a 6 day then back to full body. be a program whore but make sure you reach your goal with a program before changing. change is what makes progress.
read EVERYTHING YOU CAN on this website and others to educate yourself about this topic. it’s the only way to really get into it. everyone has questions and no one here with the exception of a few people has completely mastered everything about training/nutrition/supplementation but the great thing about this site is that people are striving to learn more. sorry to be preachy.
ps usage of the word your
your: your pen
yours: this is yours
you’re: YOU ARE…as in…you’re going to the store
yore: days of yore=long ago times
(this is not directed at rx but at every poster who doesn’t know how to use your/you’re correctly)
also whoever spelled cattle as “caddle” should not be allowed to post on any website let alone T-Nation. peace.
are dumbbell squats still as effective? I honestly don’t feel comfortable going under the barbell yet.
try goblin squats! Look up DAN JOHN on this site and on youtube for his tips on squats.
db squats are great however you’ll never be able to squat heavy which is important for overall muscle mass AND fat loss (metabolic boost from working a huge amount of muscle groups at once). try db variation of snatches. those are awesome they get your heart rate up real quick and like kinein said look up dan john
I’m rarely at a loss for words, which many may view as a bad thing, but threads like this bring me pretty close. I’ll just say of all the people in the western hemisphere who need to learn to eat a REAL frickin diet this kid’s probably in the top 5.
[quote]thesixteenth wrote:
Day 1 (5x5)
Dumbbell Bench Press
Lat Pulldown (or pullups, if you can only do 5)
Seated Dumbbell shoulder press
Bent over row/seated row
Day 3 (4x6)
Bent over Row
Barbell Bench Press
Seated Barbell Shoulder Press
Dumbbell flyes
Day 5 (3x10)
Squats
Incline Bench Press
Pullups or Lat Pull
reverse dumbbell flyes
[/quote]
i’m starting this program today… (with day 5)
The only changes i’m making are that I’m going to do squats and benchpressing with dumbbells.