Is there any way to go to failure more than once a workout without completely draining your CNS? I was thinking of maybe if you crossed I, Bodybuilder’s activation clusters and force spectrum ramping techniques to adjust to your max load, than go 4-6 reps to failure. Any thoughts if that’d spare atleast some of my CNS?
When your post has that many buzz-words, you are over-thinking the problem.
And not to attack, but do you even know what you are talking about when you mention the CNS, or are you just parroting information?
Man, you better get your flame suit out.
Seriously, you are 5’11" 158. You don’t need to THINK about anything other than lifting heavier weight every session. THAT’S IT.
Also, I see you started I, Bodybuilder 15 days ago. Why? This is not for beginners, and on top of that, you are already wanting to adjust that program to save something you don’t even need to be concerned with at this point. Your CNS needs to develop so it will learn how to lift heavier weight. Why would you hinder that by trying to “save it”?
Why do you want to fail at attempting a rep anyway?
True, there’s an in-group that feels that they’re heroes and superior to others because they “train to failure” and to be part of that group you have to say that too, but other than this, why do you want to fail at attempting a rep?
Or by “failure” do you mean not having failure occur?
Which believe it or not is how many who use the phrase “train to failure” use it.
[quote]kjmont wrote:
I was thinking[/quote] Stop thinking [quote] maybe if you crossed I, Bodybuilder’s activation clusters and force spectrum ramping techniques to adjust to your max load, than go 4-6 reps to failure.[/quote]
Clusterfuck reps?
And here lies the double edged sword of information. Christian experiments with what are new concepts for many of us, puts it together with cool and catchy phrases, and most people miss the entire point he was trying to make. I think if most people just focused on accleration of weight as an indicator of fatigue, that’s really all the ‘magic’ they need in trying to find ‘failure’
S
The way I see it, going to failure increases the burden on the CNS. The closer you are to failure, the harder the CNS has to work to recruit the muscle fibers in part because of the lactate and hydrogen ions accumulation in the muscle. The acidification of the muscle makes it more difficult, especially at the neuromuscular junction to transmit the motor command.
Because of that, reps that lead to muscle failure increase the stress on the CNS without increasing stimulation THAT MUCH. Even if that extra rep would give you 2% more gains (which it probably doesn’t) if it causes 10% more fatigue, in the long run it will actually be detrimental for long term progress.
Failure is not bad in itself. It is the excess of failure and near failure reps that can lead to stagnation in your training progression.
[quote]The Mighty Stu wrote:
And here lies the double edged sword of information. Christian experiments with what are new concepts for many of us, puts it together with cool and catchy phrases, and most people miss the entire point he was trying to make. I think if most people just focused on accleration of weight as an indicator of fatigue, that’s really all the ‘magic’ they need in trying to find ‘failure’
S
[/quote]
Um, how about just NOT being determined to label something “failure” just so as to feel like a hero and part of the in-group that beats their chest about “training to failure” ?
Exactly what need or reason is there to lable a method as “training to failure” when there are no failed reps and no intent to have any?
It’s bizarre, frankly, to redefine successfully completing a rep, albeit with more drop-off in speed than desired, as being “failure.”
I know I am beating my head against the wall and there is no way I will succeed in changing the minds of more than a tiny percentage of those hell-bent on “failure” as the Holy Grail, even if they have to engage in bizarre word twisting to do it.
So far as labeling CT’s techniques as “training to failure,” in the words of Dr Evil, “How about NO, you crazy Dutch bastard!!!”
Just forget the whole idea. This being wedded to “failure” is an extreme warping and is not useful.
Ah, failure, another one of those topics Bill is so fond of.
Rest-pause, Bill, you hear me? ONE SET REST-PAUSE TILL DEATH!
Just felt like contributing something meaningful today, that’s all.
[quote]cueball wrote:
Man, you better get your flame suit out.
Seriously, you are 5’11" 158. You don’t need to THINK about anything other than lifting heavier weight every session. THAT’S IT.
Also, I see you started I, Bodybuilder 15 days ago. Why? This is not for beginners, and on top of that, you are already wanting to adjust that program to save something you don’t even need to be concerned with at this point. Your CNS needs to develop so it will learn how to lift heavier weight. Why would you hinder that by trying to “save it”?[/quote]
I didn’t start 15 days ago, i just registered on here 15 days ago. I’ve been at it for 2 years.I have a hard time gaining muscle because im an ectomorph and a diabetic which forced me to stop lifting for awhile because i almost went into kidney failure, but i still have managed to put on about 15 lbs of muscle while getting leaner. Also, I have been lifting heavier each session, but in the Max-OT way which left me drained mentally and physically.
[quote]kjmont wrote:
[quote]cueball wrote:
Man, you better get your flame suit out.
Seriously, you are 5’11" 158. You don’t need to THINK about anything other than lifting heavier weight every session. THAT’S IT.
Also, I see you started I, Bodybuilder 15 days ago. Why? This is not for beginners, and on top of that, you are already wanting to adjust that program to save something you don’t even need to be concerned with at this point. Your CNS needs to develop so it will learn how to lift heavier weight. Why would you hinder that by trying to “save it”?[/quote]
I didn’t start 15 days ago, i just registered on here 15 days ago. I’ve been at it for 2 years.I have a hard time gaining muscle because im an ectomorph and a diabetic which forced me to stop lifting for awhile because i almost went into kidney failure, but i still have managed to put on about 15 lbs of muscle while getting leaner. Also, I have been lifting heavier each session, but in the Max-OT way which left me drained mentally and physically.[/quote]
Wow! Thibs actually had I, Bodybuilder already put together 2 years ago!!! They told us they JUST finished it! How’d you get the in bro?
/sarcasm
Re-read my post, dude. I said you started I,bodybuilder 15 days ago, not training. Reading comprehension fail.
[quote]silverhydra wrote:
When your post has that many buzz-words, you are over-thinking the problem.
And not to attack, but do you even know what you are talking about when you mention the CNS, or are you just parroting information?[/quote]
Yea I understand the CNS and the role it plays in the muscle building process. I did probably over think the problem though. I’m in the process of doing a Dr. Berardi “Growth Surge” type of periodic training cycle where you gradually increase your workload to eventually lifting twice a day. In it advised going to failure on every set, and i remembered how badly just one workout drained me when I went to muscular failure on every set, let alone two a day. I knew how important the CNS was in muscle recovery, so I asked hoping to solve my dilemma.
[quote]kjmont wrote:
I’m in the process of doing a Dr. Berardi “Growth Surge” type of periodic training cycle where you gradually increase your workload to eventually lifting twice a day. [/quote]
So you are doing this AND I,BODYBUILDER WTF?
[quote]cueball wrote:
[quote]kjmont wrote:
[quote]cueball wrote:
Man, you better get your flame suit out.
Seriously, you are 5’11" 158. You don’t need to THINK about anything other than lifting heavier weight every session. THAT’S IT.
Also, I see you started I, Bodybuilder 15 days ago. Why? This is not for beginners, and on top of that, you are already wanting to adjust that program to save something you don’t even need to be concerned with at this point. Your CNS needs to develop so it will learn how to lift heavier weight. Why would you hinder that by trying to “save it”?[/quote]
I didn’t start 15 days ago, i just registered on here 15 days ago. I’ve been at it for 2 years.I have a hard time gaining muscle because im an ectomorph and a diabetic which forced me to stop lifting for awhile because i almost went into kidney failure, but i still have managed to put on about 15 lbs of muscle while getting leaner. Also, I have been lifting heavier each session, but in the Max-OT way which left me drained mentally and physically.[/quote]
Well, I had a nice sarcastic post for you, but it apparently got lost. So, re-read my post. I never said you started TRAINING 15 days ago. I said you started I,BODYBUILDER 15 days ago and are already wanting to modify it.
Comprehension fail.[/quote]
Oh my bad, and i did have been doing the shoulder specialization for a month; but only started entering logs than. And lol yea your other quote did show, and I will admit I do have a bad habit of wanting to learn as much as I can so i can see what i respond best to; which does screw me over in the long run.
Kjmont, on such routines, a high food (protein especially) intake is crucial for recovery and progress.
I’m talking 1.8-2 grams of protein per lb of bodyweight, plus plenty of fats… And carbs as needed… Eating like someone who weighs 20-30lbs more than you at least.
That may or may not be possible for a diabetic, and if your kidney’s aren’t up to snuff… Then it may really not be possible.
Normally, for guys your size (and larger), simple eating and sleeping enough fixes the issue (and taking the scheduled off-weeks in the case of max-ot trainees).
You might want to get in contact with some of the diabetic lifters on here… I believe 5foot2 (or so, a female powerlifter) is one… Look for her threads in the PL section, she may be able to help you figure this stuff out in regards to how you need to eat/take your insulin etc while training.
I don’t know about you guys but all of this stuff just sounds completely retarded.
Unless you’re some kind of elite athlete I don’t understand why anyone would worry about “frying out” their nervous system by lifting some freaking weights.
I work up to a heavy weight and then lift it as many times as I can. If I don’t think I’m going to get the next rep of a squat or bench press, I don’t go for it because I don’t want to crush myself. If I’m doing lateral raises or cable rows or curls, I might go until I literally can’t complete a full rep.
Six days a week.
Not a big deal.
[quote]mr popular wrote:
I don’t know about you guys but all of this stuff just sounds completely retarded.
Unless you’re some kind of elite athlete I don’t understand why anyone would worry about “frying out” their nervous system by lifting some freaking weights.
I work up to a heavy weight and then lift it as many times as I can. If I don’t think I’m going to get the next rep of a squat or bench press, I don’t go for it because I don’t want to crush myself. If I’m doing lateral raises or cable rows or curls, I might go until I literally can’t complete a full rep.
Six days a week.
Not a big deal.[/quote]
Thank fuck for this post. Seriously.
Unless your hormones are completely fucked, or you are deliberately trying to make yourself sick, you shouldn’t have to worry about it at all. Get a normal sleeping schedule, eat plenty, and use relaxation techniques and you’ll be fine.
[quote]kjmont wrote:
[quote]silverhydra wrote:
When your post has that many buzz-words, you are over-thinking the problem.
And not to attack, but do you even know what you are talking about when you mention the CNS, or are you just parroting information?[/quote]
Yea I understand the CNS and the role it plays in the muscle building process.[/quote]
Everyone has a different understanding of what it means to actually ‘understand’ a concept.
I have been studying the CNS for a while, and still would not say I ‘understand’ it.
So I will call you on this, please enlighten us. (Cut n’ Pasting from Thibs forum is off limits)
I understand where the OP is coming from (if he’s experiencing what I went through).
A lot of people on here make out that no-one trains as hard as they “should”. But when I first started training, I took all this “hard core” talk to heart…and literally took EVERY set to ball busting failure. I would literally only do about 2 to 3 warmup sets, then do 3+ work sets to absolute failure. And guess what happened when I came on here a few months ago and asked why my lifts weren’t going up etc? People told me to work harder!!! Thanks to later clarification, I learned that only one or two sets PER EXERCISE needed to be hard (or as some would call, “failure”). That’s how you “protect” the nervous system…oh, and eat/rest enough lol.
Try to do this ball busting failure training AND the volume of your average bodybuilding program…and your asking for an epic failure.
It’s hilarious how some people automatically assume that when lifts stall (and or you haven’t made much progress), you’re not pushing hard enough