[quote]Julius_Caesar wrote:
How can you compare this to Dr. Squat’s raw 1000 with a walk out? Sorry, but I respect minimal gear lifts more. Anything more than a one ply is no good in my book. Now feel free to flame away…[/quote]
I don’t know how you would when they were in entirely different weight classes. Now comparing what they did at similar bodyweights would be more appropriate. Sam weighed 212-217 during his training cycle for this meet (his own words). So with a 2 hour weigh-in, he’d obviously have no problem making the 220’s. Hatfield’s best squat in the 220’s under USPF/IPF conditions was 881.
And what is the purpose to your post? To point out that this was not TEH SINGLE GREATEST SQUAT EVER!1???!!11/1/?? Oh no! Heaven forbid someone post a lift on the internet that isn’t the best one ever done! Get over yourself. What kind of snide, blase mother fucker sits at home just waiting to be THAT GUY who points out that a great lift was not, in fact, the greatest. What a worthless little troll you are.
I don’t know how you would when they were in entirely different weight classes. Now comparing what they did at similar bodyweights would be more appropriate. Sam weighed 212-217 during his training cycle for this meet (his own words). So with a 2 hour weigh-in, he’d obviously have no problem making the 220’s. Hatfield’s best squat in the 220’s under USPF/IPF conditions was 881.
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THANK YOU!!
Sam hit 705 raw AND walked out at the NERB’s at 198 I believe.
Dr. Squat wore a Titan Centurion when he squatted. Correct me if I’m wrong, but that was the top of the line supersuit at the time back then. I could be wrong, but I believe he wore the best of the best to give himself every possible advantage.
[quote]RickJames wrote:
Julius_Caesar wrote:
How can you compare this to Dr. Squat’s raw 1000 with a walk out? Sorry, but I respect minimal gear lifts more. Anything more than a one ply is no good in my book. Now feel free to flame away…
I don’t know how you would when they were in entirely different weight classes. Now comparing what they did at similar bodyweights would be more appropriate. Sam weighed 212-217 during his training cycle for this meet (his own words). So with a 2 hour weigh-in, he’d obviously have no problem making the 220’s. Hatfield’s best squat in the 220’s under USPF/IPF conditions was 881.
And what is the purpose to your post? To point out that this was not TEH SINGLE GREATEST SQUAT EVER!1???!!11/1/?? Oh no! Heaven forbid someone post a lift on the internet that isn’t the best one ever done! Get over yourself. What kind of snide, blase mother fucker sits at home just waiting to be THAT GUY who points out that a great lift was not, in fact, the greatest. What a worthless little troll you are. [/quote]
Why the feminine type histrionics about a post on a webboard? Is it that time of the month for you? If it is then take a fucking Midol.
Anyway… The comparison was the the obvious reason that they both were groundbreaking 1000 pound squats.
But of course the gear has nothing to do with 1000 pound squats or bench presses for that matter,right?
Don’t knock the power of old-school gear. My first suit- a single champion- gave me easily 60lbs. A tighter suit and some improved technique could have turned that into more like 100 lbs of carryover. I 've heard of guys who got similar carryover out of the the old Crain’s and Marathon suits as well. (The Marathons were supposed be damn good)
Personally, I get maybe 150lbs out of a tight Boss suit with Boss briefs. Multi-ply is not the give away that many make it out as and old single-ply suits are not just tight singlets.
[quote]Julius_Caesar wrote:
RickJames wrote:
Julius_Caesar wrote:
How can you compare this to Dr. Squat’s raw 1000 with a walk out? Sorry, but I respect minimal gear lifts more. Anything more than a one ply is no good in my book. Now feel free to flame away…
I don’t know how you would when they were in entirely different weight classes. Now comparing what they did at similar bodyweights would be more appropriate. Sam weighed 212-217 during his training cycle for this meet (his own words). So with a 2 hour weigh-in, he’d obviously have no problem making the 220’s. Hatfield’s best squat in the 220’s under USPF/IPF conditions was 881.
And what is the purpose to your post? To point out that this was not TEH SINGLE GREATEST SQUAT EVER!1???!!11/1/?? Oh no! Heaven forbid someone post a lift on the internet that isn’t the best one ever done! Get over yourself. What kind of snide, blase mother fucker sits at home just waiting to be THAT GUY who points out that a great lift was not, in fact, the greatest. What a worthless little troll you are.
Why the feminine type histrionics about a post on a webboard? Is it that time of the month for you? If it is then take a fucking Midol.
Anyway… The comparison was the the obvious reason that they both were groundbreaking 1000 pound squats.
But of course the gear has nothing to do with 1000 pound squats or bench presses for that matter,right?
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Why is it Fred Hatfield’s 1014 lb is so often the gold standard for 1000 squats. I believe Dave Waddington did it a few years before the good doctor.
[quote]Julius_Caesar wrote:
Why the feminine type histrionics about a post on a webboard? Is it that time of the month for you? If it is then take a fucking Midol.[/quote]
The poor little troll is upset that someone called him on his hero worship. The poor baby.
Then why not point out Waddington’s squat? Or Hammond’s? Or Vogelpohl’s? Those guys all had “groudbreaking 1000 pound squats”. Why is Hatfield’s the “obvious” comparison? There are some very similar things, yes, but that doesn’t mean Hatfield is the only obvious comparison to make.
[quote]But of course the gear has nothing to do with 1000 pound squats or bench presses for that matter,right?
[/quote]
Gear had to do with every squat we’ve mentioned on this thread, besides perhaps Don’s 900+ squats in a belt and knee wraps (depending on what is RAAAAWWWWWW). Who gives a fuck? You’re raw or you’re not.
Lets bring up something mentioned on this thread - the discrepancy between one’s squat and deadlift. Note that Hatfield’s best squat was 1014 and his best deadlift only 766. This leaves a 248lb discrepancy between the lifts. Byrd only has a 298lb difference.
Since you opened the door for the gear differential, it looks like today’s gear is only 50lbs better than what Hatfield was wearing. Well I don’t believe that, and I know you don’t either, but you can’t quantify for me how much Hatfield’s gear helped him, so the gear argument will just be a question of opinion.
The poor little troll is upset that someone called him on his hero worship. The poor baby.[/quote]
Actually I just rationally posted something, and you came back with the feminine histrionics and ad hominem.
[quote]RickJames wrote:
Then why not point out Waddington’s squat? Or Hammond’s? Or Vogelpohl’s? Those guys all had “groudbreaking 1000 pound squats”. Why is Hatfield’s the “obvious” comparison? There are some very similar things, yes, but that doesn’t mean Hatfield is the only obvious comparison to make.
But of course the gear has nothing to do with 1000 pound squats or bench presses for that matter,right?
Gear had to do with every squat we’ve mentioned on this thread, besides perhaps Don’s 900+ squats in a belt and knee wraps (depending on what is RAAAAWWWWWW). Who gives a fuck? You’re raw or you’re not.
Lets bring up something mentioned on this thread - the discrepancy between one’s squat and deadlift. Note that Hatfield’s best squat was 1014 and his best deadlift only 766. This leaves a 248lb discrepancy between the lifts. Byrd only has a 298lb difference.
Since you opened the door for the gear differential, it looks like today’s gear is only 50lbs better than what Hatfield was wearing. Well I don’t believe that, and I know you don’t either, but you can’t quantify for me how much Hatfield’s gear helped him, so the gear argument will just be a question of opinion.
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Why did I pick Hatfield? I don’t know, because it just came to my mind as an old record that was done with a lot less gear than a double ply denim.
Do you really think that the gear debates will end? Until it is analyzed from a scientific viewpoint probably not.
Surely it is not beyond the reach of human knowledge to at least establish a range of assistence that certain gear helps someone.
Do you really think that the gear debates will end? Until it is analyzed from a scientific viewpoint probably not.
Surely it is not beyond the reach of human knowledge to at least establish a range of assistence that certain gear helps someone.
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I think the trick about gear is that depending on technique, fit, individual proportions and weakenesses, the value of it can vary so much. I think that makes comparing apples to apples very difficult.
Do you really think that the gear debates will end? Until it is analyzed from a scientific viewpoint probably not.
Surely it is not beyond the reach of human knowledge to at least establish a range of assistence that certain gear helps someone.
I think the trick about gear is that depending on technique, fit, individual proportions and weakenesses, the value of it can vary so much. I think that makes comparing apples to apples very difficult.
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This is why I said establish a range. I think that it could be easily done if you made the control groups large enough to help control the variables…
Why did I pick Hatfield? I don’t know, because it just came to my mind as an old record that was done with a lot less gear than a double ply denim.
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Denim?? Unless i’m very much mistaken all the 1000lb squats have been done in canvas (inzer leviathon, metat 2x plys, ernie frantz) or poly suits. That’s a poor showing since you’re trying to construct a rational argument. I know it’s a small point but still important.
[quote]mattwray wrote:
buffalokilla wrote:
Wow, that suit completely eliminates the bottom 8th of the squat. No wonder records keep going up.
-Dan
Looks like he broke parallel to me, that is all that is needed.
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I’m impressed and I know that that is parallel by todays standard, but the nook of the hip is not below the top of the knee CAP. If you look at the nook of the hip getting down to the high point of the vastus medialis,OK.
And by the way, I don’t think that wider means that you have to bend over more. If you are just spreading the groin enough, your body is dropping straight down betwen the legs.
I was at the meet this past weekend and I saw the third attempt from behind the stage. Sam’s lift was as good of an attempt at that weight that I’ve seen recently. With Steve Goggins as one of the judges, do you think he’d give anything to anybody. That man has absolutely no reason to GIVE anyone anything. I spoke to him shortly after he judged the lift and he even said he’s got nothing to prove, although this wasn’t related to Sam’s lift but in general.
I had an absolute blast cheering Sam on and he’s a really cool guy to talk to, but meeting Steve is probably one of the highlights, but personally Kara was the one holding my attention. Too many highlights in one day. There are too many people on the internet bashing guys’s lifts and talking a lot of garbage. There’s really no need for it.
I had a conversation with a well known lifter at this meet and even they said that PLing has gotten to be “too much about the gear”. I started with Oly lifts and gymnastics, and moved into a more of the big 3 style program for football etc etc. I believe in most instances that the men of day’s past were much stronger lb for lb than we are today.
Steve Goggins squatted 1100 with his back nearly parallel, a guy like Anthony Clark presses 800 with a reverse grip in some crap “bench shirt” (note: I got the info on Clark’s shirt from one of the guy’s who trained with him) or Anderson’s 6000 lb back lift. Moreover what do we make of a guy like Sandow???
See again there’s much to being strong and putting up big numbers. If you use gear, then use gear. If you’re a raw lifter then go raw. I mean I don’t think it’s that big of a deal. I also think that guys taking issue with other’s lifts hsa gotten a bit out of hand.
Why did I pick Hatfield? I don’t know, because it just came to my mind as an old record that was done with a lot less gear than a double ply denim.
Denim?? Unless i’m very much mistaken all the 1000lb squats have been done in canvas (inzer leviathon, metat 2x plys, ernie frantz) or poly suits. That’s a poor showing since you’re trying to construct a rational argument. I know it’s a small point but still important.[/quote]
What I was trying to get at is that scientists could easily establish range of assistence for any gear if they had a control group that was sufficiently large enough to establish good data.
Each material probably differs in the way that it can store potential energy and convert it into kinetic energy with some of the potential energy being converted into heat. It’s probably as simple as a few coefficients in a easy equation.
I think it would be interesting because I am an admitted science geek.
The only part that would be difficult would be 1) Funding and 2)A sufficient control group and your typical things like variable isolation. If powerlifting was an olympic sport and more popular than it is now, these experiments would not only have been conducted, but major corportations would probably be racing to develop better gear to make money.
Are you insane? Scientists could establish? Shouldn’t scientists develop better new hard on pills and cooler tvs than work on establishing standards for a niche sport that no one but us cares about?
Hatfield’s squat was done with full gear at that time. These suits might not be as good as now, butt hey were tight as hell. they often required two people helping you and took upwards of a half hour to get on.
Hatifeld also had the racks moved away as said before, and it was controversial.
I want scientists to develop a bench shirt that a long, monkey-armed mutha like me can actually get some decent carryover out of.
I think the government-funded research grant in in order- maybe funnel some of the money away from one of these undefinable, unwinnable wars we’re always in (war on terror, war on drugs, war on poverty, etc.). Just kidding- but not much.
Pinto- I’m with you man!!! My long arms suck for benching big. I love Metal gear, but my friends call my 250 Metal shirt my most expensive gym towel ever b/c I get like 0 pounds out of it. I am working with a Titan Single Ply I bought used from a friend and it seems to be working (better)