Front Squat vs Squat

Training Beginners
1

I can’t do regular squats because it kills my back (herniated disc). I found that front squats are much easier on the back. I did them for the 1st time so I’m at pussy weight right now. I want to set a goal but not sure what to shoot for. For the guys that do both, how your numbers compare?

Right now my #'s are:

32 yo, 6’ tall 200 lbs 16% bf
Bench 1RM 275
Standing Press 155
Front squat: did 5 reps of 155 (1st time doing them)

I can’t deadlift or squat.

What would a proportionate weight be for front squat?
How do your front squat weights compare to your back squats?

2

[quote]sam_sneed wrote:…

What would a proportionate weight be for front squat?
How do your front squat weights compare to your back squats?
[/quote]

proportinate weight??? don’t worry about that man, the more you can front squat the better… Really

Compared to back squats??? That depends on how low you go on your back squat. :slight_smile: If u go to parallel it will be a lot, if you go ATG not so much.

3

it depends on the person and experience … but when my back squat goes up my front squat does too … there’s really no mathematical equation as to if I can this then I can that … Just keep doing it and adding weight when you feel comfortable … also, make sure you master form and go AT LEAST to parallel … i hate seeing assholes doing front 1/4 squats with weight I can curl … it’s pointless (to me anyway) … so just do that. For me. thanks

4

Thanks guys, I go a little lower than parallel. Not sure how great my form is. I review the section on front squats from “Starting Strength” before I hit the gym. The couple things I noticed is I have trouble resting the bar on my delts with warmup weights.

On my heavier lifts, its impossible not to so thats not a big deal. The other thing is that my wrists hurt because they’re not flexible yet. Rippetoes book says to try a wider grip but that makes its worse for me.

5

I did some front squats for the first time on my last session, I love them better than regular squats! =) And I loooooove squats! :slight_smile:

6

[quote]sam_sneed wrote:
The other thing is that my wrists hurt because they’re not flexible yet. [/quote]

Your wrist will get used to it eventually. In the meantime, it helps if you only use the first two or three fingers on each hand to hold the bar.

As far as the ratios go, your front squat is somewhere around 70% of your back squat, give or take 20 pounds.

7

there is no ratio / percentage… there are too many variables (squat depth and form to name a few). When I first started i could barely do a plate on front squat but could do four plates on my back… Now I do 4.5 plates or so for back and more then 3 for front…

practice, practice practice… just make sure every week or so the weight goes up…

8

I’m like you, regular squats kill my back so I stick with just front squats. I notice zero carryover, if you don’t practice both there won’t be much carryover.

I do 350x5 on my front squats yet 225x8 feels extremely awkward when I do back squats. Honestly, I think that the front squat is better for bodybuilding purposes so I wouldn’t really worry about it.

9

[quote]waylanderxx wrote:
I’m like you, regular squats kill my back so I stick with just front squats. I notice zero carryover, if you don’t practice both there won’t be much carryover.

I do 350x5 on my front squats yet 225x8 feels extremely awkward when I do back squats. Honestly, I think that the front squat is better for bodybuilding purposes so I wouldn’t really worry about it.[/quote]

Wow, that’s impressive, but it is also surprising. I have not heard of someone with so much larger a front squat, than back, before! I agree though, there is little carryover.

10

OP, I have the same problem with my back. i started doing front squats also. I like them alot better than back. When I hold the bar I rest it on my front delts and upper chest, also like it is choking me. I cross my arms, left hand to right side ,right hand to left side at the shoulder level elbows held high in front. For me this is a very stable and comfortable position. The weight is resting on my shoulders and chest with no weight on my wrists. Good Luck with it.

11

with regards to the ratio between back and front squat, “ideally, a lifter’s back and front squat should both be 150% of what they are now”

12

[quote]forevernade wrote:
it.

Wow, that’s impressive, but it is also surprising. I have not heard of someone with so much larger a front squat, than back, before! I agree though, there is little carryover. [/quote]

It’s not that I can’t go heavy on back squats, but for the life of me I can’t keep it from turning into a shitty good morning,and destroying my back. So I said fuck 'em lol.

13

I like front squats but if you want to put the load on you have to backsquat. Personally I got upper back pain whilst doing squats, don’t ask, I stopped 3x5x120kg on my back squats, then picked up my front squat at 3x5x85kg. My Fr Sq rocketed within a few weeks to 3x5x100kg then went back to B Squats and finished at 3x5x135kg.

Front Squats load the core much more. It is also more technique intensive, drop you elbows with a heavy weight and your screwed. Back squat there is more leeway. I would through in at least one front squat session a week.

14

[quote]ctschneider wrote:
sam_sneed wrote:
The other thing is that my wrists hurt because they’re not flexible yet.

Your wrist will get used to it eventually. In the meantime, it helps if you only use the first two or three fingers on each hand to hold the bar.

As far as the ratios go, your front squat is somewhere around 70% of your back squat, give or take 20 pounds.[/quote]

This is what I’m doing now. I’ve got decent control with 3 fingers but would feel better with a full grip. The other problem is I think the bar is so close to my throat that it pushes against it. By the time my workout is over I’m walking around the gym with a long ready mark on my throat. It got some funny looks lol.

15

[quote]danc2469 wrote:
OP, I have the same problem with my back. i started doing front squats also. I like them alot better than back. When I hold the bar I rest it on my front delts and upper chest, also like it is choking me. I cross my arms, left hand to right side ,right hand to left side at the shoulder level elbows held high in front. For me this is a very stable and comfortable position. The weight is resting on my shoulders and chest with no weight on my wrists. Good Luck with it.[/quote]

I tried this style of front squat but found I had no control over the bar with just 25lb plates on it. Maybe I’ll revisit it later. I think the original problem is that I wasn’t resting the barbell on my delts property. I problem I’ve corrected since then.

16

[quote]sam_sneed wrote:
ctschneider wrote:
sam_sneed wrote:
The other thing is that my wrists hurt because they’re not flexible yet.

Your wrist will get used to it eventually. In the meantime, it helps if you only use the first two or three fingers on each hand to hold the bar.

As far as the ratios go, your front squat is somewhere around 70% of your back squat, give or take 20 pounds.

This is what I’m doing now. I’ve got decent control with 3 fingers but would feel better with a full grip. The other problem is I think the bar is so close to my throat that it pushes against it. By the time my workout is over I’m walking around the gym with a long ready mark on my throat. It got some funny looks lol.[/quote]

I remember reading something from the forums one time that said really you should almost feel like the bar will be strangling you as you lift. Admittedly I feel more control when I really push it into place but breathing gets hard.

17

[quote]theuofh wrote:
with regards to the ratio between back and front squat, “ideally, a lifter’s back and front squat should both be 150% of what they are now”[/quote]

This is one of my favorite quotes ever.

18

[quote]ctschneider wrote:
sam_sneed wrote:
The other thing is that my wrists hurt because they’re not flexible yet.

Your wrist will get used to it eventually. In the meantime, it helps if you only use the first two or three fingers on each hand to hold the bar.

As far as the ratios go, your front squat is somewhere around 70% of your back squat, give or take 20 pounds.[/quote]

Here is a link to a front squat harness. I haven’t tried it myself, but I hear it works pretty good.
http://www.frontsquatharness.com

Have you tried to lay the bar across your upper chest/delts and cross your arms and hold it this way? This is what I do and as long as I concentrate in keeping my elbows up it works.

19

[quote]Caged wrote:
ctschneider wrote:

Have you tried to lay the bar across your upper chest/delts and cross your arms and hold it this way? This is what I do and as long as I concentrate in keeping my elbows up it works.[/quote]

Yeah I did but it felt unbalanced. I may try it again if my wrists don’t get more flexible.

20

[quote]Caged wrote:
ctschneider wrote:
sam_sneed wrote:
The other thing is that my wrists hurt because they’re not flexible yet.

Your wrist will get used to it eventually. In the meantime, it helps if you only use the first two or three fingers on each hand to hold the bar.

As far as the ratios go, your front squat is somewhere around 70% of your back squat, give or take 20 pounds.

Here is a link to a front squat harness. I haven’t tried it myself, but I hear it works pretty good.
http://www.frontsquatharness.com
…[/quote]

Don’t waste your $$$ on that. Also maybe Rippetoe got it wrong, or you misread him, but the wider the grip the more flexibility is needed. Flexibility of the wrists, and especially the scapulas and shoulders.

Anyways, I had the same issue when I started and here’s how to fix it. Even today, I still need a lil’ bit of warming up before I front squat.

Before Front squatting:

  1. Before you front squat, do a short (5-10second) stretch of you wrists.
    –palms facing out, and palms facing in.
  2. Massage your forearms for a few seconds.

Getting set to Front Squat:
3. Have the bar on the rack and simply touch the front of it with the tip of your fingers (all of them).
4. With your fingers in place walk and place yourself under the bar.
5. Don’t stand up yet, the bar would be resting across your colar bone + shoulders + the TIPs of your fingers.
–as you get more flexible you will be able to have a full grip on the bar.

Standing up and Front Squatting:
6. As you stand up focus on squeezing your elbows UP and IN towards eachother. (as explained by Dan John)
—This will drift your scapulas forward and allow the elbows to stay up (like in my avatar), while maintaining your chest up.
7. As you squat focus on keeping your elbows up (that is squeezing your elbows UP and IN).
–if you drop your elbows your chest will cave in, back will round, and you will loose the bar. Plus it will make your wrists hurt.
8. Always start with a very light weight and just stand in place for a few seconds, and do a few front squats. Then load up the bar.

After your workout
9. Stretch out your wrists (along with the rest of your body).

Do this, you will notice a night and day difference.