I forgot to mention, in that vid of justin doing bent-over/face-away extensions, it seems like he doesn’t use any pullover motion… I do incorporate that in order to get both more reps and hit the long head better.
Our high pulley station is too high for me, sort of, and I have to step very far away from it in order to be able to do this exercise… So I get quite the ab workout there On the negative, in order to keep my footing I usually bring my chest/torso down a bit while going into the stretch, and on the positive my torso rises a little bit.
May not be necessary to do that if your pulley station can be adjusted… Though if I remember right you’re fairly short?
You also don’t have to keep your elbows out all the way like that, whatever feels best.
[quote]prospa7 wrote:
Do you DC guys stick to the recommended 2 sets for training legs, for instance doing the deadlifts? The reason I ask is there’s nothing “special,” if you will, with deadlifts since it’s recommended for 5-8 or 9-12 SS reps. In my humble opinion, a 5x5 allows for more leg growth than 2 “plain” sets.[/quote]
CC and Sentoguy had good responses to this, but here’s another important factor to consider: frequency. Training “DC style” is about training to failure on every set. EVERY set. 5x5 is not. Now, one could train that way, taking every set to failure on a 5x5 template, but assuming you trained back with 5 crazy-heavy sets of deadlits to utter failure on Monday, do you think your back will be recoverd in time to hit it hard again by Friday?
Guys doing 5x5 either A) do not take every set to utter failure, or B) if they do, do not train as frequently as DC trainees do (i.e. old-school once per week/bodypart).
Show me a guy doing 5x5 deadlifts to utter failure on Monday, then destroying his lower back again on Friday with barbell rows - all with intense leg work mixed in on Wednesday as well - and I’ll show you a 170-lb newb deadlifting 315. He’s about the only guy who could get away with it, and shouldn’t be doing DC in the first place.
[quote]doubleh wrote:
prospa7 wrote:
Do you DC guys stick to the recommended 2 sets for training legs, for instance doing the deadlifts? The reason I ask is there’s nothing “special,” if you will, with deadlifts since it’s recommended for 5-8 or 9-12 SS reps. In my humble opinion, a 5x5 allows for more leg growth than 2 “plain” sets.
CC and Sentoguy had good responses to this, but here’s another important factor to consider: frequency. Training “DC style” is about training to failure on every set. EVERY set. 5x5 is not. Now, one could train that way, taking every set to failure on a 5x5 template, but assuming you trained back with 5 crazy-heavy sets of deadlits to utter failure on Monday, do you think your back will be recoverd in time to hit it hard again by Friday?
Guys doing 5x5 either A) do not take every set to utter failure, or B) if they do, do not train as frequently as DC trainees do (i.e. old-school once per week/bodypart).
Show me a guy doing 5x5 deadlifts to utter failure on Monday, then destroying his lower back again on Friday with barbell rows - all with intense leg work mixed in on Wednesday as well - and I’ll show you a 170-lb newb deadlifting 315. He’s about the only guy who could get away with it, and shouldn’t be doing DC in the first place.[/quote]
[quote]dday wrote:
Hey guys, I’m trying DC for the first time, just started a few weeks ago and LOVE IT! It’s everything that’s been missing from my training for years, one problem I’m a home gym guy. While reading up on DC training over at IM I found a thread that said home gym guys shouldn’t use DC because you’ll run out of exercises but I can’t find anything that says when or why to change them?
I searched their site for hours last night looking for something that says when or why to change but cannot find a clear answer.
I don’t want to fight the system or anything but due to funds and a newborn I can’t afford a gym membership. Any idea how long I can train at home before I’m forced to give up DC or get a membership.
FYI I have a cage, smith, OLY platform, 800lbs of weight, lat pull, leg extension/curl attachment 1in & 2in adjustable DB handles and assorted misc items.
Thanks in advance for you help.[/quote]
C_C already touched on when and why to switch out exercises, but one thing I’d like to add is that you should have at least 6 solid exercises (ones which have a good potential for strength increase) for each muscle group.
Even with the equipment you have, you’re gonna have problems with quads, hamstrings, calves and possibly chest (if you don’t have access to DB’s), and back width at least. You’ve also gotta take into consideration lower back fatigue, which is gonna be a real bitch if you’re doing multiple types of squats and deads/unsupported rows (which would pretty much be required).
Do as C_C said and try a different proven effective program. Leave DC for the future when you have access to a well equipped commercial gym.
General question for the DC group: anyone have a particular exercise where you experience a fairly dramatic drop-off in the 2nd and/or 3rd legs of the RP set? I know some get this with certain machines, but I flat-out hit the wall on close-grip bench. Happened again last night.
Last time out I went 9-4-2 = 15 RP. Last night I upped the weight by 10 lbs, but went 9-(barely)-2-2. Crazy thing is, the first 2 reps weren’t even too bad, but my tris just stopped working halfway up on rep 3. Brick wall. Virtually every other exercise I am pretty consistent with the rule of thumb of at least half of the 1st leg’s reps.
I don’t know wny this happens on this particular movement. Anyone have similar issues in any exercises?
[quote]doubleh wrote:
General question for the DC group: anyone have a particular exercise where you experience a fairly dramatic drop-off in the 2nd and/or 3rd legs of the RP set? I know some get this with certain machines, but I flat-out hit the wall on close-grip bench. Happened again last night.
Last time out I went 9-4-2 = 15 RP. Last night I upped the weight by 10 lbs, but went 9-(barely)-2-2. Crazy thing is, the first 2 reps weren’t even too bad, but my tris just stopped working halfway up on rep 3. Brick wall. Virtually every other exercise I am pretty consistent with the rule of thumb of at least half of the 1st leg’s reps.
I don’t know wny this happens on this particular movement. Anyone have similar issues in any exercises?[/quote]
I do too, Doubleh. But I weight that against the particular workouts where I make multiple jumps in reps on all 3 RP legs. There’ve even been times where I lost a rep on my first leg (from previous log), only to make it up and more on the next 2 legs.
I don’t sweat it. Progress is progress.
[quote]doubleh wrote:
General question for the DC group: anyone have a particular exercise where you experience a fairly dramatic drop-off in the 2nd and/or 3rd legs of the RP set? I know some get this with certain machines, but I flat-out hit the wall on close-grip bench. Happened again last night.
Last time out I went 9-4-2 = 15 RP. Last night I upped the weight by 10 lbs, but went 9-(barely)-2-2. Crazy thing is, the first 2 reps weren’t even too bad, but my tris just stopped working halfway up on rep 3. Brick wall. Virtually every other exercise I am pretty consistent with the rule of thumb of at least half of the 1st leg’s reps.
I don’t know wny this happens on this particular movement. Anyone have similar issues in any exercises?[/quote]
Jus give your tri’s a bit more rest between the Rp’s.
Anybody here willing to admit they are slightly interested in seeing the new I, Bodybuilder program?
I’m thinking I may incorporate the para-workout protocol (most of it) around the DC workouts and see how it goes. Just as a start I ordered some Surge Workout Fuel and Recovery and will be following the plan CT laid out for those 2 drinks along with some BCAA’s during the workout.
@ Iron Dwarf: True, but I only get this on this one particular exercise, and not even on my other tricep movements.
@ dropshot: Again true, but I kind of feel like a pussy only adding the 2.5ers. Although you’re right, progress is progress.
@ Andy06: I have tried this, although I am wary about how long is too long. There is a reason the rest period is short. I have extended out to 20 deep breaths (so maybe 40 seconds), but I won’t go beyond this.
i know what you mean, but depending on the exercise, it might be hard to continuously add 10lbs each time. like if you start incline bb at 225 for 15 rp, over the course of 6-8 weeks, you will have added over 30 lbs or more to that exercise and it might be hard for you to stay in the rep range. better to be able to progress slowly because even just adding 5lbs at a time will be able to put some nice weight on for that lift. personally, i don’t think that jumping 10lbs is really warranted unless you are outside of the rep range (like getting 17rp when the range is 11-15rp). that’s just me though
[quote]doubleh wrote:
General question for the DC group: anyone have a particular exercise where you experience a fairly dramatic drop-off in the 2nd and/or 3rd legs of the RP set? I know some get this with certain machines, but I flat-out hit the wall on close-grip bench. Happened again last night.
Last time out I went 9-4-2 = 15 RP. Last night I upped the weight by 10 lbs, but went 9-(barely)-2-2. Crazy thing is, the first 2 reps weren’t even too bad, but my tris just stopped working halfway up on rep 3. Brick wall. Virtually every other exercise I am pretty consistent with the rule of thumb of at least half of the 1st leg’s reps.
I don’t know wny this happens on this particular movement. Anyone have similar issues in any exercises?[/quote]
Ditch free-weight CGP imo. Or use a board to take out the bottom part of ROM and have a platform to “launch” the bar from via leg-drive and arch if you get stuck. JM Presses are also an option.
I get the same problem with full-range free-weight CGP due to the fatigued shoulders from chest and delt work, I come out of the bottom and suddenly my strength just evaporates or something.
IH press and SRGB work better, as you can keep the delts out somewhat when pressing towards feet as well as up.
Another thing: raise rep-range to 15+ RP reps. (15-20 or so) if you want to keep the exercise in and possibly do your chest and delt stretches after tri work, the chest one in particular can tire out the delts.
[quote]dropshot001 wrote:
i know what you mean, but depending on the exercise, it might be hard to continuously add 10lbs each time. like if you start incline bb at 225 for 15 rp, over the course of 6-8 weeks, you will have added over 30 lbs or more to that exercise and it might be hard for you to stay in the rep range. better to be able to progress slowly because even just adding 5lbs at a time will be able to put some nice weight on for that lift. personally, i don’t think that jumping 10lbs is really warranted unless you are outside of the rep range (like getting 17rp when the range is 11-15rp). that’s just me though[/quote]
Same here. I know if I went up 10 lb my reps would probably drop too much, unless i’m constantly overshooting the rep range. That’s why I only go up 5lb on the pressing exercises.
Because of that DC progress has been slow but steady. Sometimes I wish I would have been able to add more weight to a given exercise over a period of time, but i’m still able to pound away if i’m conservative when I need to be.
Bump. And why is it that this thread always gets dropped to the second page, even when there are current posts on it?
dropshot/Mein,
The issue of how much weight to add somewhat depends on:
-the strength levels of the person in question, the stronger you are when you start, the less aggressive you’ll be able to be with weight jumps (or the faster you’ll lose exercises)
-the exercise in question, you’re not gonna be adding 20 lbs to barbell curls on a regular basis, but you might be able to on things like leg press and rack deads.
-the individual’s recovery abilities, some guys can just recover faster and therefore improve in strength faster, others can’t, you’ve got to find out where you lie on the spectrum
-super supps, one of the reasons why assisted lifters have shorter blasts than naturals is because they are able to make much larger weight jumps on a regular basis (and therefore burn their recovery systems out faster).
Everyone just has to figure out what they can handle, and of course use a little common sense depending on the exercise in question. Good to hear that you two have found what works for you though.
On the negative, in order to keep my footing I usually bring my chest/torso down a bit while going into the stretch, and on the positive my torso rises a little bit.
