Massive Eating/Growth-Surge Project diet please critique

Bigger Stronger Leaner Competitive Bodybuilding
1

Meal 1:
10 egg whites w/ 2 yokes
1 c. oatmeal
1 banana
8 oz. skim milk

Meal 2:
2 sc. whey
2 oz. mixed nuts
1 T. flax
12 oz. skim

Meal 3:
1 whole chicken breast
2 pc. whole wheat bread
1/2 c. granola
mixed veggies

Meal 4:
2 scoops whey/casein/egg mix
12 oz. skim

Meal 5: Post-workout
2 sc. gatorade w/ 8 oz grape juice
2 sc. whey

Meal 6:
1 can tuna
salsa
1/2 c. Cott. C
1 T fish oil

Meal 7:
MRP shake
salad
apple

Meal 8:
good weight gainer

Totals: 4688 cals. 433 carbs 414.5 protein 142 fats

Supps: multis, R-ALA, isomer-E, add. Calcium, protein powders by ON, muscle milk, and GROW, Nitrous and Swole by Syntrax.

My total calorie intake for the the 2 week growth stage needs to be around 5300-5400 and I am at only 4700 so I need more cals. Also I think my fats and carbs are too high in some meals, so some guidance here is needed.

Thank you guys for all your feedback it’s much appreciated.

2

Eat for fat add in a cup of nut or 2 like almonds are my fave there mostly good fats at least that is what i do when i need extra cals.

3

make eggs with lots of olive oil

4

rbeliminator,
you might want to read the article by david barr. swole creatine contains Guanidinopropionic Acid (GPA)and Glycocyamine which binds the creatine transporter and plugs it up so creatine can?t be transported into various tissues.

the article is called “dangerous creatine”

5

Can I get a link to the David Barr article??

Also for the two a day lifting sessions in the growth surge project. I have been trying to work out a nutrition plan for these days but I seem lost. Can someone help me for these days?

I am planning for these to get up at 6:15. Eat a prewokout meal by 6:30, then hit the gym and be home by 8:20 am. My meal plan for this is really struggling… Then in the evening I will be back at the gym by 3:00 pm, and be too work @ 4:30 and need help here too.

Basically an entire meal plan for these days is needed or wanted. Thank you very much, guys.

6

RBeliminator, welcome to the forum! (grin)

Your plan looks pretty solid. It’s obvious you’ve done your homework and put a lot of time into planning out your diet.

Personally, I’m not a big fan of dairy, and I see you’re getting a fair amount of it, almost with every meal. Some people do well with it. Others don’t. For physiological reasons (how the sugar in milk is processed), it can result in more-than-acceptable fat gain. As much as you can, as an alternative, draw from quality starchy-carb sources; i.e., sweet potatoes, yams, brown rice, beans, oatmeal, whole-wheat pasta and bread, etc.

Make sure the mixed nuts you’re getting are raw and not cooked/roasted. You need the healthy fat.

Speaking of fat, you should be getting fish oil high in EPA/DHA (a good nutrient partitioning agent, among other things) in the 6-10g range and olive oil and/or avocado (high in monounsaturated fats, which support T levels). You’re getting some flaxseed oil, though, which is a good thing!

Re your eggs, eat them with the yolks. You need some saturated fat (along with your mono’s) when bulking to support T levels. Instead of oatmeal on Meal 1, make a veggie omelette and load up on the veggies if you’re following JB’s P+F and P+C food combining concepts.

If you’re looking for hard numbers, I’d recommend .5g x LBM for fat intake, divided roughly equally among your Omega 3s, mono’s and saturated fat.

My final recommendation is that you NOT go from one caloric extreme to another, but rather that you start at maintenance, whatever that number is, and add 250 calories per day (over the course of a week), increasing that number on any week you don’t gain weight. You’ll see results more slowly, but fat gain will be less.

If you have any questions, don’t hesitate to ask!!!

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I agree with all the good info you have received here. The only thing I would like to retouch on is TT’s recomendation of upping the k/cal intake slower than you are. Most of the time when ppl just raise k/cals up 1000 or more for a bulking stage they put on way to much fat and are back here in a few weeks asking how to cut fat off without losing LBM. It just leads to a big yoyo of dieting/bulking.

Generally I would say raise it 250 @ a time like TT said but since you are doing growth surge and the two a days you might want to go for 500 or so and see how that goes. Then raise or lower it after you see the results 2 weeks gives you.

Just my 2cc.

you got some great info and a good plan it seems. Use what you can and keep us informed on your progress.

Phill

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Thanks for all your help. I just didn’t know I wanted all the saturated fats? In other words your saying eat all ten eggs whole with the yolks? and if I use the equation .5g x LBM. Since I weigh about 205 That is roughly 102g of fat. And my diet has 142 g in it all drawn up. I have already been following the priming stage and am roughly getting in 3200-3500 cals. a day for the last two weeks. So… If I jump to 4500 over a couple of days you don’t think this will be ok? Thaks again for all your feedback.

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What’s your BF% RB? If you weigh 205 pounds, part of that is fat and part is lean body mass (LBM). As an example, if you were 15% BF at 205, you’d carry 31 pounds of BF and 174 pounds of LBM. When determining fat requirements, I would recommend that you do so on LBM, not TBW (Total Body Weight). Big difference in some cases. (grin)

Continuing with the above example, at 174 pounds of LBM, you should be taking in 87g of fat per day, which would mean that you should ROUGHLY get 29g each of EFAs, mono’s and saturated fat.

And yes, definitely, you want some saturated fat. If you avoid it like the plague, T (testosterone) levels will suffer.

As far as how many eggs to eat, once you have the numbers you’re shooting for, the next thing is to figure out which meals are going to be P+F meals and which meals are going to be P+C meals. Fat should be divided among your P+F meals. Eat as many eggs as you’re allowed to eat without going over your fat requirements/numbers for that meal. If you need more protein, without increasing fat, you can use egg whites or chicken or lean ground beef. You have any number of options.

Does that help?

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I’ve got the cutting part down pretty good (diet-wise and exercise-wise). It’s the bulking up that is difficult for me. I’m talking specifically when doing Mag-10 and going on an all-out Growth Surge cycle per Berardi. If you breaking up your meals into P+C and P+F, how the hell are you supposed to take in 500 grams of carbs per day per Berardi’s recommendations? I’m ususally doing nothing but P+C meals to meet this goal when I’m bulking up. Don’t givtake advantage of your PWO window; I already do it. Even if you stuff in carbs before, during, & after at most you are taking 250-300 grams of carbs; you’re still left with at least 200 grams to take in the rest of the day. I’ve noticed that I have gained a little bit too much fat in the past while on these bulking cycles. Would it be wiser to lower my intake to say 400 grams of carbs per day and include some P+F meals while still getting around the 5,000 cal intake? Any input by the masters on this boards?

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randman, the rules are different when you’re bulking with Mag-10.

  • Except for your 6-10g of EPA/DHA, keep fat as low as possible. Lean protein sources only.

  • Protein should be 2g x TBW.

  • Carbs should be 2g x TBW if you want to drop a little BF and put on a little muscle at the same time.

  • Carbs should be 3g x TBW if you want to put on as much size as possible.

  • Carbs should be predominantly from starchy, low-/no-fiber sources. It’s the only way you’ll be able to eat the amount of carbs you’re supposed to. Pick white rice over brown rice. Keep veggies to a minimum. Eat bread and pasta. Eat low-fiber, low-fat cereals. Everything you’d never do when you’re NOT on Mag-10. (grin)

On your off cycle, drop protein and carbs to 1.5g x TBW and add in some quality fat; EFAs, mono’s and some saturated fat.

The off cycle should be maintenance calories (at your higher LBM #) to hold onto gains. You should NOT be trying to cut on your off cycle.

Does that sound more do-able, randman?

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Thanks TT. I knew you would have some good info and actually confirmed pretty much everything I knew and have been doing. The only problem I really ran up against was going on too many bulk/maint./bulk/maint. cycles in a row (in 4 week cycles). This gradually put on the fat & probably accelerated at the end since by bf% went up. Once I get down to a lower bf % again, this time I will follow the same formula but do it like this: 4-6 weeks bulk, 2 weeks maintenance; 4 weeks slightly hypocaloric to shed the fat and retain the muscle. Then I will repeat. It’s a constant science experiment on my body. Thanks for the reply.

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randman, try “controlled” instead of “all-out.” If you’re tracking calories, carbs etc., in a food log, each cycle should get more and more precise, yielding better and better results.

Don’t forget to recalculate maintenance calories and bulking calories based on your new/higher body weight each cycle.

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[quote] TT wrote, randman, try “controlled” instead of “all-out.” If you’re tracking calories, carbs etc., in a food log, each cycle should get more and more precise, yielding better and better results.
[/quote]

This is great advice. By logging what you are doing you should be able to evaluate each attempt and make educated adjustments to find what personally works best for you.

No matter what cookie cutter program we use to star us out be it bulking/ or cutting That is exactly what it is a starting point. To get the most out of it you have to tweak it over time to fit you.

Good luck on the bulks, get huge and keep us informed on the progress.

Phill

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So about 87 grams of fat per day, if I heard correctly? My other plan was around 140 g per day, and I was still at only around 4700 cals. So I am going to need about 600 more past what I had already but when i cut my fats back from 140 to 90 I am also going to lose about another 450 cals. So now I am 1000 calories short of 5300, at 4300.

Now, another question. Tampa-terry. On days when i lift twice per day. Can you outline me a sample diet for a day like this. not with all the food, but with all the times…

I am getting up at around 6:15 on these days, eating at 6:30, leaving to gym at 6:45, arriving at gym at 7, lifting by 7:05. done lifting at 8:05. Back home by 8:20( should I have a postworkout shake in here?) then I eat at 8:30, then too school by 9:15.

For my second lifting time. I have two options of times to lift, either at 2:00 or after work at around 9:30.

I want to know if I should be having two postworkout drinks and 2 preworkout drinks on these days or what? which alone would put me at around 200 carbs, for my shakes at least. So help me out in all these areas would be great

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I’m interested in the timing of the workouts as well - what works best for me time-wise is doing them about 3 hrs apart - people think that’s too soon?

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So about 87 grams of fat per day, if I heard correctly?

RBeliminator, that’s not really what I said. I said you need to calculate your fat requirements based on your LBM. I have no idea what your BF% is or your LBM. The trick is to take in all of what you need, but no more than what you need. That will leave more room for carbs, which gram for gram (my opinion, here) will do a better job of helping you put on muscle.

Remember to increase your calories slowly. Use your knowledge of your body and personal experience versus calculators. There are huge differences in people’s metabolisms. So for two guys with exactly the same amount of LBM, a given number of calories will be too high for one (i.e., he’s putting on scale weight too fast and more fat than is acceptable), while for the other guy it’s way too low because he’s not gaining any weight!

Repeating, whatever number you choose, increase calories by 250 calories per day (for the next week) on any week you don’t gain weight. And if you’re gaining much more than a pound or a pound and a half a week (assuming you’re not on a PH), I’d drop calories a bit.

The only way you’re going to know whether you should raise or lower calories is if you’re keeping a food log. (hint, hint)

Re eating, just eat every 3 hours. It can be stretched to 4, but don’t do it unless you have to. You can also shorten it to 2.5 hours. I eat every 3 hours, 8 meals a day. I even get up at 3am to chug down a shake, not that you have to go to that extreme. As it relates to my workouts, I try and time them so that I’m due for another meal PWO. That “meal” is always Surge. If you have no idea why PWO nutrition is so important, read John Berardi’s article, “Solving the Post Workout Puzzle,” Parts I & II.

If you know you’re going to work out, just get a little something on your stomach. Even a small whey shake would work. It’s more important to optimize PWO nutrition. And yes, I’d take Surge twice on days I was doing resistance training twice. You need the carbs for bulking. And then one hour to 90 minutes after drinking Surge, you should be taking in a P+C meal with C being starchy carbs (not green veggies); i.e., oatmeal, sweet potatoes, brown rice, etc.

Bob423, in the process of answering RBeliminator’s questions, did I answer yours?

If I didn’t make myself clear or you have more questions, don’t hesitate to ask.

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It’s close to answered: from the impression I get, you’re basically saying that if I have enough time to eat properly in between workouts, I’m good to go? I plan on using Surge 2xday after workouts. I’m planning on finishing workout, having surge, waiting about 1-1.5 hrs, con’t…

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…con’t…having a decent amount of P+C, then hitting the gym again in another hour or two, looking for about 3 hrs total in between time. You think my CNS will recover enough in between to have another intense workout? I might just have to try it to find out… : )

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Anyone have an idea as to why the posting feature doesn’t like my longer posts i.e. it wouldn’t take the two above as one, and it’s damn short!