My Experience On the Anabolic Diet Part III

Nutrition
641

[quote]protein-pro wrote:
Anyone suggestions for breakfast?? 2 weeks bacon, eggs and mushroom is not something I can stand for months… some nice breakfast tips are welcome!!![/quote]
No eggs??!! Heresy!!!

My wife has the same issue. That’s right; I just called you a girl.

Here are a couple of things we do to combat it:
Flax Muffins (from the uber-thread itself)
-1/4 cup flax
-1 egg
-1 packet Splenda
-1/2 tsp baking powder
-1 tsp butter
-1 tsp cinnamon

Mix all of the ingredients up in a mug. Stick it in the microwave for one minute. Dump it out, slice it up, and slather it with butter.

Protein Pancakes
-1 scoop MD or Grow! (I like the Grow! natural best, for flavour)
-1 egg
-A pinch of cinnamon
-2 tsp psyllium fibre
-1 tbsp heavy cream
-A little flax if you want to thicken it up and poop real good

Throw it all in a bowl or mixing cup, then add water until it’s thick (pancake batter consistency, basically). Pour it in two to three servings on a heated pan or griddle (I got a griddle at WalMart for $17). When the top starts to bubble, flip it. I eat these with another couple of eggs, fried, so that I have something to soak up the yolk with.

The muffins are, I believe, about 2.5 net carbs. The pancakes are about 4-5 net, depending on the protein you use. Liberal amounts of butter will help you get a good amount of fat, too. Also, I’m sure you could mix and match a lot of the ingredients to get the macros you want (the macros in the pancakes aren’t bad due to the protein powder, especially if you cover them in butter). Just make sure your flax and/or psyllium doesn’t have any extra nor hidden carbs.

Hope that helps. I’m not usually a proponent of “faux” diet stuff (like vegetarians eating veggie-burgers; if you want a burger, eat a burger! There are tastier veggie-meals if you’re afraid of meat and chest hair), but these are not only a change from the AD norm, but a nice, mid-week psychological relief as they almost feel like eating a bread product.

642

[quote]Gymjunkie wrote:

[quote]broken4head wrote:

[quote]Gymjunkie wrote:

[quote]broken4head wrote:

[quote]Gymjunkie wrote:

[quote]broken4head wrote:
What would be the lowest anyone would recommend protein go to in relative to body weight while leaning out. For that matter what would be the lowest recommended fat%. I ask because the last time I cut I lost too much hard earned muscle. By the last couple weeks my protein was 1g = bw and fat was 30% of total cal.[/quote]

Hey man,

Personally, I would recommend, not going any lower than the 1g/lb mark for protein intake and keep fats high. The lowest INTAKE you should require to get super lean is BW(lbs)x10, which is what I did at the end of last year, getting down to 8.5% bf. My ratio was about 45/55 - Fats/Pro. I took in about 120-130g fats and about 220g protein daily, training once a day.

Over the Christmas period I gained a bit of fat back,haha…so currently at 9.5%. I am planning on getting down UNDER 8%(hopefully) before beginning more of a lean mass phase. I am experimenting with a CYCLIC approach this time, cycling the following days - high pro/low fat, med pro/med fats, low pro/high fats. I am hoping to see SOME lean mass gains, along with fat loss using this approach. I found that I lost too much weight, even though i got lean…a little mass went too, whilst simply taking in less of both nutrients. When I took in more protein, it got converted to glycogen and was stored or used as glycogen, so I found a high protein intake whilst trying to get lean can also work against you in some cases.

You will simply have to experiment with diet and training with yourself until you find the ideal approach for YOURSELF. But yes, I think you intake is a bit low…unless you are keeping you muscle and strength whilst dropping a good amount of fats… Can’t argue with results in the end, regardless of the approach.

GJ[/quote]
Interesting, What ratios are your macros during the cycles and what days (Training wise) do they land on? Also,is this a method you would use when your on the lower side of calorie intake? I have been bulking since Nov. 1st and am going to start dropping Feb. 1st. I was thinking of first dropping my fat from 65% to 55%. Protein staying as is at 2g per lb bw. [/quote]

Ok,

High pro/low fats = 2g/lb pro/0.5g/lb fats
Med pro/med fats = 1.5g/lb pro/0.65g/lb fats
Low pro/high fats = 1g/lb pro/0.8g/lb fats

You may be able to set up LESS of a fluctuation in Protein. I created and big variation in amount of pro, due to this holding my fat loss back somewhat when too high.

I ensure 2 High/Low days, 2 Med/Med days and 2 Low/High days…One Cheat day, whereby pro is at roughly 1g/lb, fats at maybe 0.65g/lb and one cheat meal…I simply ensure that my training day falls on either a High/Low or Med/Med…with low protein or Cheat days when protein is low always been OFF days.

Your plan looks decent…trail and error regarding the macro ratio dude. I personally, unfortunately struggle dropping fat when protein is so high every day(2g/lb) but gain lean mass well with this intake. Others do better…very individual man.

GJ[/quote]
Do you figure your total multiplying by lean mass, total, or goal?[/quote]

I go by total mass…not lean or goal. However, to be honest, it won’t make a MASSIVE difference unless you have a shtload of fat…and or have unrealistic goal weight.

Stay strong,
GJ
[/quote]
Thanks GJ, You’ve been helpful.

643

I’m starting my first carb-up in one hour with the old protocol. 2 FINiBARS (chocolate and PB sandwhich :slight_smile: ), 2 scoop Surge Workout Fuel, and 1 serving of Surge Recovery. Then I’m probably heading to Chipotle right after for a big ass buritto, i don’t know though.

644

first carb up weekend is almost over… had a bit of a headache, it came from the neck, not much, but is surprises me… expected it during the week, not during carbups…

645

Does anyone know what the suggestes fat ratios are of mono, poly, and saturated? I saw DH’s recommendations somewhere but can’t remember what they were.

646

Voila my man!! Forums - T Nation - The World's Trusted Community for Elite Fitness

[quote]ashylarryku wrote:
Does anyone know what the suggestes fat ratios are of mono, poly, and saturated? I saw DH’s recommendations somewhere but can’t remember what they were.[/quote]

647

Hey guys! Just started a modified version of the AD using some of CT’s refined physique techniques, some of which include:

eat all the greens you want
refeed (based on BF)- every 10 days
carb intake (based on BF) - 50g’s
splitting fat and pro cals 50/50

and a few others. I have a few questions though. In order to become fat adapted, CT says it should take somewhere around 10-14 days. With that being said, I started the AD diet on Monday (go figure) and if I follow the AD diet I will refeed this weekend. Will this refeed inhibit or slow my transfer to fat adaptation? It seems to me that it would, maybe I should hit 14 days AD with no refeed until the 15th day to help ensure fat adaptation, then follow CT’s rule of refeed every 10 days. What do you guys think?

I am hoping that this “modified” version of the AD will help me lose some BF a little quicker than the normal AD, and once I make some good fat loss, then I plan on switching completely to strictly AD.

Sorry if this was covered here already, but I dont want to read 26 pages + the older threads! However I will try to keep up from now on!

One more, what are your favorite nighttime meals? My sixth meal comes around 8 in the evening, and I need somehwere between 40-50g of pro and 20g of fat. I dont like taking shakes this late, so I am looking for some substitutes. Last night I took a shake and two (1) Tbsp shots of EVOO.

648

[quote]Emz wrote:
Voila my man!! Forums - T Nation - The World's Trusted Community for Elite Fitness

[quote]ashylarryku wrote:
Does anyone know what the suggestes fat ratios are of mono, poly, and saturated? I saw DH’s recommendations somewhere but can’t remember what they were.[/quote]
[/quote]

Much appreciated kind sir!

649

[quote]smithers584 wrote:
Hey guys! Just started a modified version of the AD using some of CT’s refined physique techniques, some of which include:

eat all the greens you want
refeed (based on BF)- every 10 days
carb intake (based on BF) - 50g’s
splitting fat and pro cals 50/50

and a few others. I have a few questions though. In order to become fat adapted, CT says it should take somewhere around 10-14 days. With that being said, I started the AD diet on Monday (go figure) and if I follow the AD diet I will refeed this weekend. Will this refeed inhibit or slow my transfer to fat adaptation? It seems to me that it would, maybe I should hit 14 days AD with no refeed until the 15th day to help ensure fat adaptation, then follow CT’s rule of refeed every 10 days. What do you guys think?

I am hoping that this “modified” version of the AD will help me lose some BF a little quicker than the normal AD, and once I make some good fat loss, then I plan on switching completely to strictly AD.

Sorry if this was covered here already, but I dont want to read 26 pages + the older threads! However I will try to keep up from now on!

One more, what are your favorite nighttime meals? My sixth meal comes around 8 in the evening, and I need somehwere between 40-50g of pro and 20g of fat. I dont like taking shakes this late, so I am looking for some substitutes. Last night I took a shake and two (1) ounce shots of EVOO.

[/quote]

Most people say to skip the first refeed. 2oz of olive oil should be a LOT more than 20g of fat… As far as substitutes, fatty meats are pretty good… Pork, fatty cuts of beef, etc. or even some lean meat with some heavy cream or half and half or something similarly high fat low carb.

650

@smithers584
Why the 10 day carb up/refeed?
I think it is important to speed up your metabolism and hormone levels. (Thyroid, leptine etc.)

So many have tried it before us, and from my experience, after my first carbup, it looks like my fatburning even has increased. And during my 2 hrs spinning yesterday evening (3days after my carb-weekend) I was in great cardio-shape.
No problems in energy, so i was burning fat for fuel, no carbs or protein.

651

Samdan- You are right, I ment to type in tbsp instead of ounces. That makes it around 28g.

Protein-pro - The ten day refeed is just a suggestion from CT’s Refined Physique article. He breaks down the amount of carbs per day and the frequency of the refeed based on initial body fat. I am pretty much following the anabolic diet, but changing it just a little following CT’s rules. The main reason for that is because in his article, his before picture looks exactly like I did before I got more serious about my diet. This makes me think since we have the same body type and it worked so well for him that it may work well for me, even though the genetics/exercise knowledge/nutritional knowledge may be vastly different.

I may try a refeed every weekend (most likely just Friday night and Saturday) and see how it goes, and then if I think I am not progressing properly, cutting it back to the ten days CT recommends. Every weekend would definately be a lot easier!!

Thanks for the input guys.

652

ok, interesting… where can i find that artivle and the pics? Will look in to it…

653

Here is the link:

Anyways, yeah his before pic is pretty much how I looked when I was doing the same thing as him, only concerned with getting strong and power lifting (in my own right, not on a competition level). I may never reach that level of leaness, but definately want to use his principles to move towards it.

I have no idea what my body fat is, and I should probably find out, but Im using the 15-20% range for the purposes of calculating my needs. I am surely not above that range, and probably sitting right around 15% itself.

654

Man, its only the fourth day and the two whey shakes I am taken daily are starting to take a toll on my stomach. I feel “unsettled” and nausea for about an hour after taking them. I usually include some fat source like almonds or natural PB, any advice on how to combat this?

Right now, until I get my stuff together, I need the shakes to meet my daily requirements, because I dont prepare as well as I should.

Also, last time I low carbed (only lasted about 4 weeks), when I went back to eating carbs, I would almost instantly feel full, no matter how hungry I was prior to eating, and then I would literally get sick after every meal for about 4 weeks with no way to control it, other than using some pills the doc gave me.

Has this happened to anyone? Anyone know what it is or what causes it? Doc had no idea, initially thought I was diabetic, which was scary seeing that I am 5’11", 195lbs, and have a 32" waist (obviously not overweight per se) and have no family history of it. After running some blood work he eliminated that possibility and I never went back.

655

extra fiber?
I take 2 or 3 shakes a day between the meals, a little whipcream and flaxseed or olive oil.
Most of the time i take some fiber supplement, or some nuts indeed.

And i feel better after a shake than a meal with lots of (salty) meat…

656

!!!NEWBIE ALERT!!!

Hello there fellow ADer’s…this is my first post to this amazing thread(or series of threads for that matter).

Obviously It is only necessary to start off by saying…THANK YOU DH!!! …from all of us…you are a godsend…and you have created a monster here…and an amazing one at that.
And to the rest of the numerous contributors you have helped me quite a bit along the way as well.

I am on day 7 of the AD…and have been diligently reading the 1st thread since I started, and I plan to read the entire thing, but I had to jump forward and see if it was still going so that I could be a part. I can already tell that I will be an ADer for life.

So I have a question and I hope it hasn’t been covered by any of the pages that I haven’t read. However I havent seen it yet. How does swimming fit with the AD? Since it can be a very calorie burning total body aerobic exercise it seems like it could do wonders for fat loss.

I’m just wondering if anyone has experimented with this? For the record, I also do heavy weight lifting, total body workouts, running (both HIIT and low tempo) along with the occasional pickup game of basketball. So It’s not like swimming is my only form of exercise. It’s actually the least employed currently.

Brian

657

[quote]AirBoren wrote:
!!!NEWBIE ALERT!!!

Hello there fellow ADer’s…this is my first post to this amazing thread(or series of threads for that matter).

Obviously It is only necessary to start off by saying…THANK YOU DH!!! …from all of us…you are a godsend…and you have created a monster here…and an amazing one at that.
And to the rest of the numerous contributors you have helped me quite a bit along the way as well.

I am on day 7 of the AD…and have been diligently reading the 1st thread since I started, and I plan to read the entire thing, but I had to jump forward and see if it was still going so that I could be a part. I can already tell that I will be an ADer for life.

So I have a question and I hope it hasn’t been covered by any of the pages that I haven’t read. However I havent seen it yet. How does swimming fit with the AD? Since it can be a very calorie burning total body aerobic exercise it seems like it could do wonders for fat loss. I’m just wondering if anyone has experimented with this? For the record, I also do heavy weight lifting, total body workouts, running (both HIIT and low tempo) along with the occasional pickup game of basketball. So It’s not like swimming is my only form of exercise. It’s actually the least employed currently.

Brian[/quote]

Hey Brian,

What are your current goals?

What are your stats: Weight and est bodyfat?

GJ

658

Well im 5’11" and about 180#s. I would say I’m about 10% bf but I’m not positive, the calipers are on their way, lol. I want to gain muscle and lean out like everyone else haha. I think my target final bodyweight is going to be somewhere around 190 lbs but I would like to increase that slowly and lose bodyfat as my primary goal.

I have been on this for 7 days, keeping my carbs right around 30g…and Ive been anal about logging all of this and checking everything twice so I’m pretty sure I’m doing it right. I got the book and read it so I have a good knowledge of the concept.

I will admit the first day or two I was very hesitate to eat all that fat lol coming from a low fat diet before. But I went from 1800 cal/day to ~3000 cal/day and havent gained a #. Since I was already at a low BF I feel like I might be gaining a little fat from this initial phase but thats ok…This is the AL not the magic pill.

I also have noticed that my lifts are increasing significantly already and I haven’t carbed up yet. Which I am looking forward to. It is funny how I never craved any of that bad food when on my other diets where it was absolutely not an option, but now that its ok to eat a little ice cream and sugar…I’ve been craving sweets for 7 days.

Choc Whey with cream has been my savior.
As for the swimming its something that I do every once in awhile and planned to get back in the pool soon and didn’t know if this type of cardio would be more catabolic than typical walking, etc. While I am new to all of this I hope to learn quick so I can help other newbies like myself.

I just wish I was 12 weeks in so I could start the tweaking process. From the reading I have done it seems like thats where the greatest success with lowering BF comes from.

Brian

659

Ok,

Sounds like your’e in a good spot, been lean, you will be even more insulin senstive!

I suggest finding the amount of food intake, in conjuction with the right training that allows you to lean out further and gain some lean mass. I would suggest undertaking something that I love doing when training once a day - Destroying the Fat, by CT. Basically, it is a mix of heavy work and lactic acid training. Geared more toward fat loss, muscle retention…but IMO if you get your diet right, you will gain some lean mass too…Do a search for it, but the schedule will/could look like this:

Day 1: Heavy Chest/Back (muscle gain workout)
Day 2: Lactic Acid circuit work(fat loss workout)
Day 3: Off
Day 4: Heavy Legs (muscle gain workout)
Day 5: Lactic acid training(fat loss workout)
Day 6: Off OR Heavy Arms/Shoulders (muscle gain workout)
Day 7: Off

It is my firm believe than when dieting or cutting you still need heavy work to retain the muscle. The above routine is a great mix that assists with both getting leaner and bigger. You COULD opt for a total lactic acid type routine, Poliquins GBC…but I would recommend something like that for someone a bit higher in bf with primary goal to lose fat. At 180lbs, 10% you are in a good spot to carry out the above routine instead.

The swimming 'be catabolic…but I would suggest simply focusing your energy in the gym lifting harder and heavier every time your’e in there.

Any other questions, I’m happy to help.
GJ

660

Would doing some sort of cardio during a mass phase on the AD be beneficial for keeping fat gains low? I’m thinking since you are always in a state of burning fat it would be wise to do so. Does anyone have any experience or knowledge on this?