[quote]azza30 wrote:
God. This so proves my point about bodybuilding destroying itself at the grass roots with idiots like this. You seem knowledgable, but as i’ve said before too much knowledge causes confusion and stupid decisions.
This is my first and last post here.[/quote]
Um…
Good.
[quote]azza30 wrote:
God. This so proves my point about bodybuilding destroying itself at the grass roots with idiots like this. You seem knowledgable, but as i’ve said before too much knowledge causes confusion and stupid decisions.
This is my first and last post here.[/quote]
What?
[quote]Makavali wrote:
Affliction wrote:
It’s the difference between giving a 16 year-old $1,000 and a 30 year-old $1,000. Who gets more value out of it?
The more intelligent one. Sorry dude, but that was a poor choice for your analogy.[/quote]
Agreed, Mak. I was somewhat handcuffed as I was using the monetary and stock market framework provided by AKBoxer, not me.
To clarify, I meant:
A thirty year-old that is;
versus;
A sixteen year-old that has no experience therein.
You guys talk like a teenager is going to ruin the sanctity of steroids or something. This isn’t gay marriage. Not that I have any problem with that either.
Let the guy do what he wants. He’s an intelligent guy, and he’s weighed the risks vs rewards.
If your response is “He’s going to ruin it for the rest of us”. Well I can tell you, it’s already been ruined. Many of the world’s governments don’t seem to happy about adults using either. I don’t think it can get any worse.
Just to be perfectly clear, I have no issues with this cycle. His body, his choice. If he gets snapped, it’s not like AAS will become… double illegal?
I see this as a chance for responsible teenagers to show what they can do and prove that there are a few intelligent ones out there.
No pressure.
Well, I guess my continued attempts to dissuade have fallen on deaf ears, but I already knew that. I was 19 once as well.
Apologies to Dopamineloveaffa and Mak if I seemed like I was all ivory tower about it. I’ve seen so many people between my age and the OP’s (19-22) get nothing out of sauce because they don’t know much about training, diet, or they party it away. I suppose time will tell if this is to be the case here or not.
To the OP, good luck. I wasn’t “hating” on you, per say. My intentions were good, honestly. If you have any training questions, just ask. I consider myself fairly knowledgeable in that regard.
As a final note, consider changing your name to “KVA”. Seriously.
Thanks for the support Mak and Dopamine.
Affliction-I know you meant well, thanks. Feel free to comment on anything you see on my log that you think I should adjust or do differently, training or cycle related.
JUST NO MORE ARGUMENTS ABOUT WHETHER THIS SHOULD BE DONE OR NOT! 
LOL
I’m going to work out, so I’ll post my Chest workout in a couple hours. Also, I’ll have wheel pics for you guys tonight also.
Day (-1)
Weight (177.0)
Chest Day
Bench Press
135x5, 185x5, 190x5, 190x4, 185x4, 175x7
DB Flies
35x5, 35x5, 35x5, 35x5, 35x5
Incline Barbell Bench
155x4, 135x5, 135x5, 135x5, 145x5
***I will be going with DB Bench from now on, shoulder is hurting me from BB Incline
Hammer strength Wide Chest Press Machine
200x5, 210x5, 220x4, 210x4, 200x5
Low to high Cable flies (just felt like throwing them in today)
40x10, 40x10, 40x10
Caloric Intake 3700 (Oops…)
and…leg shot
looks like your still going strong… More power to you! Keep up the work…
[quote]Affliction wrote:
Well, I guess my continued attempts to dissuade have fallen on deaf ears, but I already knew that. I was 19 once as well.
Apologies to Dopamineloveaffa and Mak if I seemed like I was all ivory tower about it. I’ve seen so many people between my age and the OP’s (19-22) get nothing out of sauce because they don’t know much about training, diet, or they party it away. I suppose time will tell if this is to be the case here or not.
To the OP, good luck. I wasn’t “hating” on you, per say. My intentions were good, honestly. If you have any training questions, just ask. I consider myself fairly knowledgeable in that regard.
As a final note, consider changing your name to “KVA”. Seriously.[/quote]
I appreciate your sentiments Affliction as they largely mirror my own. You had an opinion that you had some conviction behind and you expressed it. You did it respectfully. In the end everyone is responsible for his or her own choices. As you stated clearly Kayveeay is going to do this period. I never had one post in the imfamous jake log but I feel compelled to make one here because I see this going the same way
[quote]kayveeay wrote:
JUST NO MORE ARGUMENTS ABOUT WHETHER THIS SHOULD BE DONE OR NOT! LOL
[/quote]
But you see that’s precisely what you need to hear even if you don’t want to hear it.
Let me ask you this. Why do you think there has been almost a complete absence of the dozen most respected and knowledgeable gear guys in this thread?
I’ll tell you why its because we have seen this before. There was another guy named jake who has a multi-hundred post thread log in this forum and its all about his determination to do things his way not heeding advice from the wiser and more experienced members here.
If you merely wanted to post your experiences for all the world to read you could have done a blog. By coming in here clearly part of your process intentional or not is for feedback. You can say you don’t want negative feedback all you want but two things there. 1] this is an public internet forum so people can and will say what they please. 2] if you are generally wrong. If you are making bad choices, do you truly just want to be surrounded by yes-men who tell you want you want to hear and not the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth?
The reason none of the true vets are coming in here is, as I do, they probably see you as another jake. As another teen who truthfully is not ready for what you are about to undertake.
Now having said all that, I will affirm your absolute right to do whatever you please. But you need to affirm two things as aforementioned. 1] That if those with more knowledge and experience try and give you what they intend as constructive criticism that they have the right to do so. 2] That if you fail to follow good solid and proper advice you are unwise.
Please don’t take this personally. My words to you transcend this thread. They truly apply to all those in your situation. Normally I’m extremely helpful with the newbie scene. Sometimes answering questions and providing info where many will not. However, you absolutely need to hear and be told what I’m telling you. Its likely you will choose to proceed with your proposed cycle and no one can deny you that freedom. You just need to know it will be a mistake for you to do so.
Understand where I’m coming from. I’m on gear right now. Started my own cycle sunday. I think my avatar holds the key to the lesson I hope I can teach you and I hope you will learn and appreciate. Trenbolone Cola for Big Boys. Sure its meant to be funny. Its a joke. Gear heads appreciate it. But think about it for a second. Cola for big boys. With all due respect Kayveeay you are not a big boy. So you should not yet be doing as the big boys do. I understand your need and desire to get bigger, stronger, faster. [No wonder they called the movie that] But in every aspect of life you crawl before you walk and you walk before you run. You play in the minors before you make the big show. Bluntly you simply are not ready for the big show. You are not ready for gear yet. The prime example I will use is your training. I’m looking at what you are doing and I can honestly tell you at 177lbs you are doing more than twice the volume per workout that I am doing at 235lbs geared up. By failing to prepare you are preparing to fail. Your age is a factor but moreso is what seems to me like your ignorance when it comes to training. You said yourself you’ve been training seriously for only a year. You mentioned somewhere else you didn’t know how to properly do incline DB flyes. You seem to be to be grossly under-educated in matters of training.
What guys like Affliction were trying and I am now too is to instill some sense of the truth in you. You don’t have everything set up right and properly. You are wanting to leap from your Honda Civic into an Indy Car and you just aren’t ready you need to graduate up the ranks a bit more.
Again, I totally get your desire for the whole bigger, faster, stronger thing. I’m not saying you have to wait till your 25. I’m not saying you have to hit your genetic maxim before gearing up. I’m saying right now, looking at how you train. Looking at the posts you’ve made both in your own threads and in response to others. You simply are not ready to gear up.
Pumping exogenous hormones into your body is a big deal especially if you are ignorant. So sure you can read all the stickies here and you can pick the brains of the vets and I encourage you to do so. All this will bring you closer to being ready.
I realize the day before you planned to gear up might be a tough time to choose to educate yourself and postpone this pending cycle. I hope you do though. Whatever choice you make only you will have to live with it. Believe me, I know how bad you want to be 190-195. I know you want that extra inch on the arms and two on the legs. I know you want to see your lift numbers all go up. Merely taking gear does not guarantee you success in this pursuit. I hate to say it but I would almost bet against your progress and success based on what you have posted about your training and what you have said that reflects on your general knowledge/ignorance of the gear game.
I’m sure this comes off rather harshly but really it is not. Speaking as a very experienced gear vet I’m telling you the absolute truth. The truth whether you admit it or want to hear it or not.
My final piece of fatherly advice to you Kayveeay is this. Should you make the mistake [IMO] to proceed. Don’t just surround yourself with yes men who will perpetuate your ignorance. If and when you encounter difficulties you will need good solid truthful advice. I’ve been a Corrections Officer for 8 years. Corrections by its nature implies there is a problem. In your case I see the problem. Hopefully, hopefully this can be corrected. If you truly want to learn and do this the right way I offer you all my knowledge and ability. If you proceed on your own course, Good Luck. I really and truly don’t want to see you fail. All the best to you.
[quote]saps wrote:
imfamous jake log[/quote]
Link?
I might add to this thread as well concerning jake.
I, and quite a few other members, helped him out considerably. To the point where I was answering 10 of his PMs a day because I volunteered to manage his training and diet. And he got great results.
Then he decided to quit heeding all warnings and advice (much like you) and threw me under the bus. I am rather bitter about in case you can’t tell.
And honestly, your behavior thus far mirrors that of jake, another ignorant ass. Hence, why I have not offered any advice on this thread thus far.
Thought I would clear that up for you.
World
Guys,
I respect your opinions.
I’m open to any advice you guys can give me, regarding diet, training, etc.
Saps, you said my volume is twice what yours is, and you’re probably twice my size.
However, I did a lot of research on training programs, and was under the impression OVT was a good overall mass/strength program. I understand it is high volume, but doing 10-12 sets per muscle group seems awful low, especially since I’m on an overall BULK phase/cycle.
What does your program look like?
I read the Jake log. Almost all of it (skipped a few pages between 4-10) At first, it definitely reminded me of my own log, the way he laid it out and everything.
Unlike him, IMO, I’m open to advice and suggestions. The only “advice” I’ve taken offense to or argued with is the argument about my size/my age. And that’s only when the people word it rudely. Saps, I take no offense whatsoever to what you said.
I really would welcome the advice and input of vets on this forum. I know a lot haven’t chimed in, and World, I’m sorry the guy turned on you, so to speak. However, some vets have let me know that they support me and are here to help me.
I really appreciate those of you who are looking to help me however you can. I know some/alot of you don’t advise me to do this because of my age/size/experience, but I hope you know there’s a 99% chance I’m going to do it, so I’d greatly appreciate any constructive advice towards my diet/training/cycle I can get.
It’s guys like “Azza” (see above a few posts) that cause me to get defensive and argue…
All the others, I’m listening to you guys, and I do value your input.
So, what can I do to improve my training? OVT is not good for a first time bulk cycle?
YGPM
Day (0) <<<Pending mailman tomorrow…
Weight (179.0)
Back Day
Lat Pulldown
115x5, 120x5, 120x5, 110x5, 115x6
1-Arm Row
70x5, 80x5, 80x5, 85x5, 85x5
T-Bar Row
80x5, 85x5, 90x5, 95x5, 95x5
Deadlifts
135x5, 185x5, 225x3, 225x3, 235x3, 255x3 (PR)
Caloric Intake 4900
Did you get your gear?
Gear is not in. If it doesn’t come Monday, I’m going to have to have a talk with my source. It was supposed to be in on Friday.
I’m taking a couple days off to let my body rest up, so I can start on Monday with a clean slate, so to speak.
My routine is changed to this:
Day 1: Chest and Back
Day 2: OFF
Day 3: Delts and Traps
Day 4: Arms & Abs
Day 5: Legs
Day 6: OFF
Six Day split. Same excercises and volume as I’ve been doing.
I was thinking of throwing another rest day in between Delts and Arms, what do you guys think?
I’d get more workouts in on cycle with a 6 day routine than a 7 day.
[quote]kayveeay wrote:
My routine is changed to this:
Day 1: Chest and Back
Day 2: OFF
Day 3: Delts and Traps
Day 4: Arms & Abs
Day 5: Legs
Day 6: OFF[/quote]
Try:
Monday: Chest + Back
Tuesday: Legs + Abs
Wednesday: OFF
Thursday: Arms
Friday: Delts
Saturday: Cardio or something else. I did Ribcage expansion exercises.
Sunday: OFF
Just a thought. It depends on your schedule I guess.