My Experience On the Anabolic Diet Part III

Nutrition
421

Hi guys,

im in my 1st week of the anabolic diet after the introductory 12 day period and i have a few questions i was hoping i could get help with. I bought the E-book (bodybuilder one) and feel there are some issues which need clarifying for me. Any feedback would be very much appreciated.

Firstly, from what i understand the 1st few days of the low carb section of the week result in a lowering of subcutaneous water levels and a depletion of muscle glycogen. With this in mind it is unusual IMO to experience a bloat toward even the end of the week, this is what i’m experiencing. May this be to do with fluid intake/ sodium intake?

Secondly, i am still unsure about peri-workout nutrition and amino acid loaded insulin spikes. I understand it as this. An amino acid of a high enough level will cause an insulin response in the body, however, as long as there is not an excess of carbohydrate the result of this spike will not be lypogenesis. Therefore is taking amino acid supplements throughout the day a bad/good idea? This applies also to peri-workout nutrition. Is it fair to assume that an insulin spike before/during/after the workout is good in the sense that it facilitates transport of nutrients to the muscles?

In order for you to help me effectively i thought i would post my diet (sample day)

Meal 1 (as soon as i wake): Whey with 3 tbsp cream, flax, superfood. 5g fish oil blend, 1 litre water, coffee
Meal 2: 4 egg omelette, 3 rashers bacon, spinach, 3 slices havarti cheese, onions, mushrooms + green tea
Meal 3: sliced pepporoni and string cheese, cucumber, 2 tbsp olive oil
Meal 4: 2 beef burgers, 2 slices cheese, pork meatballs, spinach, mushrooms + 5g fish oil blend
Meal 5: 4 rahers bacon/ 4 fried eggs, onions + 5 g fish oil blend
Before bed: Metabolic Drive with flax or cream, 2 tbsp oilve oil

Para workout nutrition is this:
Blend: (1 scoop whey, hydrolised casein, beta-alanine, citrilliun milate, BCAA, glutamine)
Start drinking 30 minutes before workout and during (in 2 litres of water)
Post-workout: 2 scoops whey isolate with a fat source.

Any input/advice at all would really help

Thanks in advance

422

I want to chime in with something I’ve been doing lately that seems to be working well.

I’ve been on the AD for 6 years straight, only taking breaks if I’ve been sick, but for most of the six years I’ve done either 5/2 or 6/1.

And I hate carb loads. To begin with, I went from 80 kg to 95 in just above two months. The whole ‘stop when you smooth out’ took a while to get.

Now lately, training six days a week, I’ve done a 6/1 with a carb up meal mid-week to get me trough the workouts, but I’d walays be drained on Saturday and have sub par performance.

Now I do this: Low carb all the time,basically weekday AD.
These are the only carbs I get in major quantities:

60 minutes before workout:
30 g whey
30 g maltodextrin
5 g creatine
7 dl water

30 minutes before
30 g whey
30 g maltodextrin
7 dl water

During
30 g whey
30 g maltodextrin
1.5 l water

30 minutes after
60 g whey

That’s it.Around 100 grams peri-workout. Strentgh has been going up, measurements, feel less bloated in general, more stable energy…Once you’re adapted, I would seriously recommend this.
30 g maltodextrin

423

Good plan here. I’m glad it’s working well for you.
Another option is to use L-glutamine @ .5gr per kilo/BW + glycine @ .25/kilo BW round the training window --instead of the maltodextrin (or whatever). It will give many folks even better results -especially if high(er) bodyfat is an issue.

[quote]Amonero wrote:
I want to chime in with something I’ve been doing lately that seems to be working well.

I’ve been on the AD for 6 years straight, only taking breaks if I’ve been sick, but for most of the six years I’ve done either 5/2 or 6/1.

And I hate carb loads. To begin with, I went from 80 kg to 95 in just above two months. The whole ‘stop when you smooth out’ took a while to get.

Now lately, training six days a week, I’ve done a 6/1 with a carb up meal mid-week to get me trough the workouts, but I’d walays be drained on Saturday and have sub par performance.

Now I do this: Low carb all the time,basically weekday AD.
These are the only carbs I get in major quantities:

60 minutes before workout:
30 g whey
30 g maltodextrin
5 g creatine
7 dl water

30 minutes before
30 g whey
30 g maltodextrin
7 dl water

During
30 g whey
30 g maltodextrin
1.5 l water

30 minutes after
60 g whey

That’s it.Around 100 grams peri-workout. Strentgh has been going up, measurements, feel less bloated in general, more stable energy…Once you’re adapted, I would seriously recommend this.
30 g maltodextrin[/quote]

424

500mg per kilo L-Glutamine and 250mg per kilo Glycine?

Some of the biggest L-glutamine supplements I’m finding are like 1500mg per serving, and 500mg per serving for Glycine… Did you mean 50mg and 25mg per kilo?

425

[quote]Emz wrote:
Hey Mr Pauli D, I would be grateful if you could confirm what is Charles Poliquin’s view on fat intake, I mean, I’ve seen loads of articles stating that he prefers low carbs (typically less than 50g a day) and high protein 1.5-2 g/lb) but I’ve never seen anything on fat intake other than he likes to megadose on fish oil?

Cheers
Emz[/quote]

The common perception that the Poliquin approach is a “low carb” - “mega-fish-oil-dosing” approach is really not at all accurate.

A more accurate perception would be that the majority of trainees (who ask) are insulin resistant and that the most successful initial therapy for these individuals involves carb-restriction to thwart fat storage and high dose fish oil to properly balance blood lipid profiles and encourage fat metabolism.

The truth is, Charles’ protocols are specifically tailored to the trainee and the trainee’s specific needs.

You wanted to know what Charles would recommend for fat intake?

That question can only be addressed after several more questions are posed, such as:

1.) What do you eat? (Be specific. Include a 7 day food log)
2.) How much do you eat? (grams of ea/protein and fat)
3.) When do you eat? (how many meals of what and when?)
4.) What carbohydrates do you choose to eat, how much of each and why?

Let me know…

~ain’t nothin’ simple

426

[quote]samdan wrote:
500mg per kilo L-Glutamine and 250mg per kilo Glycine?

Some of the biggest L-glutamine supplements I’m finding are like 1500mg per serving, and 500mg per serving for Glycine… Did you mean 50mg and 25mg per kilo?[/quote]

Work up slowly. You don’t “need” carbs PWO -especially if you have become fat adapted.
In fact…carbohydrates are not “needed” at all physiologically --and, most of us do so much better without them.

427

Pauli, how beneficial do you believe BCAA’s are and what is your recommended dosage at what times?

Thanks

428

[quote]Pauli D wrote:
Gymjunkie wrote:
I would recommend dropping your protein intake in favor of some healthy fats instead.
Eg. 45% Protein, 50% Fats, 5% carbs…could be a pick, once you are fat adapted.

I say this, because you may have turned yourself into a protein oxidizer due to this nutrient been so much higher compared to the rest of your intake.

GJ

Preach it, GJ![/quote]

thanks. i do plan on doing a strict AD startup then bulk, but my main question that im hoping someone can answer for me is…would the AD be a good nutrition plan to follow whilst on anabolics?

429

[quote]Pauli D wrote:
Good plan here. I’m glad it’s working well for you.
Another option is to use L-glutamine @ .5gr per kilo/BW + glycine @ .25/kilo BW round the training window --instead of the maltodextrin (or whatever). It will give many folks even better results -especially if high(er) bodyfat is an issue.

Amonero wrote:
I want to chime in with something I’ve been doing lately that seems to be working well.

I’ve been on the AD for 6 years straight, only taking breaks if I’ve been sick, but for most of the six years I’ve done either 5/2 or 6/1.

And I hate carb loads. To begin with, I went from 80 kg to 95 in just above two months. The whole ‘stop when you smooth out’ took a while to get.

Now lately, training six days a week, I’ve done a 6/1 with a carb up meal mid-week to get me trough the workouts, but I’d walays be drained on Saturday and have sub par performance.

Now I do this: Low carb all the time,basically weekday AD.
These are the only carbs I get in major quantities:

60 minutes before workout:
30 g whey
30 g maltodextrin
5 g creatine
7 dl water

30 minutes before
30 g whey
30 g maltodextrin
7 dl water

During
30 g whey
30 g maltodextrin
1.5 l water

30 minutes after
60 g whey

That’s it.Around 100 grams peri-workout. Strentgh has been going up, measurements, feel less bloated in general, more stable energy…Once you’re adapted, I would seriously recommend this.
30 g maltodextrin

[/quote]

That would be interesting to try if it was readily available and affodable over here. Norway’s got the highest taxes and strictest restrictions in the world on supplements though, so those amounts of product would be almost as expensive as doing a cycle :stuck_out_tongue:

430

[quote]Pauli D wrote:
Emz wrote:
Hey Mr Pauli D, I would be grateful if you could confirm what is Charles Poliquin’s view on fat intake, I mean, I’ve seen loads of articles stating that he prefers low carbs (typically less than 50g a day) and high protein 1.5-2 g/lb) but I’ve never seen anything on fat intake other than he likes to megadose on fish oil?

Cheers
Emz

The common perception that the Poliquin approach is a “low carb” - “mega-fish-oil-dosing” approach is really not at all accurate.

A more accurate perception would be that the majority of trainees (who ask) are insulin resistant and that the most successful initial therapy for these individuals involves carb-restriction to thwart fat storage and high dose fish oil to properly balance blood lipid profiles and encourage fat metabolism.

The truth is, Charles’ protocols are specifically tailored to the trainee and the trainee’s specific needs.

You wanted to know what Charles would recommend for fat intake?

That question can only be addressed after several more questions are posed, such as:

1.) What do you eat? (Be specific. Include a 7 day food log)
2.) How much do you eat? (grams of ea/protein and fat)
3.) When do you eat? (how many meals of what and when?)
4.) What carbohydrates do you choose to eat, how much of each and why?

Let me know…

~ain’t nothin’ simple[/quote]

My aplogies! Having read his articles on this site as well as his own I got the impression he was an avid advocate of a low carb lifesytle (person/activity dependant), having been influenced by Dr Pasquale and Dr Bowden et al! So presumably, the really high protein intakes also advised by Charles is not so much a general recommmendation but something tailored to the individual depending on needs/goals etc and not necessairly compatible with the AD as Gymjunkie has mentioned, he was on a very high protein intake @ 2g/lb and found this to be a hindrance to fat loss until he lowered protein and upped fats?!

I myself try to keep things really simple to ensure compliance and have a list of foods that I simply rotate:
Protein - Beef, Turkey, Chicken, O3 Eggs (limit 3 a day as they are damn expensive in the uk) and whey/casein blend (60/40 ratio, might push that to 50/50!)
Fat - EVOO, Avocado Oil, Macadamia Nut Oil, Heavy Cream, EPO x 3, Fish oil (40/20) x 6 (one with each meal), Milled flaxseeds, incidentals with protein food.
Veggies - Broccoli, Caulflower, Spinach, Mushrooms, small amounts of Brussell Sprouts, I also use greens+ to plug the gaps!

Carb up is typically small bowl of blue/strawberries with greek yogurt and syrup, kilo of sweet potato with cod in parsley sauce every 5th day for one meal as I’m not sub 10%…yet :wink:
ATM, I’m 150lbs at about 13% but I’m a skinny fat so eating @ bw x 12 to try and get sub 10% so that I can achieve a good basline ready for a mass gaining cycle. A typical day might be:
6:30 20g whey, tbl flaxseed, 3 eggs, spinach/mushrooms, 1 x epo+fish oil
10:30 150gms Turkey, Broccoli, tbl evoo, 1 fish oil
14:30 150gms Chicken, Cauliflower, tbl mac nut oil, 1 epo/fish oil
18:30 150gms Beef, Veg medley - broc/cauli/spin/mush/sprouts, tbl avocado oil
10:30 40gms Milk Protein, Greens+, tbl flaxseed, tbl heavy cream, 1x epo/fish oil

There’s not much variety above but the reason for this is I suffer with crohn’s disease so really tough coarse fibrous foods like celery or nuts or ‘seedy’ foods like raspberries , tomatoes, cucumbers irritate the intestinal lining and trigger flareups so I must avoid! I find the baove foods agree with me so I’m a bit loathe to experiment with new ones as my consultant was all but ready to cut me open before the high fat cyclical lifestyle began a year ago and saved me, removing grains, wheat, gluten etc was the best thing I ever did!!

431

[quote]Amonero wrote:
That would be interesting to try if it was readily available and affodable over here. Norway’s got the highest taxes and strictest restrictions in the world on supplements though, so those amounts of product would be almost as expensive as doing a cycle :stuck_out_tongue:

[/quote]

You really do not need any supplements to get big, strong, lean and healthy -folks have been doing wonderfully well without supplements for years. However, when used wisely…supplements can certainly help.

432

Lol I was just making sure those numbers were right because that’s a LOT of powder or pills… In the meantime, Anaconda and MAG-10 are out and I wholly intend to make myself a human guinnea pig for a regiment a little less costly than the Protocol that Biotest put out. We’ll know around the middle of February what my results are. I’ll do a control week and then 2 months of Anaconda-assisted workouts. I’m also, starting this week, moving to 6 workouts per week rather than the 3-4 I already do.

Speaking of stuff though, I saw this Anutra stuff at Whole Foods. The label compares it (favorably in all categories) to flax. What’s your take?

[quote]Pauli D wrote:
samdan wrote:
500mg per kilo L-Glutamine and 250mg per kilo Glycine?

Some of the biggest L-glutamine supplements I’m finding are like 1500mg per serving, and 500mg per serving for Glycine… Did you mean 50mg and 25mg per kilo?

Work up slowly. You don’t “need” carbs PWO -especially if you have become fat adapted.
In fact…carbohydrates are not “needed” at all physiologically --and, most of us do so much better without them. [/quote]

433

[quote]Emz wrote:

ATM, I’m 150lbs at about 13%
[/quote]

And, how tall are you?
What is your age?

I think, in your case, you might should just stop obsessing over the details and eat more in general. You need to build a bigger and more efficient ‘furnace’ -or ‘engine’ in order to make any real body comp changes

I have helped many people beat Crohn’s, IBS and Ulcerative colitis. There are a few things we could do here to open up your food choice and variety.

434

[quote]Pauli D wrote:
Emz wrote:

ATM, I’m 150lbs at about 13%

And, how tall are you?
What is your age?
[/quote]

5,7…and a bit :wink: and 30!

[quote] I think, in your case, you might should just stop obsessing over the details and eat more in general. You need to build a bigger and more efficient ‘furnace’ -or ‘engine’ in order to make any real body comp changes
[/quote]

Are you referring to a full on mass gain cycle or just eat ‘slightly’ more, maybe upto maintenance? I was planning on doing this tbh, weeks of dieting have taken their toll and I’m sure my metabolism is in need of repairing!

This has really peeked my interest, would love to hear more on this as I would really enjoy adding more foods that ain’t gonna hurt this damned disease! I don’t suppose raw nuts would figure in there…

435

Nice to see the AD thread, in one form or another, still lives.

Rock on my KETO / AD brothers :wink:

Sasha

436

[quote]Emz wrote:
This has really peeked my interest, would love to hear more on this as I would really enjoy adding more foods that ain’t gonna hurt this damned disease! I don’t suppose raw nuts would figure in there…[/quote]

No, no nuts…at least not until we heal your gut.
Have you ever had any food allergy testing done?

Where do you live? What country?

437

[quote]SashaG wrote:
Nice to see the AD thread, in one form or another, still lives.

Rock on my KETO / AD brothers :wink:

Sasha
[/quote]

Hey, Pal!
Nice of you to drop in!
Stick around…plenty of questions still. We could use your expertise.

~Paul

438

[quote]Pauli D wrote:
Emz wrote:
This has really peeked my interest, would love to hear more on this as I would really enjoy adding more foods that ain’t gonna hurt this damned disease! I don’t suppose raw nuts would figure in there…

No, no nuts…at least not until we heal your gut.
Have you ever had any food allergy testing done?

Where do you live? What country?[/quote]

Nope!! My docs take the classical view that diet isn’t a factor/we don’t know enough and we will treat each flair up with copious amounts of corticosteroids and immunosuppresants, side effects be damned, they won’t entertain any other form of treatment! This ‘classical’ thinking isn’t good enough anymore, I’ve seen way too many anecodtal evidence pointing to diet as a benefit to induce and maintain remission which is what I’ve tried to do on my own for the last year since adopting a high fat cyclical diet, so far so good - no symptoms since March and no steds since April, it’s the best period I’ve had since diagnosed 4 years ago!! the only drawback is I’ve severley restricted foods/food groups that ‘may’ be problematic and am now too afraid to introduce foods back just in case it triggers a response, can’t be good to eact the same thing over and over day in day out!! I love nuts but every book/information I’ve seen says stay away, definately do not consume in any shape or form as they’re too tough/coarse - sucks!! I’m in Wales, UK!
I live in Wales, UK!

439

Hi guys, I started the anabolic diet but I did my first carb load on 10 days because I started the diet on wednesday and I wanted to do the carb-up on the weekend. Is it possible that I didn’t switch to fat burning? Should I start again or just continue with 5 days no carbs and load on weekends? Thanks in advance.

440

Just keep going with the diet. You’re probably most of the way fat adapted and it doesn’t completely reset you.

Welcome to the madhouse.