Deload While Cutting?

Bigger Stronger Leaner Competitive Bodybuilding
1

I have added about 20lbs of weight since August using 5/3/1, along with a lot of strength.

I have been a bit too liberal with my diet during this period, which has lead to more fat gain than I would like. Especially since I was not at my leanist when I started the bulk.

My goal is to return to the weight I was prior to the bulk, while maintaining as much of my strength and muscle gains as possible.

I intend on using the velocity diet to get me started and then replace whole foods back in at the same caloric level and protein level as I transition off the Velocity diet until I reach my goal.

That in addition to adding daily NEPA walks of about an hour should do the job of dropping the weight.

I plan on using the weights, rep schemes and assistance work from my current cycle of 5/3/1 without adding to the percieved max during the process. This should help me keep a close eye on my strength level during the process.

My question is: Should I diet heavily during scheduled deloads? If not, should I drop the scheduled deloads in 5/3/1 during the process, or should I up my calories during the deload? If dropping the deload, I could change 5/3/1 to a 3 week program or repeat one of the weeks.

I am concerned that if I deload while under restricted calorie consumption, my body will choose to burn muscle over fat.

Any advice would be appreciated.

2

I find it a tiny bit odd that one would go from a 5/3/1 to the Velocity diet. You only gained 20lbs, so even if it was ALL fat then it would only be 20 lbs, so if it’s 50/50…that’s of course only 10.

Velocity Diet may be overkill in the other direction.

Could you tell us how heavy you were and are now? How much fat do you think you put on? You say you want to return to your previous wieght but be stronger and more retain the muscle you gained. That may be difficult and very hard to control anyway, in my opinion.

3

[quote]Nards wrote:
I find it a tiny bit odd that one would go from a 5/3/1 to the Velocity diet. You only gained 20lbs, so even if it was ALL fat then it would only be 20 lbs, so if it’s 50/50…that’s of course only 10.

Velocity Diet may be overkill in the other direction.

Could you tell us how heavy you were and are now? How much fat do you think you put on? You say you want to return to your previous wieght but be stronger and more retain the muscle you gained. That may be difficult and very hard to control anyway, in my opinion.
[/quote]
I agree with Nards. If you were able to gain 20lb in a lot of strength gain in about 3 months. I am assuming you were not an advanced trainer or were relatively lean. I think I you go on a radical diet like V-diet, your strength will be dramatically reduced and you will end up where you started in August.

4

[quote]P-Ha wrote:
I have added about 20lbs of weight since August using 5/3/1, along with a lot of strength.

I have been a bit too liberal with my diet during this period, which has lead to more fat gain than I would like. Especially since I was not at my leanist when I started the bulk.

My goal is to return to the weight I was prior to the bulk, while maintaining as much of my strength and muscle gains as possible.

I intend on using the velocity diet to get me started and then replace whole foods back in at the same caloric level and protein level as I transition off the Velocity diet until I reach my goal.

That in addition to adding daily NEPA walks of about an hour should do the job of dropping the weight.

I plan on using the weights, rep schemes and assistance work from my current cycle of 5/3/1 without adding to the percieved max during the process. This should help me keep a close eye on my strength level during the process.

My question is: Should I diet heavily during scheduled deloads? If not, should I drop the scheduled deloads in 5/3/1 during the process, or should I up my calories during the deload? If dropping the deload, I could change 5/3/1 to a 3 week program or repeat one of the weeks.

I am concerned that if I deload while under restricted calorie consumption, my body will choose to burn muscle over fat.

Any advice would be appreciated.[/quote]

I wouldn’t use the Velocity Diet. I think it’s great for some people in particular situations. I lost 15 pounds on it, but I lost a little bit more muscle than i would have liked to have (although I still thought I looked great).

But I think there’s more effective ways to cut WHILE RETAINING muscle. I would go to the Thibs forums and talk to him about cutting. I believe if you diet hard and do the Anaconda protocal (minus the FINiBARs because they have so many calories and carbs), you will have better results in losing weight and maintaining muscle.

Obviously it’s a lil more complicated than that which is why I’d go to Thibs forums and ask there.

5

I disagree with everyone on this thread!

P-Ha, it’s actually a bad decision to eat MORE during a deload because of decreased physical activity. Why would you eat more while doing less work?

You can do a protein-sparing modified fast like the V-Diet or the Rapid Fat Loss Diet to lose weight quickly, but you have to cut back your weight training to 2 to 3 full-body sessions per week. You DON’T have to lose a significant amount of muscle on one of these diets. Granted, you most likely will lose some strength and muscle, but it doesn’t have to be significant. Plus these diets shouldn’t be followed for more than 2 to 6 weeks. Even if you do lose SOME strength and muscle, you can quickly regain after you go back to a lifestyle diet. Your other choice is to lose the fat you gained with a lifestyle diet over a longer period of time.

I’ve done the Rapid Fat Loss Diet 2 times, had no significant muscle loss, and was back to my old poundages within 2 weeks - all while being at a better body composition.

How is the V-Diet overkill? I did the Rapid Fat Loss Diet with 1,300 calories near zero starchy carbs–excluding carbups and cheat meals–at a weight of 240#! It wasn’t overkill because the diet worked and I looked and felt much better after finishing it.

Snew, you said you lost a LITTLE muscle. What’s a little? And is this little amount not worth losing if you have lost A LOT of fat? Is it worth holding onto 1 to 3 pounds of muscle if you are in the process of losing 15 pounds of fat - as if this muscle cant be quickly regained at a leaner weight after a diet is completed?

P-Ha, I don’t understand some of your post. You mention different restrictive dieting strategies, and then mention even further restriction during deloads and a three-week program. Is that right? I’m totally confused.

6

I was between 195 and 200 lbs when I started. I am 200 to 225 lbs today. I gained the weight over the past 5 months using 5/3/1 and Thibs pre-anaconda peri workout nutrition (Finibars, SWF, SR, Creatine), along with an eat and drink everything diet the rest of the times. I suspect the drink everything part is where the fat gain came from.

I think 10 to 15 lbs is muscle, 10 lbs is probably fat and water. I was carrying about 10 lbs of excess fat when I began the cut.

My bench is up 35 lbs from 280 to 315 lbs, my military press is up 15 lbs from 180 to 195 lbs, my deadlift is up 75 lbs from 380 to 455 lbs, and my below parallel squat is up 70 lbs from 280 to 350 lbs.

I am by no means advanced, but I am also not a beginner. I guess that makes me intermediate.

If I can return to my previous weight of 195 to 200lbs and retain most of the muscle, I suspect I would have leaner, stronger more athletic build. This would require me to lose the 10 lbs of fat I gained during the bulk, along with the 10 lbs I was carrying before I started.

I have used the Velocity Diet twice in the past. I lost 17 lbs the first time and 15 the second. I have no problem staying on the diet and actually find it very convenient to not have to prepare food every 3 to 4 hours.

I used the original Waterbury circuit workouts the first time and then the new Waterbury template where you try to complete a prescribed number of reps, regardless of sets, the second time. They helped with fat loss, but were less than optimal for strength gain or retention. It is just too difficult to measure strength levels when you are messing with rest periods, exercise selection, rep numbers and ciruits so much.

I plan on using 5/3/1 this time, because it very simple and clear cut. You either hit your prescribed reps, or you don’t. If you don’t, you are not progressing, or you are going backward.

I have already ordered the shakes, so the Velocity Diet is definately going to occur. I have also made up my mind to continue 5/3/1 while on the diet. I plan on keeping the weights, assistance work and rep targets the same as this past cycle, so I can monitor my strength levels clearly.

My original question was and still is, should I take a deload on the 4th week as prescribed in 5/3/1 while still cutting, or should I just skip the deload and repeat weeks 1 through 3 twice, which will take me through the entire 6 weeks of the Vdiet without a deload? Is deloading while cutting a bad idea? It worked well while bulking, but I am concerned it will do more harm than good while cutting.

7

I already answered your question above.

A deload is necessary, regardless of whether you’re on a restrictive diet or not. Actually, cutting down on workout volume during such a restrictive diet as the V-Diet is recommended, as I pointed out above.

Why would a deload become unnecessary during a restrictive diet. In fact, your recovery ability is lessened during a restrictive diet and you run the risk of overtraining even more than usual.