[quote]Adamsson wrote:
Not that I know of. But opponents like Gomi and Sato… well, it would be fun to see Hansen vs. Hughes, but i don’t think that it is going to happen, and if it does, i think Hansens KO-power and his eminent groundgame is too much to handle for Hughes… 
[/quote]
You have got to be kidding me…Hughes would destroy Hansen. There is way too big a size and strength disparity there…for that matter BJ Penn would annihiliate Hansen as well.
Well, you can of course ask me to prove what you want me to prove, but I haeven’t heard any such questions so far…
When it comes to fighters talking about how this and that happens to their opponent, well… I like to take that with a handfull of salt… 
I often get a “crack”-sound in my neck when in giljotins or similar holds/locks, but that doesen’t mean that my neck is about to break, just that it is under pressure and that it lets jointfluid go.
[quote]Adamsson wrote:
Well, you can of course ask me to prove what you want me to prove, but I haeven’t heard any such questions so far…
When it comes to fighters talking about how this and that happens to their opponent, well… I like to take that with a handfull of salt… I often get a “crack”-sound in my neck when in giljotins or similar holds/locks, but that doesen’t mean that my neck is about to break, just that it is under pressure and that it lets jointfluid go. [/quote]
I can see your point.
But given how tightly secured Hughes had that arm (leverage etc). And given his ability and strength, I would have to lean on the side of Royce having some elbow problems today.
And that he didn’t tap out seems to me that he wanted badly to win that match no matter what. Not giving up is what all of us are supposed to admire in an athlete. No?
[quote]cap’nsalty wrote:
1-packlondoner wrote:
It’s a sad day, if a rather expected one.
Hughes pretty much fulfils the template of what a decent MMA fighter should be and regardless of what my heart was telling me, it was a fairly obvious result.
As for GSP - He is quite obviously the future of the sport and there’s not many fighters you think would ever take him apart. He learns and improves with every match and seems to have some real heart too.
Should be an interesting year for UFC
I just wish there was some competition for Chuck Liddell, it doesn’t look like anyone poses a threat to him right now.
[/quote]
Too true, and if a 196 year old Randy Couture could still cause him a little trouble (which he was doing until he got knocked on his arse!) there MUST be someone out there that could challenge him.
Matt Hughes VS. Chuck Lidell
UFC 63: Champion vs Champion
[quote]Rookie21 wrote:
Matt Hughes VS. Chuck Lidell
UFC 63: Champion vs Champion[/quote]
Now this doesn’t sound half bad…think of an open-weight grand prix like pride does…since their middleweights and welterweights are mostly around 190 anyways.
Liddell-Arlovski
Babalu-Hughes
Franklin-Ortiz
Penn-Sylvia
[quote]ZEB wrote:
Adamsson wrote:
Well, you can of course ask me to prove what you want me to prove, but I haeven’t heard any such questions so far…
When it comes to fighters talking about how this and that happens to their opponent, well… I like to take that with a handfull of salt… I often get a “crack”-sound in my neck when in giljotins or similar holds/locks, but that doesen’t mean that my neck is about to break, just that it is under pressure and that it lets jointfluid go.
I can see your point.
But given how tightly secured Hughes had that arm (leverage etc). And given his ability and strength, I would have to lean on the side of Royce having some elbow problems today.
And that he didn’t tap out seems to me that he wanted badly to win that match no matter what. Not giving up is what all of us are supposed to admire in an athlete. No?[/quote]
actually, i’ve read that not giving up makes you an egotistical douche.
[quote]swivel wrote:
ZEB wrote:
Adamsson wrote:
Well, you can of course ask me to prove what you want me to prove, but I haeven’t heard any such questions so far…
When it comes to fighters talking about how this and that happens to their opponent, well… I like to take that with a handfull of salt… I often get a “crack”-sound in my neck when in giljotins or similar holds/locks, but that doesen’t mean that my neck is about to break, just that it is under pressure and that it lets jointfluid go.
I can see your point.
But given how tightly secured Hughes had that arm (leverage etc). And given his ability and strength, I would have to lean on the side of Royce having some elbow problems today.
And that he didn’t tap out seems to me that he wanted badly to win that match no matter what. Not giving up is what all of us are supposed to admire in an athlete. No?
actually, i’ve read that not giving up makes you an egotistical douche.[/quote]
You really think so?
When you see a Basketball star driving for the basket with seconds to go even though his team is down he’s not quitting!
You think he’s a douche?
When you see a batter hanging in there at the plate in the 9th inning with the count 3 and 2 and his team is down by 5 runs.
You think he’s a douche?
No…I’d have to disagree with you on that one. That is what sport is all about at a high level at least. And that’s what makes games, and fights exciting.
You can hate Gracie and his entire family if you want. But as I have already posted, they changed the landscape of martial arts into a realistic one.
And Royce was right there at the forefront.
I give Royce Gracie plenty of credit for taking the chance that he did. Fighting the premier star Welterweight of the UFC and not tapping when he was most likely in pain…
No…that takes guts, determination and a real spirit to win.
[quote]ZEB wrote:
You really think so?
When you see a Basketball star driving for the basket with seconds to go even though his team is down he’s not quitting!
You think he’s a douche?
When you see a batter hanging in there at the plate in the 9th inning with the count 3 and 2 and his team is down by 5 runs.
You think he’s a douche?
No…I’d have to disagree with you on that one. That is what sport is all about at a high level at least. And that’s what makes games, and fights exciting.
You can hate Gracie and his entire family if you want. But as I have already posted, they changed the landscape of martial arts into a realistic one.
And Royce was right there at the forefront.
I give Royce Gracie plenty of credit for taking the chance that he did. Fighting the premier star Welterweight of the UFC and not tapping when he was most likely in pain…
No…that takes guts, determination and a real spirit to win.[/quote]
Err… Ditto.
[quote]ZEB wrote:
You really think so?
[/quote]
no, not at all. i was dripping sarcasm and referring to AgentOrange a few posts back when he said:
“The fact that a Gracie will lie there and allow you to tear his joints apart instead of tapping proves nothing except that the Gracie family is full of egotistical douches.”
ftr i think it’s absurd to hate on the gracies. although i’m glad you misunderstood me zeb 'cause that was a nice post.
[quote]danew wrote:
Either Gracie by submission in the 2nd or 3rd round, or Hughes by decision. Royce is too smart to be KO’d. He’s faced many harder punchers than Hughes, and no way Hughes submits him. However, Royce can’t win a decision. Hughes will be able to out-box him, and on the ground Royce will spend most of his time on his back. Although this is comfortable for him, it doesn’t bode well for a positive decision. I’m going out on a limb to say that Hughes gets frusterated not being able to finish Royce and makes a mistake in Royce’s guard. Royce by submission in the 3rd round.[/quote]
Wow! your prediction couldn’t have been any farther off bro. ever watched ufc before?
[quote]toocul4u wrote:
danew wrote:
Either Gracie by submission in the 2nd or 3rd round, or Hughes by decision. Royce is too smart to be KO’d. He’s faced many harder punchers than Hughes, and no way Hughes submits him. However, Royce can’t win a decision. Hughes will be able to out-box him, and on the ground Royce will spend most of his time on his back. Although this is comfortable for him, it doesn’t bode well for a positive decision. I’m going out on a limb to say that Hughes gets frusterated not being able to finish Royce and makes a mistake in Royce’s guard. Royce by submission in the 3rd round.
Wow! your prediction couldn’t have been any farther off bro. ever watched ufc before?
[/quote]
Isn’t hindsight a beautiful thing?
[quote]slimjim wrote:
Adamsson wrote:
Not that I know of. But opponents like Gomi and Sato… well, it would be fun to see Hansen vs. Hughes, but i don’t think that it is going to happen, and if it does, i think Hansens KO-power and his eminent groundgame is too much to handle for Hughes…
You have got to be kidding me…Hughes would destroy Hansen. There is way too big a size and strength disparity there…for that matter BJ Penn would annihiliate Hansen as well.[/quote]
I have to disagree there… BJ Penn would maybe have a decent chance against Hansen, Hughes wouldn’t.
[quote]slimjim wrote:
Penn-Sylvia
[/quote]
I’d pity Sylvia in this matchup.
[quote]ZEB wrote:
As predicted, I was not surprised by the Hughes victory last night. Nor in the manner it was achieved.
However, I was surprised and very impressed that Royce refused to tap out when Hughes put him in that arm lock. I could almost hear the elbow pop. Royce has incredible mental toughness and desrves much credit in that area.
As for the few who have written or will soon post that the referee stopped the match too quickly, you’re very wrong.
Hughes hit Gracie with 19 unanswered shots from the time that he took his back. All 19 strikes landed in good position, either on the head or side of the face.
It took Matt Hughes 4:39 to put away a true legend in the MMA world!
However, I want to remind all of the Hughes fans (of which I am one) that if it had not been for Gracie and his family many people would still be thinking that grapplers cannot defeat traditional karate practitioners, or other strikers such as boxers. The myth of the unbeatable Karate black belt is dead because of Royce Gracie! No one will ever be able to take away what one man, Royce Gracie did for “truth” in martial arts!
As for Matt Hughes, he demonstrated incredible athleticism and incredible ground strategy. From this point forward anyone who underestimates Matt Hughes does not understand how this fighter grows, as he gets better with each match.
Frankly, I don’t see GSP doing any better than he did in their first match up when he was submitted by Hughes.
In my opinion there is only one match left that will test Hughes. And that is with the great BJ Penn!
[/quote]
Although I never predicted a Gracie win (I instead focused on Hughes relative weaknesses which I still believe in by the way), I’ll accept a big fat helping of “I told you so” because if Gracie pulled out a submission, I’d be here with serving it up. I knew Gracie was the underdog but I thought he would have a shot with his technique if Matt made a mistake.
The reason I will always love the Gracie’s was on display this night. He did not tap (most in the UFC would have tapped to that kimora) and he made no excuses after the fight. He fought and lost with honor. He was a gamedog. And not to piss on this thread anymore, I do believe Hughes would have tapped in a similiar position. The Gracies are a rarity with regard to not quitting which I do admire the most.
I still don’t like Hughes and probably never will b/c of his attitude. But I’ll start eating my helping of “I told you so”.
Steve
[quote]ZEB wrote:
swivel wrote:
ZEB wrote:
Adamsson wrote:
Well, you can of course ask me to prove what you want me to prove, but I haeven’t heard any such questions so far…
When it comes to fighters talking about how this and that happens to their opponent, well… I like to take that with a handfull of salt… I often get a “crack”-sound in my neck when in giljotins or similar holds/locks, but that doesen’t mean that my neck is about to break, just that it is under pressure and that it lets jointfluid go.
I can see your point.
But given how tightly secured Hughes had that arm (leverage etc). And given his ability and strength, I would have to lean on the side of Royce having some elbow problems today.
And that he didn’t tap out seems to me that he wanted badly to win that match no matter what. Not giving up is what all of us are supposed to admire in an athlete. No?
actually, i’ve read that not giving up makes you an egotistical douche.
You really think so?
When you see a Basketball star driving for the basket with seconds to go even though his team is down he’s not quitting!
You think he’s a douche?
When you see a batter hanging in there at the plate in the 9th inning with the count 3 and 2 and his team is down by 5 runs.
You think he’s a douche?
No…I’d have to disagree with you on that one. That is what sport is all about at a high level at least. And that’s what makes games, and fights exciting.
You can hate Gracie and his entire family if you want. But as I have already posted, they changed the landscape of martial arts into a realistic one.
And Royce was right there at the forefront.
I give Royce Gracie plenty of credit for taking the chance that he did. Fighting the premier star Welterweight of the UFC and not tapping when he was most likely in pain…
No…that takes guts, determination and a real spirit to win.[/quote]
Yet another young bitch from this “x” generation that knows nothing about gameness…don’t like it, quit. That simple. Don’t waste your breath on a quitter - he can always start his PS2 over again if he loses. G showed honor and gameness - for someone to come here and make that comment speaks for itself. It deserves neither reply nor debate - let his comments stand on their own turdpile.
After seeing this fight I fully believe Royce would’ve passed out or rather died than tap to that choke BJ had on Matt. Just a measure of their hearts. Some call it stupidity, I call it pride. Royce has never tapped and I don’t think he ever will. If that arm bar couldn’t break em, I don’t think anything will.
Very sad to see alot of people hating on Royce. I bet 90% of them started watching the UFC when Liddel and Coture fought for the second time. Alot of those same people have no idea what He’s done for us. The UFC will be known as his house and his house only forever.
[quote]A-Town Crown wrote:
Very sad to see alot of people hating on Royce. I bet 90% of them started watching the UFC when Liddel and Coture fought for the second time. Alot of those same people have no idea what He’s done for us. The UFC will be known as his house and his house only forever.[/quote]
A-Town I agree. Ever watch the old UFC fights when gracie fought? Was it me or did it just seem mysterious and there was an aura in the room. Almost gladiator-like. Just look at the Gracie-Kimo fight.
I know the sport has evolved, but it seemed more distant back then.
But hey what do I know…
Agree 100%
[quote]Adamsson wrote:
I think people blow the kimura/keylock-attempt out of proportion… It was not a very close attempt, you have to bend the arm to make it hurt… and a straight armbar with only a figure four as leverage is not all that hard/painfull… Blown out of proportion i tell you… :)[/quote]
Yeah I can’t believe everyone hating Royce. He’s a good guy and he’s a good teacher. He just hasn’t kept up with all aspects of MMA and he is a little old for the game. And Matt Hughes is really friggin good. Besides his early losses to Hallman 2x and Pele, he’s schooled everyone he’s fought in UFC save BJ Penn, who is a SUPER freak. Also, almost any figher can lose to or beat any other fighter on any given night. They are all dangerous in their own way and if you make a mistake, you’re done.
Nothing is worse than people ripping on fighters who have no idea how to fight or what they’re talking about.
Bottom line, I would pay to see Royce kick the shit out of people who talk shit about him in posts on the net.
At the end of the day you need to realize Royce knew what most people knew. Matt Hughes would beat him. He walked in there anyway. Matt Hughes would beat me…I’m sure of that, but I’m not sure I would walk in there…pretty ballsy IMHO