Levrone is Back!

Training Bodybuilding
401

[quote]w00tage wrote:
I just want to clear something up. Since Kevin reached a much larger size than he would have been able to naturally (assuming there is a natural limit), it seems to me that means he would now be able to reach a larger size naturally than his original natural limit, because of muscle memory and such. Although, I guess no-one really knows, that makes sense, yes?

If so, am I the only one finding it a bit weird how everyone is calling this inspirational to people who want to be natural, because firstly, he has great genetics. Secondly, Kevin perhaps couldn’t even reach the size he will naturally, had he not been much bigger previously, with the aide of whatever-he-used.

Of course, it is somewhat inspirational, and I love the fact he’s maintaining this blog in the way he is, but the way I’m reading certain things people have said is “look, Kevin Levrone is getting huge naturally, that means you can be just as huge without using steroids!” which will likely not be the case for almost everyone.

For the record, I don’t doubt for a minute that this is a natural transformation, and imo the steroid test is pretty pointless as the critics will likely claim that he cheated it somehow.[/quote]

Why do you think he couldn’t reach the size he is now naturally? How big do some of you think he is? He is nowhere near the 250+lbs of solid contest conditioned mass he was at his peak and there are tons of people who can get bigger than he is right now without steroids.

I mean, I’ve seen high school kids at Yates high school in Houston who make most of the members on this site look like they don’t even lift. If you have been in areas where there is a large number of genetically gifted athletes, this transformation doesn’t seem so mind boggling.

402

[quote]Professor X wrote:
w00tage wrote:
I just want to clear something up. Since Kevin reached a much larger size than he would have been able to naturally (assuming there is a natural limit), it seems to me that means he would now be able to reach a larger size naturally than his original natural limit, because of muscle memory and such. Although, I guess no-one really knows, that makes sense, yes?

If so, am I the only one finding it a bit weird how everyone is calling this inspirational to people who want to be natural, because firstly, he has great genetics. Secondly, Kevin perhaps couldn’t even reach the size he will naturally, had he not been much bigger previously, with the aide of whatever-he-used.

Of course, it is somewhat inspirational, and I love the fact he’s maintaining this blog in the way he is, but the way I’m reading certain things people have said is “look, Kevin Levrone is getting huge naturally, that means you can be just as huge without using steroids!” which will likely not be the case for almost everyone.

For the record, I don’t doubt for a minute that this is a natural transformation, and imo the steroid test is pretty pointless as the critics will likely claim that he cheated it somehow.

Why do you think he couldn’t reach the size he is now naturally? How big do some of you think he is? He is nowhere near the 250+lbs of solid contest conditioned mass he was at his peak and there are tons of people who can get bigger than he is right now without steroids.

I mean, I’ve seen high school kids at Yates high school in Houston who make most of the members on this site look like they don’t even lift. If you have been in areas where there is a large number of genetically gifted athletes, this transformation doesn’t seem so mind boggling.[/quote]

I didn’t say he couldn’t as such, he might not even reach that limit (again, if such a limit exists) as that may or may not be his goal. I was saying that - it seems to me anyway - like said limit would have increased, simply because he has carried far more muscle in the past.

I was talking in terms of expecting him to reach his goal of 245lbs, being as lean as he is currently, or even more so, as I fully expect him to do that.

Yeah, I see that as a real disadvantage for me, as weightlifting isn’t big at all over here. We don’t grow up with it at all, and the gyms that are available (certainly the ones I’ve checked into near to where I live) are all lacking in free weights. I am always envious when I see American videos taken in the gym, because they always look big and really well equipped, lol. There are basically no huge guys in my gym, and it seriously pisses me off.

403

[quote]w00tage wrote:
Professor X wrote:
w00tage wrote:
I just want to clear something up. Since Kevin reached a much larger size than he would have been able to naturally (assuming there is a natural limit), it seems to me that means he would now be able to reach a larger size naturally than his original natural limit, because of muscle memory and such. Although, I guess no-one really knows, that makes sense, yes?

If so, am I the only one finding it a bit weird how everyone is calling this inspirational to people who want to be natural, because firstly, he has great genetics. Secondly, Kevin perhaps couldn’t even reach the size he will naturally, had he not been much bigger previously, with the aide of whatever-he-used.

Of course, it is somewhat inspirational, and I love the fact he’s maintaining this blog in the way he is, but the way I’m reading certain things people have said is “look, Kevin Levrone is getting huge naturally, that means you can be just as huge without using steroids!” which will likely not be the case for almost everyone.

For the record, I don’t doubt for a minute that this is a natural transformation, and imo the steroid test is pretty pointless as the critics will likely claim that he cheated it somehow.

Why do you think he couldn’t reach the size he is now naturally? How big do some of you think he is? He is nowhere near the 250+lbs of solid contest conditioned mass he was at his peak and there are tons of people who can get bigger than he is right now without steroids.

I mean, I’ve seen high school kids at Yates high school in Houston who make most of the members on this site look like they don’t even lift. If you have been in areas where there is a large number of genetically gifted athletes, this transformation doesn’t seem so mind boggling.

I didn’t say he couldn’t as such, he might not even reach that limit (again, if such a limit exists) as that may or may not be his goal. I was saying that - it seems to me anyway - like said limit would have increased, simply because he has carried far more muscle in the past.

I was talking in terms of expecting him to reach his goal of 245lbs, being as lean as he is currently, or even more so, as I fully expect him to do that.

Yeah, I see that as a real disadvantage for me, as weightlifting isn’t big at all over here. We don’t grow up with it at all, and the gyms that are available (certainly the ones I’ve checked into near to where I live) are all lacking in free weights. I am always envious when I see American videos taken in the gym, because they always look big and really well equipped, lol. There are basically no huge guys in my gym, and it seriously pisses me off.[/quote]

Then your perspective makes more sense, but you have to realize, someone with the genetics of Levrone shouldn’t have that much of a problem weighing over 240lbs “relatively lean” (not contest shape) without drugs. These guys aren’t skinny dudes who just take steroids. 9 times out of 10, they would have been way bigger than most of their critics without using anything “extraneous”.

This isn’t that uncommon here, especially if you live in a big urban city.

404

[quote]w00tage wrote:
…the way I’m reading certain things people have said is “look, Kevin Levrone is getting huge naturally, that means you can be just as huge without using steroids!” which will likely not be the case for almost everyone.[/quote]

Why don’t you provide an example quote of someone on this site who said the first thing implying that Levrone’s results show anything with regard to people in general all becoming as large and muscular?

So far as I can tell you’re arguing against something not said here. Or perhaps which may have been a single isolated comment that you managed to stretch or something like that, but certainly not something much said here if at all.

405

i fucking hate Kevin Levrone so much. muscle memory or not this dude is bigger than me in 5 weeks of training.

this dude could probably make his biceps grow 2 inches as a party trick. what an asshole

:slight_smile:

406

[quote]LiveFromThe781 wrote:
i fucking hate Kevin Levrone so much. muscle memory or not this dude is bigger than me in 5 weeks of training.

this dude could probably make his biceps grow 2 inches as a party trick. what an asshole

:)[/quote]

lol

407

[quote]Bill Roberts wrote:
w00tage wrote:
…the way I’m reading certain things people have said is “look, Kevin Levrone is getting huge naturally, that means you can be just as huge without using steroids!” which will likely not be the case for almost everyone.

Why don’t you provide an example quote of someone on this site who said the first thing implying that Levrone’s results show anything with regard to people in general all becoming as large and muscular?

So far as I can tell you’re arguing against something not said here. Or perhaps which may have been a single isolated comment that you managed to stretch or something like that, but certainly not something much said here if at all.[/quote]

“I think it would be really inspirational to a lot of young people to know that Kevin did this naturally.”

quote from: Levrone Agrees to Steroid Test!

I actually feel my original argument was sort of, well, wrong, after reading my post again. If it inspires people to train harder/etc, because they believe they can achieve those results without taking steroids - whether they are able to or not - is all that really matters.

I don’t really know what has been said on T-Nation in particular, because I’ve read maybe only a handful of posts in the entire thread. I’ve mostly just been reading comments on the blog - which mostly suggest to me that the quote is a good assumption.

I had been wondering about my first question for a while though (but didn’t ask as it made sense to me for that to be true). After reading that sentence I quoted, I suddenly felt it implied something against what I had thought, which sparked the post. I should probably go back to not-posting.

408

No, not at all. It was just a matter of it not being clear that you weren’t referring to what was being said here. As an objection to things said elsewhere, it makes perfect sense.

As for what’s being said by outsiders on Kevin’s blog, there’s so much awful nonsense that I very quickly stopped reading anything there by anyone other than Levrone himself.

409

[quote]Bill Roberts wrote:
No, not at all. It was just a matter of it not being clear that you weren’t referring to what was being said here. As an objection to things said elsewhere, it makes perfect sense.

As for what’s being said by outsiders on Kevin’s blog, there’s so much awful nonsense that I very quickly stopped reading anything there by anyone other than Levrone himself.[/quote]

It’s like youtube comments. If reading them doesn’t piss you off, you are probably dumber than the people you are reading from.

I personally don’t see how this could be that “inspirational” to people who knew where he was before. Maybe they just didn’t believe muscle memory existed before now and are really in shock.

Maybe they believed, like some clueless newbs here, that the human body can ONLY gain .25lbs of muscle a week.

That is the only explanation I have for why so many act like this is drop dead amazing.

It is interesting seeing him train, but I don’t understand most of the responses.

410

I believe he could get back to about where he was with the juice, naturally, but he has to be the one to believe it, so if he will be able to focus on his previous imagine, without thinkin he got that with the juice, he may replicate it naturally, using the law of attraction

411

[quote]Professor X wrote:
I personally don’t see how this could be that “inspirational” to people who knew where he was before. Maybe they just didn’t believe muscle memory existed before now and are really in shock.

Maybe they believed, like some clueless newbs here, that the human body can ONLY gain .25lbs of muscle a week.

That is the only explanation I have for why so many act like this is drop dead amazing.

It is interesting seeing him train, but I don’t understand most of the responses.[/quote]

Personally, I enjoy seeing people make progress, and I don’t care who they are or were.

I am very much aware of the concept of muscle memory, and for me this is a great example of it working.

It’s impressive to see someone get back into it who did used to be so much more. To me its kindof like a comeback attempt of any older athlete; interesting to see how they handle where they are at, interesting to see how well they go, will they compare themselves to where they were? will that get them down? etc etc etc

I’m definitely not in awe, but it’s very cool to watch his progress.

You’re just being old and cynical ;-)…I get where you’re coming from but thought I’d point out why I find this interesting.

412

Where I do see it as inspirational is both in that it’s good to watch anyone have good success and particularly if it is done quickly, and secondly there are a lot of guys in their 40s (or perhaps older but I wouldn’t know about that) that like Levrone, though from a different point, slipped to a condition much less than what they’d had earlier. And seeing another guy of similar age make some quick imnprovement would reasonably be inspirational in such a situation.

Regardless that it should have been known already that such things are doable. Because you don’t see it done every day, and certainly not ordinarily documented day-by-day and in detail as this is.

413

[quote]GluteusGigantis wrote:
Professor X wrote:
I personally don’t see how this could be that “inspirational” to people who knew where he was before. Maybe they just didn’t believe muscle memory existed before now and are really in shock.

Maybe they believed, like some clueless newbs here, that the human body can ONLY gain .25lbs of muscle a week.

That is the only explanation I have for why so many act like this is drop dead amazing.

It is interesting seeing him train, but I don’t understand most of the responses.

Personally, I enjoy seeing people make progress, and I don’t care who they are or were.

I am very much aware of the concept of muscle memory, and for me this is a great example of it working.

It’s impressive to see someone get back into it who did used to be so much more. To me its kindof like a comeback attempt of any older athlete; interesting to see how they handle where they are at, interesting to see how well they go, will they compare themselves to where they were? will that get them down? etc etc etc

I’m definitely not in awe, but it’s very cool to watch his progress.

You’re just being old and cynical ;-)…I get where you’re coming from but thought I’d point out why I find this interesting.[/quote]

I think it is “interesting” as well, but some of these responses are as if the man is lifting a weight for the first time in his life.

414

[quote]stefanogym wrote:
I believe he could get back to about where he was with the juice, naturally, but he has to be the one to believe it, so if he will be able to focus on his previous imagine, without thinkin he got that with the juice, he may replicate it naturally, using the law of attraction[/quote]

In general I can’t agree for a couple of reasons. I want to however change this to a general question of pro bb’ers or other experienced steroid users who have trained seriously, hard, and well for years with drugs.

First and most simply, being on androgens allows the muscles to be fuller for reasons I believe of storing more glycogen and holding more glycogen-associated water. In my case this is consistently 9 lb. For others the value can be somewhat different. But there is always such an effect. For a more muscular person the figure can well be more. So to start off with, even if getting back to the same amount of actual contractile protein, muscle fibers and so forth, size would be less by such an amount.

Second, if your theory were true then with post-cycle methods yielding androgen levels never dropping below mid-normal or even high-normal, and this certainly can be done, then if it were possible as you say to build back up to the exact same, surely it ought to be possible to maintain the exact same. But this is not the case. While losses can be much slower and less than what many think must be the case – due to their less than optimal methods – if the lifter really achieved at a high level, for him, with the drugs, there will be a fall-off. So how can one argue that he could naturally build back up fully to the same?

Lastly, for the vast majority of pro bb’ers their peak muscularity (which isn’t at contest time) represents having reached a homeostasis where, despite the drugs and big eating and training and everything else, a balance point is reached where muscle mass stays about the same.

Without the drugs, the homeostasis point is less.

Now in the case of Levrone, a monkey wrench is thrown into the works in that he wasn’t in the practice of reaching such a homeostasis point in the off-season.

But still, by no means would I expect that he can naturally attain a condition such as in the example pic not many posts back. As for “Law of Attraction,” I am unaware of its existence in terms of any real science and so citing it does not really show anything.

415

[quote]totti13 wrote:
no[/quote]

Cy Wilson.
That was the pharmacologist in chief for Biotest when I used to live here 2 years ago and that was when I also read articles about Anthony Roberts.
I have not read or posted on T-Nation for 2 years so I am obviously confusing everyone!

: D

On Kevin’s development:

I am not surprised at all that his body can respond so efficiently.
There is a reason why athletes don’t grow up to become brain surgeons.
Anyone here who has been exposed to elite level athletic training or has witnessed these human bodies at work and at rest will tell you you are at another level of efficiency.
It is almost as if they are not deficient in any way physically and the body responds to favorable conditions optimally.

I have just been watching Wimbledon ( The Wiliams sisters supremacy is phenomenal, by the way, it is like they were bred to dominate - but that is for another thread )and Martina Navratilova was giving an interview where she said she put on 20lbs in two weeks when she moved to America - not from eating junk, just because the portions were larger than in her country. Navratilova, in my opinion, is another example of physical excellence like Levrone.

Many Olympic champions have reported how quickly their bodies respond when the same level of training is restored.

I think it is fair to remember also they don’t have to go back to a 9 to 5 job and train.
Training is their 9 to 5 job.
They train, eat, sleep, train, eat, sleep, train.

That is their mind set and their life style - it is not a strategy.

When you live it you become it.

I am not saying it can not be done if one has to work but it takes longer and that is when you need a strategy.

Also, I can clearly tell the difference between a strong man training at my gym and an athlete training at the same gym.

I am sorry if this breaks your balls but people who arrive or can arrive at levels of excellence in physical conditioning do actually FULLY OCCUPY THEIR BODIES and it does show in the way they train, their attitude, their mind set and most of all what they are prepared to sacrifice to arrive at peak conditions.

They seem almost possessed in a powerful but quiet way.

416

Kevin busting out the Prowler!

417

He finally trained traps. By this time next week he will have monster traps haha. I’m suprised he was doing sled pulls, he is traning outside of the norm (BB wise).

418

[quote]Game Time wrote:
By this time next week he will have monster traps haha. I’m suprised he was doing sled pulls, he is traning outside of the norm (BB wise).[/quote]

I think he is up to something, don’t you?

: )

419

Great to hear someone like Levrone talk about the importance of overall conditioning and flexibility as a bodybuilder and athlete.

420

[quote]Alpha F wrote:
Game Time wrote:
By this time next week he will have monster traps haha. I’m suprised he was doing sled pulls, he is traning outside of the norm (BB wise).

I think he is up to something, don’t you?

: )

[/quote]

In my opinion, yes. But I will believe the drug test so I will bite my words if I am wrong.

Did anyone else comment on a company name? It would be really nice to get a chance to talk with Levrone, the free supps don’t really intrigue me…I’ll still take them tho :slight_smile: