[quote]heavythrower wrote:
[quote]SteelyD wrote:
[quote]heavythrower wrote:
seems like one of the biggest baddest bodybuilders out there right now relies on heavy pressing and pulling for his upper body size.
as a matter of fact, I remember hearing Ronnie Coleman say on one of his training videos posted on this website a long time ago saying something to the effect “I dont train biceps much at all, I get plenty big enough from all my back work”
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But that video was Ronnie Coleman when Ronnie Coleman was “Mr. Olympia competitor level Ronnie Coleman”.
Sure, when you’re at that level, you have true ‘imbalances’ that professional judges are going to detect and that you need to spend more time/energy fixing because your title and livelyhood depend on it. I never heard anyone ever say Ronnie’s arms were ‘lagging’.
Ronnie, Phil and others have universally superior arm genetics that no doubt they trained directly trained the shit out of for years. They are amongst the what, 20 or so people in the world who can just ‘cruise’ on their arm work.
Ronnie’s/Phil’s training universe is a much different one than “Mr. 16-in Smooth Arms”.
[Edit: DAMN, how did 4 posts get snuck in there before I finished this??]
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agreed, to a point. the other side of that coin reinforces what I have been saying though. big lifts, not so much(see what I did there? I did not say “at all”) on arms can give you a big solid mass and strength foundation that once you hit the next level and have to start the crazy diet and pharma the top guys have to do, then you put in your time with direct arm work.
I have watched a lot of Ronnie Coleman videos, and truth be told, his training reminds me a lot of the RAW old school powerlifters I idolized when I was young and just getting into the sport, like Pat Casey, Doug Young, etc.
that is, he (Coleman) squats, deadlifts, rows and presses (barbell and dumbbell) insanely heavy weights. [/quote]
I obviously missed this thread but whatever. There is a huge flaw in the logic here so I’ll bump it just to see my name on the side of the screen.
You are claiming that big lifts build a foundation and then juice and curls provide refinement for the biceps.
THAT IS THE COMPLETE OPPOSITE OF WHAT COLEMAN AND HEATH HAVE APPARENTLY DONE.
They have both obviously built up their arms with plenty of direct work and then, once their foundation of size was established, used little to no direct work except during pre contest.
You either have an indoctrinated bias so firmly rooted in your beliefs or you are trolling this topic.
It’s amazing that people can analyze a situation and perceive the exact opposite of the truth as fact.
And if you want to claim that I dont know that Phil did direct arm work earlier in his career, consider this. How in the world would he know that his arms grow too fast from doing direct work (the reason he doesnt do it in the offseason) if he didnt have the experience to base that opinion on.
The absurdity of your arguement is only overshadowed by the absurdity of the claim that regular people should model their training off the highly specialized routines of Coleman and Heath.