I’m pretty new to deads and just recently started pushing the weight upwards significantly. My question is, where should I be feeling sore? I don’t have anyone right now to critique my form.
My soreness right now is located in my mid-back on either side of my spine.
assuming your form is perfect (which it probably isnt due to the time you have been doing it) you will feel sore in the region that is weakest in the whole chain of muscles used during that lift…
do it near mirrors and check form. practice tons with light weight. when i say tons, i mean a year or so, before pushing the envelope
Joe
Thanks for the reply. I’ve been doing them for about six months. It makes sense that I’m sore in the low to mid back because I have never trained that area directly. I was able to pull 405lbs two weeks ago and it took a week to recover (probably because I’m 40). This week I did 8x3 with 255lbs and I am sore as hell. I just wanted to make sure my area of soreness wasn’t indicating improper form (I know there is no way to know without seeing me do one).
[quote]matt88 wrote:
Thanks for the reply. I’ve been doing them for about six months. It makes sense that I’m sore in the low to mid back because I have never trained that area directly. I was able to pull 405lbs two weeks ago and it took a week to recover (probably because I’m 40). This week I did 8x3 with 255lbs and I am sore as hell. I just wanted to make sure my area of soreness wasn’t indicating improper form (I know there is no way to know without seeing me do one).
[/quote]
No way, youre right. However, it has in the past given me doms in the lumbar muscularture, traps, hams and glutes only.
Joe
I dunno if you’ve ever experienced this but whenever you’re lifting something theres a “good” pain that comes from fatiguing the muscle and “bad” pain that comes from improper form and stressing he joints and whatnot. I’ve done squats/deadlifts plenty of times with poor form and I can tell what it feels like when im doing it wrong. Idk if this makes any sense lol but more simply, whenever I get the “bad” pain in my back from deadlifts it usually is difficult to bend over/straighten out and the lower back just throbs and feels really tight, and stretching is quite painful. If you are experiencing any of these things it may be indicative of soreness from poor form.
Hell yeah! I try to diferentiate between “good/bad” pain with my clients often, it is such a subjective thing, it is so hard to explain…
Joe
haha yeah, as you can tell by my post it is a very difficult concept to explain in words lol.
Make sure you’re driving your glutes forward and not your back.
If you are balanced postural wise, you should not feel much in the lower erectors, but rather in the lats, traps, and glutes.
If you’re performing the exercise right, your glutes, lats, and hamstrings should be kicking you in the morning after… not your lower back.
[quote]Joe Brook wrote:
Hell yeah! I try to diferentiate between “good/bad” pain with my clients often, it is such a subjective thing, it is so hard to explain…
Joe[/quote]
It can be hard to explain, but there should be no problem telling the difference for yourself in a relatively short period of time. It goes hand in hand with the mind muscle connection. Any pain not caused by fatiguing muscles should end that set.
I know what your saying about good sore. I would have to say it is honestly borderline. Luckily I have no nerve pain and my back doesn’t feel “out” but for a couple days I was real stiff. Hard to bend over or stand up straight from a bent over position. I will definitely concentrate on getting the glutes more involved at the end of the movement because I think that may be the culprit. I’ll also be dropping the weight a little until I feel I have a better handle on the correct form.
Thanks everyone for the great advice and interest. Any other tips are welcome.
Matt
DOMS can be totally debilitating-BAD sore, but just DOMS. IMO.
But DURING the exercise, you should beel the muscle straining-as though it is doing work, no sharp pain, no hot pains, no sudden pain, no pain in a specific area other than the WHOLE ara being used…
What tiribulus said, its true but i would go so far as to say,
“Any pain not caused by fatiguing muscles should end that set.” - should end that exercise, and depending on the severity, the session for that muscle as an agonist or even stabilizer. Then only return when pain is gone and you have a chance to learn proper form if that is an issue…
Some work “through” bad pain - ask any rugby players! i is customary to work through that shit and stop fucking around! (IME)
However this can often lead to worse and worse sprains and strains.
Joe
I had no pain during the actual sets. It came on like a mofo two days later - so basically it was more than likely just normal doms of the son of a bitch variety. Today I am almost soreness free (4 days later).
I plan to hit it again Wed but I might drop down to 225 to work on form. After studying some anatomy diagrams I think the area of soreness is actually the bottom part of my lats that tie in near the spine. I’m thinkin thats a good thing.
405lbs is real good…
I’ve been training deadlift for 8 years, 2 years ago i weighed 165lbs and i did 315lbs… My DL now isn’t too far above that as i have’t been specializing…
…And 6 months into Deadlift, that is some meaty weight, if you do have good form which i am sure it’s ok considering your experience (i assume you have).
Plus the pain you experienced sounds like DOMS to me anyway… good luck with your next lift!
Joe
I’m one of the unluckiest people I can think of what it comes to DOMS. I can do a single set of squats and have sore legs for 3 days, totally sucks. That said, from DL’s, I’ve never noticed much in the way of soreness except for my forearms (my grip is a bit of a weakpoint) and definitely my traps…the next morning is usually quite painful.
[quote]Joe Brook wrote:
assuming your form is perfect (which it probably isnt due to the time you have been doing it) you will feel sore in the region that is weakest in the whole chain of muscles used during that lift…
do it near mirrors and check form. practice tons with light weight. when i say tons, i mean a year or so, before pushing the envelope
Joe[/quote]
I totally agree with the first part, and everything else Joe has said in this thread except for this:
Don’t even dream of looking in a mirror while you are pulling. For one thing, it only allows you to check form in one plane of motion, which can be deceiving. Worse, if you turn your head to get a side view of the lift, you can really wrench your back.
Lower the weight, practice form, and do glute activation work before pulling (1 or 2 sets of 25 floor bridges works really well for me). This will get you more attuned to how the lift is supposed to feel. If you still think your form is bad, get video and post it here for someone to critique.
One quick way to tell would be to add in supplemental work for the spinal erectors. If, after you strengthen your back, it is still getting sore, that might indicate a problem.
[quote]tom8658 wrote:
Joe Brook wrote:
assuming your form is perfect (which it probably isnt due to the time you have been doing it) you will feel sore in the region that is weakest in the whole chain of muscles used during that lift…
do it near mirrors and check form. practice tons with light weight. when i say tons, i mean a year or so, before pushing the envelope
Joe
I totally agree with the first part, and everything else Joe has said in this thread except for this:
do it near mirrors and check form
Don’t even dream of looking in a mirror while you are pulling. For one thing, it only allows you to check form in one plane of motion, which can be deceiving. Worse, if you turn your head to get a side view of the lift, you can really wrench your back.
Lower the weight, practice form, and do glute activation work before pulling (1 or 2 sets of 25 floor bridges works really well for me). This will get you more attuned to how the lift is supposed to feel. If you still think your form is bad, get video and post it here for someone to critique.
One quick way to tell would be to add in supplemental work for the spinal erectors. If, after you strengthen your back, it is still getting sore, that might indicate a problem.[/quote]
but why lower the weight tom? didn’t you say that using light weight wont give you any kind of progress??
using a mirror is awesome for checking your form btw. that is, if you dont have someone coaching you.
[quote]matt88 wrote:
I’m pretty new to deads and just recently started pushing the weight upwards significantly. My question is, where should I be feeling sore? I don’t have anyone right now to critique my form.
My soreness right now is located in my mid-back on either side of my spine.[/quote]
theoretically, your glutes lower back and hammies should be feeling it, but its varies. the first time i pulled 315, i felt my shoulders basically collapse down from the weight. the next couple days the soreness was mostly in my glutes and traps… and the rhomboids… sick right? thats your mid back.
You guys don’t get sore in your quads from deads also? I guess I just go lower and pull with a lot of leg. I do feel it in my back also but mostly in legs and lower back.