[quote]Bill Roberts wrote:
I added a couple more possibilities to the post for what might help with the serotonin.[/quote]
gracias
I do take the 5-htp
/hijack
[quote]what else could replace the serotonin? Chocolate right?
that or sex isnt it? soooo maybe he needs to start taking some more for the team
I have no clue
[/quote]
I think your right
he needs to f@*k her back into shape
[quote]OctoberGirl wrote:
gracias
I do take the 5-htp
/hijack
[/quote]
Sure thing!
The SAMe may be worth trying too. I used to “have” to take a selective serotonin reuptake inhibitor to avoid moderate depression, but on adopting SAMe usage, never had a further need for it and do completely fine on the SAMe whereas the SSRI was only partially effective. The mechanism is probably increased serotonin. There are a lot of literature findings of success as well.
Saving the whales by increasing the amount of harpooning never does seem to induce fat loss, unfortunately.
[quote]Bill Roberts wrote:
OctoberGirl wrote:
gracias
I do take the 5-htp
/hijack
Sure thing!
The SAMe may be worth trying too. I used to “have” to take a selective serotonin reuptake inhibitor to avoid moderate depression, but on adopting SAMe usage, never had a further need for it and do completely fine on the SAMe whereas the SSRI was only partially effective. The mechanism is probably increased serotonin. There are a lot of literature findings of success as well.
Saving the whales by increasing the amount of harpooning never does seem to induce fat loss, unfortunately.[/quote]
HARSH!!!
but is serotonin stored in fat once it is released or is it only resident in the brain?
would that be another reason for the weight gain?
and the OP is going to have to deal with her head before he can get her working her body.
Thanks for the info, especially from the ladies. Thanks especially for your offer Miss Parker.
I hadn’t seen the Seven Rules before, but they’re pretty much repeating what I’ve read many times before.
I feel like I have a bit more backup and info. Now we just need to slay the dragon lady (KH) and hit the diet.
Serotonin is a brain chemical only, so far as I know.
(UPDATE/CORRECTION: Not correct, it exists elsewhere in the body, see followup post, the one after the mini-diet-article.)
By the way, it occurs to me – hadn’t thought about this till now – that I shouldn’t be crediting only the SAMe for my result. The mechanism by which it can increase serotonin is as a methyl donor, as a methyl donor is required for serotonin production. But I started taking TMG (trimethylglycine) at the same time, and like the SAMe have continued it consistently, and it too is a methyl donor.
TMG is also credited for aiding depression.
So it probably is the combination that was effective for me, not the SAMe alone, which may explain why a low dose of SAMe (400 mg) was effective for me.
TMG is quite cheap while SAMe is moderately costly so the combination may make more sense than taking higher levels of SAMe.
Carb cravings might well be reduced.
Oh, also by the way, the harpooning thing was intended as funny, rather than harsh. But if one had never seen the sexual-connotation T-shirt or bumper sticker, “Save the whales – harpoon a fat chick” then the humor might not have been apparent. Anyway, no harshness intended.
[quote]OctoberGirl wrote:
Here is an article that TC wrote about this
OP you might want to read them.[/quote]
Jesus tapdancing christ. Could someone please hack the KH page and make this the top post?
[quote]synthetic wrote:
OctoberGirl wrote:
Here is an article that TC wrote about this
OP you might want to read them.
Jesus tapdancing christ. Could someone please hack the KH page and make this the top post?
[/quote]
I know! Isn’t that your situation right now?
[quote]Bill Roberts wrote:
Oh, also by the way, the harpooning thing was intended as funny, rather than harsh. But if one had never seen the sexual-connotation T-shirt or bumper sticker, “Save the whales – harpoon a fat chick” then the humor might not have been apparent. Anyway, no harshness intended.
[/quote]
it was funny, besides, sometimes you you have to be blunt or folks miss the hint
[quote]Bill Roberts wrote:
The only suggestion I have is in the direction of limiting further damage.
This is actually a tremendously useful and I think important principle for everyone, men as well as women, and fat-prone kids as well as almost any adult.
Draw a line in the sand that will not be crossed on clothes size, particularly pants size.
Read that line as being in gigantic bold letters. If everything else about diet and exercise is lost from memory, keep that one.
When you see some huge-ass guy wearing size 50 pants, how did this happen?
It happened because there was a day when the largest size he ever wore was 48, but they were getting a little tight and he decided, I’m perfectly willing to wear size 50. And he went and bought some 50’s (or his spouse did and he chose to wear them.)
Now, he was still wearing 48’s the day they were bought. If they were a little tight, all it would have taken is a few DAYS of dieting to get them proper-fitting again. But no, he decided that wearing size 50 was the way to go.
The same is true for guys wearing size 36 (where they really are not big enough framed to wear that in lean condition), 11 year old boys wearing men’s size 34, etc.
The ONLY way they got this fat was because of a decision that, yup, let’s buy some yet-bigger pants.
Refuse to do that, and you won’t get fatter than that. It is a guaranteed method.
And for fat-prone people, buying the bigger clothes when in fact the current size can still (barely) be fit into is a guarantee of of growing yet fatter into the new clothes.
So for example if your wife is wearing a size 18, if she can get with the program that a size 20 should never be bought – size 18 is enough, 20 is too much – at least that will end the yet-further fat-ification.
It actually would go easier if you yourself had a little bit of an issue with fat and employed this method yourself and frequently mentioned how well it works.
Now of course, people will say that this makes perfect sense but then fail to follow through. For example, my ex-fiancee’s son is a fat kid who really would have found it simple enough to not be particularly fat. The first few years, she never really listened to me that, for example, a 9 year-old really should not be wearing a size 14 “Husky” (read: size 14 Fat) and for sure she should draw the line at the current 12 “Husky” for the next couple of years, etc. She sounded like she finally was seeing the light when he was wearing size 34 at age 11, but no… she went and bought him yet bigger pants so he was enabled to reach well over 200 lb prior to his 13th birthday.
So I’m not saying that even given the undoubted truth of this principle, people will necessarily follow through, but on the other hand back when I advised a lot of people on diet, many said this single simple thing was the best thing anyone ever told them. So it can help; actually not just help but absolutely guarantee not getting worse than a given point. (And that point can be tightened up with time if desired.) It just depends on whether the person has any self-willingness at all, or actually downright prefers being fat, or prefers, probably subconsciously, for their child to be fat (where relevant).[/quote]
I’ve never heard anyone else express this before, but I agree.
I watched my mother get fatter and fatter and buy bigger and bigger clothes. She would always talk about dieting to get back in her 10’s/12’s/14’s/16’s etc. Though skinny at the time, I vowed never to buy bigger clothes because it appeared that that was the point of no return.
One complication to this rule is that there has been size deflation in women’s clothing. I swear I am not making this up; the clothing companies have simply put smaller numbers on the the same size clothes. I don’t know how much more they can keep this up, since sometimes you will now see a size “00” (smaller than “0”).
I think that we should post this thread on Harding’s blog, many times…
But for the OP, in my opinion, you can’t really force her or change her attitude, it must come for her. When she will realize how bad her attitude is, she will want to do something, you can only help her realizing this. But she won’t do anything if she doesn’t change her mindset.
she needs to hit rock bottom before she’ll change. If subtle hints don’t work, have a serious talk with her about how you are less attracted to her now, not because of her appearance, but because she apparently has lost enough respect for herself that she would let herself become fat.
5 HTP was a lifesaver for me, as it helped restore serotonin for me.
OP, here is a link to another serotonin study.
http://serendip.brynmawr.edu/bb/neuro/neuro99/web1/Byrd.html
maybe you can at least get her to try the 5-HTP and the TMG
if she starts feeling better maybe you can get her to go on walks with you
[quote]synthetic wrote:
Draw a line in the sand that will not be crossed on clothes size, particularly pants size.
She has a $2500 custom DUI drysuit (SCUBA) that doesn’t fit at the moment. That’s a big issue, and she’s trying to get it to fit. It’s a goal for her because we both dive. She just doesn’t know how to lose weight (aside from starvation), and won’t listen to me. All I ‘know’ is what works for ME, not for her. Not that she’s had any success with her own plan.
If I cook a low-carb meal, she has cereal afterward. When I plan the menu for the week, she wants nights for pasta, tikka masala with rice and naan, steak and veggies… with bread. Always starch. And since diet is 85% of the battle, there’s no progress.
I could start dumping HOT-ROX Extreme into the salad dressing: “raspberry vinaigrette!”
Seriously, if I could just get rid of the daily affirmation that it’s OK to be obese that would be a big start. [/quote]
Find a really good trainer who “gets it” and send her to him. Getting the info on diet and exercise from a 3rd party may get her to take it more seriously even if it’s the same info you’ve given her. Also she may be more willing to follow along if she’s paying for the advice.
[quote]andersons wrote:
One complication to this rule is that there has been size deflation in women’s clothing. I swear I am not making this up; the clothing companies have simply put smaller numbers on the the same size clothes. I don’t know how much more they can keep this up, since sometimes you will now see a size “00” (smaller than “0”).
[/quote]
It’s been a factor with men’s clothing, though as a relatively fine point.
It seems to me that pants of a given nominal size are now the same actual size as what the next smaller size was years ago. E.g., today a “size 32” is the same as what a “size 34” used to be. Similar to how women’s clothes are now called a size smaller than they used to be.
However, it’s a relatively fine point: someone who over a decade or more grew from a then-called 32 to a modern-day 32 has kept the fat gain very slow and, if desired, well within the range of quickly dieting off while the guy who let himself buy and wear modern-day 34’s or larger when, in his case, 32’s represented already being as big in the waist and/or hips as he should be has indeed let himself go to fat.
Similarly a woman’s fat gain would be very, very slow and still quite limited by holding to given nominal pants and blouse sizes. True, if the trend you mention continues that may allow getting slightly fatter over long periods of time, but to a very gradual extent and certainly far more limited than when the situation of buying and wearing larger sizes is seen by the woman as a doable thing.
Anyone care to join in my boredom induced past-time of insulting fat people over the internet?
Alternatively I may go and pack by gym bag 
You know, maybe the situation may be better than it could have appeared at first glance.
While I think you didn’t specifically say, it sounded to me as if (though maybe I misread between the lines) your wife is not drastically far off from being able to fit in her custom SCUBA suit.
And you did say that she does think that being able to get back into it is something that would be good.
So while there’s also the desire to listen this poisonous pro-fat source, obviously it’s more of being conflicted than being dedicated to saying the hell with it.
Now, if she’s not way, way off from being able to fit into her SCUBA suit, then as lousy as her own diet methods may be, they may be sufficient.
Clearly, she has gotten results – temporary as they may have been – from her lousy diet methods before. Whereas she has not gotten results from better methods (because she won’t follow them.)
So maybe the thing to do is to accept that her dieting method will be crap, and one prone to rebound, but hey, if she’ll do that and won’t do something better, then don’t give advice that isn’t wanted. (Something I gave up trying to do long, long ago… it just doesn’t work. People in general, not just women, do not listen and do not want to hear except for when they specifically ask how to do something. It is more productive to talk to a wall than to give unsolicited let alone proven-unwanted advice.)
But if she gets the encouragement, support, and positive reinforcement for getting that result no matter how awful the method, AND once she is down to that size, you manage to persuade her on the “let’s never get above this dress size, let’s give away the big clothes as they will just allow yo-yo’ing, you look great at this size” then problem solved.
Fat people don’t need things to be cotton padded - they’ve got enough padding of their own.
I worked as a ski instructor at a dry ski slope for about 7 months a little while back… I saw some horrible things regarding obesity.
Fat little kids about 8 years old who were huffing and puffing just trying to get into position to sit on a one person tobogan. It wasn’t the walking (which was tiring them something horrible also)… it was simply going from standing to sitting.
Another time there were some older children… maybe 12 years old with a school. One fat little kid had to go through about 7 or 8 pairs of boots and trying on about 3 different pairs of socks because there was always something digging into his ankle or cramping his calf. Our widest adult fitting boots were too narrow for his podgy little legs. He came in early… was sulking for ages because he couldnt ski. Then at the end of the session was raiding the vending machine to the max… after having spent a five pound note already I heard him begging around his friends for another 5p so he could get a pot noodle.
[quote]benmoore wrote:
… after having spent a five pound note already I heard him begging around his friends for another 5p so he could get a pot noodle.[/quote]
LMAO!