When performing the hang clean or snatch should one feel a stretch in their hammies?? Reason I ask is I have watched two vids recently. The first being one by Dan John where he emphasizes a stretch in the hamstrings. The second was Jim Schmitz’s guide to oly style lifting and it he does not seem to activate his hammies much at all. Any advice is appreciated!
I guess it depends on you whether or not you’ll feel a hamstring stretch before you pull. The hamstrings are defiantly necessary for both moves.
I think what’s most important is how much weight you’re able to lift with good form. Some people would lift best if they stretch their hammies while others won’t. It all depends on the person.
My impression is that the second pull of both the snatch and the clean are facilitated by a stretch-shortening cycle in the hamstrings as the bar clears the knees. Advanced lifters can transition very quickly between this phase of the pull and the final extension, which increases the contribution of reactive strength to the execution of the lifts.
That being said, I have always been taught that control is far more important than speed (at least in the first pull), especially when first learning the lifts. Speed can always be added later, but bad habits acquired through poor practice can be very difficult to unlearn.
I hate to say this, as it may come off as rude, but a lot of what has been pawned off as honest, well-intentioned advice here is just plain wrong.
You had better be feeling a stretch in those hamstrings on the first pull. There is a reason successful weightlifters have a “pained” expression on their faces before transitioning to the second pull. It fucking hurts - if you’re comfortable you’re doing it wrong.
Very true, but the emphasis on control does not actually mean an intentional slow, “controlled” pull. This is going to bring about what is sometimes referred to as “Paralysis by Analysis.” The right idea is that the tension from the first pull be kept on the hamstrings so that the second pull can be maximally explosive. The lifter should not be thinking “Okay, I must control the bar along my body and then when I reach my mid-thigh I can speed up the bar and shrug, then rebend my knees, blah de fucking blah.”
It’s an important distinction, and one that seems to be missed by a lot of people.
Tuggles
What is your goal?
If your goal is to feel or to train the hamstrings, go for something more specific.
If you want to know how it should feel it will vary from person to person and it will also depend in the technique that you are using.
Train the movement get your positions, get your technique and you will polish it with time.
Remember there is more than one way to skin a cat!!!
cormac is right, you HAVE to feel that painful stretch in the hamstrings during the pull. On the hang position you should feel the stretch in the hammstrings. Try also pushing your knees out when your in position.
Where’d you get that from? I’ve never heard of a stretch in the hamstrings being an absolute necessity, and I’ve been involved with a lot of weightlifters, and having weightlifted myself, never had to bother with this.
Here’s something on Bud Charniga’s site about the role of the hamstrings: http://www.dynamic-eleiko.com/sportivny/library/index.html
I think pulling with slack hamstrings isn’t really any different from pulling with bent arms.
Maybe I came from a different planet but in 10,000 power cleans I never once felt a pain in my hamstrings.
Now if its bent arms, I’m guilty of that about 9,999 times. (I think I coughed during one pc and caught it low with straight arms.) Doc
Maybe pain’s not really the right word…Extreme tension perhaps.
I find that if i think about anything at all during any of my O-lifts I fuck it up. The only thing i can think of is “explode emerson, EXPLODE!”
So I can’t rally say. But I know for real that I am hamstring dominant as opposed to quad dominant because I jump off my hells sometimes. Bad habit.
-chris
[quote]Dr.PowerClean wrote:
Maybe I came from a different planet but in 10,000 power cleans I never once felt a pain in my hamstrings.
Now if its bent arms, I’m guilty of that about 9,999 times. (I think I coughed during one pc and caught it low with straight arms.) Doc[/quote]
It’s not that you’re from another planet, your form just blows something awful. The only thing that is running through my mind as I approach the bar is “tension in the ass and hamstrings, stay over the bar, let the arms hang.”
Visualizing yourself constantly on the platform as a person with no upper body at all - just a set of big hamstrings, glutes, and quads - actually rewires a sense of self and will make you a better weightlifter. Try it.
[quote]cormac wrote:
Dr.PowerClean wrote:
Maybe I came from a different planet but in 10,000 power cleans I never once felt a pain in my hamstrings.
Now if its bent arms, I’m guilty of that about 9,999 times. (I think I coughed during one pc and caught it low with straight arms.) Doc
It’s not that you’re from another planet, your form just blows something awful. The only thing that is running through my mind as I approach the bar is “tension in the ass and hamstrings, stay over the bar, let the arms hang.”
Visualizing yourself constantly on the platform as a person with no upper body at all - just a set of big hamstrings, glutes, and quads - actually rewires a sense of self and will make you a better weightlifter. Try it.[/quote]
I see. Whenever I do power cleans, I do think about how hard and fast I’m gonna extend my hips and nothing else. However, I mostly feel my glutes and lower back, not my hamstrings. If that’s the case, what do you think is wrong?
I think you need to change your set up for the lift. If you read Dan John’s free eBook (danjohn.org) he describes the proper set up for both the clean and snatch as “The Bow.” Think about keeping your ass kept back to the wall behind you and your chin out to the wall in front of you. Use those hammies, not your lower back.
If you want to learn how to properly approach the bar, watch this video of Naim “Pocket Hercules” Suleymanoglu.
You can tell that he is approaching the bar while keeping tension in his glutes and hamstrings, and probably thinking that he doesn’t have arms nor anything above his waist. He is letting his arms dangle around because he is visualizing them merely as threads that attach to the weight. I’m serious, this is important. You’ll also notice that he doesn’t waste much time thinking once he starts the lift.
Without even seeing you I’m quite certain you’re deadlifting the bar up, not doing a pull. The primary mover for that first pull should not be your lower back. Hip extension is important, but it’s natural and it happens when you think about keeping tension in your glutes and hamstrings and staying out over the bar with your shoulders for as long as possible. Drive your heels into the ground and keep your weight and balance over them for the lift.
As far as I’m concerned Naim’s setup and first pull is the best I’ve ever seen. The 95 World’s Ironmind tape really shows how great it is because it’s filmed from 45 degrees rather than head on, to the point that Randall Strossen can’t help repeatedly telling the viewer to “watch his start…”.
Hmm, I think you should know what I feel. In the first pull, I feel my glutes. In the second pull, I feel my glutes and lower back. I’m pretty sure I’m not deadlifting or using my lower back on that first pull, but I feel only litte hammies. The only exercises that make me feel them a lot are stiff-legged GMs/DLs and leg curls.
I’d get a coach, but it’s hard to get a guy who knows how to power clean in my country.
If you can’t feel it in your hamstrings you probably need to push you hips back more and get over the bar more before the lift off. Dan John’s metaphor is very good - load them like a bow.
How high are your hips at the start in relation to your knees/shoulders?
I’d say right in between.
the 95 worlds tape is great. I love watching suleymanglu, his technique is something to aspire to.
His first pull is just plain amazing.
When I set up for my lifts, I get down into position, set up grip, push my ass back, knees out, and stay over the bar. I don’t think about it, my arms are relaxed, and I just pull with my legs and then BAM let the tension out and throw the bar.
My first pull, I can feel my hamstrings winding up, and then BAM let it go.
Thats how you should be doing it